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Topic: [CryptoStocks][Bitcoin Arbitrage Fund]Fund was closed, we bought back all shares - page 3. (Read 18478 times)

hero member
Activity: 994
Merit: 1000

Quote
All this aside : you can’t invest with Cryptostocks for the same reason you can’t swim in the desert, you can’t invest with Cryptostocks for the same reason you can’t sunbathe at night. You can’t invest with Cryptostocks because it can’t be done, nobody can do it. It’s a gamble, and as my PR aptly pointed out for the benefit of the forum muppetry long long ago, if gambling is your idea of “investing” then you’re much better served “investing” in one of the dice games. You can roll for “dividends” as often or as rarely as you can stomach it, you can set your “dividend” ratio in advance, and most of all you are actually playing a provably fair game. Which is a much better deal than the sort of crap computer-illiterate dorks with a ready software package and zero business experience can ever offer.

Full text on Trilema, chronicling for those of you who either missed it or weren't paying attention Cryptostocks' subconscious spelling out of why investing does not and cannot take place on its "platform", from the guy's defective self-IPO all the way to the recent listing of Dragon's Tale by some random scammer with no actual affiliation with the game.

Ah I see, so it's not a problem with the exchange itself, just for the investors looking for legitimate businesses?
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 522

The interface is also alot more familiar to those that have used BTC-TC/LTC-Global.  It is also not US based/owned/hosted and will not have the problems that those exchanges and bitfunder had.  It offices are located in Hong Kong, which may be of some convenience for you as well.

Like other exchanges it also will allow you choose how much information you wish to provide to back up your identity with eg: passport, address, phone, social networking etc and the users will be able to see this info on site and make their decisions on whether to invest or not.

Head, meet desk.

The idea that anyone would actually encourage yet more citizen finance just boggles. It is not the fact that play exchanges were "in the US" that caused their shutdown. It is the very fact that they were run by unqualified people catering to anyone and everyone imagining themselves capable on the basis of passion and nebulous "hard work" that caused, and will continue to cause, their demise.


Serious question, been hiding in a cave the last few months...what's so bad about cryptostocks?

Quote
All this aside : you can’t invest with Cryptostocks for the same reason you can’t swim in the desert, you can’t invest with Cryptostocks for the same reason you can’t sunbathe at night. You can’t invest with Cryptostocks because it can’t be done, nobody can do it. It’s a gamble, and as my PR aptly pointed out for the benefit of the forum muppetry long long ago, if gambling is your idea of “investing” then you’re much better served “investing” in one of the dice games. You can roll for “dividends” as often or as rarely as you can stomach it, you can set your “dividend” ratio in advance, and most of all you are actually playing a provably fair game. Which is a much better deal than the sort of crap computer-illiterate dorks with a ready software package and zero business experience can ever offer.

Full text on Trilema, chronicling for those of you who either missed it or weren't paying attention Cryptostocks' subconscious spelling out of why investing does not and cannot take place on its "platform", from the guy's defective self-IPO all the way to the recent listing of Dragon's Tale by some random scammer with no actual affiliation with the game.
hero member
Activity: 994
Merit: 1000
Please consider using a different exchange from cryptostocks to list your fund with.

Serious question, been hiding in a cave the last few months...what's so bad about cryptostocks?
legendary
Activity: 1672
Merit: 1010
Please consider using a different exchange from cryptostocks to list your fund with.

We are considering this issue seriously.

It seems people really dislike CyptoStocks.
how's cryptotrade?

There are too few securities on Crypto-Trade, we are afraid.

Btct.co was closed, and bitfunder is about to be closed.

Maybe Havelock Investment is the last choice.

Crypto-Trade only launched their securities a few days ago, and it was as response to the closure of BTCT & LTCGlobal, the assets currently there are related to the owners/exchange and already paid their first dividends for the month.  They were  previously listed on BTCT and LTCGlobal before they closed. It highly probably that first few securities that list there will do quite well, and the popularity of the exchange has risen signifigantly in the past few weeks.  It also the only securities site with a chatbox and lots of cool friendly people there Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 1672
Merit: 1010
Please consider using a different exchange from cryptostocks to list your fund with.

We are considering this issue seriously.

It seems people really dislike CyptoStocks.
how's cryptotrade?

There are too few securities on CyptoStocks, we are afraid.

Btct.co was closed, and bitfunder is about to be closed.

Maybe Havelock Investment is the last choice.

