Daily Reminder: Watch Out for $5 Wrench Attacks - page 2.

mk4

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Quote from: Pmalek on November 04, 2021, 04:58:10 AM

The news article doesn't mention that he got robbed for bragging about his wealth. He might have been targeted because people knew who he was. A successful entrepreneur who created his own company and sold it to a telecommunications giant. That sort of news goes around.

*snip*

Yeap. But the main point is that he got robbed due to people knowing about his wealth, despite us not knowing what the main cause is. And I'm pretty sure 99% of us here aren't some big shot entrepreneur. Main point being the warning, not necessarily the poor dude.

dkbit98

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Sold his company for 75 million euros, then lost 50 million euros in Bitcoin after this attack, but at least he is still alive.
This attacks are happening all the time and Jameson Lopp even keeps known list of all Bitcoin attacks on his github page, that is one of the reasons he later started Casa.
Maybe someone from Spain can confirm this, but I think that Zaryn Dentzel was a public figure and it was known that he owns a lot of Bitcoins.
It's strange for someone who owns that much btc to not use multisig setup, but keep coins on some online account with password that is probably some centralized exchange, but maybe that saved his life.

Interesting thing I noticed is that he was posting on twitter in 2014 about WSJ article how Bitcoin price could go to $1 million:
https://twitter.com/zaryn/status/451977124207812608

davis196

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Perhaps we should compile a list of tips and tricks about what to do in order to be safe,if you are rich.
If you are rich and famous,hire bodyguards and buy a house that looks like a well equipped fortress.
If you are rich by having lots of BTC,but you are not famous,then try to stay as anonymous as possible and don't tell anyone about your wealth.Try not go get doxxed.Doxxing is pretty common these days,most of the personal info of everyone can get leaked online.

Quote from: glendall on November 04, 2021, 09:40:38 AM

Publishing assets on social media makes people tempted to rob us, because one robbery incident is usually from oneself who is too ostentatious of wealth
Don't 50$ for 10$ even the robbers, if they are cornered, will kill us, so avoid announcing our assets anywhere, just be quiet like people who have nothing so that our lives are safe

This is easier said than done,because almost all rich people have a luxurious lifestyle.
You can't just lie to the robbers saying "I don't have any money!" while you are wearing expensive clothes,driving a Lambo and living in a big penthouse.The robbers aren't that dumb.

glendall

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Publishing assets on social media makes people tempted to rob us, because one robbery incident is usually from oneself who is too ostentatious of wealth
Don't 50$ for 10$ even the robbers, if they are cornered, will kill us, so avoid announcing our assets anywhere, just be quiet like people who have nothing so that our lives are safe

DdmrDdmr

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There are lies, damned lies and statistics. MTwain

Quote from: mk4 on November 03, 2021, 08:24:15 PM

<…>

The reminder remains valid, and a core aspect to bear in mind is that being your own bank also entails some risks that need to be taken into account in order to mitigate them. One obviously shouldn’t go around saying hey, I’ve got a "bank" at home with such amount of value in crypto. Even just the first part should likely be avoided being announced, regardless of the quantity.

The story about Zaryn Dentzel has evolved over the past hours, and the latest local update I read, states that no crypto was really stolen (he allegedly has 50M € in crypto), but rather the codes to access his bank accounts and his computer, which he feared might enable the thugs to access his crypto.

The above makes me wonder what type of wallet he really used. There is no mention to any hardware wallet, and the fact that by providing codes to his computer and bank accounts made him concerned for his crypto, points to something more in the line of [hypothesis] Electrum or an online wallet / custodial service [/hypothesis].

This is the reference article, Google Translated:
https://www-eldiario-es.translate.goog/politica/denuncia-fundador-tuenti-asaltantes-apodaban-numero-encapuchada-carolina_1_8456686.html?_x_tr_sl=es&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=es&_x_tr_pto=nui
If you read the article, you’ll find some near-to gory details that will make you cringe at the thought of it ... (hint: ball(s) related).

DaveF

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To expand on have a little wallet that you can give up. This is also the reason for multiple wallets. If they know you have BTC but not sure how much.
You can give them the $100 hot phone wallet and the $2500 from hardware wallet.
If the wrench hits continue you can then give them the BTC.25 cold storage wallet.
They never have to know about hardware wallet #2 with 10BTC in it.

You don't drive through bad neighborhoods in your exotic sports car with a bag of cash on the seat.
Guess what, the internet is a bad neighborhood.

