Can anyone give a wrong negative trust? Even when he is wrong?

ABCbits

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Quote from: TheBeardedBaby on September 01, 2020, 05:56:23 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Would theymos blacklist you manually from DT? I never heard anyone trying to do that.

There are a few cases where people were blacklisted, some by request, some for abusing the trust.
I cannot give you example right now, but for sure I'll check it out when I have time, if someone doesn't do that before me.
But you can request to be removed from the DT lottery if you want, if theymos will approve it, that's a different story but if you have good enough reason, should be OK.

I didn't think theymos would remove yourself from DT by request, i'll keep that in mind.

bubbalex

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Thank you marlboroza, lovesmayfamilis, I've sent the report to the hilariousandco

lovesmayfamilis

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This is getting ridiculous. In addition to the fact that cheaters violate Ban evasion, they also begin to defend their reputation.
Bubbalex, you are an experienced manager, and you can immediately see who is cheating and who is not. I agree that it takes a lot of time to check, but there is no other way. This is not the first time when, after another ban, cheaters begin to hysteria and blame everyone.

Submit the correct report to the moderator to end this comedy.

marlboroza

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Activity: 1932

Merit: 2272

^ Small correction here, account kiranshehzadi is not banned.

So, OP registered account on April 11, 2020 and they used the same facebook profile for bounties as other accounts which are registered in 2017/18. They made little mistake here (https://archive.is/54qNB#selection-3695.11-3695.23):

It is obviously ban evasion so report them to moderator/send PM to global moderator/create topic in meta. Account is tagged for now.

bubbalex

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Quote from: marlboroza on September 01, 2020, 10:28:48 AM

I didn't check anything else than this https://etherscan.io/txs?a=0x72F67Db9A7793252Bad63b22E37aC5c1E22F07BB. There are few transactions from ashraf786100 to OP and vice versa (0xeac03070d0092c2d4315992aa4f949894bc91487 is ashraf786100's addy, posted 2 years ago:

Quote from: ashraf786100 on August 06, 2018, 10:29:09 PM

Proof of joined post
~
ETH wallet address: 0xeAc03070D0092c2d4315992aA4f949894Bc91487

@bubbalex, how did you connect accounts?

Quote from: ?? on ??

Would theymos blacklist you manually from DT? I never heard anyone trying to do that.

He can blacklist users from DT1.

I connected them though bitcointalk activity, I can't remember this exact case, but most of the time - it's same date of the registration on forum, same date of the registration in campaign/spreadsheet, same time submitting reports, the reports are exactly the same (yes, there is not a lot of ways to submit reports, but reports of different people are different a little), same social accounts/wallets, same campaigns.

They are using same accounts, violating bounty rules and violating forum rules via ban evasion.

5 Accounts: Banned shown in red

1. world1212
2. kiranshehzadi
3. ashraf100786
4. ashraf786100
5. zainr7073

Proof:

Quote from: world1212 on August 15, 2020, 12:03:25 AM

Campaign : Facebook
Facebook Profile Link: https://www.facebook.com/kiranshehzadi786

https://archive.is/wip/iURtn

Quote from: kiranshehzadi on August 27, 2018, 08:38:01 AM

Bitcointalk Username: kiranshehzadi
Telegram airdrop: @kiranshehzadi
Twitter airdrop: @Kiran35875038
Facebook airdrop: https://www.facebook.com/kiranshehzadi786

https://archive.is/wip/lJ7q6

Quote from: kiranshehzadi on February 02, 2019, 09:09:10 PM

Proof of authentication
Bitcointalk Username:kiranshehzadi
Telegram Username:@ashraf786100
Twitter Username:@batter1000
Facebook Profile Link:https://web.facebook.com/muhammad.ashraf.3304673

https://archive.is/wip/R4CMB

Post by: ashraf100786

Quote from: ashraf786100 on August 21, 2018, 09:30:36 AM

week no. 1
Forum username: ashraf786100
Twitter username: @Ashraf786100
Cointalks username: ashraf786100

https://archive.is/wip/kOaKW

Quote from: ashraf100786 on August 23, 2019, 10:17:22 PM

#Proof of Authentication
Bitcointalk username: ashraf100786
Bitcointalk Profile : https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/ashraf100786-1776447
Twitter profile: https://twitter.com/batter1000
Join Campaign : Twitter ,Telegram
Telegram : @MuhammadFarooq6

https://archive.is/wip/O1ABX

Quote from: ashraf786100 on May 13, 2018, 11:59:45 PM

Proof :
telegram : @Ashraf342

https://archive.is/wip/SjOUL

Quote from: zainr7073 on April 13, 2018, 09:09:30 PM

AUTHENTICATION POST
#JOIN
TELEGRAM
@username:@Ashraf342
TWITTER
Profile link: https://twitter.com/Ashraf786100
FACEBOOK
Profile link: https://web.facebook.com/muhammad.ashraf.3304673
REDDIT
https://https://www.reddit.com/user/ashraf786100

https://archive.is/wip/hvWr8

Related Addresses:

