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Topic: Buying a Bitcoin paper wallet from a train ticket dispenser (Read 248 times)

m2017

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Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:10:28 AM

In Switzerland, you can buy a Bitcoin paper wallet from a train ticket dispenser, saw this online https://x.com/CRYPTO_JOKKER/status/1801252432523235550

Though I had to check another video about YouTube that gives a more detailed information how it works, though it seems like it can only be bought through their fiat currency and not master card with a fee of about 7%. https://youtube.com/shorts/HkelOCD4GUY?si=iB66KZU-WWvoH4gt

The YouTube comments got me perplexed, since they claimed they had 0btc when they load it though it's a few comment.
My question is has anyone here ever use it ?
Is there any other countries were this is available?
I will like to ask if anyone has ever tried it or are there other countries were this is done.

This news would be worthy of attention if train tickets from these dispenser could be purchased for bitcoin, but when the company offers the opposite (buying bitcoin from a dispenser), the question arises, why all this? To attract attention? Those who need to leave by train will buy tickets anyway. Those who need bitcoin will buy it without leaving the couch and certainly won’t haul ~~ass~~ themselves to buy bitcoin for the dispenser. In my opinion, this is some kind of meaningless and useless service. The next step will be for us to be offered to buy bitcoin from soda vending machines? Well, I don't. This is not the crypto-future we expected.

doomloop

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Quote from: bitbollo on June 16, 2024, 02:00:56 PM

these vending machine are part of bitcoin history since this has been the most wide spread initiative in the early times (I guess it was 2016-2017 when they launched it).
With this solution swiss rail company was able to give access to bitcoin in a time where it was not easy at all find a serious exchange (and at that time KYC was not a famous acronym).
I think that only here there is this kind of adoption... but it's not casual that has been launched here... there is a city Lugano that accept btc payment for any service ....

Not only specific from the past but everything including what we have now or in the future that are involved in BTC are going to be part of its history. Everything that is new is always going to be a widespread because people are still amazed or overwhelmed with it and others are only FOMOing for the trend, add in that they launched it during one of the peaked times/years of BTC. There are a couple of serious exchanges that time but indeed that there are only no KYC, which is a good thing actually because there are no hassles for using the exchange.

Nice to know that there is that city of Lugano. They are a proof that any place or country can still accept BTC for anything, even if they don't have a legal tender status.

Lucius

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Quote from: Don Pedro Dinero on June 17, 2024, 09:49:12 AM

~snip~

I wonder how much privacy there is if you are being recorded by cameras and if you have to verify the transaction using your mobile number? Of course, you can wear a cap, glasses or even a mask and use a burner phone, but whatever method you use to buy BTC, it is difficult to preserve privacy - and most people don't think too much about it because they are not even aware of the risks that arise from such an investment.

However, when we finally draw a line under everything that has happened in the past ten years in the context of Bitcoin, then we can see how open an individual country is to innovation and enabling its citizens to use it.

Don Pedro Dinero

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Quote from: Lucius on June 17, 2024, 09:42:16 AM

Let's say that this fee is on par with the fees that you will otherwise find at crypto ATMs, although I have seen that there are those that have 4%, but also even 20% if I remember correctly one example from the UK. It will certainly be too much for some, considering the much lower fees that can be realized when using CEX/DEX, but the average Swiss has a standard that is among the highest in the world, so he might look at these things from a different angle.

Well, but as has been said before in the forum, if people pay these fees it is for privacy and immediacy. Only a few pay them out of ignorance. Although I see more sense in bitcoin atms to exchange them for cash than to buy bitcoin or as in this case with the train ticket machine, because for that I think a DEX is better.

Lucius

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Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 17, 2024, 08:37:38 AM

I tried to find such thread but couldn't find one though I did use the ninjastic space for it.

I tried a little and found one topic, although I'm sure there were many more - it's possible that some have been deleted.

Just bought Bitcoin from a train ticket machine in Switzerland for a trip abroad

Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:10:28 AM

I just discovered I made a mistake when writing, though corrected it in Op now, they don't accept master card but only their fiat currency. Though the 7% is not cheap but I think most people use it just for the experience

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Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 17, 2024, 08:37:38 AM

This sounds like buying Bitcoin for cash, without KYC verification. Quite unreal and suspicious, even if the fee is a little higher than acceptable, 7%. All criminals will come to launder their money here

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Quote from: Lucius on June 17, 2024, 04:43:44 AM

Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:10:28 AM

In Switzerland, you can buy a Bitcoin paper wallet from a train ticket dispenser, saw this online ...

