Decentralized Security in the Blockchain - page 2.

DannyHamilton

legendary

Activity: 3472

Merit: 4801

Quote from: erre on January 09, 2015, 05:41:14 PM

There is general net consensus about that address storing stolen coins,

No. There isn't.

Quote from: erre on January 09, 2015, 05:41:14 PM

can't a transaction be reversed via a fork or something?

Not without the likely destruction of Bitcoin.

Quote from: erre on January 09, 2015, 05:41:14 PM

I know the coins are not still Int his address, but just as an example...

It's a very bad idea. There are several reasons why it is a very bad idea.

goosoodude

hero member

Activity: 584

Merit: 500

Quote from: erre on January 09, 2015, 05:41:14 PM

There is general net consensus about that address storing stolen coins, can't a transaction be reversed via a fork or something?

How are you going to find the 'general net consensus'? Think about it, its not possible.

Technically its a simple matter of hard forking and making it unspendable.

cr1776

legendary

Activity: 4256

Merit: 1313

Quote from: calci on January 09, 2015, 05:18:42 PM

Quote from: Delek on January 09, 2015, 04:28:13 PM

I was thinking yesterday, this address:
https://blockchain.info/address/1L2JsXHPMYuAa9ugvHGLwkdstCPUDemNCf

We all know that it belongs to the Bitstamp hacker, a thief; why then, the whole network, knowing that Bitcoins are coming from a hack, can't do anything about it? Why if we all agree, the network, can't do anything against this injustice?

Crazy idea, but what if we all start to migrate to new anti-thief-nodes where, while analyzing the blockchain during a transaction and find that this address was involved, automatically reject the transfers?
Does not this would eliminate the profit of the hacker?, this will not eliminate the urge to steal bitcoins, and still maintain a decentralized, anti theft system?

I know that this will only works for BIG hacks, that the entire network knows about, but this could be done somehow or I'm missing something?

Thanks in advance.

Maybe if satoshi was here, we could ask him to create a hack to be able to remove coins from any address. That way we could have punished these hackers Tongue

Why would we want to have him do that? Not that he could unless he forked bitcoin into bitcoin-taint.

I have to disagree with Danny though, the coins at address 172YkAaaWjKucB9nHnXdYyYwJ7V7fQUPPa were hacked from me so we should block them and return them to my address. EVERYBODY knows that 172YkAaaWjKucB9nHnXdYyYwJ7V7fQUPPa has stolen coins now.

Grin

erre

legendary

Activity: 1680

Merit: 1205

Quote from: goosoodude on January 09, 2015, 05:33:18 PM

Quote from: Delek on January 09, 2015, 04:28:13 PM

We all know that it belongs to the Bitstamp hacker, a thief; why then, the whole network, knowing that Bitcoins are coming from a hack, can't do anything about it? Why if we all agree, the network, can't do anything against this injustice?

Who are 'all'? How do we 'know' beyond any shadow of doubt?

Its easy to think that cases like this should be handled like as you suggested, but where do you stop? Its supposed to be trustless, you are putting in actors you have to trust.

There is general net consensus about that address storing stolen coins, can't a transaction be reversed via a fork or something?

I know the coins are not still Int his address, but just as an example...

goosoodude

hero member

Activity: 584

Merit: 500

Quote from: Delek on January 09, 2015, 04:28:13 PM

We all know that it belongs to the Bitstamp hacker, a thief; why then, the whole network, knowing that Bitcoins are coming from a hack, can't do anything about it? Why if we all agree, the network, can't do anything against this injustice?

Who are 'all'? How do we 'know' beyond any shadow of doubt?

Its easy to think that cases like this should be handled like as you suggested, but where do you stop? Its supposed to be trustless, you are putting in actors you have to trust.

calci

full member

Activity: 168

Merit: 100

www.secondstrade.com - 190% return Binary option

Quote from: Delek on January 09, 2015, 04:28:13 PM

I was thinking yesterday, this address:
https://blockchain.info/address/1L2JsXHPMYuAa9ugvHGLwkdstCPUDemNCf

We all know that it belongs to the Bitstamp hacker, a thief; why then, the whole network, knowing that Bitcoins are coming from a hack, can't do anything about it? Why if we all agree, the network, can't do anything against this injustice?

Crazy idea, but what if we all start to migrate to new anti-thief-nodes where, while analyzing the blockchain during a transaction and find that this address was involved, automatically reject the transfers?
Does not this would eliminate the profit of the hacker?, this will not eliminate the urge to steal bitcoins, and still maintain a decentralized, anti theft system?

I know that this will only works for BIG hacks, that the entire network knows about, but this could be done somehow or I'm missing something?

Thanks in advance.

Maybe if satoshi was here, we could ask him to create a hack to be able to remove coins from any address. That way we could have punished these hackers Tongue

Melbustus

legendary

Activity: 1722

Merit: 1004

^ What Greg said.

Further, doing some sort of coin-blocking collective action like that starts bitcoin down a nasty road of eliminating its "fungibility"; ie, a core property of any good money which means that one unit is just as good as another. Start going down that road, and you introduce all kinds of friction into the system which makes it less workable for everyone longrun.

DannyHamilton

legendary

Activity: 3472

Merit: 4801

I would like to announce that I was hacked and that exactly 1.89283702 bitcoins were stolen from me. I've traced these bitcoins from the addresses where they were stolen to: 172YkAaaWjKucB9nHnXdYyYwJ7V7fQUPPa and they are still there right now.

"We all know that it belongs to a hacker, a thief; why then, the whole network, knowing that Bitcoins are coming from a hack, can't do anything about it? Why if we all agree, the network, can't do anything against this injustice?"

Crazy idea, but what if we all start to migrate to new anti-thief-nodes where, while analyzing the blockchain during a transaction and find that this address was involved, automatically reject the transfers?

Thanks in advance.

Edit: For those who don't see what I'm doing here, I have not actually been hacked, and those bitcoins haven't actually been stolen. The point is that anyone can make such a claim, and it is extremely difficulty to prove that such a claim is false. The question I'm posing is: "How does Delek feel about actually giving this power to the users of Bitcoin?"

gmaxwell

staff

Activity: 4284

Merit: 8808

For all I "know"- in a strong sense-- Bitstamp sold those coins to an innocent third party. (Or, if implicating Bitstamp is indeed too crazy for you: The hacker could have directly sold them to an unaware third party; and half the coins flowing there could actually be unrelated to Bitstamp.)

Be mindful of what you know, vs what you think you know. Part of the value of the system is that it minimizes importing human judgement into its operation. If it does that then there is no clean boundary, and risk analysis is much more costly.

Delek

full member

Activity: 157

Merit: 103

Salí para ver

I was thinking yesterday, this address:
https://blockchain.info/address/1L2JsXHPMYuAa9ugvHGLwkdstCPUDemNCf

We all know that it belongs to the Bitstamp hacker, a thief; why then, the whole network, knowing that Bitcoins are coming from a hack, can't do anything about it? Why if we all agree, the network, can't do anything against this injustice?

Crazy idea, but what if we all start to migrate to new anti-thief-nodes where, while analyzing the blockchain during a transaction and find that this address was involved, automatically reject the transfers?
Does not this would eliminate the profit of the hacker?, this will not eliminate the urge to steal bitcoins, and still maintain a decentralized, anti theft system?

I know that this will only works for BIG hacks, that the entire network knows about, but this could be done somehow or I'm missing something?

Thanks in advance.

Topic: Decentralized Security in the Blockchain - page 2. (Read 1696 times)