Code:

Username:@ashraf786100
Twitter Username:@batter1000
Facebook Profile Link:https://web.facebook.com/muhammad.ashraf.3304673
telegram : @Ashraf342

marlboroza

legendary

Activity: 1932

Merit: 2272

I didn't check anything else than this https://etherscan.io/txs?a=0x72F67Db9A7793252Bad63b22E37aC5c1E22F07BB. There are few transactions from ashraf786100 to OP and vice versa (0xeac03070d0092c2d4315992aa4f949894bc91487 is ashraf786100's addy, posted 2 years ago:

Quote from: ashraf786100 on August 06, 2018, 10:29:09 PM

Proof of joined post
~
ETH wallet address: 0xeAc03070D0092c2d4315992aA4f949894Bc91487

@bubbalex, how did you connect accounts?

Quote from: ?? on ??

Would theymos blacklist you manually from DT? I never heard anyone trying to do that.

He can blacklist users from DT1.

The Sceptical Chymist

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Quote from: ?? on ??

I removed, but ... your explanation that you give someone negative tags for yourself, not being sure that this user is who you think he is, may be regarded by someone as a trust abuse. Still, the trust system was not invented for personal experiments, but for the real reflection of the behavior and actions of a particular user.

Totally agree--and I gave bubbalex merits only because he made a solid post that contained more honesty than I would expect from the typical bitcointalk member if they found themselves in the same situation.

This rotating DT system, man....I don't know if it's such a good idea. It seems like it's gotten to the point where the concept of being trusted by default has no meaning anymore. I'm hoping Theymos eventually sees this and undoes some of what he's done to the DT system.

Quote from: bubbalex on September 01, 2020, 06:19:09 AM

That's why I don't want to be in DT, I don't have enough time and knowledge to be DT member now, I'm still learning. Thank you.

No offense intended to you, but you shouldn't be on DT right now.

YOSHIE

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Activity: 2128

Merit: 1775

Quote from: ?? on ??

If you want to tags someone, do it in a neutral color, if you are sure of something, then red. Because if some user complains about you that you wrote to him unreasonably in the trust and you could prove it, you yourself can be painted for trust abuse. Undecided

It should be like that...! So, there are no pros & cons.

Actually what: @bubbalex is doing, is correct, based on his suspicions, towards: @world1212 and @ashraf100786, committing fraud in the campaign he manages.
Only, @bubbalex shows no evidence here, Directly to Sheets.

Supposing @bubbalex, show evidence on a famous Alt topic or make your own thread about a cheating Alt, it's not like this is the case, everyone sees the evidence.

OP, your problem is resolved, lock the topic and have fun, before things get complicated.

TheBeardedBaby

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I don't think feedback which are not "urgent" or unsafe will be removed. If you have been doxxed in your feedback which can lead to personal harm in a way, those things will be removed, but if we are talking about bullsh!t feedback like fake accusations, spam and even advertising, and do not have a higher risk for the user, will most likely not be.

actmyname

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Quote from: Little Mouse on September 01, 2020, 06:58:05 AM

Is there any such case where admin removed any feedback left by other user? It would be good to have an example of such case. I have one neg tag although I'm nit much concerned about that as it is not in trusted feedback (Have tried to reach him but no response).

I do not recall the username, and it would be difficult to figure out who it was without directly asking theymos.

I'm certain that any rule-breaking feedback will be removed. For example, links to malware would definitely be something considered for removal.

All in all, I would just toss out the blanket statement, "if there's any doubt, it's not happening."

Little Mouse

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Quote from: actmyname on September 01, 2020, 02:45:09 AM

Quote from: Rikafip on September 01, 2020, 02:43:34 AM

Trust is not moderated, so only person that can remove the negative trust is the person that left it. None of us can do much here in that regard, not even admins.

Well, that's untrue. Admins can remove negative trust. They just don't tend to do it unless it's egregious spam or something significantly malicious outside of words.

Is there any such case where admin removed any feedback left by other user? It would be good to have an example of such case. I have one neg tag although I'm nit much concerned about that as it is not in trusted feedback (Have tried to reach him but no response).

bubbalex

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https://t.me/bubbalex

Quote from: ?? on ??

~

I removed, but ... your explanation that you give someone negative tags for yourself, not being sure that this user is who you think he is, may be regarded by someone as a trust abuse. Still, the trust system was not invented for personal experiments, but for the real reflection of the behavior and actions of a particular user.

You give people in some situations false negative tegs, even if not trustworthy. But I can show you many examples when DT members have negative tags similar users for such tags.

