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Topic: CoinTerra Unveils a 2TH/s ASIC Bitcoin Miner : TerraMiner IV - page 2. (Read 18654 times)

donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
Oh, I don't mind preorders. I think a lot of people will be terribly dissapointed when they realize that no preorder means no profit.

This.  Preorder = risk.  Risk is the potential for profit.  I thing people are going to be terribly disapointed once companies have units in stock for immediate delivery.  Look at ASICMiner as an example.  I mean once built a company can do the same math a consumer can.  Future cashflow can be reduced to net present value.  If a company has a miner and it has a net present value of 50 BTC why would they sell it for less than 50 BTC?  They could simply use it to mine and generate >50 BTC.  Now if a company runs out of space, or power they may sell excess capacity for slightly less than net present value to increase demand but they days of massive "potential" profits are over.  100%, 200%, 300% gains per year.  Never going to happen with in stock miners.  Maybe 10% or 20% if you buy at the right time, have the right climate (cooling costs), and the low electrical costs.

Once again look at ASICMiner blade prices.  This is the same equipment used by ASICMiner.  People complain the prices are so high that all the potential profit is gone.  As the CEO of ASICMiner why would you see it for less?  If they (using their own projections on difficulty growth) project a blade will earn X BTC (discounted for risk & time value of money) it makes no sense to sell it for significantly less than X.  Shareholders would simply be subsidizing the profits of the buyers.  As a CEO looking to maximize the return for shareholder it doesn't really matter where the revenue comes from (sales or mining) the goal is to maximize revenue.

That being said some companies (BFL) have taken this to an asinine extreme so some backlack is inevitable but like you I really don't think most people appreciate what "in stock" prices are going to mean.  Another way to look at it is imagine you have a rig (or rigs) which produce 2 TH/s.  What would YOU sell it for?
full member
Activity: 172
Merit: 100
16k still too expensive. I would purchase immediately for 10k though.

you may want to revisit http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/ and set shipping date to jan/2014

10k is still way overpriced

they are supposed to announce their remaining product line "by the end of the month" unless they miss their second self imposed deadline. 

i think they must decide to ship 3x hashpower for the same price or slash prices by a third to live up to their own hype and leave any meat on the bone for their customers... or implement a SERIOUS protection plan. guarantee a return of invested btc, minimum, for anyone to take them seriously.
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
Oh, I don't mind preorders. I think a lot of people will be terribly dissapointed when they realize that no preorder means no profit.

Why would you sell a product in hand for less than you would get from mining with it?  Are there any asic manufacturers listed as charities?

16k still too expensive. I would purchase immediately for 10k though.
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 250
Tired of all the pre-announcements.   How about selling when your product is ready and ready to ship?

nicely spoken
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
Tired of all the pre-announcements.   How about selling when your product is ready and ready to ship?
hero member
Activity: 1118
Merit: 541
Haven't heard anything new in a few days. I wonder if lots of people are buying these units?

It seems like competitors will be able to demolish these prices by the time December rolls around. Who cares about efficiency at this point in the game?

Do you think they will try again or stick with BFL's prices?

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/

set to december

never roi Sad

they HAVE to reboot prices or increase hash power to ever sell a unit

if it were $4,000 cheaper, it would roi for about 2 seconds then become unprofitable and that is if difficulty does NOT increase any faster (fat chance!)


If they had some sort of miner protection plan in place it could make it viable. But they've yet to answer my inquiries about it and have not heard anymore since they said they were going to have a very "friendly" policy for delays (which is counter to their terms of sale).


full member
Activity: 172
Merit: 100
Haven't heard anything new in a few days. I wonder if lots of people are buying these units?

It seems like competitors will be able to demolish these prices by the time December rolls around. Who cares about efficiency at this point in the game?

Do you think they will try again or stick with BFL's prices?

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/

set to december

never roi Sad

they HAVE to reboot prices or increase hash power to ever sell a unit

if it were $4,000 cheaper, it would roi for about 2 seconds then become unprofitable and that is if difficulty does NOT increase any faster (fat chance!)
sr. member
Activity: 420
Merit: 250
Haven't heard anything new in a few days. I wonder if lots of people are buying these units?

It seems like competitors will be able to demolish these prices by the time December rolls around. Who cares about efficiency at this point in the game?

Do you think they will try again or stick with BFL's prices?
  I dont think many buyer for high end price and you are not going to preorder for 15kUSD for it.
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
Haven't heard anything new in a few days. I wonder if lots of people are buying these units?

It seems like competitors will be able to demolish these prices by the time December rolls around. Who cares about efficiency at this point in the game?

Do you think they will try again or stick with BFL's prices?
sr. member
Activity: 308
Merit: 250
decentralizedhashing.com
I'd say ASIC vendors are a "too good to be true" businesses. The point is that this madness will end soonish, mining will get "pro" and amateurs will be just cut out of the business, mining will be profitable only for those being able to design their own chips, cover NRE costs and then produce tons of chips at a small cost, "consumers" will just be totally cut out of the equation. Meanwhile, some see the huge business opportunity in getting advanced money by greedy customers, and they are just trying to exploit the short time window in which these pre-order shenanigans still work.
I think about this a lot.  This is why I made my website, to keep people informed of the best deals and support the companies that are keeping bitcoin decentralized.  If the greater share of the hashrate is controlled by a few large farms growth, stability and the core nature of bitcoin can become compromised.
hero member
Activity: 1118
Merit: 541


$15,750!?  To me, that says "Hi.  I'm Cointerra.  I'm only interested in talking to you if you have a TON of money laying around for an asic."

