Dear Environmentalists, please stop ranting about global warming - page 2.

myrkul

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Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 02:48:09 PM

Quote from: Mike Christ on April 17, 2013, 02:42:58 PM

Hey, isn't PETA also on that road where they'll only be satisfied when all human beings are wiped out?

I think it's safe to say, humans being selfish is a lot better than humans being dead. Not saying "screw the planet", but, if I gotta live in space for the rest of my life, I'll be down with that.

So you admit it's better to be selfish and try and prevent our home from being destroyed by our pollution rather than being dead due to ecosystem destruction by our hand?

I've yet to see you admit it.

Just once, say that your top priority is human survival, and not that of "the planet," and I'll be behind you 100% on that.

Gimpeline

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Quote from: Mike Christ on April 17, 2013, 02:42:58 PM

Hey, isn't PETA also on that road where they'll only be satisfied when all human beings are wiped out?

I think it's safe to say, humans being selfish is a lot better than humans being dead. Not saying "screw the planet", but, if I gotta live in space for the rest of my life, I'll be down with that.

Pretty much my point. If humans left or died, the planet would be fine without us. It's not like it's the end of the world

FirstAscent

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Quote from: myrkul on April 17, 2013, 02:38:32 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 02:21:11 PM

What he just doesn't get is if nature, in the absence of mankind, takes the world in that direction, then so be it, but the reality is (and this is the key point), it is mankind that is taking the world in that direction, and that should be corrected.

"If nature, absent a key part of nature, takes the world in that direction, so be it, but the reality is (and this is the key point), it is that key part of nature that is taking the world in that direction, and that should be corrected."

If man's technology is part of nature, then so are his efforts and programs to curtail pollution and environmental destruction.

FirstAscent

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Quote from: Mike Christ on April 17, 2013, 02:42:58 PM

Hey, isn't PETA also on that road where they'll only be satisfied when all human beings are wiped out?

I think it's safe to say, humans being selfish is a lot better than humans being dead. Not saying "screw the planet", but, if I gotta live in space for the rest of my life, I'll be down with that.

So you admit it's better to be selfish and try and prevent our home from being destroyed by our pollution rather than being dead due to ecosystem destruction by our hand?

Mike Christ

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Hey, isn't PETA also on that road where they'll only be satisfied when all human beings are wiped out?

I think it's safe to say, humans being selfish is a lot better than humans being dead. Not saying "screw the planet", but, if I gotta live in space for the rest of my life, I'll be down with that.

myrkul

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Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 02:21:11 PM

What he just doesn't get is if nature, in the absence of mankind, takes the world in that direction, then so be it, but the reality is (and this is the key point), it is mankind that is taking the world in that direction, and that should be corrected.

"If nature, absent a key part of nature, takes the world in that direction, so be it, but the reality is (and this is the key point), it is that key part of nature that is taking the world in that direction, and that should be corrected."

FirstAscent

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Quote from: RodeoX on April 17, 2013, 02:14:44 PM

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 02:06:14 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:19:18 PM

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 01:15:45 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL8HP1WzbDk

Think Carlin is spot on

He's not spot on. Not only are people fucked, but so are tens of thousands of other species, ecosystems, and so on. And we're the cause of it.

There is no baseline metric of what defines the planet as being fine. The best metric is the one in which the planet's systems proceed at the pace they normally do, which is not occurring right now.

Nope. If you look at the planet you can find life everywhere. Dosen't matter how harsh it is. Life is everywhere. No matter if it's cold, warm, no oxygen, high pressure..... The planet will do fine long after we are gone.
If it's our time to go, it's our time to go. The planet will do fine without us

That is not very consoling. lol

It's an absurd argument.

What he just doesn't get is if nature, in the absence of mankind, takes the world in that direction, then so be it, but the reality is (and this is the key point), it is mankind that is taking the world in that direction, and that should be corrected.

myrkul

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Quote from: RodeoX on April 17, 2013, 02:14:44 PM

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 02:06:14 PM

If it's our time to go, it's our time to go. The planet will do fine without us

That is not very consoling. lol

No, it's not. Not, at least, if you're human-centric. However, if what you care about is "the environment," or "the planet," then I imagine it's quite comforting to know that after we've wiped ourselves out, life on earth will continue.

RodeoX

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The revolution will be monetized!

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 02:06:14 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:19:18 PM

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 01:15:45 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL8HP1WzbDk

Think Carlin is spot on

He's not spot on. Not only are people fucked, but so are tens of thousands of other species, ecosystems, and so on. And we're the cause of it.

There is no baseline metric of what defines the planet as being fine. The best metric is the one in which the planet's systems proceed at the pace they normally do, which is not occurring right now.

Nope. If you look at the planet you can find life everywhere. Dosen't matter how harsh it is. Life is everywhere. No matter if it's cold, warm, no oxygen, high pressure..... The planet will do fine long after we are gone.
If it's our time to go, it's our time to go. The planet will do fine without us

That is not very consoling. lol

FirstAscent

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Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 02:06:14 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:19:18 PM

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 01:15:45 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL8HP1WzbDk

Think Carlin is spot on

He's not spot on. Not only are people fucked, but so are tens of thousands of other species, ecosystems, and so on. And we're the cause of it.

There is no baseline metric of what defines the planet as being fine. The best metric is the one in which the planet's systems proceed at the pace they normally do, which is not occurring right now.

