Topic: Cryptopia stole our coins (Read 334 times)

how can i make a complaint against CSC team? they are saying this problem happens because of low confirm number from cryptopia and blockchain rolled back those nonexistent coins . so blockchain didn't hide anything. maybe if this problem was because of corrupted and scam blockchain i could make a complement against csc team but blockchain was ok so i dont think i can make a complement against them.

Where do you live? Have you done some research on CSC? Have you filled any complaint yet?

Try contacting the CSC team as well and ask them to help, the way you did with Cryptopia.
If they come up with a good and reasonable answer then good.
Otherwise, tell them you are going to file a complaint against them.

Daily volume is less than 6k USD, I think it doesn't worth but still, try.  

I send many tickets in cryptopia but they did not  answer me so I made a complaint against them to New Zeland Financial Dispute Resolution www.fdr.org.nz after that they contacted me by email.



i send my info to www.fdr.org.nz and they send it to cryptopia
 Good Afternoon Cryptopia,
 

Financial Dispute Resolution has received the following complaint From Mr -------:

 

hi
first i want to apologize for my english language.
my problem with cryptopia is they sold me something that didn't exist and take my 1.5 btc (bitcoin) for it. and now they do not give my btc back.

What happened::

On the 06/28/2017 I noted that the exchange rate for CSC (casinocoin) went down on Cryptopia, as a long-term holder I wanted to use this chance to buy more CSC and deposited 1 BTC. It looked like someone prepared a pump on the market with a lot of buying/selling into themselves. I placed a buy of 1/5 BTC which was filled over the next hours. As I was expecting more movement on the market and so I did not withdraw those coins. Over the following days, the market had some swings.

after few days I decided to take 500.000 CSC off while waiting on my orders. The withdrawal failed. I contacted support about it. On the 6/29/2017 5:39:10 PM I got a reply from support telling me: 51% attacks hapend (document 1). It appears there may have been a 51% attack on the CSC network, so we have placed it into maintenance while we investigate this further." I noticed several other coins had been placed into maintenance for the same reason.

The following days I opened several tickets asking about the status and when I would get my coins. I had been told the "maintenance" or "investigation" would be still on. At this point in time, Cryptopia must have already known that their wallets are empty and they have suffered an attack on their exchange.

Have a look on my filed tickets and Cryptopias response on them before I sum up what happened.

An attacker prepared this for several days by causing double spends to deposit coins to Cryptopia. Cryptopias system didn't detect it for some reasons:

1) They were fine with 6 confirmations on a high-speed coin
2) Getting a huge % of the total coin supply deposited from a newbie account did not cause a red flag
3) Huge volume (in relation) on a market that has been slow for months, did not cause a red flag
4) Failed deposits did not cause a red flag

and the worst:

5) Once a deposit confirms, it will be credited to your account in their database. AT NO POINT IN TIME does their system validate if the balances for each user and their total amount of holdings stored in the database match the amount of coins in their wallets. Therefore, Cryptopia allowed trading on a market with coins they didn't even have.

So if you trade on Cryptopia and everything works fine, they make money off it. If something fails, they will blame the everyone except Themselves.

Those things could have been detected if Cryptopia would do its homework and just validate balances or several checks that highlight strange movements on markets.

Cryptopia is not only not willing to reimburse my lost which is their fault, they clearly state that basically every loss of fund because of whatever issues is not their responsibility.

I either want my 1.07 million CasinoCoin or my initially deposited BTC (1.5 btc).
1.07 milion csc now worth near 200 btc but i want just my 1.5 btc.

thanks.

 

I either want my 1.07 million CasinoCoin or my initially deposited BTC (1.5 btc).

 

Attached is the correspondence we have had.


Can you please contact Mr --------- regarding his complaint.  I’ve included him in this email for transparency.



after that cryptopia finally answered me


Hi Mr -----------,

 

As you are aware, CSC was the victim of a 51% attack. Cryptopia regards protection from 51% attacks as the job of the coin developers (as do all major exchanges). At the time of the attack CSC required 20 confirmations on Cryptopia and if the coin developers had raised any issue with our number of confirmations we would have adjusted this. CSC had a network with a very low hash rate which led to a coin with questionable security and stability. Those who create and maintain a coin are far more responsible for the hash rate than an exchange that hosts it.


Please note that when a 51% attack occurs, rogue nodes commit blocks to the chain and then roll back the chain, invalidating what was already confirmed. Please look at this link for further information on 51% attacks: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/1/51-attack.asp


We have made attempts to work with the new CSC development team toward a solution for our customers. At this time there has been no agreement made. Unfortunately, without the coin developers working with us to create a solution we are unable to refund your losses.