If you want to tags someone, do it in a neutral color, if you are sure of something, then red. Because if some user complains about you that you wrote to him unreasonably in the trust and you could prove it, you yourself can be painted for trust abuse. Undecided

Yes, I have already changed some feedback to the neutral and will be giving neutral feedback in future in case I'm not sure that user deserves negative feedback. That's why I don't want to be in DT, I don't have enough time and knowledge to be DT member now, I'm still learning. Thank you.

bubbalex

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Quote from: Sanitough on September 01, 2020, 05:59:41 AM

They can because they are in control of their account, they can put a feedback to any profile anytime they want, but the question should be, "is it ethical to put red trust without proof?, and my answer would be no, but like I said, we can't control what's on the mind of the rater but I'm sure DT members who trusted such account will remove him from their trust list if they found enough evidence a DT member abusing the trust system.

You can read my posts above to understand that I'm surely not going to abuse DT powers and already asked to remove me from DT.

Sanitough

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They can because they are in control of their account, they can put a feedback to any profile anytime they want, but the question should be, "is it ethical to put red trust without proof?, and my answer would be no, but like I said, we can't control what's on the mind of the rater but I'm sure DT members who trusted such account will remove him from their trust list if they found enough evidence a DT member abusing the trust system.

bubbalex

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: TheBeardedBaby on September 01, 2020, 05:49:31 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: bubbalex on September 01, 2020, 04:55:31 AM

As far as I understand, I got into DT. I'm sending negative feedback only for myself in order to not allow these users into my further campaigns, I do sent feedback based on the suspicious activity, some of them are totally valid, some are not. Please, remove me from the DT list in order to not show my trust feedbacks by default, they might be totally inacurate.

You could remove yourself from eligible DT member if you don't meet the criteria, while i don't remember all the criteria, but the easiest way is remove your trust list.

I think it's easier just to sent a PM to theymos to blacklist you from the DT's, so you can keep your turst list as it is. If you remove your tust list and later you want to start building a new one, it's very easy to happen the same thing.

Would theymos blacklist you manually from DT? I never heard anyone trying to do that.

I just found out that one forum member added me to his trust list and therefore I became a DT, I asked him to remove me from there.

TheBeardedBaby

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Would theymos blacklist you manually from DT? I never heard anyone trying to do that.

There are a few cases where people were blacklisted, some by request, some for abusing the trust.
I cannot give you example right now, but for sure I'll check it out when I have time, if someone doesn't do that before me.
But you can request to be removed from the DT lottery if you want, if theymos will approve it, that's a different story but if you have good enough reason, should be OK.

TheBeardedBaby

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: bubbalex on September 01, 2020, 04:55:31 AM

As far as I understand, I got into DT. I'm sending negative feedback only for myself in order to not allow these users into my further campaigns, I do sent feedback based on the suspicious activity, some of them are totally valid, some are not. Please, remove me from the DT list in order to not show my trust feedbacks by default, they might be totally inacurate.

You could remove yourself from eligible DT member if you don't meet the criteria, while i don't remember all the criteria, but the easiest way is remove your trust list.

I think it's easier just to sent a PM to theymos to blacklist you from the DT's, so you can keep your turst list as it is. If you remove your tust list and later you want to start building a new one, it's very easy to happen the same thing.

bubbalex

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As far as I understand, I got into DT. I'm sending negative feedback only for myself in order to not allow these users into my further campaigns, I do sent feedback based on the suspicious activity, some of them are totally valid, some are not. Please, remove me from the DT list in order to not show my trust feedbacks by default, they might be totally inacurate.

In recent days, some people began to write to me with a request to remove feedback, I will not do this in general, because the situation with sarwari makes me think that in most cases I am right, but in some cases I'll change it to neutral. In any case, my goal was not to harm these people so that they could not participate in other campaigns too. Based on my feedback, I do not accept them in my campaigns and only in my own, based on the rules that are indicated in my bounty campaigns.

I will change some feedbacks to the neutral, instead negative.

UPD. Recent feedbacks without enough evidence changed to neutral, in future I will be more careful in giving negative feedbacks.

TheBeardedBaby

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I won't discuss the feedback itself, i think the neutral in this case could be enough for the evidence we have.
What i want to focus here is the usage of the reference link, it's pointing to a spreadsheet which for me is not a good practice at all.
Better open own thread with the all the proof and description and leave that as a reference link.

actmyname

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Spear the bees

Quote from: dre1982 on September 01, 2020, 02:49:38 AM

Well then admins can remove all the negative trust spam of game-protect. He have been spamming negative trust to everyone who gave him negative trust which he deserved.

Despite his negative feedback spam spanning three pages, this is still less spam than what I remember theymos removing.

If we take that as a lower bound, then game-protect's negative feedback will never be removed. It takes quite a bit of push for theymos to actually perform some restitution: see flags, spam, investor-based games board for examples.

Topic: Can anyone give a wrong negative trust? Even when he is wrong? (Read 444 times)