[Come on guys!] Rant on underfunding of viable projects - page 2.

FrozenBit

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Probably there are too many similar projects, wasting valuable energies. But still, it's very hard to tell which one will have real success.

Another good point, but innovation still counts if you can still do the same thing faster. However, its detering for people to do that without support.

FrozenBit

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Quote from: Kluge on August 14, 2014, 04:07:01 PM

We can't even fund Core or Armory development at a sustainable level. -But we're always talking about funding NEW projects by unknowns. Almost every project which is able to acquire needed funding which doesn't snag corporate or angel funding is hyped so much with 200+ page threads over a couple months' time, "boring" fundamental stuff is completely ignored. Corporate/Angel funding really muddies the waters, too. For example - when I fund Armory, am I funding development or am I funding Trace? -and why should I donate to Core development when developers are being picked up by corporations? Those points don't seem too relevant though, given this wasn't always the case for either and they took "centralized" funding because we couldn't put out enough. -And Core has a separate problem, where donation options aren't really given to user.

I'm not sure if this community just doesn't have the capacity to sustainably fund fundamental development or if projects have just been going about it the wrong way.

I agree entirely. Too much wasted on hype projects. If we could give the funds contributed to something like etherum to the core devs I suspect well see a lot more progress than what we've seen. I'd love to see what the devs think about this if theure watching this thread.

Kluge

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We can't even fund Core or Armory development at a sustainable level. -But we're always talking about funding NEW projects by unknowns. Almost every project which is able to acquire needed funding which doesn't snag corporate or angel funding is hyped so much with 200+ page threads over a couple months' time, "boring" fundamental stuff is completely ignored. Corporate/Angel funding really muddies the waters, too. For example - when I fund Armory, am I funding development or am I funding Trace? -and why should I donate to Core development when developers are being picked up by corporations? Those points don't seem too relevant though, given this wasn't always the case for either and they took "centralized" funding because we couldn't put out enough. -And Core has a separate problem, where donation options aren't really given to user.

I'm not sure if this community just doesn't have the capacity to sustainably fund fundamental development or if projects have just been going about it the wrong way.

FrozenBit

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Quote from: juju on August 14, 2014, 03:28:56 PM

Quote from: FrozenBit on August 14, 2014, 09:29:50 AM

People say it, but ill say it again. Bitcoin is a community, however, recently I've noticed a theme. People are often missing the important innovative projects. I see things like etherum being funded but darkwallet, a project of a good supporter of the community runs dry until someone posts a rant like this.

I see the attractiveness of some of these projects, the promise of money. Do people realize that this way of moving forward won't change anything? These viable projects are often worth millions, look at bitgo. 12 million in funding due to their stellar team and wallet Tech. The money is deserved, however, this serves as an example of what and why funding can do for a project.

Simply look at some of these project's (will add more later on phone)

etherum
storj

These projects promise coins in return. Let's be honest most of these currencies won't amount to much (truth be told). I think we need to rethink how we decide projects to support. A lot of these projects are just hidden wealth, contributions go far.

A lot of these projects just resolve to VC. They shouldn't have to, they're often giving an amazing innovation to the community for free. Can't we show a little aptitude towards these projects?

I've talked to a lot of project owners. From the guys at darkwallet, bithalo, bitgo and so on... I know the difference funding can do to some of these projects. Remember trezor?

Adding more soon and adding links on phone atm
Some viable projects;

Darkwallet
bither
armory

If you have a project please list it below with a link a description thanks.

To not seem like a douchebag I didn't list my teams project you can find its announcement in my signature
address; 15yqW7NaGUbq1B3WZ6Th1m1XNaMaiSzHar

Whenever I see a Donate with Bitcoin button or an address added to a site I frequent I will donate ~10 USD.

Its sad to see how much money Stellar and Ethereum have raised in such a short period of time compared too worthy projects.

Just a side-note, maybe some places needing funding can offer a t-shirt or hat for a donation. (10 dollar t-shirt, accept a 25 dollar donation in BTC/Fiat) Not only would it help earn 10-15 dollar donations, but people who donated will then advertise the software by wearing the shirt.

That's a good idea. But I do agree there is a big discourse between hype and innovation.

juju

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Quote from: FrozenBit on August 14, 2014, 09:29:50 AM

People say it, but ill say it again. Bitcoin is a community, however, recently I've noticed a theme. People are often missing the important innovative projects. I see things like etherum being funded but darkwallet, a project of a good supporter of the community runs dry until someone posts a rant like this.

I see the attractiveness of some of these projects, the promise of money. Do people realize that this way of moving forward won't change anything? These viable projects are often worth millions, look at bitgo. 12 million in funding due to their stellar team and wallet Tech. The money is deserved, however, this serves as an example of what and why funding can do for a project.

Simply look at some of these project's (will add more later on phone)

etherum
storj

These projects promise coins in return. Let's be honest most of these currencies won't amount to much (truth be told). I think we need to rethink how we decide projects to support. A lot of these projects are just hidden wealth, contributions go far.