Regards,

Cryptopia Dispute Resolutions

 


arvin
 
hi again

first of all At the time of the attack CSC required 6 confirmations
not 20 . if was 20 damage was lower .
If cryptopia had sufficient confirms around 200 for a low hashrate
coin with very fast blocktimes, none of this would have happened. coin
Developers cannot set confirmation times on an exchange or how they
check transactions against the their database and the blockchain.
Developers have 0 access to the exchange.
and protection from 51% attacks is not job of the coin developers .
and if cryptopia security was like all major exchanges this problem
was not happened

and this is csc team answer:


After thorough analysis, we concluded that the attacker(s) were able
to falsely deposit some 9.7 million CSS to Cryptopia without actually
having those coins in their possession. While Cryptopia tells its
users that the coin developers are responsible for the loss, analysis
of the blockchain shows a different story:



More than 200 double spent deposits took place
41 of those deposits were successful
All double spent transactions were automatically rolled back by the
CasinoCoin blockchain and there was no successful fork
Most transactions rolled back within 1-2 blocks, the double spends
that succeeded had rollbacks between 10-60 blocks
The attack continued for eight days
Cryptopia claims block rollbacks of 300 blocks took place, this is not true
Cryptopia claims there was 1.2 Thash involved, this is not true, there
was a max of about 800 MHash during the attack
Cryptopia had set block confirmations to only six blocks for deposits
Cryptopia had no checks of their wallet against the blockchain at any time
Cryptopia only depends on its own database instead of the coin’s
blockchain after the six confirmations
Cryptopia allowed for 25% of CSS total market capital to be deposited
by a user(s), without that setting off any flags as a potentially
suspicious transaction
Only when a large withdrawal request was no longer possible did they
detect something was wrong
We tried to work out a solution with Cryptopia but they demanded we
deposited the missing 9.7 million coins or alter the blockchain. It is
obvious that neither were viable options for the CasinoCoin team
As an alternative we asked for a detailed list of BTC buys that would
be required to rollback the malicious transactions and return the
original BTC to the users. Cryptopia refused to supply this
Cryptopia decided to walk away, de-list CasinoCoin from their exchange
and leave users with their losses



and if it was csc team fault (which is not) It has nothing to do with
me. cryptopia can make a Complaint against CSC team and get back their
losses. cryptopia sold me Something that didn't exist and must give
back same money that i gave to them . is really simple.



cryptopia

Hi again,

I can your email references a post that the CasinoCoin team made regarding the attack. Many of the figures and the information in this post are factually incorrect.

Additionally, we proposed that during their coin swap they created extra coins (or used leftover coins from the swap) to replace the missing coins from the 51% attack. The CasinoCoin team refused to do this and instead kept the leftover coins from the swap; this can be seen on their website in the coin swap conclusion news release. We have made many attempts to come to a solution with the CasinoCoin team and without them working with us we are unable to refund your losses.

Regards,
Cryptopia Dispute Resolutions



arvin

hi
(again apologize for my English. I hope you can read my writing)
this problem happened because your site security was low. why should they give you coins that you lost? it's nonsense. in your logic when bitfinex or BitStamp and btc-e hacked they should blamed bitcoin and ask bitcoin devs to create that lost coin again. but its never going to happen. not bitcoin or other coins will not do that. so cryptopia should take responsibility like bitfinex and btc-e and... and give my money back because I send my money to your site and i don't know anyone except cryptopia . those sites give the user all of theire coins back but i want just my 1.5 btc not 1.07 million csc ( now worth 150 btc)
and as I said before if it was csc team fault It has nothing to do with
me. cryptopia can make a Complaint against CSC team and get back their
losses. you guys sold me Something that didn't exist and must give
back same money that I gave to you . is really simple.



cryotopia

Hi again,

Cryptopia was not hacked, the CSC coin network was compromised. We only facilitate trades between users on the CSC network. You can make a complaint against the CSC team to attempt to regain your losses.

I'm using crytopia do for keeping my altcoin. I feel so bad when I read your posts. If this is true then they did lose your CSC and blame others.
you deserve to be compensated in the amount of CSC that you have lost. 200 btc is huge amount. you should go to court. Maybe I should use a different exchange instead of cryto

A majority attack have nothing to do with exchange
The problem is with CSC itself
I think this is your bad luck
Feels bad man

Better keep your BTC and let the FBI raid it. They did this before with Mega and Kim Dotcom. Newzealand seems to work hard to become a haven for Internet scammers.

in cause you should get your deserved 200 btc, please do us all a favour and bomb the company.

i did use this . cryptopia send them this . and they send it to me

As you are aware, CSC was the victim of a 51% attack. Cryptopia regards protection from 51% attacks as the job of the coin developers (as do all major exchanges). At the time of the attack CSC required 20 confirmations on Cryptopia and if the coin developers had raised any issue with our number of confirmations we would have adjusted this. CSC had a network with a very low hash rate which led to a coin with questionable security and stability. Those who create and maintain a coin are far more responsible for the hash rate than an exchange that hosts it.


