Credit cards and gambling (tabcorp, Australia)

pinggoki

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So the worst-case scenario is a possible outlier case that only a small percentage of gamblers succumb into. That being said it's still something that should be looked upon and I think it is justified that banks are the ones who are supposed to impose restrictions on the gambler's behalf. Gambling addiction is just as bad as any other type of addiction out there and it's not something that could or should be downplayed no matter how absurd it may look or sound to you.

Quote from: agustina2 on October 02, 2021, 03:12:29 AM

Quote from: Fatunad on October 01, 2021, 03:16:31 PM

Quote from: DarkDays on September 30, 2021, 05:50:18 PM

Quote from: michellee on September 06, 2021, 02:20:58 AM

And if they know that there are abusing the credit card from the user, they can know because they will have a way to track the account and investigate. Even if the banks and the government prohibit using credit cards for gambling, the gambler will not have a problem because they will use the other way to continue gambling.

Yes, there will be no point in using credit cards for gambling the concept just doesn't add up to me. Governments want to crack down gambling itself so why then support a system i.e. banks that can provide credit cards to gamblers, possibly one of the most unreliable customers you could have.

In short, I find it problematic for both credit card providers as much as for the gamblers themselves due to their activities being ttracked as clear as day, which may even extend to affecting their credit card history.

There's no need for a ban but rather a more strict monitoring out of those credit card users which had really involved in gambling.Banks could able to do such thing and if there's banning then its clearly
theres mo reason behind that decision because they cant just impose any bans without any depth reason to do so.If they dont like gambling then they could ban it directly without attaching out
credit cards because we know that this isnt only the sole purpose on why credit cards exist on the first place.

Bank-issuing cards can just restrict gambling-related transactions. But you know, it will be easy for gambling sites to just ban it totally but since banks have different policies, it's now up for banks to do the job of banning credit card users. And not all do have credit cards that's why for me, it's not really alarming unless gambling sites have the record that most transactions on their platforms are with the use of credit cards.

Responsible gambling is the key here basically. For me, people should have all rights to their money, even if it came from their credit cards, but the fact remains that money should be spent wisely, and moves like these which could prevent future jeopardies would be beneficial not only on the person gambling's behalf but would also be beneficial to the banking institution. So it doesn't really matter who bans credit card usage for gambling, as long as rules are imposed, it's all good.

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Quote from: Hamphser on September 30, 2021, 02:54:55 PM

banks do know that it could possibly be used on gambling.They should have prohibited it on the first place if they dont really allow on using it on gambling

I doubt banks will prohibit something against their advantage. More usage of credit cards, the more interest they will get. The hard regulations might be the reason why banks are opting out the credit card transactions on gambling sites because of money laundering or anything along those lines.

But whatever it is, gambling sites should not be affected if credit card transactions will be ban. Also, a right way as some credit cardholders can't resist the temptation of using it more because they can't feel the pressure of hard spending as no money physically is involved.

agustina2

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Quote from: Fatunad on October 01, 2021, 03:16:31 PM

Quote from: DarkDays on September 30, 2021, 05:50:18 PM

Quote from: michellee on September 06, 2021, 02:20:58 AM

And if they know that there are abusing the credit card from the user, they can know because they will have a way to track the account and investigate. Even if the banks and the government prohibit using credit cards for gambling, the gambler will not have a problem because they will use the other way to continue gambling.

Yes, there will be no point in using credit cards for gambling the concept just doesn't add up to me. Governments want to crack down gambling itself so why then support a system i.e. banks that can provide credit cards to gamblers, possibly one of the most unreliable customers you could have.

In short, I find it problematic for both credit card providers as much as for the gamblers themselves due to their activities being ttracked as clear as day, which may even extend to affecting their credit card history.

There's no need for a ban but rather a more strict monitoring out of those credit card users which had really involved in gambling.Banks could able to do such thing and if there's banning then its clearly
theres mo reason behind that decision because they cant just impose any bans without any depth reason to do so.If they dont like gambling then they could ban it directly without attaching out
credit cards because we know that this isnt only the sole purpose on why credit cards exist on the first place.

Bank-issuing cards can just restrict gambling-related transactions. But you know, it will be easy for gambling sites to just ban it totally but since banks have different policies, it's now up for banks to do the job of banning credit card users. And not all do have credit cards that's why for me, it's not really alarming unless gambling sites have the record that most transactions on their platforms are with the use of credit cards.