Nope. If you look at the planet you can find life everywhere. Dosen't matter how harsh it is. Life is everywhere. No matter if it's cold, warm, no oxygen, high pressure..... The planet will do fine long after we are gone.
If it's our time to go, it's our time to go. The planet will do fine without us

Study up on ecosystems, ecosystem services, and biodiversity.

It doesn't matter if we find lichens and bacteria in Antarctica. Our goal isn't to acknowledge that if we radically render the planet into an inhospitable place for megafauna, we will still have bacteria and heat thriving nematodes on the planet.

Please read again the last paragraph of the post you're responding to. I'll quote it for you:

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:19:18 PM

There is no baseline metric of what defines the planet as being fine. The best metric is the one in which the planet's systems proceed at the pace they normally do, which is not occurring right now.

Gimpeline

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Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:19:18 PM

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 01:15:45 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL8HP1WzbDk

Think Carlin is spot on

He's not spot on. Not only are people fucked, but so are tens of thousands of other species, ecosystems, and so on. And we're the cause of it.

There is no baseline metric of what defines the planet as being fine. The best metric is the one in which the planet's systems proceed at the pace they normally do, which is not occurring right now.

Nope. If you look at the planet you can find life everywhere. Dosen't matter how harsh it is. Life is everywhere. No matter if it's cold, warm, no oxygen, high pressure..... The planet will do fine long after we are gone.
If it's our time to go, it's our time to go. The planet will do fine without us

FirstAscent

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Quote from: myrkul on April 17, 2013, 01:33:17 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:28:56 PM

Quote from: myrkul on April 17, 2013, 01:21:53 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:12:57 PM

You can clearly see the difference in 100,000 humans using fire vs. billions of cars today.

Certainly. Progress. Eventually, we'll have a few trillion humans using space ships. Then some number of quadrillions using who knows what.

Or we can go back, and we'll still be back at 100,000 using fire when the sun bakes the planet dry.

Your views are naive and unencumbered with sophistication.

...and we're back to slinging mud, then, are we?

Not that I'm aware of. I made an assessment of your views on the subject. I don't consider it to be mud slinging, but a fair summary of your views. Take it as you will.

myrkul

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Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:28:56 PM

Quote from: myrkul on April 17, 2013, 01:21:53 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:12:57 PM

You can clearly see the difference in 100,000 humans using fire vs. billions of cars today.

Certainly. Progress. Eventually, we'll have a few trillion humans using space ships. Then some number of quadrillions using who knows what.

Or we can go back, and we'll still be back at 100,000 using fire when the sun bakes the planet dry.

Your views are naive and unencumbered with sophistication.

...and we're back to slinging mud, then, are we?

FirstAscent

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Activity: 812

Merit: 1000

Quote from: myrkul on April 17, 2013, 01:21:53 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:12:57 PM

You can clearly see the difference in 100,000 humans using fire vs. billions of cars today.

Certainly. Progress. Eventually, we'll have a few trillion humans using space ships. Then some number of quadrillions using who knows what.

Or we can go back, and we'll still be back at 100,000 using fire when the sun bakes the planet dry.

Your views are naive and unencumbered with sophistication.

myrkul

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Activity: 532

Merit: 500

FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 01:12:57 PM

You can clearly see the difference in 100,000 humans using fire vs. billions of cars today.

Certainly. Progress. Eventually, we'll have a few trillion humans using space ships. Then some number of quadrillions using who knows what.

Or we can go back, and we'll still be back at 100,000 using fire when the sun bakes the planet dry.

FirstAscent

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Activity: 812

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Gimpeline on April 17, 2013, 01:15:45 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL8HP1WzbDk

Think Carlin is spot on

He's not spot on. Not only are people fucked, but so are tens of thousands of other species, ecosystems, and so on. And we're the cause of it.

There is no baseline metric of what defines the planet as being fine. The best metric is the one in which the planet's systems proceed at the pace they normally do, which is not occurring right now.

Gimpeline

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL8HP1WzbDk

Think Carlin is spot on

FirstAscent

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Quote from: myrkul on April 17, 2013, 01:03:47 PM

Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 12:58:14 PM

Thank you for putting your foot in your mouth. If the new technology which mankind puts to use is part of the self regulating system, then please refrain from ever pointing to events prior to the technological age as analogies for climate change.

Right, because if the new stuff is part of the system, the old stuff clearly must not be. Roll Eyes

Humans have been changing their environment since the first hominid picked up a burning stick and brought it back to the cave.

At ever changing rates, our technological changes are not necessarily things that our planet's self regulating system can deal with if your interest is a world rich in biodiversity, productive ecosystems, and by extension, ecosystem services.

You can clearly see the difference in 100,000 humans using fire vs. billions of cars today. Or are you not able to see that difference?

myrkul

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Quote from: FirstAscent on April 17, 2013, 12:58:14 PM

Thank you for putting your foot in your mouth. If the new technology which mankind puts to use is part of the self regulating system, then please refrain from ever pointing to events prior to the technological age as analogies for climate change.

Right, because if the new stuff is part of the system, the old stuff clearly must not be. Roll Eyes

Humans have been changing their environment since the first hominid picked up a burning stick and brought it back to the cave.

FirstAscent

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Quote from: RodeoX on April 17, 2013, 01:00:13 PM

Frankly, I wish the deniers were right. Embarrassed

Unfortunately, they are not. Too bad they can't see that.

Topic: Dear Environmentalists, please stop ranting about global warming - page 2. (Read 3068 times)