Please note that when a 51% attack occurs, rogue nodes commit blocks to the chain and then roll back the chain, invalidating what was already confirmed. Please look at this link for further information on 51% attacks: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/1/51-attack.asp


We have made attempts to work with the new CSC development team toward a solution for our customers. At this time there has been no agreement made. Unfortunately, without the coin developers working with us to create a solution we are unable to refund your losses.


Regards,

Cryptopia Dispute Resolutions

 

Maybe because the problem was not in cryptopia but the blockchain itself of casino tokens you should research what really happened to casinocoins if it really had an 51% attack or just turned out to be a ponzi scheme. There should be threads or ANN about casinocoins here you can email them to really know what happened.

I doubt they will repay those CSC coins based on your claimed valuation of 200 BTC. That would be 2 mil USD or nearly 3 mil New Zealand dollars. Crypto exchanges in countries like NZ do not offer the same deposit insurance system or asset protection guarantees which banks traditionally provide to their customers. The courts (if you go so far as to use lawyers in NZ to pursue a claim of damages) might look at it as a high risk investment and therefore a risk you should have reckoned with when you bought the 1 mil CSC.

You might stand a chance if you insist on being compensated with partial reparation. I don’t believe they will easily and willingly give you 200 BTC. That would be too easy.

If your valuation is correct then those coins were worth 200BTC and that is more than 2 million dollars at current prices that is more than enough reasons to try to do everything you can to get that money back or at least a portion of it, maybe the lawsuit it is not going to proceed but if you do nothing you are never going to see those coins again.

That is the problem with these shit exchanges! Users are always at their mercy and their customer care service is always non-existent. You can look for others with similar situation and submit a complaint to the New Zealand Financial Dispute Resolution website since cryptopia is a New Zealand based company. Follow this guideline posted by this btctalk user on how to proceed.

If you were stolen money in real life what would you do? you would probably go to the police and hire a lawyer, and that's what you should do, you should hire a lawyer and report this case to the police I believe you will have a better chance of solving your problem. here is a forum where each person is anonymous and you limit yourself to posting so your problem is solved will not do any good. hire a lawyer and report the case to the police.

" The company is based in Christchurch, New Zealand and has been around since 2014 and was founded by Adam Clark 
 and Rob Dawson
. "

source: https://www.bestbitcoinexchange.net/en/cryptopia-co-nz-scam-or-not/

The owners:

Adam Clark 

Rob Dawson

What should I do?
They can't just take my btc and sell me something that not exist and tell me we can't do anything about it .

I bought my 1070000 csc 7 months ago. 1 month ago csc team takes all csc from users and gives them 1000 csc instead of 1 csc . So if price was 1000 sat after swap goes to 1 sat

A coin swap happened for csc few weeks ago and csc team give 1000 csc instead of 1 old csc to users . 20 sat is new csc price but mine was old csc so 20 sat means 20000 sat for old csc . 20000sat x1070000=214 btc

It sounds like Cryptopia required very few confirmations before crediting CasinoCoin deposits, and they had no system in place to flag suspicious deposits -- like when 25% of the supply got deposited to the exchange over a short period of time. So after the 51% attack occurred, Cryptopia was overrun by double spends and their platform allowed the attacker to drain exchange funds.

This was catalyzed by a bona fide attack on the CasinoCoin chain, but the losses were largely Cryptopia's fault.


I'm not sure where you're getting those prices from. Coinmarketcap prices CSC at 17 satoshis.

Exactly, when you realize that they have withdrawal problems on bigger withdrawals, supposedly as a "safety" protocol, but they are able to credit 9 million casinocoins to a user's account without any security concerns, you realise how absurd that is.

They should have thoroughly researched the risk of a 51% attack in this case, before listing this wallet.

Your request of a refund is very very fair. However I don't know how you got your 200 BTC valuation. Casinocoins are currently traded at just under 20 sats, meaning that the amount you stored with them would be worth 0.2 BTC right now.

I doubt they'll actively try to fulfill compensation for their customers, however. They don't seem that willing to do anything right now on the support end.

Cryptopia security is really bad . They will let anyone came in deposit and withdraw big amount of coins without a problem. During csc 51% attack hackers deposit 9 million csc all at once (csc total supply was 38 million) how cryptopia let someone deposit 1/4 all of total supply at once so for example of someone deposit 4 million bitcoin all at once in a exchange they shouldn't find out!!?
But now they just says it's not our fault and they blaming csc coin .
Even if this is true why they list this coin?

And I agree with you it's not completely cryptopias foult because of this i want my btc not csc . 1 million csc now worth 200 btc but i want my same amount that i give it to cryptopia instead of 1 million csc. Around 1.5 btc!

Horrible disaster. Why is there no accountability? Not even an offer for partial reparation or damage control! They have a duty to protect assets stored within their system.

This shows and proves that storing coins in any exchange is not only unwise but potentially can cause financial ruin. They boast and advertise state of the art security systems, top notch support services and protection systems rivaling those of banks but zero marks for integrity.

As if their regrets and apologies will make you feel better. Sure.