Coinbase sponsors two Bitcoin developers! - page 3.

stompix

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 17, 2020, 03:05:39 AM

You are missing the unpleasant, untrustworthy and low moral past of Coinbase. I do not think they really care about anything else except the balance sheet of their account. Bitcoin is just a business for them, if this does not work for them then they will move to something else. But for us bitcoin is everything.

Common, let's not go overboard, are you going to commit suicide tomorrow if bitcoin disappears? How have you lived before?
Bitcoin is just another tool we use in our life, it's not something that we can't live without, look at the 7 billion people carry on living without even owning a satoshi or even knowing what bitcoin is.

As for Coinbase, it's a company, it's their money, it's their choice to do what they want with it. You don't agree with their move, of you're free to not agree but remember the same principle of bitcoin, your keys, your money your decision, just as they can't force you to use bitcoin cash or their service you can't force them to spend their money on what you want.

And in the end, if people involved in bitcoin development fail to coinbase's bribe, aren't they just as guilty?

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: 20kevin20 on October 17, 2020, 02:45:11 AM

It's open source though, so how exactly could there be malicious coding or strings attached to this offering?

"Develop this way or we will pull your funding."

I don't trust Coinbase with a single satoshi. History has shown that anything they stick their grubby little fingers in to is for their own benefit, and their own benefit alone. They are quite happy to sell out their customers and sell out the community to enrich themselves.

I'm not suggesting that Coinbase are going to try to pay off devs to insert malicious code, or that any of the devs would take up such an offer. What I am suggesting is that the only reason Coinbase are doing this is because they want to be able to influence bitcoin's future development and direction. They wanted a few years ago to get rid of the core devs and set up a new team. It was obvious they were never going to be able to do that, so now they are going to try to influence the direction of bitcoin from the inside. Coinbase are essentially going down the path of "If you can't beat them, join them."

NotATether

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Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on October 17, 2020, 02:39:29 AM

What's changed? Why are they suddenly sponsoring people they wanted rid of a few years ago? Leverage?

Quote from: pooya87 on October 16, 2020, 11:31:50 PM

worst case scenario is government putting pressure on the centralized company and the company putting pressure on their "employee" to do something malicious to bitcoin.

Exactly. Coinbase already work hand in hand with governments and banks. These are not the kind of people we want funding bitcoin development.

Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 17, 2020, 02:52:28 AM

Quote from: 20kevin20 on October 17, 2020, 02:45:11 AM

It's open source though, so how exactly could there be malicious coding or strings attached to this offering? Coinbase may have more influence over them, but in case anything goes wrong isn't there just enough possibility for reversal? I don't think it'd take too long before someone notices something's wrong in the new lines of code..

Here is a common scenario of real life in a job place:
Your employer pays your bills and you obey whatever they say or you are risking your paycheck, right? Yes, maybe an employer who value their employees would give them freedom of work.

How about an asshole employer? He will ~~wish~~ push you hard to do whatever he wants, if you don't then he will fire you anytime. Coinbase are in no way trustable for bitcoin community, whoever they will sponsor - they (Coinbase) will be that asshole employer of those core developers.

A company who merely sponsors an open-source developer or project is just funneling them money without dictating to them what features to make. The situation would be different if company employees were the ones contributing, those have to take orders from their company no matter what because of their legal status as employed by the company, whereas there's no legal relationship between open-source contributors and the company sponsoring them. The only possible leverage Coinbase can put here is to select developers who commit changes to bitcoin that align with their own interests.

The vast majority of bitcoin contributors don't commit like that so I think that anyone who does only work on minor parts of bitcoin, not important enough for Coinbase to seriously consider sponsoring them. If this is Coinbase's intention then spending it on people with little influence isn't going to work for them.

AB de Royse777

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Quote from: 20kevin20 on October 17, 2020, 03:21:16 AM

That's exactly what I'm trying to say: there's nothing to really worry about because it won't work, as chances are low the codes will go through unseen and unverified. Just my 2 cents Cheesy

I meant their entire bitcoin business not this news of sponsoring devs. If the business does not work they will move to another business.

20kevin20

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 17, 2020, 03:05:39 AM

You are missing the unpleasant, untrustworthy and low moral past of Coinbase. I do not think they really care about anything else except the balance sheet of their account.

Well, that's specifically why I am not worrying much about the sponsorship.

It may actually be a good thing. How many active core devs trust Coinbase and centralized services? Theoretically, there shouldn't be many.. right? As they have to apply themselves for it on Coinbase's website, it's only going to basically be the possible "traitors" of Bitcoin that are going to do it. And as we all can see new changes, it's going to be a complete waste of time & money in the end with a positive ending for us: if any strings are attached, the reputation of those devs who'll take the sponsorship will fall to the ground. Better now than later.

Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 17, 2020, 03:05:39 AM

if this does not work for them then they will move to something else.