Take a look at history, we discussed this back in 2016 - it's nothing new or revolutionary.

Quote from: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-37810438

Switzerland's national rail service (SBB) plans to start selling the digital currency Bitcoin at stations next month. From 11 November, customers will be able to trade Swiss francs for Bitcoins using ticket machines.

I tried to find such thread but couldn't find one though I did use the ninjastic space for it.

Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:10:28 AM

Though I had to check another video about YouTube that gives a more detailed information how it works, though it seems like it can only be bought through their fiat currency and master card with a fee of about 7%.

This is nothing strange, it is logical that they accept their national currency, and as far as I know, the fee depends on the amount of BTC you buy and can be much higher than 7%. In any case, it is not a cheap way to buy BTC.

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Quote from: OmegaStarScream on June 16, 2024, 11:27:52 AM

Although I don't see why would this attract any users at all? Especially for someone who lives there since exchanges are easily accessible, and much cheaper.

Here in my country, there are lots of machines just like this where you can basically exchange your cash to some digital cash. This works even with bitcoin if you don’t have any digital fiat to exchange with bitcoin and you just want to exchange it directly.

Another scenario is if you are running and you suddenly need some bitcoin (which I agree seems unrealistic but hear me out here), you can easily exchange your fiat to bitcoin right here.

It might seem more of an inconvenience right now but this looks like a good step towards mass adoption of bitcoin. It also increases awareness as people might see it and get curious what the heck is a bitcoin and why is it in our train station?!

Quote

As for the complaints of users finding the private keys empty, then I would imagine that could be solved easily since it's easy to prove if the address had any funds, and when did the buy transaction occured. (assuming the company has no intention of scamming people of course).

They need to raise this concern. Since it is situated on a train station, the train station even if it they are not directly responsible for these machines still have responsibility because it is their place where these machines are situated in.

I don’t know how it works in other countries but trains are usually implemented and controlled by the government itself which seems like a bad idea if these machines were openly scamming people.

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Too lazy to check the video but do they ask for ID/KYC in that instance? I know in the EU now, I haven't seen as many Bitcoin ATMs as pre-Covid, something to do with new AMLD5/6 requirements. Used to be you could buy/sekk EUR 10k in a day without verification.

Something in my memory says Switzerland still has maintained that sort of privacy protection. Can easily see people with a lot of cash willing to pay 7% to convert it to Bitcoin without so much as meeting a person. As in, load up a few thousand francs per trip at the train.

retreat

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After watching the video, the ticket dispenser works like a Bitcoin ATM, where you can buy Bitcoin and then you are given paper which you can later redeem on their software on your device. This method is a bit complicated too, because the user needs to work twice just to buy Bitcoin and the fee is 7% which is also quite high. But even though there are some drawbacks, I see that this is something that needs to be appreciated because it will make Bitcoin more accessible and buyable from wherever users want.

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Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:10:28 AM

In Switzerland, you can buy a Bitcoin paper wallet from a train ticket dispenser, saw this online ...

Take a look at history, we discussed this back in 2016 - it's nothing new or revolutionary.

Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:10:28 AM

The YouTube comments got me perplexed, since they claimed they had 0btc when they load it though it's a few comment.
My question is has anyone here ever use it ?
Is there any other countries were this is available?
I will like to ask if anyone has ever tried it or are there other countries were this is done.

As for the YT comment, I wouldn't really believe that there is any truth in it, because the Swiss have been doing it for years and they certainly don't cheat people by selling them empty wallets. I know that in some other EU countries it is possible to buy BTC in post offices (Austria, Croatia, maybe even Poland), and that there are also physical exchange offices where you can sell/buy cryptocurrencies even without KYC up to a certain amount.

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Quote from: OmegaStarScream on June 16, 2024, 11:27:52 AM

This is not really any different from a lot of the BTMs (Bitcoin ATMs) out there. They print you a private key which you can later scan.

I'm more concerned about the security validation of using this kind of wallet. This is more like reducing the privacy and self custody associated with that account Since your private keys were printed by a third party. Its risky because in the event of the company's data being compromised, then your wallet already is and there may be cases funds theft if the company employs a wayward staff and clients funds are very much vulnerable.

What if I loose it?, my funds are gone since the person currently having it can have access to the private keys (let's assume it can print the private keys to the new holder).

I can never keep a lot of money in such a wallet because I see it as a centralized scheme. Also I kind of prefer using bitcoin ATM since I can just make purchases easily by loading it with fiat and paying with it in bitcoin at a go.