Fatunad

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Quote from: DarkDays on September 30, 2021, 05:50:18 PM

Quote from: michellee on September 06, 2021, 02:20:58 AM

And if they know that there are abusing the credit card from the user, they can know because they will have a way to track the account and investigate. Even if the banks and the government prohibit using credit cards for gambling, the gambler will not have a problem because they will use the other way to continue gambling.

Yes, there will be no point in using credit cards for gambling the concept just doesn't add up to me. Governments want to crack down gambling itself so why then support a system i.e. banks that can provide credit cards to gamblers, possibly one of the most unreliable customers you could have.

In short, I find it problematic for both credit card providers as much as for the gamblers themselves due to their activities being ttracked as clear as day, which may even extend to affecting their credit card history.

There's no need for a ban but rather a more strict monitoring out of those credit card users which had really involved in gambling.Banks could able to do such thing and if there's banning then its clearly
theres mo reason behind that decision because they cant just impose any bans without any depth reason to do so.If they dont like gambling then they could ban it directly without attaching out
credit cards because we know that this isnt only the sole purpose on why credit cards exist on the first place.

DarkDays

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Quote from: michellee on September 06, 2021, 02:20:58 AM

And if they know that there are abusing the credit card from the user, they can know because they will have a way to track the account and investigate. Even if the banks and the government prohibit using credit cards for gambling, the gambler will not have a problem because they will use the other way to continue gambling.

Yes, there will be no point in using credit cards for gambling the concept just doesn't add up to me. Governments want to crack down gambling itself so why then support a system i.e. banks that can provide credit cards to gamblers, possibly one of the most unreliable customers you could have.

In short, I find it problematic for both credit card providers as much as for the gamblers themselves due to their activities being ttracked as clear as day, which may even extend to affecting their credit card history.

Hamphser

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Quote from: wxa7115 on September 30, 2021, 02:49:06 PM

Quote from: michellee on September 26, 2021, 03:09:49 AM

Quote from: Ryker1 on September 24, 2021, 04:59:02 PM

Well, I agree with the banning of credit cards in gambling because that is very tempted to borrow cash from the bank just to gamble.
It should always gamble of what they can afford and not the fund that they borrowed just to gamble and I don't see the problem there, in fact --this has a good impact between the gamblers and the casino owners, it has a fewer chance that you will become a burden by a debt. The government will take action if they saw that this is not good for the community even though there is revenue but in exchange for damaging people life once they are addicted to it.

Most people will not get revenue from the gambling games instead of losing their money for the most. Maybe the banks and the government do not want people to lose their money because of using credit cards to play gambling. The banning of credit cards can protect people from using them for the wrong purpose, such as playing gambling. But that can attract people to search for the other way to keep playing gambling so the government and the banks should be aware of that.

But that is the issue here, if we were talking about debit cards then this would bother me because as long as you are using your money in an activity that is legal then you should be free to use your money in whatever way you want.

But they are banning the use of credit cards for gambling, if a person borrowed money from a friend with the excuse he was short on cash to pay rent or other necessities and instead they gambled that money away we will think that to be wrong and the same is happening here, those that are gambling with credit cards are doing so with money that is not theirs so the banks are withing their rights to disallow this use if that is what they want.

For sure Banks are pretty aware on how things had been done because this is something that have its pro's and con's because people could really make use their credit cards whatever purpose it maybe and for sure

banks do know that it could possibly be used on gambling.They should have prohibited it on the first place if they dont really allow on using it on gambling neither also in debit cards too if they are really intently just
make use for other purpose.

They do came into such extent where banning would be only the solution and for sure banks do really agree on that.

wxa7115

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Quote from: michellee on September 26, 2021, 03:09:49 AM

Quote from: Ryker1 on September 24, 2021, 04:59:02 PM

Well, I agree with the banning of credit cards in gambling because that is very tempted to borrow cash from the bank just to gamble.
It should always gamble of what they can afford and not the fund that they borrowed just to gamble and I don't see the problem there, in fact --this has a good impact between the gamblers and the casino owners, it has a fewer chance that you will become a burden by a debt. The government will take action if they saw that this is not good for the community even though there is revenue but in exchange for damaging people life once they are addicted to it.