Anybody with any real interest in the bitcoin community would be willing to serve all customers, not just wealthy ones.

This is a very unfortunate mistake you are making.  It obviously only benefits very few with deep pockets, it is an absolute disgrace to the bitcoin community as a whole.  It has no value whatsoever to low-end consumers (miners) - the very people that brought bitcoin into existence.  What a horrible business model, nothing more than a quick exploit for big profits.

If you are interested, have a look at a company who serves the entire community:  AsicMiner (friedcat) has everything from low-end USB sticks to blades.  Something for everyone.  (You'll figure out after you fail that "something for everyone" was something you've overlooked while you were blinded by huge hash rates selling for tons of money)

Will it make you happy knowing that so many out there would love to own a product like this, but that you've completely priced most of them out?  You deserve to fail, miserably.


We actually have a full product line of various hashing rates and price points, in order to serve "something for everyone", that will be released later this month. We did an early unveiling of this highend product due to immense interest we have received.

I am sorry you wish that we fail, miserably. We are working extremely diligently to support this community and develop the most advanced ASIC yet.


What are the details of your miner protection plan equivalent?

You have not posted any details and your terms of sale leave much to be desired.



legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1018
I just don't get not accepting BTC.  That just seems insane.  They have to be the only ASIC/FPGA company yet that doesn't accept BTC.
To a CFO, or such investors as there might be, it make total sense to not accept BTC.  Every day's orders, a different sales price.  The extreme volatility.  The lack of liquidity and low cost cost exchange.  We all know the issues.

And, I'd hazard a guess: every single component of the product has to be paid in USD.  

So I can see a CFO saying, were the product already produced, "Okay, accept them.  I'll see what I can do in terms of risk management."  But to do so at t=0, with USD payments having to be made at t in {1...120}.  Not really insane at all.

More retarded argument of the day. Did you know about Bitpay? Consumer pays in BTC, company gets USD.

Not accepting BTC is simply ridiculous.
full member
Activity: 224
Merit: 100
Looking for places to invest. Nothing to see here.
legendary
Activity: 1121
Merit: 1003
If you can keep your schedule and accept CC payments, I can see this as a viable option.

Now the most important step for you is to have some device hashing in front of the cameras to prove your capabilities.

How far away are the first ASIC engineering samples?

good luck, even if they could accept cc. ROI negative

but let this thread, die!
sr. member
Activity: 280
Merit: 250
If you can keep your schedule and accept CC payments, I can see this as a viable option.

Now the most important step for you is to have some device hashing in front of the cameras to prove your capabilities.

How far away are the first ASIC engineering samples?
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
I just don't get not accepting BTC.  That just seems insane.  They have to be the only ASIC/FPGA company yet that doesn't accept BTC.
To a CFO, or such investors as there might be, it make total sense to not accept BTC.  Every day's orders, a different sales price.  The extreme volatility.  The lack of liquidity and low cost cost exchange.  We all know the issues.

And, I'd hazard a guess: every single component of the product has to be paid in USD. 

So I can see a CFO saying, were the product already produced, "Okay, accept them.  I'll see what I can do in terms of risk management."  But to do so at t=0, with USD payments having to be made at t in {1...120}.  Not really insane at all.

Your entire statement can be refuted with one word.

Bitpay

This.  Company can price in USD, customer pays in BTC and company receives USD in bank account the next day.  This isn't theoretical multiple ASIC manufacturers have done this to date.
legendary
Activity: 994
Merit: 1000
I just don't get not accepting BTC.  That just seems insane.  They have to be the only ASIC/FPGA company yet that doesn't accept BTC.
To a CFO, or such investors as there might be, it make total sense to not accept BTC.  Every day's orders, a different sales price.  The extreme volatility.  The lack of liquidity and low cost cost exchange.  We all know the issues.

And, I'd hazard a guess: every single component of the product has to be paid in USD.  

So I can see a CFO saying, were the product already produced, "Okay, accept them.  I'll see what I can do in terms of risk management."  But to do so at t=0, with USD payments having to be made at t in {1...120}.  Not really insane at all.

Your entire statement can be refuted with one word.

Bitpay


Not taking Bitcoin is like trying to sell grandma's hand-rolled tortilla's in Mexico and not accepting Peso's.
full member
Activity: 184
Merit: 100
"Unveil" usually means actually having something to show.

This whole "ASIC era" of bitcoin is turning out to be some real sad bullshit.
full member
Activity: 238
Merit: 100
I just don't get not accepting BTC.  That just seems insane.  They have to be the only ASIC/FPGA company yet that doesn't accept BTC.
To a CFO, or such investors as there might be, it make total sense to not accept BTC.  Every day's orders, a different sales price.  The extreme volatility.  The lack of liquidity and low cost cost exchange.  We all know the issues.

And, I'd hazard a guess: every single component of the product has to be paid in USD.  

So I can see a CFO saying, were the product already produced, "Okay, accept them.  I'll see what I can do in terms of risk management."  But to do so at t=0, with USD payments having to be made at t in {1...120}.  Not really insane at all.
sr. member
Activity: 251
Merit: 250
in dec 2013 / jan 14 at 15K price lol ?



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