A lot of these projects just resolve to VC. They shouldn't have to, they're often giving an amazing innovation to the community for free. Can't we show a little aptitude towards these projects?

I've talked to a lot of project owners. From the guys at darkwallet, bithalo, bitgo and so on... I know the difference funding can do to some of these projects. Remember trezor?

Adding more soon and adding links on phone atm
Some viable projects;

Darkwallet
bither
armory

If you have a project please list it below with a link a description thanks.

To not seem like a douchebag I didn't list my teams project you can find its announcement in my signature
address; 1Hkcm5P1uwqonaz8R7vMaXtUkP3jmV7rbh

Whenever I see a Donate with Bitcoin button or an address added to a site I frequent I will donate ~10 USD.

Its sad to see how much money Stellar and Ethereum have raised in such a short period of time compared too worthy projects.

Just a side-note, maybe some places needing funding can offer a t-shirt or hat for a donation. (10 dollar t-shirt, accept a 25 dollar donation in BTC/Fiat) Not only would it help earn 10-15 dollar donations, but people who donated will then advertise the software by wearing the shirt.

FrozenBit

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Quote from: franky1 on August 14, 2014, 11:55:47 AM

Quote from: FrozenBit on August 14, 2014, 11:26:15 AM

Good point, but this isn't about short term gain. It's about substance and a viable ecosystem

my investments are not about personal profit (i got enough coin, so making money comes 5th place to me). but i only invest if that project is going to actually bring some BIG benefit to the bitcoin ecosystem.

and now you know why i tried getting info out of you frozenbit. why i tried asking you to add certain features (different log in methods or even a simple pushTX), and your replies.. well as you know i didnt help you out financially..

hmm.. that reminds me, the "subtle" part
7. dont let on to a business your interested in investing. just act like its due diligence or just being nosey

Besides frozenbit (http://frozenb.it) there are plentiful projects available. Especially armory. Immensely underfunded, but very popular. We've gotten support from the community, we've just recently hired 2 more people.

franky1

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Quote from: FrozenBit on August 14, 2014, 11:26:15 AM

Good point, but this isn't about short term gain. It's about substance and a viable ecosystem

my investments are not about personal profit (i got enough coin, so making money comes 5th place to me). but i only invest if that project is going to actually bring some BIG benefit to the bitcoin ecosystem.

and now you know why i tried getting info out of you frozenbit. why i tried asking you to add certain features (different log in methods or even a simple pushTX), and your replies.. well as you know i didnt help you out financially..

hmm.. that reminds me, the "subtle" part
7. dont let on to a business your interested in investing. just act like its due diligence or just being nosey

FrozenBit

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Quote from: franky1 on August 14, 2014, 10:38:17 AM

Quote from: commandrix on August 14, 2014, 10:18:20 AM

A lot of us really don't have a lot of Bitcoin to throw around. If it was me, I wouldn't mind doing a bit of investing if it meant a reasonable chance of making a good return on investment. And for me that means giving projects the same level of scrutiny that any smart investor on Wall Street would give to something new.

ive done ALOT of investing and if you do come to a point of having enough wealth to invest in a project keep these things in mind. oh and be subtle about how you ask for the info, you can tell more about the project by HOW they reply, more so than the details they reply with. which combined with these (atleast) 6 points will help you decide:

1. what is the purpose of the project
2. what niche market it will fill
3. what potential it has for growth/usage in the practical and real world
4. whats their 5 year plan
5. ask them to lay it out in specific detail.(most important)
6. ask for current progress and proof

if they seem evasive or very weak on the details, where it sounds more like a brain fart rather than a well thought out and planned project, DO NOT invest.

for every 1000 scammy money grabs idea's, you may only find the 100 brainfarts and of those 100 brainfarts you may find 1 single feasible project. so dont just throw your funds around.

Good point, but this isn't about short term gain. It's about substance and a viable ecosystem

franky1

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Activity: 4410

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Quote from: commandrix on August 14, 2014, 10:18:20 AM

A lot of us really don't have a lot of Bitcoin to throw around. If it was me, I wouldn't mind doing a bit of investing if it meant a reasonable chance of making a good return on investment. And for me that means giving projects the same level of scrutiny that any smart investor on Wall Street would give to something new.

ive done ALOT of investing and if you do come to a point of having enough wealth to invest in a project keep these things in mind. oh and be subtle about how you ask for the info, you can tell more about the project by HOW they reply, more so than the details they reply with. which combined with these (atleast) 6 points will help you decide:

1. what is the purpose of the project
2. what niche market it will fill
3. what potential it has for growth/usage in the practical and real world
4. whats their 5 year plan
5. ask them to lay it out in specific detail.(most important)
6. ask for current progress and proof

if they seem evasive or very weak on the details, where it sounds more like a brain fart rather than a well thought out and planned project, DO NOT invest.

for every 1000 scammy money grabs idea's, you may only find the 100 brainfarts and of those 100 brainfarts you may find 1 single feasible project. so dont just throw your funds around.

commandrix

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Activity: 798

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A lot of us really don't have a lot of Bitcoin to throw around. If it was me, I wouldn't mind doing a bit of investing if it meant a reasonable chance of making a good return on investment. And for me that means giving projects the same level of scrutiny that any smart investor on Wall Street would give to something new.

