Buying stocks with Bitcoin profits | Bitcointalksearch.org

Hyena

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Quote from: CobaltPH on April 30, 2014, 09:28:38 AM

being raped by the local tax office.

I guess what I was trying to propose was that if you work then there are less questions of where your money comes from, thus taking a loan for a house or whatever seems possible. Still, you don't want to work your ass off, but just enough to make it plausible that you can afford a loan. You don't really want to work, so the job you choose should be super easy and have as few working days as possible, just enough to explain how you pay your loan while living off bread scraps and water. But instead of bread scraps, you can afford something better as if your salary was a little greater. The free time you get from such a system can be reinvested in your personal bitcoin project for example. Once your project succeeds, you can hire yourself and then bitcoin profits are no longer needed and can remain as a long term investment --- untouched.

CobaltPH

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Quote from: Hyena on April 30, 2014, 04:53:43 AM

Quote from: sgbett on April 28, 2014, 04:46:51 AM

http://www.snopes.com/politics/conspiracy/malaysiapatent.asp

Seems plausible, some conspiracy theories are lame.

Back to the topic. Speaking of bitcoin profits, what do you guys think of such plan:
1. go to work
2. get a loan and buy a X, Y or Z
3. pay back the loan gradually from your salary
4. live off your bitcoin profits (food, toilet paper, booze, hookers, drugs)

When loan gets paid back, you have saved a lot of bitcoins because during that time the value went up. Also, because you only cashed out the pocket money and spent it on stuff that is hard to tax, you dodged the taxes. Win win, no?

Worst case scenario 1:
1. you lose your job
2. declare your bitcoin profits and just pay back the whole loan at once

Worst case scenario 2:
1. Bitcoin loses its value and you don't have any PeerCoins either.
2. At least you have your job, but now you're the system's slave. No more drugs and hookers.

Worst case scenario 3:
(most likely due to the first law of the universe --- conservation of irony)
1. You lose your job, bitcoin loses its value and you go to jail for tax evasion
2. Say "IT WAS WORTH IT" and take what life gives you.

Any takers?

1,2,3,4 all yes but with a consideration:

I would try to prevent worst case scenarios. It is plausible that your state will want to put his hands on your treasure and IMO you must declare it somehow unless you keep it in btc as it is. In order to transform your bitcoins into other kind of properties you have to declare your wealth, at least partially.
This said, I would decide to apply the most convenient taxation I could find, adapting existing laws to your particoular case (of course with the help of a professionist) in such a way it would be honestly plausible to explain your choices in front of a government-issued inspection / tribunal / other state attempts to get more money from you. You can't go to jail for breaking a rule which doesn't even exist yet, but of course you have to pay taxes especially if you are now a millionaire. Remember you hold your bitcoins steady on your pocket and you can trade a good bargain with your local administration BEFORE transforming btc into other assets.

Otherwise take an airplane to a btc-accepting country and enjoy freedom. Thus I would definitely prefer living where I already am and find a way to do so without being raped by the local tax office.

Hyena

legendary

Activity: 2114

Merit: 1015

Quote from: sgbett on April 28, 2014, 04:46:51 AM

http://www.snopes.com/politics/conspiracy/malaysiapatent.asp

Seems plausible, some conspiracy theories are lame.

Back to the topic. Speaking of bitcoin profits, what do you guys think of such plan:
1. go to work
2. get a loan and buy a X, Y or Z
3. pay back the loan gradually from your salary
4. live off your bitcoin profits (food, toilet paper, booze, hookers, drugs)

When loan gets paid back, you have saved a lot of bitcoins because during that time the value went up. Also, because you only cashed out the pocket money and spent it on stuff that is hard to tax, you dodged the taxes. Win win, no?

Worst case scenario 1:
1. you lose your job
2. declare your bitcoin profits and just pay back the whole loan at once

Worst case scenario 2:
1. Bitcoin loses its value and you don't have any PeerCoins either.
2. At least you have your job, but now you're the system's slave. No more drugs and hookers.

Worst case scenario 3:
(most likely due to the first law of the universe --- conservation of irony)
1. You lose your job, bitcoin loses its value and you go to jail for tax evasion
2. Say "IT WAS WORTH IT" and take what life gives you.

Any takers?

PhoneBloks

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Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Quote from: Hyena on December 04, 2013, 04:25:52 AM

I would like to make sure that my first million won't be the last one. For this I would reinvest a portion of my bitcoin profits to stocks.

