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Topic: CoinTerra announces its first ASIC - Hash-Rate greater than 500 GH/s - page 104. (Read 231002 times)

hero member
Activity: 702
Merit: 500
I like CoinTerra and generally find them to be credible. I do not like the insanely risky pre-order model that encourages investors to make poor decisions based on murky calculations about future profitability. The pre-order model would die a quick death if people would stop feeding it...then we could get vendors that were willing to shoulder some of the risk themselves.

theres really two models that make sense for a new asic company :-

1.  the equity investment model.  ie: investors buy equity in the asic company.  said company then has all the funds it needs to cover the NRE (non recurring engineering fees) and start production.   Most likely, once the company can afford to make its own asics then it will go directly into mining with them, which is the most profitable use for them.   There's no reason for the company to sell its asics if it could make more money just mining with them.

2.  the pre-sales model.  instead of equity investors, the company takes pre-orders.  Those pre-orders are effectively crowdsourcing the funds required to start production.  That way, the company's production will be sold to its customers.  Since the company is focussed on crowdsourcing to raise its production costs, the customer is able to buy miners at a lower price, than if the company could afford to be mining with the hardware instead of selling it.

there may be some hybrid models too.

the pre-order system will probably remain for the forseeable future until such time as customers stop pre-ordering.  when that happens, the only asic mining companies will be those that make the asics purely for themselves, and only sell them to the public when they can make more at retail than they can mining themselves (asicminer for instance).

sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
I like CoinTerra and generally find them to be credible. I do not like the insanely risky pre-order model that encourages investors to make poor decisions based on murky calculations about future profitability. The pre-order model would die a quick death if people would stop feeding it...then we could get vendors that were willing to shoulder some of the risk themselves.
hero member
Activity: 702
Merit: 500
Cointerra do look a bit shark jump-ish. Turning up last to the party, charging the same $/GH/s value as Avalon Batch 1 and also still not accepting BTC payment. This is not something I would expect well informed BTC community members to buy, the whole ethos is reminiscent of what BFL thought they were going for (shiny boxes photography, press testimonials, top-drawer highest quality ultra power efficiency winner blah blah blah)

at least get your facts right... Cointerra do accept bitcoin.  its on their web site!

there's a heap of difference between bfl and cointerra.  one of those companies actually employs asic designers and its ceo is also one.  there's no comparison!

legendary
Activity: 3430
Merit: 3080
Cointerra do look a bit shark jump-ish. Turning up last to the party, charging the same $/GH/s value as Avalon Batch 1 and also still not accepting BTC payment. This is not something I would expect well informed BTC community members to buy, the whole ethos is reminiscent of what BFL thought they were going for (shiny boxes photography, LinkedIn respectability badges, press testimonials, top-drawer highest quality ultra power efficiency winner blah blah blah)

Long on marketing, short on anything approaching tangible
hero member
Activity: 702
Merit: 500
I just preordered one, mainly because the principals of this company seem the most legitimate to me.

I feel very comfortable that there will be profit to be made here, despite the claims by people of one trillion difficulty (or more) by the end of 2013.

There is ZERO CHANCE that difficulty will be 1 trillion by end of 2013.  there's a slim chance it might get to 1 billion but even that is a stretch, but definitely not 1 trillion!

its unlikely to get 1 trillion by end of 2014 either.  that would be an insanely unrealistic expectation.

Difficulty of 1 trillion is 7,000 Petahashes of network performance!  (aka 7 Exahashes).  the cfhance of the network being 8,000 times more power than today in just over a year seems far fetched.

hero member
Activity: 560
Merit: 500
I just preordered one, mainly because the principals of this company seem the most legitimate to me.

I feel very comfortable that there will be profit to be made here, despite the claims by people of one trillion difficulty (or more) by the end of 2013.

Out of curiosity, what particular principle do you feel that cointerra embodies that makes them so legitimate? I have read a good bit of their marketing materials too, and do not see how their lofty ambitions actually match company practices. They have excellent PR, but what does this PR really mean? Has BitSynCom and BFL really lowered the ball for principles in bitcoin mining so low that the first person to spout rhetoric doesn't have to back it up with proof first? I seem to remember BitSynCom had quite a bit of good rhetoric, community support, and seeming good will until the Avalon chip deal went up in flames.

I am not so quick to trust someone just due to pretty words. So far only a few small PCB makers seem to legitimately have principles. I'll put Cointerra in the same grouping when I see some action to back up the words.   

I hope we are not confusing 'principals' with 'principles' here. They have very different meanings.
member
Activity: 98
Merit: 10
I just preordered one, mainly because the principals of this company seem the most legitimate to me.

I feel very comfortable that there will be profit to be made here, despite the claims by people of one trillion difficulty (or more) by the end of 2013.

Out of curiosity, what particular principle do you feel that cointerra embodies that makes them so legitimate? I have read a good bit of their marketing materials too, and do not see how their lofty ambitions actually match company practices. They have excellent PR, but what does this PR really mean? Has BitSynCom and BFL really lowered the ball for principles in bitcoin mining so low that the first person to spout rhetoric doesn't have to back it up with proof first? I seem to remember BitSynCom had quite a bit of good rhetoric, community support, and seeming good will until the Avalon chip deal went up in flames.