Beliathon

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https://youtu.be/PZm8TTLR2NU

Quote from: franky1 on August 14, 2014, 09:59:23 AM

etherium is a promise of making an altcoin where the blockchain stores contracts. its not even made yet and supposedly will be launched late 2014-early 2015. and instead of just launching it then, they greedily asked people to pay for their name to sit on a 'pre-paid' list. with a promise that one day they will receive ether.

in short a money grab effort much like BFL's shady pre-sale scheme.

Nailed it.

franky1

legendary

Activity: 4410

Merit: 4766

etherium is a promise of making an altcoin where the blockchain stores contracts. its not even made yet and supposedly will be launched late 2014-early 2015. and instead of just launching it then, they greedily asked people to pay for their name to sit on a 'pre-paid' list. with a promise that one day they will receive ether.

in short a money grab effort much like BFL's shady pre-sale scheme.

iluvpie60

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Activity: 700

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Quote from: FrozenBit on August 14, 2014, 09:29:50 AM

People say it, but ill say it again. Bitcoin is a community, however, recently I've noticed a theme. People are often missing the important innovative projects. I see things like etherum being funded but darkwallet, a project of a good supporter of the community runs dry until someone posts a rant like this.

I see the attractiveness of some of these projects, the promise of money. Do people realize that this way of moving forward won't change anything? These viable projects are often worth millions, look at bitgo. 12 million in funding due to their stellar team and wallet Tech. The money is deserved, however, this serves as an example of what and why funding can do for a project.

Simply look at some of these project's (will add more later on phone)

etherum
storj

These projects promise coins in return. Let's be honest most of these currencies won't amount to much (truth be told). I think we need to rethink how we decide projects to support. A lot of these projects are just hidden wealth, contributions go far.

A lot of these projects just resolve to VC. They shouldn't have to, they're often giving an amazing innovation to the community for free. Can't we show a little aptitude towards these projects?

I've talked to a lot of project owners. From the guys at darkwallet, bithalo, bitgo and so on... I know the difference funding can do to some of these projects. Remember trezor?

Adding more soon and adding links on phone atm
Some viable projects;

Darkwallet
bither
armory

If you have a project please list it below with a link a description thanks.

To not seem like a douchebag I didn't list my teams project you can find its announcement in my signature
address; 1Hkcm5P1uwqonaz8R7vMaXtUkP3jmV7rbh

A lot of people vote with their wallets(bitcoin wallets too!). But that is just how it is. Not many people have money or bitcoins to throw around you gotta remember this is a forum. Forums are generally places people come to to hang out and chill and type back and forth and learn. People are not primarily coming here to donate to anything and you gotta remember that, this isn't kickstarter, it is a forum where a lot of people come to and don't have money or bitcoin.

FrozenBit

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Quote from: DeboraMeeks on August 14, 2014, 09:31:32 AM

Could someone tell me about etherum, I dont know what it is because I havent been much here lately.

It's a new crypto platform that's supposed to promise ether currency.

DeboraMeeks

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Could someone tell me about etherum, I dont know what it is because I havent been much here lately.

FrozenBit

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Activity: 658

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People say it, but ill say it again. Bitcoin is a community, however, recently I've noticed a theme. People are often missing the important innovative projects. I see things like etherum being funded but darkwallet, a project of a good supporter of the community runs dry until someone posts a rant like this.

I see the attractiveness of some of these projects, the promise of money. Do people realize that this way of moving forward won't change anything? These viable projects are often worth millions, look at bitgo. 12 million in funding due to their stellar team and wallet Tech. The money is deserved, however, this serves as an example of what and why funding can do for a project.

Simply look at some of these project's (will add more later on phone)

etherum
storj

These projects promise coins in return. Let's be honest most of these currencies won't amount to much (truth be told). I think we need to rethink how we decide projects to support. A lot of these projects are just hidden wealth, contributions go far.

A lot of these projects just resolve to VC. They shouldn't have to, they're often giving an amazing innovation to the community for free. Can't we show a little aptitude towards these projects?

I've talked to a lot of project owners. From the guys at darkwallet, bithalo, bitgo and so on... I know the difference funding can do to some of these projects. Remember trezor?

Adding more soon and adding links on phone atm
Some viable projects;

Darkwallet
bither
armory

If you have a project please list it below with a link a description thanks.

To not seem like a douchebag I didn't list my teams project you can find its announcement in my signature
address for frozenbit; 15yqW7NaGUbq1B3WZ6Th1m1XNaMaiSzHar

Topic: [Come on guys!] Rant on underfunding of viable projects - page 2. (Read 2820 times)