Havelock is established and trusted,  but before you make a decision I would like to suggest you look into Crypto-Trade - link is in my signature.  Their securities platform is really new and has opened this week and allows a security to be listed in BTC, LTC, XPM or PPC,  but they have been around for some time as a currency exchange for the main crypto currencies and fiat which would may useful for your arbitrage. It would be my preference now over havelock as it has the advantage that dividends paid go straight to account ready for my own trading on the site without the need to transfer/withdraw.
The interface is also alot more familiar to those that have used BTC-TC/LTC-Global.  It is also not US based/owned/hosted and will not have the problems that those exchanges and bitfunder had.  It offices are located in Hong Kong, which may be of some convenience for you as well.

Like other exchanges it also will allow you choose how much information you wish to provide to back up your identity with eg: passport, address, phone, social networking etc and the users will be able to see this info on site and make their decisions on whether to invest or not.


heres a screenshot i made earlier that shows part of the create security page:
[/center]
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
Please consider using a different exchange from cryptostocks to list your fund with.

We are considering this issue seriously.

It seems people really dislike CyptoStocks.
how's cryptotrade?

There are too few securities on Crypto-Trade, we are afraid.

Btct.co was closed, and bitfunder is about to be closed.

Maybe Havelock Investment is the last choice.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Please consider using a different exchange from cryptostocks to list your fund with.

We are considering this issue seriously.

It seems people really dislike CyptoStocks.
how's cryptotrade?
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
Please consider using a different exchange from cryptostocks to list your fund with.

We are considering this issue seriously.

It seems people really dislike CyptoStocks.
legendary
Activity: 1672
Merit: 1010
Please consider using a different exchange from cryptostocks to list your fund with.
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
At what rate do you do forex exchange of RMB to USD? What volumes per transaction do you do?


Exchange rate rom RMB to USD will be 6.09, which may be changed according to the price of the People Bank of China.

Volumes every round  = 40 BTC (which is invested by OP) + all shares income(which is invested by shareowners)


CryptoStocks site shows your verification level as "None", and this gets you nowhere.
I like the idea but unless you do provide certain provable ID documents to CryptoStocks and also to the public, the only people who may jump ahead to buy would be drunk or the newb fool. You should provide documents and full verification first!

Not that "verification" matters there anyway.

OP, see here.


Really good guide for us,  and a lot of information, we will read it carefully and try to learn something.

Thank you very much. You help us a lot.
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 522
CryptoStocks site shows your verification level as "None", and this gets you nowhere.
I like the idea but unless you do provide certain provable ID documents to CryptoStocks and also to the public, the only people who may jump ahead to buy would be drunk or the newb fool. You should provide documents and full verification first!

Not that "verification" matters there anyway.

OP, see here.
sr. member
Activity: 312
Merit: 265
At what rate do you do forex exchange of RMB to USD? What volumes per transaction do you do?
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
I'm willing to purchase a few shares, but when do you plan on starting your first arbitrage round and how long will it last?

New informtion was updated just now as following, thank you for your understanding.

"The first dividend will be paid after 7 days, then we will start the first arbitraging process."

In order to reduce the period of each arbitraging round, we may take the fastest way to transfer money. 

However, doing this will reduce our incoming.
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 1000
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I'm willing to purchase a few shares, but when do you plan on starting your first arbitrage round and how long will it last?
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
How are you able to transfer money in and out of exchanges fast? Those usually take days.
BTC-e's funding methods are particularly annoying, and have high fees.

From a European point of view, at least getting money to BTC-e was easy (SEPA transfer started Monday, money
available on Wednesday) and fast. And the fees of 1% (when you deposit 1500€) ist also just fair.

Getting money out is more of a problem (higher amount needed to get the good fee and not the minimal fee).
But I never tried this.

trepex

We will withdraw Bitcoins not USD from btc-e.com, so things may be more simple.

We tested to withdraw 50 BTC, after one minute our wallet received the exchange information.  It is very fast.
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
How are you able to transfer money in and out of exchanges fast? Those usually take days.
BTC-e's funding methods are particularly annoying, and have high fees.

From a European point of view, at least getting money to BTC-e was easy (SEPA transfer started Monday, money
available on Wednesday) and fast. And the fees of 1% (when you deposit 1500€) ist also just fair.

Getting money out is more of a problem (higher amount needed to get the good fee and not the minimal fee).
But I never tried this.

trepex
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
CryptoStocks lists blatant scams. Why even do business there?