3 questions rise:
1. Must I pay income tax before investing my bitcoin earnings to stocks?
2. How profitable can stocks be?
3. This is probably lame but: what stocks would you suggest to buy?

I wouldn't own stocks to trade them but to get the dividends. However, I have no idea how profitable stocks are in that sense. Can anyone tell me how much money I should invest in some nice stocks in order for them to earn me noticeable dividends?

My point of view

1, Depends on country, here in Europe, my country, you dont need to declare where you have your money from Wink

So ...here no
2, As much profitable as you can loose ...WIthout inside info its gambling Wink

3, Big market caps (over 5Bln) wich have low price ...

see this

http://www.gurufocus.com/stock/PBR

sgbett

legendary

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http://www.snopes.com/politics/conspiracy/malaysiapatent.asp

Hyena

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Speaking of latest bubbles. I feel that electric cars will start dominating the market soon. Think of the missing air plane for example, supposedly it was transporting some patent holders for Nikolai Tesla's suppressed technology which is deemed to be the reason for the flight to get missing. Also, the Tesla Motors' electric cars are really impressive.

guyrx

newbie

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If one wants to continue gambling, then one can take the profits from bitcoin and dump them into the marijuana stocks, which have just corrected, and continue on with that high risk appetite OR one can buy Utilities stocks for the dividends. I've been thinking about all those bubbles that have happened recently - 3D printing, bitcoin mining, marijuana stocks (and by extension MJ growing). What's the common factor behind it all? They all require a lot of power. Hence, utilities stocks.

counter

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Time is on our side, yes it is!

Quote from: STT on April 26, 2014, 02:48:19 PM

Did anyone mention a holding in a BTC company ? That can grow. Generally you should buy a mutual fund not single stocks, the risks are too high unless you are an accountant and can study factors. More generally you should hold sectors

I was basically saying the OP should look into other Bitcoin investemnts such as that in my last post. I think it would be good to do that sense the OP has a good idea what Bitcoin is all about and can then research what new companies have to offer and can then begin to look into how much potential profits could be made. Probably best to do a number of things mentioned in this thread and not go all in on one of them.

I also like the idea of investing in bonds but don't really know much about it honestly.

keithers

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This is the land of wolves now & you're not a wolf

Since you are taking profits out of a high risk investment, you probably want to put some in something that is a little less risk i.e mutual funds or bonds rather than individual stocks. Obviously some stocks are more stable than others, but you typically dont take profits out of something that is high risk, just to invest it in something else that is also high risk, you know?

STT

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Sure you can, stocks can go bankrupt but its fairly hard to make gold evaporate. In absolute terms it is absolutely risk free in comparison but they are two different asset types. Gold wont grow either and a stock can go from a garden stall to cover half the world and you as the owner it is a proper investment. Gold is just a rock, it starts, continues and ends at the same point it always was

Quote

I am a believer in gold but I wonder how long until it shoots for the moon and how long it will stay that way if it does at all.

Ive heard of gold in catalysts but never seen it, rocket fuel is even more unlikely. Its essentially a paradox, not essentially useful but unique and unchanging and that includes price. Dollar value can fall into a pit and its very likely, inversely appearance of gold in dollars rises

Quote

Gold has already declined almost 50% from its peak in just 2 years.

The Chinese stopped buying gold directly and tried to declare no alteration in their gold holdings for the past few years yet they are the worlds largest miner and export nothing. Since they've also tried to misrepresent their treasury holdings at times, this decline is more about politics then a real change

http://pricedingold.com/bitcoin/

Did anyone mention a holding in a BTC company ? That can grow. Generally you should buy a mutual fund not single stocks, the risks are too high unless you are an accountant and can study factors. More generally you should hold sectors

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: gagalady on April 26, 2014, 09:40:36 AM

Yes, i better suggest to buy gold or silver instead stocks. You really need to know what you're doing when buying stock and still you are on a risk. Gold and silver like many people say.

Gold has already declined almost 50% from its peak in just 2 years. And I am not sure whether it will go down even more in the near future or not. So, in short, we can't say that bullion is any more risk-free when compared to the stocks.

gagalady

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Yes, i better suggest to buy gold or silver instead stocks. You really need to know what you're doing when buying stock and still you are on a risk. Gold and silver like many people say.

counter

hero member

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Time is on our side, yes it is!

Quote from: Hyena on April 24, 2014, 04:37:31 AM

Quote from: counter on April 24, 2014, 03:23:29 AM

yes but if you take into consideration what the price was like a decade ago then you can see the the price is still pretty high. I believe the price will soar but you shouldn't expect something like that over night. I for one suspect manipulation in that market and would be cautious is what I'm getting at.

