Do I deserve to die and do I deserve healthcare? - page 4.

myrkul

hero member

Activity: 532

Merit: 500

FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 05:20:30 PM

What if nobody is willing to help? Then is it ok for me to die? Also, I would never threaten violence or death because both are immoral.

Democracy in action. You just got voted off the island.

And if you would never threaten violence or death, how do you propose to 'make' people pay?

david4dev

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

Quote from: myrkul on July 11, 2011, 05:18:25 PM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 05:13:16 PM

Quote from: myrkul on July 11, 2011, 05:10:52 PM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 04:23:34 PM

Imagine I have a fatal, but treatable, illness. The treatment costs more than I could personally afford. Due to my financial situation I can't afford any health insurance.

In which, if any, of the following cases do I deserve to die and in which to I deserve healthcare:

1) I was a hard working citizen but due to no fault of my own I lost my job and am currently looking for work but unable to find any.
2) I am a child born into a poor family.
3) I have never worked due to laziness.
4) I did have a job but got fired for a valid reason. Due to my employment history, I am unable to find another job.
5) I committed a criminal offence and was sent to prison. I am now out of prison and can't find work due to my criminal record.

In no case do you deserve to die, and in no case are you entitled to healthcare, however much you deserve it.

So it is fine for me to die even if I don't deserve death?

Never said it was fine. I said you can't pay for it out of my pocket if I don't want to help you. Find someone (or a group of them) who is willing to help, and let them pay. Don't force complete strangers to upon threat of violence or death.

What if nobody is willing to help? Then is it ok for me to die? Also, I would never threaten violence or death because both are immoral.

myrkul

hero member

Activity: 532

Merit: 500

FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 05:13:16 PM

Quote from: myrkul on July 11, 2011, 05:10:52 PM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 04:23:34 PM

Imagine I have a fatal, but treatable, illness. The treatment costs more than I could personally afford. Due to my financial situation I can't afford any health insurance.

In which, if any, of the following cases do I deserve to die and in which to I deserve healthcare:

1) I was a hard working citizen but due to no fault of my own I lost my job and am currently looking for work but unable to find any.
2) I am a child born into a poor family.
3) I have never worked due to laziness.
4) I did have a job but got fired for a valid reason. Due to my employment history, I am unable to find another job.
5) I committed a criminal offence and was sent to prison. I am now out of prison and can't find work due to my criminal record.

In no case do you deserve to die, and in no case are you entitled to healthcare, however much you deserve it.

So it is fine for me to die even if I don't deserve death?

Never said it was fine. I said you can't pay for it out of my pocket if I don't want to help you. Find someone (or a group of them) who is willing to help, and let them pay. Don't force complete strangers to upon threat of violence or death.

Zncon

jr. member

Activity: 46

Merit: 10

Quote

Many that live deserve death. And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then be not too eager to deal out death in the name of justice, fearing for your own safety. Even the wise cannot see all ends.
J. R. R. Tolkien, The Lord Of the Rings, Book Four, Chapter One

david4dev

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

Quote from: myrkul on July 11, 2011, 05:10:52 PM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 04:23:34 PM

Imagine I have a fatal, but treatable, illness. The treatment costs more than I could personally afford. Due to my financial situation I can't afford any health insurance.

In which, if any, of the following cases do I deserve to die and in which to I deserve healthcare:

1) I was a hard working citizen but due to no fault of my own I lost my job and am currently looking for work but unable to find any.
2) I am a child born into a poor family.
3) I have never worked due to laziness.
4) I did have a job but got fired for a valid reason. Due to my employment history, I am unable to find another job.
5) I committed a criminal offence and was sent to prison. I am now out of prison and can't find work due to my criminal record.

In no case do you deserve to die, and in no case are you entitled to healthcare, however much you deserve it.

So it is fine for me to die even if I don't deserve death?

myrkul

hero member

Activity: 532

Merit: 500

FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 04:23:34 PM

Imagine I have a fatal, but treatable, illness. The treatment costs more than I could personally afford. Due to my financial situation I can't afford any health insurance.