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Quote from: OmegaStarScream on June 16, 2024, 11:27:52 AM

We just don't know they intend to scam or have vulnerability in their security system that can be exploited. It's better to avoid it if we have other choices but this is actually one of activities to bring Bitcoin to more people, to increase Bitcoin adoption in Switzerland then globally.

If people want to experience it, purchase bitcoin with small value, they will be disappointed later when they make an on chain transaction that turns small value bitcoin they have to dust. It makes sense if those companies add such warning on their automatic machine. A warning like "You should buy bitcoin at a minimal value which can be used for a next transaction like $20, $50. Average transaction fee last 24 hours is $5.37"

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Well, I've seen some posts or topics in this forum that talk about bitcoin ATMs, and I think these ATMs are still not worldwide; they are in selected countries or places, but the thing is, does someone actually use them? Maybe there are some of them, but I think their reviews or insights about the experience are still not enough. I think the only way we could know if something is effective and efficient is if we actually use it or are introduced to it more, even on social media, so many people will have an idea that this thing actually exists.

I hope this ATM could also be put in the country where I am, but of course someone should fund it, but for now I think it is still impossible. We can just know the experience of those who have actually used it, and I envy them. Anyway it is a great experience for those who could use it.

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Quote from: Die_empty on June 16, 2024, 01:16:22 PM

I have never used a Bitcoin ATM because we just have two machines in my country. It would have been fun to experience it but the city it is located in is far from my location. However, the cost of transactions and accessibility to exchanges makes it unnecessary for many people. I have also read news about scams and fraud through this medium. I don't think Bitcoin ATMs will promote adoption in my location because the cost of transactions and poor internet connections might be discouraging. Maybe this might be the reason why more machines have not been installed in more cities.

Since you haven't tried them out, I will advise you to do proper research before making use of them in case you finally take the chance and have the opportunity to use one of them.

Because I have read in a few threads on this forum that the bitcoin ATM selling price is way higher than what the market is actually selling, you should always try to confirm the price difference before going ahead to buy in order not to lose some money.

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Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 03:48:27 PM

Quote from: BitMaxz on June 16, 2024, 01:52:40 PM

Yes this is true but I think it might not just be only through the CCTVs, some people might just be too ignorant from the fact that they may have kept somehow were others might be able to use it though there's an high chance if there is any CCTVs being around there to be highly targeted by hackers for such reasons.

Yeah, its definitely true that using one of those Bitcoin vending machines could let someone spying on you steal your private key if it gets printed on the wallet receipt. I mean, those new to crypto dont really get how risky that can be yet. Makes sense why there dont seem to be as many of those machines around anymore, even though they did help more folks learn about Bitcoin back in the day.

I remember when my buddy first showed me how to use one at the mall. We were pumped to get our first fraction of a bitcoin. but then I realized later that anyone could have peeked over my shoulder and gotten my key. I would definitely be a lot more careful today.

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Quote from: Die_empty on June 16, 2024, 01:16:22 PM

Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:38:55 AM

Quote from: OmegaStarScream on June 16, 2024, 11:27:52 AM

This is not really any different from a lot of the BTMs (Bitcoin ATMs) out there. They print you a private key which you can later scan. Although I don't see why would this attract any users at all? Especially for someone who lives there since exchanges are easily accessible, and much cheaper.

Yea this is true but don`t forget people also may just try things like this just for the experience especially when it fosters crypto adoption and this is still the reason few still use these Bitcoin ATMs.

Hackers are always creative, people have suffered scam from this.

Quote from: BitMaxz on June 16, 2024, 01:52:40 PM

Quote

I hope that we can see a machine like this but with a little improvement about hiding the key on the ticket and you can only see it when you scratch the paper which is way safer than just no hiding mechanism.

This will be good but from the fact only a few will use it makes it not really necessary and also I guessed they have to create a special machine for it, which can dispense paper card one can scratch off, since this machine not just dispense bitcoin paper wallet but others like the train ticket which ought not be really solid as paper used for scratch off card paper.

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It seems it's not safe if someone is watching behind you like CCTVs or a person on the line could reuse the paper wallet and import it immediately.
That's the only problem I think is possible that is why those who comment on YouTube got 0BTC.

I hope that we can see a machine like this but with a little improvement about hiding the key on the ticket and you can only see it when you scratch the paper which is way safer than just no hiding mechanism.

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Quote from: Amphenomenon on June 16, 2024, 11:38:55 AM

Quote from: OmegaStarScream on June 16, 2024, 11:27:52 AM