Also about cold storage a topic on a while ago: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitcoin-value-keeps-climbing-make-sure-your-old-cold-storage-is-safe-5326757

-Dave

matjas

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Thats why you dont brag about how much crypto you own or worse yet, post your portfolio online. If you did that in 2017, and someone who knows ur identity rat you to some criminals, you will end up in a bad shape. Its much easier to steal from a geek at home than from a bank.
Thank god not everywhere is as bad as in USA when it comes to crime.

yazher

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Quote from: OgNasty on November 03, 2021, 09:04:57 PM

This is why you should make sure that you don’t have access to your coins. There are people in this world who will take your life for $50. You can take every security precaution available and still be at risk. I have a similar take on passwords. I have no idea what my bitcointalk password is, so I’ll never have it stolen from me by force because I don’t know it. The downside to this plan being that a pissed off criminal might murder you anyway, or make it look like you drowned.

That's why I'm against wearing a printed T-shirt that has a print of symbols of cryptocurrencies in it because I often walk alone and I may not know the people I encountered on the road maybe some of them will hunt me thinking that I'm one of those whales who owns a huge amount of cryptocurrencies. In this era, we need to stay low-key as if we don't own anything in this world. Sometimes when you hide who you really are, you always free and no need to hide from anyone.

Reid

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Thanks for the reminder.
I am not the boastful type of guy so I guess I am safe about this. But, I still want to warn my friends about keeping their identity secure as much as possible to anyone especially the social media.
You can always post about what you purchased like your new gaming console but never tell them how you made money to buy it. Grin

Let it be a secret unless they are also trying to figure out what cryptocurrencies are. Give them hints about it like you are also a rookie in the industry and trying to gain new information just like him.

tranthidung

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Quote from: mk4 on November 03, 2021, 11:01:39 PM

Unfortunately it isn't even only the younger peeps. I know a few "adults" that post Facebook/Instagram stories of price charts, and the percentages of how much their holdings have increased; and I'm not talking about one-off posts here, they post almost daily. Even adults aren't susceptible to flexing on social media.

Social media are painful in our society, somewhat toxic. People take risk and spend too much time for such social media.

I agree with you about that fact but I meant the younger they are, the more time they spend for social media and more activities to show off what they are doing, temporary achieve, etc. It's dangerous but they don't realize it before something happens.

Pmalek

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The news article doesn't mention that he got robbed for bragging about his wealth. He might have been targeted because people knew who he was. A successful entrepreneur who created his own company and sold it to a telecommunications giant. That sort of news goes around.

There is a politician in my neighborhood. He lives alone because his family lives in a different town. He is here because of work. He is also an expert in economics and looks wealthy by the way he dresses, the car he drives, etc.
Another neighbor owns an insurance company, a hotel, and a restaurant. I have never spoken with either of them, but I still know who they are. Now imagine what one might find out if they were interested in snooping around and visiting them with a mask over the face?!

What worries me in this article is the way they explain how he was storing his coins. Maybe they don't have all the details and don't know much about crypto. Nevertheless, it is mentioned that he was forced to reveal the password to his "online account."

Quote

Dentzel was allegedly sprayed in the eyes and tazed while the assailants stole his belongings and forced him to reveal the password to an online account that contained his Bitcoin fortune, based on what he told investigators afterward.

https://www.newsweek.com/bitcoin-millionaire-zaryn-dentzel-beaten-fortune-stolen-masked-robbery-cryptocurrency-1645550

Maybe an exchange or a web wallet. A man of his status should know better about protecting his assets.

hatshepsut93

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Quote from: OgNasty on November 03, 2021, 09:04:57 PM

The downside to this plan being that a pissed off criminal might murder you anyway, or make it look like you drowned.

This is why when people start talking about multisig, encryption and all that stuff, they sound exactly like in that comic about $5 wrench. The real solution is to heavily invest in physical security - get alarm, strong locks, live in a safe neighborhood, hire private security if you are really rich. Do not open doors to unknown people, do not go to unknown places with strangers that you met 20 minutes ago. The list can go on, because there's so many possible ways someone can rob you.

Bttzed03

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Quote from: mk4 on November 03, 2021, 08:24:15 PM

~ Sometimes it feels great sharing your gains on social media, especially if you haven't had this much money in the past.

Yeah that's exactly what's happening to some people in my circle right now. They've been around since 2017 but it seems they're too proud on their recent gains from a dog themed meme token. I'm just not sure if it was their portfolio or they just grabbed it from somewhere.

Kakmakr

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Yes, #mk4 ..... They say, your coins are just as safe as your strength to tolerate torture and pain. Wink

I think most people will give up those private keys or passwords for their hardware wallet, after the first nail was ripped from their finger or one tooth pulled. I have had a loaded gun to my head before... so I can tell you that your whole world flash before your eyes, when you are on the other side of that barrel. Sad

DO NOT brag about your wealth on social media, even if it is not about Crypto currencies, because it will paint a target on your back. Wink

mk4

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Quote from: tranthidung on November 03, 2021, 10:51:12 PM

This is nightmare and to avoid this, to protect ourselves, we should not let others know that we are bitcoin investors or crypto investors.