In which, if any, of the following cases do I deserve to die and in which to I deserve healthcare:

1) I was a hard working citizen but due to no fault of my own I lost my job and am currently looking for work but unable to find any.
2) I am a child born into a poor family.
3) I have never worked due to laziness.
4) I did have a job but got fired for a valid reason. Due to my employment history, I am unable to find another job.
5) I committed a criminal offence and was sent to prison. I am now out of prison and can't find work due to my criminal record.

In no case do you deserve to die, and in no case are you entitled to healthcare, however much you deserve it.

Zncon

jr. member

Activity: 46

Merit: 10

In cases 1 & 2 you should be helped.

For situations 3, 4, & 5 you should get no help, unless there was a provable reason why your future value to society would exceed the cost of your treatment.

Does that opinion make me a bad person?

NghtRppr

sr. member

Activity: 504

Merit: 252

Elder Crypto God

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 04:33:07 PM

I'm a socialist

Cool. Are you a voluntary socialist or a coercive socialist?

david4dev

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

Quote from: randomguy7 on July 11, 2011, 04:25:36 PM

Sorry for offtopic but: Atlas? Is this you?

No.

It's strange you think so because I'm pretty sure Atlas is a capitalist libertarian and I'm a socialist libertarian.

david4dev

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

Quote from: NghtRppr on July 11, 2011, 04:27:34 PM

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 04:23:34 PM

Imagine I have a fatal, but treatable, illness. The treatment costs more than I could personally afford. Due to my financial situation I can't afford any health insurance.

In which, if any, of the following cases do I deserve to die:

1) I was a hard working citizen but due to no fault of my own I lost my job and am currently looking for work but unable to find any.
2) I am a child born into a poor family.
3) I have never worked due to laziness.
4) I did have a job but got fired for a valid reason. Due to my employment history, I am unable to find another job.
5) I committed a criminal offence and was sent to prison. I am now out of prison and can't find work due to my criminal record.

Deserve to die? None.

I think you mean, which of the above justifies coercing others to help you and again the answer is "none".

I've edited the question to clarify this point.

JoelKatz

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1012

Democracy is vulnerable to a 51% attack.

In none of those cases do you deserve to die. Nobody deserves to have bad luck. However, no society can afford to save everyone. Many people deserve all kinds of things that it is not possible to provide them. That a person deserves something does not create an obligation on others to see that they get it.

TiagoTiago

hero member

Activity: 616

Merit: 500

Firstbits.com/1fg4i :)

I'm against death sentence even for the worst offenses, torture on the other hand...

NghtRppr

sr. member

Activity: 504

Merit: 252

Elder Crypto God

Quote from: david4dev on July 11, 2011, 04:23:34 PM

Imagine I have a fatal, but treatable, illness. The treatment costs more than I could personally afford. Due to my financial situation I can't afford any health insurance.

In which, if any, of the following cases do I deserve to die:

1) I was a hard working citizen but due to no fault of my own I lost my job and am currently looking for work but unable to find any.
2) I am a child born into a poor family.
3) I have never worked due to laziness.
4) I did have a job but got fired for a valid reason. Due to my employment history, I am unable to find another job.
5) I committed a criminal offence and was sent to prison. I am now out of prison and can't find work due to my criminal record.

Deserve to die? None.

I think you mean, which of the above justifies coercing others to help you and again the answer is "none".

JA37

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

Die? None of the above.
Healthcare? All of the above.

randomguy7

hero member

Activity: 527

Merit: 500

Sorry for offtopic but: Atlas? Is this you?

david4dev

newbie

Activity: 56

Merit: 0

Imagine I have a fatal, but treatable, illness. The treatment costs more than I could personally afford. Due to my financial situation I can't afford any health insurance.

In which, if any, of the following cases do I deserve to die and in which to I deserve healthcare:

1) I was a hard working citizen but due to no fault of my own I lost my job and am currently looking for work but unable to find any.
2) I am a child born into a poor family.
3) I have never worked due to laziness.
4) I did have a job but got fired for a valid reason. Due to my employment history, I am unable to find another job.
5) I committed a criminal offence and was sent to prison. I am now out of prison and can't find work due to my criminal record.

Topic: Do I deserve to die and do I deserve healthcare? - page 4. (Read 4491 times)