I am not so quick to trust someone just due to pretty words. So far only a few small PCB makers seem to legitimately have principles. I'll put Cointerra in the same grouping when I see some action to back up the words.   
legendary
Activity: 1176
Merit: 1001
I just preordered one, mainly because the principals of this company seem the most legitimate to me.
This is the only reason that keeps cointerra alive.
sr. member
Activity: 404
Merit: 250
I just preordered one, mainly because the principals of this company seem the most legitimate to me.

I feel very comfortable that there will be profit to be made here, despite the claims by people of one trillion difficulty (or more) by the end of 2013.
hero member
Activity: 608
Merit: 500
OK maybe I've lost my mine but I'm seriously considering a wire transfer today split with a few other people lol.  In retrospect I should have ordered more hardware last year instead of buying these future miners now but oh well.
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250

Cointerra is little different than Hashfast and KncMiner in that they're selling a high end mining product that has performance higher than those that have come before at a lower price per GH. 


Unfortunately high performance is not going to give much of advancement against Russian Bitfury, because of cheap power cost in Russia --- USD 0.025 per kvh

Please source your claim of .025 per kwh..

https://estore.enerdata.net/power-market/russia-electricity-report.html

According to this study: "The electricity price is controlled by the State. In 2011, the average price reached US$11c/kWh for households and US$6.7c/kWh for industry, showing a strong increase compared to 2010."

my source is private, and I do not have any reason do not trust him. calculations made according to current USD/RUB rate and his electricity bill. East Siberian region.
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
eve is a retard and should die.

just ignore him. see his glowing yellow ignore button?


Does the ignore button become highlighted as more people ignore 'said' person?  With that being said, isn't even not even real??? Its always a repeated message that never has anything positive to say...sum bullshit like "show me the chips!!!!"
Lol, yes, the ignore button lights up as others ignore them.
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1018
HoneybadgerOfMoney.com Weed4bitcoin.com
eve is a retard and should die.

just ignore him. see his glowing yellow ignore button?


Does the ignore button become highlighted as more people ignore 'said' person?  With that being said, isn't even not even real??? Its always a repeated message that never has anything positive to say...sum bullshit like "show me the chips!!!!"
sr. member
Activity: 280
Merit: 250
Hell?
eve is a retard and should die.

just ignore him. see his glowing yellow ignore button?
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
...and REALLY hard to find...

Got a link eve? Cheesy
eve
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
The hardware doesn't likely cost more than $2k, and they want you to pay a 700% premium to make like $400 on a $14k investment. The numbers simply don't add up.

Drop the price to about $7k.

+1

and weren't they supposed to release their "something for everyone" product line "by the end of the month"??

Agreed, they did say they would offer 1-chip versions as well so hopefully thats still coming.  if they can make a 4-chip box they sure can make a 1-chip box... !

Much as i'd love to buy Cointerra's (or anyones) 2 TH box for $7k myself (thats $3500 per TH), its unrealistic at this point to expect them to sell us their gear for significantly less than their competitors are!

Lets just compare the price of the advanced mining hardware for delivery in the nov/dec timeframe :-

KnC's new pricing (i got my email from them a few hours ago, ie: today) is $4999 for a Jupiter 400 GH box (thats $12,497 per TH)
Hashfast's price for the baby Jet is $5800 for a 400 GH box (which is $14,500 per TH).  presumably they will re-price to compete with KnC in due course.
BitFury's October pricing is still $8000 for a 400 GH box ($20,000 per TH).
Cointerra's price is $13999 for a 2 TH box in Dec (ie: $7000 per TH)  (corrected price, thanks bcp!)




Extremely expensive, a $3 to $5 per gh/s is way more reasonable.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0


Hey shadizzle,

Try the Mining calculator at The Genesis Block:

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/

If you put in the specs for an AM blade, the returns fall off a cliff pretty rapidly. Unfortunately, with rising difficulty, lots of hardware will never make ROI.

Here's an interesting chart put together by a forum member:

http://decentralizedhashing.com/bitcoin-mining-equipment-table/

Thank you again Mr. Zombie! I really appreciate everyones help this is much help!!
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
Hey shadizzle,

Try the Mining calculator at The Genesis Block:

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/

If you put in the specs for an AM blade, the returns fall off a cliff pretty rapidly. Unfortunately, with rising difficulty, lots of hardware will never make ROI.

Here's an interesting chart put together by a forum member:

http://decentralizedhashing.com/bitcoin-mining-equipment-table/
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
Reserved

Watching this thread closely.  I absolutely love the debates and peoples thoughts here- really for a noob like me, this is EXTREMELY educational.   Thank you everyone!~!!!!!!!!!@!!!!!!!!!

Id love to purchase any of these units personally, just so high of cost, the only way I see being feasible is purchasing stock/shares from one of these big names out there.

Why is a blade considered such a poor investment to someone brand new to this?  Is it based purely because of difficulty mainly? or more aimed at the w/gh/s ratio? -  NOT trying to thread hyjack, just trying to stay up to speed Smiley
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
Much as i'd love to buy Cointerra's (or anyones) 2 TH box for $14k myself (thats $7000 per TH), its unrealistic at this point to expect them to sell us their gear for significantly less than their competitors are!

Lets just compare the price of the advanced mining hardware for delivery in the nov/dec timeframe :-

KnC's new pricing (i got my email from them a few hours ago, ie: today) is $4999 for a Jupiter 400 GH box (thats $12,497 per TH)
Yeah but you'll be hashing in November with that. Cointerra you'll be hashing in January, maybe late January. And if you only buy their chip possibly much later. Things really do devalue that fast in this space.

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