Most people will not get revenue from the gambling games instead of losing their money for the most. Maybe the banks and the government do not want people to lose their money because of using credit cards to play gambling. The banning of credit cards can protect people from using them for the wrong purpose, such as playing gambling. But that can attract people to search for the other way to keep playing gambling so the government and the banks should be aware of that.

But that is the issue here, if we were talking about debit cards then this would bother me because as long as you are using your money in an activity that is legal then you should be free to use your money in whatever way you want.

But they are banning the use of credit cards for gambling, if a person borrowed money from a friend with the excuse he was short on cash to pay rent or other necessities and instead they gambled that money away we will think that to be wrong and the same is happening here, those that are gambling with credit cards are doing so with money that is not theirs so the banks are withing their rights to disallow this use if that is what they want.

michellee

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Quote from: Ryker1 on September 24, 2021, 04:59:02 PM

Well, I agree with the banning of credit cards in gambling because that is very tempted to borrow cash from the bank just to gamble.
It should always gamble of what they can afford and not the fund that they borrowed just to gamble and I don't see the problem there, in fact --this has a good impact between the gamblers and the casino owners, it has a fewer chance that you will become a burden by a debt. The government will take action if they saw that this is not good for the community even though there is revenue but in exchange for damaging people life once they are addicted to it.

Most people will not get revenue from the gambling games instead of losing their money for the most. Maybe the banks and the government do not want people to lose their money because of using credit cards to play gambling. The banning of credit cards can protect people from using them for the wrong purpose, such as playing gambling. But that can attract people to search for the other way to keep playing gambling so the government and the banks should be aware of that.

iTradeChips

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While this is being discussed, I did some research and thought to myself that this might be actually a good instance, as less and less people being controlled by the credit card companies, then less and less people will likely to gamble or use gambling sites online, even the small time online casinos that lets you do small bets. Less people gambling then less people put down by crippling debt. Surely there would also be more better ways of making people responsible gamblers.

harizen

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Quote from: adzino on September 23, 2021, 07:27:01 PM

Why even talk about credit cards when you have crypto currencies to gamble with? The banks were never friendly with fiat casinos. They take every opportunity to ban or block users access to their cards as soon as they see a transaction made to a casino. I know they do it to "protect" their customers, but this was a choice made by their customer. Why is the bank interfering? And this is one of the reason why centralized banks are being hated right now. Use crypto currencies and play in crypto casinos. They are much better and more fair than your traditional online casino.

Not all gamblers are into crypto-gambling. And you are wrong that banks are not friendly with fiat casinos. It's been ages already that banks are dealing with fraud-related activities with credit cards in fiat casinos but still, they are not totally banning the use of it since the purpose is "convenience" and banks are getting profits from it. It means they can handle the case and able to trace those moles.

Quote from: adzino on September 23, 2021, 07:27:01 PM

They take every opportunity to ban or block users access to their cards as soon as they see a transaction made to a casino. I know they do it to "protect" their customers, but this was a choice made by their customer. Why is the bank interfering?

On what part does the bank interfering with that? Credit cards will not be blocked if transactions are smooth even it was on fiat casinos. Can you elaborate what's your point there or give an example much better.

Quote from: adzino on September 23, 2021, 07:27:01 PM

And this is one of the reason why centralized banks are being hated right now.

Just because of gambling? lol .

Fiat casinos are supposed to be centralized and they are like that since the beginning. They are under regulatory. What do you expect on fiat casinos?

Dragonfund

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Quote from: Cling18 on September 08, 2021, 12:56:36 AM

If banks would ban credit card usage for gambling, people would be responsible for using their credit cards. We all know that most people have fallen into gambling addiction because they rely on their credit card funds where they could easily gamble through it. If banks could control it, then they could also control or lessen the gambling addiction of some of their users.

Gambling is supposed to be fun, especially for sports fans, and not to become hooked to it, but the truth is that many people have turned it into a full-time career. I don't see anything wrong with it but some folks simply don't know when to quit. They would rather go the extra mile to find finances to play more at the risk of their demise than accept their loss and restructure their flow. This is one of the reasons why the government is concerned.
This is not the best approach pushing blame on the banks, they exist to make a profit, and it is the responsibility of the consumer to manage their funds as they see fit. Furthermore, the government received internal revenue from these banks by charging gamblers fees, why turning back now.

