Topic: Clear agreements in a Casual/P2P gambling is important to ensure fair gambling - page 3. (Read 422 times)

If you must gamble with someone without escrowing the funds, then it should be someone you completely trust and not just a random or casual friend. If you don't escrow funds when you gamble with strangers or casual pals, it is likely to end in quarrels, just as you found out, the loser might decide to default on the agreement and since it was just agreement through words of the mouth, then it is nothing concrete. One good lesson from this is that you now know that you should only gamble this way with people you completely trust.

This is the reason why people turn to a middleman when they are doing anything that involves agreement like this or that involves people trading money or staking money between themselves. I don’t think I have a similar experience but if something like this had happened to me, it would depend on the amount and the person involved on what action I’d have taken.

The person in question probably trusted his ability on 8-balls that he thought he would never lost to you and thus the reason he went ahead to play with you but after realising that his opponent skill was beyond his he then went on with the “they didn’t stake anything trick” - but since you have learnt your lesson I believe you won’t make the mistake of playing against someone without first seeing the prize or handling the prize over to someone else for safe keeping or to guarantee that something like this doesn’t happen again.

That's why casinos exist in the first place, people can't accept when things go out of their way so it's always important to do things in the right way if you're serious about it. My personal advice will be never mix personal relationships with money because it's bad combo and always backfire at you so if it's possible step away from head to head if you know the person at the other end because even if they agree to pay you they feeling of guilt inside you maybe a problem.

if its in the Philippines, where pool players are like Efren Bata Reyes, the person who always accepts a challenge always is a greater player. in your case the guy is just trying to earn money for free. if you beat him on the game easy, then you know the challenger is up to something.

they do have a lot of guts for a fight knowing you got an agreement. if you are not from that place you did a good job escaping alive. 

What just happened between you guys is not far from normal street gambling; inside a 10 to 20 game, more than 60% of the game always ends in a fight or argument before everything is resolved, and in some cases, if the person who doesn't want to pay has an upper hand in the place, you, the winner, will be the one trying to fight your freedom out of that place instead of fighting for the money that you have won. 
 
In the event that such a person comes out to place a bet with you again, I will advise you to stay away from him unless you are very certain you have enough backup in that place that will fight for you if the game ever escalates to that point.

If we're betting for real on a head to head bet, I would give the money to someone outside of the bet under the mutual understanding that we will respect their judgment.

It's also important to not make huge bets so even if someone loses it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. We should bet on something like a beer or a meal or on who's gonna drive on our next trip or something like that that's not gonna leave the loser in pain.

Was it worth the money?
When it's in public and you shame the guy, it will always be trouble. I wouldn't want to make a fuzz about it if it were me unless the money is worth that much. There are people you don't know who will keep the grudge and you find yourself looking behind your back occasionally.  You are going to pay when you lose that game that's for sure and it won't matter. You play in good faith. Don't bother yourself if they won't keep the end of the bargain.

I think the problem is the money down the table before start playing. If they didn't initiate the money be on the table. You might as well doubt whether they will pay and not begin playing.

My bad, I missed the part that stated that they already had a gentleman's agreement. You are absolutely correct; an escrow would be the best option in such a situation. Face-to-face agreements can easily be broken since the funds are still in the custody of both parties. But a middleman who can even be paid a percentage from the win would have handled the situation brilliantly.  Online deals are riskier since people can easily fake their location and identity

This is why escrow is very important when it comes to money matters. As mentioned by the OP, it was already a face-to-face agreement and yet, the person wanted not to honor their initial agreement. What more via online deals, the person can easily say no and disappear. Hence, if you will deal another person better look for a reputable escrow to handle the funds involved, whether, you are dealing with a friend or not.

Quite funny for me to imagine and compare your opponent that refused to pay you out after losing same as the new members opening new topics and accusing trusted casinos of cheating them, while the truth is only they can’t afford losing.
After all for you, your safety and well being is better than his money, it is also a lesson for you to keep in mind, choosing wisely against whom you are going to play and gamble. Casinos are a better destination and safer place to compete against others even when they charge fees, but you guarantee more than a small fee.

I have witnessed many similar stories about gambling and arguing after the game is over leading to serious conflicts and injuries. Unfortunately, few years ago a young guy in my age lost his life after winning against the owner of an illegal gambling store, the owner wanted his money back after losing it to the young man, so he had to slaughter him and steal it back.

Not just in gambling transactions or relationships that involve money or anything of value should have an agreement. The agreement should have terms and witnesses if possible. You will never know the true nature of an individual until you have financial transactions with them.  I am sorry for what happened, @OP, but you would have let him go with his money instead of allowing the situation to degenerate into violence. Such issues can lead to injuries and loss of life. This is why I prefer to gamble physically with mature and responsible gamblers that I am familiar with. Or just focus on gambling with formal gambling firms.