I really think that an unexpected event can happen --- gold crashing down to its intrinsic value.

As technology advances, the intrinsic value of gold may go up but I don't think it can go that much up. Ancient aliens were into gold for some reason, but it is highly speculative to think that man kind starts building pyramids with their tips made of pure gold any time soon.

Maybe buying land / houses and apartments would be a better alternative?

I'm bearish for conventional energy production too because the suppressed technology of Nikolai Tesla may soon find its way to the main stream. If energy becomes a free resource then you wouldn't want to be in the same boat with fossil fuels companies and its best friends.

Agreed always expect the unexpected as they say. I am a believer in gold but I wonder how long until it shoots for the moon and how long it will stay that way if it does at all.

I do like the open mindedness you have when it comes to investing but I think you should try and stick with more conventional ways of making profit at this time. Land is not a bad idea I guess but like stocks you really have to do your due diligence. I'm thinking stocks like Biotech would be good to look into as people will always be sick and that field is advancing. Maybe look into other forms of technology based stocks sense you seem to have done well with BTC and even consider pharmaceuticals? This is all just ideas that I think have potential in the future but need to be researched fully before making any real moves. Best of luck with your investments!

wachtwoord

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Quote from: Dalmar on April 25, 2014, 01:30:07 PM

Quote from: wachtwoord on April 25, 2014, 12:27:31 PM

I'm not sure you understand what undervalued means.

I'm not sure you understand how efficient markets work.

I don't think anyone knows how efficient markets work because they are a myth.

keithers

legendary

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This is the land of wolves now & you're not a wolf

Quote from: Hyena on December 04, 2013, 04:25:52 AM

I would like to make sure that my first million won't be the last one. For this I would reinvest a portion of my bitcoin profits to stocks.

3 questions rise:
1. Must I pay income tax before investing my bitcoin earnings to stocks?
2. How profitable can stocks be?
3. This is probably lame but: what stocks would you suggest to buy?

I wouldn't own stocks to trade them but to get the dividends. However, I have no idea how profitable stocks are in that sense. Can anyone tell me how much money I should invest in some nice stocks in order for them to earn me noticeable dividends?

For question #1...you can re-invest your earnings whenever you want, but you will have a tax liability on the gains that you made from BTC. For the BTC you had more than a year it would be long term capital games, for BTC that you have owned less than a year it will be short term capital gains. The tax liability will be due when you file your taxes in April (in United States)

Dalmar

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Life is short, practice empathy in your life

Quote from: wachtwoord on April 25, 2014, 12:27:31 PM

I'm not sure you understand what undervalued means.

I'm not sure you understand how efficient markets work.

Cheap credit has been flowing around Western markets for many years now, most stocks aren't 'cheap' at all. Most of those that appear to be undervalued on the surface usually have significant underlying issues. An example of this would be ticker PAL.

wachtwoord

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Quote from: Dalmar on April 25, 2014, 12:21:18 PM

Quote from: wachtwoord on April 25, 2014, 12:11:18 PM

So buy the undervalued ones.

OP, I think this is a great idea and stocks is the best thing to diversify to from Bitcoin imo.

With all the central bank pumping around the world there are not many left... And if they are still undervalued by now, there's usually either something fundamentally wrong with the company or the industry.

I'm not sure you understand what undervalued means.

Dalmar

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Life is short, practice empathy in your life

Quote from: wachtwoord on April 25, 2014, 12:11:18 PM

So buy the undervalued ones.

OP, I think this is a great idea and stocks is the best thing to diversify to from Bitcoin imo.

With all the central bank pumping around the world there are not many left... And if they are still significantly undervalued by now, there's usually either something fundamentally wrong with the company or the industry.

wachtwoord

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Quote from: Dalmar on April 24, 2014, 06:09:51 AM

Buying stocks now is pretty retarded. The vast majority of them are significantly overvalued.

So buy the undervalued ones.

OP, I think this is a great idea and stocks is the best thing to diversify to from Bitcoin imo.

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: twiifm on April 25, 2014, 10:36:17 AM

There is risk. But its a new company w a lot of growth potential. 8 or 9 would be a good price. Not sure itll dip that low

Well... it is a blue chip stock. That means that it is having high risk profile, at the same time having the potential for high returns as well. Just keep in mind that the EPS is -0.61 right now.

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