Sterbens

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Quote from: adzino on September 23, 2021, 07:27:01 PM

Why even talk about credit cards when you have crypto currencies to gamble with? The banks were never friendly with fiat casinos. They take every opportunity to ban or block users access to their cards as soon as they see a transaction made to a casino. I know they do it to "protect" their customers, but this was a choice made by their customer. Why is the bank interfering? And this is one of the reason why centralized banks are being hated right now. Use crypto currencies and play in crypto casinos. They are much better and more fair than your traditional online casino.

We should bet with crypto and don't want to make fiat a betting tool. Indeed, lately credit card transactions with casino have become the target of account blocking. So with crypto casinos already providing solutions, we are much more confident in crypto casinos to bet on big and small stakes. Because as far as I have experienced betting in fiat casino, especially in the online casino available in my country, on average everything is just manipulating and creating unfair play. A prominent comparison we can see in crypto casino.

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Quote from: Wakate on September 25, 2021, 02:17:10 PM

Quote from: timerland on September 07, 2021, 06:41:17 PM

I honestly don't see credit cards as being much of an issue.

As you mentioned, only 14% of people actually use credit cards to gamble.

The vast majority of these people are going to be legitimate gamblers. Only a small portion of them are going to be frauds - but that applies to virtually every payment processor/method.

Many fraud are being done through credit card which hard left many person to discriminate the use of it. Innocwy people end up being hacked if the mistakenly disclose there information or hackers linking credits to get the funds it. It all left to the government to do something about it not leaving it to the bank to decide.

You cant really tell if those reasoning of being hacked would really be real or just an alibi from the user itself but with some investigation or something like that which could really be proven out.

When it comes to decision making then this is something that really needs some both take about or in regards the situation and also this is only one of the angle of possible usage of credit cards
which isnt really just limited for this one.

Not really that surprising that CC's would be mainly used but its not bad on having that initiative on banning but it is way too much considering this isnt the only usage of these
cards but people are really abusing it.

Wakate

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Quote from: timerland on September 07, 2021, 06:41:17 PM

I honestly don't see credit cards as being much of an issue.

As you mentioned, only 14% of people actually use credit cards to gamble.

The vast majority of these people are going to be legitimate gamblers. Only a small portion of them are going to be frauds - but that applies to virtually every payment processor/method.

Many fraud are being done through credit card which hard left many person to discriminate the use of it. Innocwy people end up being hacked if the mistakenly disclose there information or hackers linking credits to get the funds it. It all left to the government to do something about it not leaving it to the bank to decide.

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Well, I agree with the banning of credit cards in gambling because that is very tempted to borrow cash from the bank just to gamble.
It should always gamble of what they can afford and not the fund that they borrowed just to gamble and I don't see the problem there, in fact --this has a good impact between the gamblers and the casino owners, it has a fewer chance that you will become a burden by a debt. The government will take action if they saw that this is not good for the community even though there is revenue but in exchange for damaging people life once they are addicted to it.

crzy

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Quote from: Johnyz on September 24, 2021, 04:03:03 PM

Quote from: hello_good_sir on September 24, 2021, 07:44:18 AM

I don't see a problem with banning credit cards.

There is a reason why nobody in the cryptosphere is willing to accept credit card/Paypal payments.

It's way too clunky, there are huge transaction costs, and there are significant drawbacks such as the risk of getting carding fraud. If it's not worth it for the casino, why force them?

Thought its more convenient to use cards online, I also not agree to use it in your gambling activities since its not your real money, and banks might charge you more if you are not able to pay it on time. There’s a lot of options to fund your gambling activities, if you can’t do it with your own money better not to gamble at all.

This is being greedy for me, borrowing money is not good for your gambling addiction because it can make you broke especially if you failed to control that addiction. Credit card is not good if you abused using it, charges and fees might already kill you and the pressure that you will get from the bank, its stressful so better not to use it at all.

Johnyz

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Quote from: hello_good_sir on September 24, 2021, 07:44:18 AM

I don't see a problem with banning credit cards.

There is a reason why nobody in the cryptosphere is willing to accept credit card/Paypal payments.

It's way too clunky, there are huge transaction costs, and there are significant drawbacks such as the risk of getting carding fraud. If it's not worth it for the casino, why force them?