That's exactly what I'm trying to say: there's nothing to really worry about because it won't work, as chances are low the codes will go through unseen and unverified. Just my 2 cents Cheesy

AB de Royse777

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Quote from: 20kevin20 on October 17, 2020, 03:02:32 AM

I think it'd be a very silly and useless move from Coinbase if that's their plan. Maybe they can force their two sponsored devs to work the way Coinbase wants, but in the end it's going to be an absolute waste of time and resources if the larger community rejects their malicious intents. Or maybe I'm missing something here.

You are missing the unpleasant, untrustworthy and low moral past of Coinbase. I do not think they really care about anything else except the balance sheet of their account. Bitcoin is just a business for them, if this does not work for them then they will move to something else. But for us bitcoin is everything.

20kevin20

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 17, 2020, 02:52:28 AM

Here is a common scenario of real life in a job place:
Your employer pays your bills and you obey whatever they say or you are risking your paycheck, right? Yes, maybe an employer who value their employees would give them freedom of work.

How about an asshole employer? He will ~~wish~~ push you hard to do whatever he wants, if you don't then he will fire you anytime. Coinbase are in no way trustable for bitcoin community, whoever they will sponsor - they (Coinbase) will be that asshole employer of those core developers.

I think it'd be a very silly and useless move from Coinbase if that's their plan. Maybe they can force their two sponsored devs to work the way Coinbase wants, but in the end it's going to be an absolute waste of time and resources if the larger community rejects their malicious intents. Or maybe I'm missing something here.

AB de Royse777

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Quote from: 20kevin20 on October 17, 2020, 02:45:11 AM

It's open source though, so how exactly could there be malicious coding or strings attached to this offering? Coinbase may have more influence over them, but in case anything goes wrong isn't there just enough possibility for reversal? I don't think it'd take too long before someone notices something's wrong in the new lines of code..

Here is a common scenario of real life in a job place:
Your employer pays your bills and you obey whatever they say or you are risking your paycheck, right? Yes, maybe an employer who value their employees would give them freedom of work.

How about an asshole employer? He will ~~wish~~ push you hard to do whatever he wants, if you don't then he will fire you anytime. Coinbase are in no way trustable for bitcoin community, whoever they will sponsor - they (Coinbase) will be that asshole employer of those core developers.

Quote from: 20kevin20 on October 17, 2020, 02:45:11 AM

I don't think it'd take too long before someone notices something's wrong in the new lines of code..

Why would we welcome bugs?

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on October 17, 2020, 02:39:29 AM

This will be the same Coinbase who were quite keen to fire all the core developers are bring in a whole new team just a few years ago, right? The same Coinbase who tried to swing their weight around to force 2MB blocks and prevent SegWit from happening, against all the recommendations and plans from core developers?

Quote from: pooya87 on October 16, 2020, 11:31:50 PM

worst case scenario is government putting pressure on the centralized company and the company putting pressure on their "employee" to do something malicious to bitcoin.

Exactly. Coinbase already work hand in hand with governments and banks. These are not the kind of people we want funding bitcoin development.

Hey bud, I am out of merit. Thanks for those findings. This news in no way good news for the community. I can feel it in my bones.

20kevin20

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Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on October 17, 2020, 02:39:29 AM

Exactly. Coinbase already work hand in hand with governments and banks. These are not the kind of people we want funding bitcoin development.

It's open source though, so how exactly could there be malicious coding or strings attached to this offering? Coinbase may have more influence over them, but in case anything goes wrong isn't there just enough possibility for reversal? I don't think it'd take too long before someone notices something's wrong in the new lines of code..

o_e_l_e_o

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This will be the same Coinbase who were quite keen to fire all the core developers are bring in a whole new team just a few years ago, right? The same Coinbase who tried to swing their weight around to force 2MB blocks and prevent SegWit from happening, against all the recommendations and plans from core developers?

Quote from: pooya87 on October 16, 2020, 11:31:50 PM

worst case scenario is government putting pressure on the centralized company and the company putting pressure on their "employee" to do something malicious to bitcoin.

Exactly. Coinbase already work hand in hand with governments and banks. These are not the kind of people we want funding bitcoin development.

pooya87

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Quote from: ABCbits on October 16, 2020, 06:16:53 AM

Why some people are surprised? It's quite common for big open-source project where big companies sponsor/recruit someone to develop on open-source project. Even majority of contribution on linux kernel are done by programmer working on/sponsored by company.

that doesn't mean it is a good thing just because some other project is infested by it.
the centralized companies have proven that they aren't doing anything for the greater good! not to mention that the centralization that would come in could have many negative sides. worst case scenario is government putting pressure on the centralized company and the company putting pressure on their "employee" to do something malicious to bitcoin.

NotATether

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Coinbase should sponsor achow101 IMO, he's a very active bitcoin developer

They did say in their blog we'd be able to nominate people for the sponsorship, but I don't see an option to nominate people anywhere in the Google Form. I think Coinbase needs to be contacted about it as currently there's no "official" (as in, don't expect a recommendation by tweet to be considered) channel to nominate people anywhere, the Google Form's only for the applicants themselves.