Yeah, that's how it goes with P2P games. You must first make sure that the money on both ends is in the safe pockets so that no one will cheat. It's gambling, even a small amount can change a person and there's no such thing as an honest game in it. There will always be some dirt.

Anyway, yes it's your mistake since you are the pro in that pool table and you should've known better from your own experience. Well, it's a good lesson learned and I guess you won't be making the same mistake next time.
It's a nice sport and it's actually popular here in our country. Keep it up but stay out of trouble.

How do you engage in bets that happens as result of argument, and then you expect to have a safe ride? It will definitely result in a big trouble that you may not be able to settle.. moreover, what sort of friends do you keep? ... I'm asking because I can recreate that scenario in my head.
That doesn't look like t'was fun to me...well, there's a saying that "birds of the same feathers flock together" that as well might have been the case.. better still, you could make some proper negotiations next time..

Well if there is one thing I know, that would be the fact that when it comes to money every human tend to do otherwise like it tends to somehow pull out or amplifies their true colors and that's why anything concerning betting with someone especially when it have to do with something that involves the stake of money definitely a third party needs to be standby and everyone needs to be cleared on the fact that rules are guiding the bet and everyone should abide by them if not it's definitely going to turn out to something else.

This is why a middleman is always required on any bets set by P2P method. Trust is the most common issue on gambling with other person physically since they can forfeit the payment on bets anytime they want using forced which is very hard to go against if you are just a normal gambler with no physical advantage.

It’s much better to do a friendly match instead of staking real bets especially if the amount involved is high regardless if the person is a friend since the money change everything. Be happy that nothing bad happened to you physically because this kind of argument usually end up with physical confrontation.

Even the casinos will never allow you just make a prediction and assume that you will make payments after the game especially if you win then the staked amount will be deducted, i mean this doesn't even make any sense a I'm even saying it. gambling only takes place when the two parties have collectively placed their stakes and the amount to be won is clear so they are both playing for that amount and not them just gambling, in such case there can be a binding law against winners and looser but when no solid agreement has been made then you can have situations as this which can even turn really bad when not kept under control enough.

If you want to do it in another time, always make sure to have some intermediary who helps keeps the fund for you guys and be sure the money will be given to the winner when one emerges. anything outside having some funds with an intermediary will mostly result in conflicts because the other party may not be wanting to agree to loosing meanwhile the winning party just want to be rewarded.

Lolz, bro, I think it's best you understand that in this part of the world that we live in, there is absolutely no way you can participate In peer to peer gambling for a whole day and don't get involved in a fight, this is simply one of the known facts about peer to peer physical gambling, and this is something a clear agreement solves, for even with this, something will always come up at the end of the day that would cause or result to a fight.

This is possibly one of the reasons what many people prefer to only gamble either on well organized and established physical casino, or the online counterpart/version.
I did like to mention that peer to peer gambling is only meant for the streets and those who belong there, people in their right senses should always go well to avoid street gambling for their own safety, because street gambling and fighting go hand in hand.

Sometimes you just want to trust someone after you see the seriousness on their face not knowing you are making the worst mistake ever to do that. OP, i feel sorry because as long as there is no assigned third party to hold the winning money or whatever that was staked as an escrow it will be difficult to get the money from the other person. Because he only has access to his account and even if the fight continues you dont know if he has the money on him. I have seen cases where some persons go as far as betting without having any money on them. They are hoping to win you so that they can get some money. But why would they choose to take such a risk? People are just crazy that's what ill say.

Role number one in playing a physical bet is to hand the money over to a third party who is strong enough to resist whatever attempt coming comes from the person who lose the bet. You give the third party the money and he gets a certain percentage of it regardless of who eventually wins the money. If you just allow it to end in a mere statement when the money isn't visible yet, if he denied ever making such an agreement with you in the first place, you will be left with no option but to let it go or engage in forceful means of getting your money back. Do you even have to let it get to a fighting stage? What happens if someone sustains a serious injury? What would you have said knowing fully well that no form of agreement's written that can be held unto as a backing to show that he agreed on it but couldn't keep up to his words?

For the online gambling, the site through which you make your deposit stands as the middle man that makes it impossible to retrieve your money after placing certain bet. If sports betters have the ability to retrieve Thier money when things is about to go sour, most of them will compromise on thier agreement just like your friend. The only difference is that in the case of an online gambling, it's mostly favourable to the gambling owners who are the ones in control of the money and can cook up flimsy excuse as to why they wouldn't pay you in certain instances.

If I understood you well, you bet with someone but you did not know if the person have the money or not. I said this because you did not see the money the person wants to use to bet but you bet with the person. This is a mistake that should have been avoided. You need to make sure that you see the money and also the money also needs to be with another person which is the third party just like you later advised.