Thought its more convenient to use cards online, I also not agree to use it in your gambling activities since its not your real money, and banks might charge you more if you are not able to pay it on time. There’s a lot of options to fund your gambling activities, if you can’t do it with your own money better not to gamble at all.

wxa7115

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Quote from: fiulpro on September 06, 2021, 01:06:34 AM

I remember the time I made the last topic about how the credit cards might be banned for the future gamblers. Apparently according to the tabcorp, banks are supposed to be responsible for the credit card bans.

They also provided the stats that only 14% of the users use credit cards and most of them use it responsibly. Therefore the ban would be enforced by the banks and not by any government and the authority.

At the same time, there was a statement that I did like in the whole news:

Quote

“If we got more information from the banks that a card was suspect, we could shut it down,” he added. “If the banks notified us that this was a problem, we would be able to stop dealing with that problem, but this flow of information doesn't happen.”

-Exactly the problem here.
The governmental bodies and the banks thoroughly oppose gambling sometimes but at the same time they are not working together with the companies to make sure it's safe and more practical and therefore it's indeed hard for them to point fingers even though they did not try to work together.

I do think this sends a strong message about how things can be done in a better way, what do you think about it ?

https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/13007/tabcorp-banks-should-be-responsible-for-online-gambling-credit-card-bans

You have a point however the fact that we are talking about credit cards and not your regular bank accounts means at least to me that banks can do whatever they want, after all the money that you have available as credit in credit cards doesn't really belong to you but to the bank, and if they do not want you to spend that money in a casino then they are within their rights to block your card if that is what they want.

Now this will be completely different if we were talking about banks blocking your debit card, after all if gambling is legal in your country then you are within your rights to use your money in whatever way you want and if any bank did that to me I'll close my account and look for another one.

milewilda

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Quote from: hello_good_sir on September 24, 2021, 07:44:18 AM

I don't see a problem with banning credit cards.

There is a reason why nobody in the cryptosphere is willing to accept credit card/Paypal payments.

It's way too clunky, there are huge transaction costs, and there are significant drawbacks such as the risk of getting carding fraud. If it's not worth it for the casino, why force them?

I have seen recently a crypto casino had made out some integrations about credit card payment deposits method.I just forgot the name
but eventually this had been already possible. https://bitedge.com/blog/bitstarz-becomes-the-1st-crypto-casino-with-credit-card-deposits/
When it comes to banning or something like this then it is usually in between banks and government neither gov't had really taken out those considerations
or would really be having that mutual agreement or does depend.

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Quote from: fiulpro on September 06, 2021, 01:06:34 AM

I remember the time I made the last topic about how the credit cards might be banned for the future gamblers. Apparently according to the tabcorp, banks are supposed to be responsible for the credit card bans.

They also provided the stats that only 14% of the users use credit cards and most of them use it responsibly. Therefore the ban would be enforced by the banks and not by any government and the authority.

At the same time, there was a statement that I did like in the whole news:

Quote

“If we got more information from the banks that a card was suspect, we could shut it down,” he added. “If the banks notified us that this was a problem, we would be able to stop dealing with that problem, but this flow of information doesn't happen.”

-Exactly the problem here.
The governmental bodies and the banks thoroughly oppose gambling sometimes but at the same time they are not working together with the companies to make sure it's safe and more practical and therefore it's indeed hard for them to point fingers even though they did not try to work together.

I do think this sends a strong message about how things can be done in a better way, what do you think about it ?

https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/13007/tabcorp-banks-should-be-responsible-for-online-gambling-credit-card-bans

Here everything is wrapped in a general purpose that exists in all countries but they do not say it very well totally, which is The Business Model, they do not make efforts to have a radical prohibition, they give a certain tolerance (and they assume a certain tolerance knowing that people are using it for gambling). If they cut off all the benefits that many use it for gambling, people will no longer be interested in acquiring credit cards, therefore they will not enjoy the debts and interests that guarantee profits for them.

Over time, they have to accept that the technology that improves economies, there is gambling and other activities that people seek and that many prohibit, if they refuse this, they would be dying their business little by little. And in addition to this, they are interested in generating money, the concern about possible addiction to gambling or other similar problems are simply masks.

Topic: Credit cards and gambling (tabcorp, Australia) (Read 416 times)