ABCbits

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Why some people are surprised? It's quite common for big open-source project where big companies sponsor/recruit someone to develop on open-source project. Even majority of contribution on linux kernel are done by programmer working on/sponsored by company.

Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 15, 2020, 08:50:06 PM

Quote

there is publicity

It seems they have already managed to get it. Good for them but not much good for people who value their privacy. Some day without their knowledge Coinbase will hand over the information to third party and no law enforcement will say a word.

But they don't have much publicity on bitcoin/open-source development. Sponsoring 2 developers have small costs for company as big as Coinbase.

AB de Royse777

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Quote from: stompix on October 15, 2020, 04:05:10 PM

First, there is publicity, then bitcoin is their main business, at one point you have to spend money to help it develop or you're going to lose more longterm, besides I doubt the sums will be that big, probably just some pocket money Coinbase has decided to put to some better use. Let them spend it, I just wish they would have spent some on implementing batching trasnactions 3 years earlier...

Fair points:

Quote

there is publicity

It seems they have already managed to get it. Good for them but not much good for people who value their privacy. Some day without their knowledge Coinbase will hand over the information to third party and no law enforcement will say a word.

Quote

at one point you have to spend money to help it develop or you're going to lose more longterm

Information is the business.

Quote

I doubt the sums will be that big

This never crossed my mind. Thing is when you heard a big company is going to sponsor or giving fund - we tend to have the expectation that it will be some life changing big amount.

Maybe I am too pessimistic in this news but hopefully this brings some good to the bitcoin community without damaging much. This is all that matters.

stompix

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Quote from: notblox1 on October 15, 2020, 01:38:51 PM

Good move from Coinbase and I expect other crypto related companies to follow their example, and we want to see more interesting development around Bitcoin.

It's Coinbase that is following Square and Bitmex, but yeah, about time they start spending some money.

Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 15, 2020, 01:42:35 PM

I wonder what string they have attached with it. They are all about in business so obviously they have plans to pull out something out of it. It's just hard to believe Coinbase doing anything for nothing.

First, there is publicity, then bitcoin is their main business, at one point you have to spend money to help it develop or you're going to lose more longterm, besides I doubt the sums will be that big, probably just some pocket money Coinbase has decided to put to some better use. Let them spend it, I just wish they would have spent some on implementing batching trasnactions 3 years earlier...

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Quote

Btw Adam Back liked this news and asking about it:
https://twitter.com/adam3us/status/1316808871801954306

With him being one of the major backers behind behind HalognMining (the DragonMint miners) and the ASICBoost "Defensive Patent Protection" scheme I hope to God he is NOT one of the devs that gets sponsored. He sure as hell does not need the money and has a general disdain for anything that is good or ethical for the BTC Community!

AB de Royse777

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Quote from: notblox1 on October 15, 2020, 01:50:04 PM

You think Bitcoin developers live on air and that Bitcoin will never need new developers? Grin

It's not like those two guys can make backdoor access just for Coinbase that none of other devs will notice...

I did not say any of these of course. Coinbase is going to do anything without any catch is not comfortable news. I agree with jackg, sooner or later we will face the consequence. It's just not clear now that how it will be done.

Quote from: notblox1 on October 15, 2020, 01:50:04 PM

Now that is a bit exaggeration don't you think so, putting all US companies in same basket and blaming them for chain splits?

Coinbase already had a bad history. So yeah, I will not consider ALL that was applied here.

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 15, 2020, 01:42:35 PM

Not sure if I will call it good.

You think Bitcoin developers live on air and that Bitcoin will never need new developers? Grin

It's not like those two guys can make backdoor access just for Coinbase that none of other devs will notice...
Btw Adam Back liked this news and asking about it:
https://twitter.com/adam3us/status/1316808871801954306

Quote from: jackg on October 15, 2020, 01:46:39 PM

US companies look good for extortion and predatory business practices, that could be brought across into cryptocurrency and cause a lot of chain splits.

Now that is a bit exaggeration don't you think so, putting all US companies in same basket and blaming them for chain splits?

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on October 15, 2020, 01:42:35 PM

I wonder what string they have attached with it. They are all about in business so obviously they have plans to pull out something out of it. It's just hard to believe Coinbase doing anything for nothing.

Quote from: notblox1 on October 15, 2020, 01:38:51 PM

Good move from Coinbase and I expect other crypto related companies to follow their e xample, and we want to see more interesting development around Bitcoin.

Not sure if I will call it good.

Yeah I agree with that... If they don't want something now, they'll want it sooner than we will want them to be able to...

US companies look good for extortion and predatory business practices, that could be brought across into cryptocurrency and cause a lot of chain splits.

AB de Royse777

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I wonder what string they have attached with it. They are all about in business so obviously they have plans to pull out something out of it. It's just hard to believe Coinbase doing anything for nothing.

Quote from: notblox1 on October 15, 2020, 01:38:51 PM

Good move from Coinbase and I expect other crypto related companies to follow their example, and we want to see more interesting development around Bitcoin.

Not sure if I will call it good.

Topic: Coinbase sponsors two Bitcoin developers! - page 3. (Read 863 times)