The young generation has some habit that I don't know. They would prefer to share screenshot of their balance, make noise that they are crypto investors, etc. I don't naively believe all of those guys are rich but doing so, they put themselves under more eyes, observation and risk.

Risk of steal their coins online via hacks or in real life.

Unfortunately it isn't even only the younger peeps. I know a few "adults" that post Facebook/Instagram stories of price charts, and the percentages of how much their holdings have increased; and I'm not talking about one-off posts here, they post almost daily. Even adults aren't susceptible to flexing on social media.

tranthidung

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Farewell o_e_l_e_o

This is nightmare and to avoid this, to protect ourselves, we should not let others know that we are bitcoin investors or crypto investors.

The young generation has some habit that I don't know. They would prefer to share screenshot of their balance, make noise that they are crypto investors, etc. I don't naively believe all of those guys are rich but doing so, they put themselves under more eyes, observation and risk.

Risk of steal their coins online via hacks or in real life.

stompix

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Quote from: mk4 on November 03, 2021, 08:24:15 PM

It's that time of the year again, where our coins are worth a lot more than they were months ago.

It doesn't have to be a huge sum and you can still get into trouble, for example for 1000$ back in 2015:
https://www.cnbc.com/2015/06/05/new-york-city-man-robbed-at-gunpoint-for-bitcoin.html
There is a list here, I remember another one that had a lot more cases but I can't find it in my bookmarks, I'll add it later if I remember it but still of a lot of dangerous stuff has happened.

I'm amazed the ledger hack than yet triggered a few dozens of cases, or maybe we're unaware of them as the victims and police are not talking to the press.

Quote from: OgNasty on November 03, 2021, 09:04:57 PM

The downside to this plan being that a pissed off criminal might murder you anyway, or make it look like you drowned.

When the downside means death, simple robbery looks like the better option to me.
Also, the risk of the guy who is doing robbing losing his nerves because you won't tell him the pass to a fortune that for him is a life-changer, ending with him shooting or beating the crap out of you and leaving you with a paralyzed limb or some brain trauma isn't a better outcome either in my opinion.

Darker45

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Quote from: OgNasty on November 03, 2021, 09:04:57 PM

This is why you should make sure that you don’t have access to your coins. There are people in this world who will take your life for $50. You can take every security precaution available and still be at risk. I have a similar take on passwords. I have no idea what my bitcointalk password is, so I’ll never have it stolen from me by force because I don’t know it. The downside to this plan being that a pissed off criminal might murder you anyway, or make it look like you drowned.

I remember a law enforcement authority saying that when confronted with an armed robber, you don't resist. Instead, simply give the robber what he/she wants. In which case, the suggestion of franky1 applies. By saying you don't know your password or PIN or security key or whatever, it might seem to the robber that you are resisting. If a robber will take your life for $50, the same robber will definitely take your life for not giving the access to $100. Resistance always pisses off a robber who is oftentimes doing his/her thing as quick as possible.

I guess it is safer not to let anybody know that you have Bitcoin than not having access to your Bitcoin.

franky1

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Quote from: OgNasty on November 03, 2021, 09:04:57 PM

This is why you should make sure that you don’t have access to your coins.

bad idea
in fiat land .. if someone knows you have a wal safe in your home. .. the more you try to tell them you dont know the key code to open it. the more strikes to the head you will get from them demanding you tell them

saying you have no access will not save your life. it may save your investment. but not your life.

instead have a second wallet with small amount and give them that. tell them its all you have ever had
..
its like street robbery. dont put al your cash in your easy to pickpocket wallet. only put $20 in it and keep your hundreds of dollars stored more safely. that way if ever attacked you only lose $20 and you give them what they want. thus removing the risk of continued assault.

mk4

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Quote from: OgNasty on November 03, 2021, 09:04:57 PM

This is why you should make sure that you don’t have access to your coins. There are people in this world who will take your life for $50. You can take every security precaution available and still be at risk. I have a similar take on passwords. I have no idea what my bitcointalk password is, so I’ll never have it stolen from me by force because I don’t know it. The downside to this plan being that a pissed off criminal might murder you anyway, or make it look like you drowned.

Or they could simply not believe you and continue to interrogate, since the sort of "normie" thing to do is to have one password for all your accounts, so that's what they might expect from you as well. The sure-fire way is always to not have them know that you own cryptocurrencies in the first place. "Prevention is better than cure", as they always say.

Topic: Daily Reminder: Watch Out for $5 Wrench Attacks - page 2. (Read 439 times)