Thank you for your emphasis.

We really didn't consider such a thing, maybe we have to think about transferring our fund to another market ?

Do you have any advice ?
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
Right, if you are provided with 160BTC, successfully arbitrage, and then pay out dividends, then they will know that you can at least do what you say that you will.

Providing ID to cryptostocks is great, but it's not enough - it would be good to know who we're dealing with here before your entrusted with that much currency. I think you'll find people reluctant to invest with no credentials from you.

So many questions. How many 'round' have you previously done? How much money have you made so far? Do you still expect to make ~15% per round with the fees taken into account? What will you do if one of the exchanges closes, or one become more expensive than another? How will you close the fund, if necessary? What factors could lead to a fund closure?

There are SO many questions you haven't answered here. Look at the prospectus at any of these other securities that were listed on BTC-TC, especially, or BF - their are quite a few pages long, not a handful of paragraphs with no credentials.

We really appreciate your attentioin and your questions.

This is one of our accounts on btc-e.com, some information was deleted, you can judge whether it is true or not. And the amount of BTC will help us to withdraw BTC easier.
 


This is one of our wallets.


Maybe you will ask why we don't take all of our assets to arbitrage. Actually, we are long-time BTC holders so that we can benefit from long-term BTC booming. 160 BTC is not so much for us, but we are willing to do such things to get investor's acknowledge.

As you said, maybe we have not remarkable scores to show, but everyone should have a chance to start. Otherwise all of us will never make an success IPO except those who made one before.

We took about 50 BTC to arbitrage each round, and made 15 BTC on our 3 rounds arbitraging activities. Average 10% profit, It is not a remarkable scores but we think it is nice to us.

So we didn't said we must acquire 15% profit rate every round, but we want to get more profit for shareholders and ourself.

If the one of the exchanges closes, we still have choices, there are several exchanges in China, there are serveral exchanges in the rest of the world.

If one exchange become more expensive than another, we will change the arbitrage path, it is still ok. For example, the bitcoin pirce of bitstamp.net is higher than btcchina.com, so the arbitrage path will be:

Deposit RMB to btcchina.com  => Buy BTC => Transfer BTC to bitstamp.net => Sell BTC => Withdraw USD to Hong Kong => Exchange to RMB => Deposit RMB to btcchina.com

As for fund closure, we mentioned in our document, there is when and how:

If the difference disappears, then management will close this fund giving 30 days notice. All assets in the fund including each share's value will be liquidated on the respective markets and paid to shareholders. Unpaid dividends will be paid to shareholders at the same time after 15% management fees.

Comparing with other prospectus, the subject of this fund is very easy to understand, and it can do nothing but arbitrage. So we think we should not make simple things more complicated.  

Thank you for your questions and advice, which are really helpful to us.
We hope you can help us to make BAF better in the future.

 
I never posted in threads like this, but, considering how many people actually bought Labcoin, it might be helpful.  So:

OP wants your money.  If you're happy with giving him your money to trade 20% of it, and you're happy with paying 15% management fee if the gamble pays off, by all means go ahead.

Please keep in mind that OP's soundest exit strategy is saying "Okthxbai," or
(and this is more graceful) remaining incommunicado for a few days, thus inducing panic, letting the share prices tank & buying them up for nothing (rinse & repeat as needed).

Or any of the 101 proven methods of taking away your coin.

I apologize to the 99.9% of the folks reading this.  Yeah, i know you know.  The intended audience, both for my post & this entire thread, is the remaining clueless .1%.

*To folks asking for dox on bitfunder:  You're planning to mount international legal proceedings, rly?  Over a few BTC you've invested?

Thank you for your frank words.

This is the prove that we also bought Labcoin shares, we bought at the highest price 0.0037, and we hold them till now.


We really hate such a scam and we are not willing to become them.
Anyway, saying is nothing, action is everything.

Most of all, if you really read the shares part in our document, you will know one important issue, that is, We issued 16,000 shares, that is all for investors.

WE NEVER TAKE 20% MONEY FROM INVESTORS, WE INVEST 40 BTC TO THIS FUND BY OURSELVES AND ACQUIRE DIVIDENDS ALONG WITH OTHER SHAREOWNERS, THAT IS THE SOURCE OF 20%.

So we can't benefit from shares, the only way to make money is arbitaging.

CryptoStocks lists blatant scams. Why even do business there?

We really didn't heard that before, thank you for your information.
We will check and consider it.
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