Do not use more than 2x leverage | Bitcointalksearch.org

justdimin

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Quote from: tygeade on January 28, 2024, 04:24:31 AM

You can use 150x and make profit too, if you can of course, the amount you are leveraging is not the problem here, you can use any type of amount and make any kind of profit, that is never the point. I think it is quite important to remember that we are going to lose a lot more quicker if we are wrong, that is the point of it.

I hope that it could get to a level where we could make some good return from it and 150x or 2x we both all win, but when the price is going the opposite direction, I rather be at 2x than be at 150x, that would make sense. I mean margin-wise, you can cover 2x very easily, whereas you can't really make that 150x at all. So, yeah there are people with 10x who make profit, but there are also many who doesn't.

The problem is that people who do 10x have very little chance to stay, but also more than 150x people as well. In an example, if you have 10 thousand dollars, and you want to do 10x, that means you will be acted as if you invested 100k, so by logic if it goes to 90k, you are gone, that means 10% drop makes you lose it all, but at 100x for example, that 10k will become 1 million, and you will lose it all at 990k, so even 1% would make you lose it all. That's the difference and this is why 10x sounds better.

Obviously at 2x, you would need to lose 50% to lose it all, hence it's much better but 10% feels alright risk for some people. At worst case, they think they can get out before they can lose it all, or top the margin a bit more to lower the risk.

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Quote from: Bushdark on January 26, 2024, 01:54:08 PM

There are people that are using 10x leverage. What do you have to write about them and they are making profits from the market.
It is good when we understand what leverage really means and how we could leverage without hurting our account.
We need to take risk and when we win, people would call us successful. Understanding how risk works is a first step for us to be a winner in the market. We can always make money for ourselves without bothers.

You can use 150x and make profit too, if you can of course, the amount you are leveraging is not the problem here, you can use any type of amount and make any kind of profit, that is never the point. I think it is quite important to remember that we are going to lose a lot more quicker if we are wrong, that is the point of it.

I hope that it could get to a level where we could make some good return from it and 150x or 2x we both all win, but when the price is going the opposite direction, I rather be at 2x than be at 150x, that would make sense. I mean margin-wise, you can cover 2x very easily, whereas you can't really make that 150x at all. So, yeah there are people with 10x who make profit, but there are also many who doesn't.

MIner1448

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Well, here, of course, it is very contradictory, if x2 then the profit is x2, if you know how to trade futures, then you can play with the best leverage. The X2 shoulder is, of course, as close as possible to the spot, so to each his own, each has his own path.

leonair

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Quote from: God bless u on January 26, 2024, 07:06:39 AM

Quote from: the rise on January 22, 2024, 11:20:17 AM

maybe what is meant for long term trading, most average futures traders place leverage at 25+, because it usually only works temporarily, like me personally sometimes I increase the leverage to 125 x and only order $1-2 in each trade setting the SL and TP options for Minimizing risk, which Vitalik said is true if we trade for the long term, does not apply to the short term

Basically what you are doing is to make very few dollars. For those people who have a lot of investment, they wait for about three days, four days, five days, sometimes even a month. So I think it's better because it has a lot of benefits because they're giving you a loan, right? will get more benefit if you have thinking about a good future trade.

For long term trading it is very effective to gain good profit. you can't make profit in short time every time. many time you have to wait long time to make profit by trading like you mentioned so high leverage is soo risky. so i agree with op we shouldn’t take more then 2-3x leverage for safe trading. if we take high leverage like 10-125x then our balance can move to 0 in very short time and our trading fund will Liquided. so 2-3x is much better for safe trading

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Quote from: LastKiss on January 26, 2024, 09:03:05 PM

...As long as we know the risks it's up to someone if they want to use low leverage or high leverage.

I think that high leverage is mainly used by beginners, and this is due to the desire to make a big profit faster, without having a sufficient deposit for this. And if you add to this desire a lack of knowledge and experience, then this 100% entails the loss of the deposit.

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Investing and trading using leverage may also involve a higher amount of risk hence, it's obviously discouraged most especially for those who are still starting to trade or invest in the market.

But I believe for those who are eager enough to use leverage, then most probably they are also responsible to deal with its associated risk. If they can manage the risk and use leverage wisely, then most likely they're actually determined to use it successfully. With that, there's nothing we can do but to have faith in them that they can really make it in the end.

Vaculin

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There’s nothing you can do if that certain investor wants to take higher risk by using leverage. I guess that’s not actually wrong to use leverage if you are capable enough to manage it, since the more you put leverage into your trade or investment, the bigger profit opportunity you will gain. But if you are a pleb in crypto, I suggest don’t bother using leverage since it will only push you and end up losing. Gain some knowledge and skills first so you can use leverage in the future and make it an advantage.

Rehan Zakir

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You are saying right. Must use low leverage and take a trade when you are sure about the trade. Taking high leverage is really risky.
Firstly I don't prefer to take leverage trading. Because it is risky when you are beginner. Start with spot trading. But if you really want to start then start with very leverage is not so risky.
And put your spot limit at 10% loss.

MusaMohamed

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Quote from: poodle63 on January 26, 2024, 09:11:28 PM

125x leverage with $1 could actually make quite good profit if done consistently and each day is being done few times. after all if worst goes to worst we only lose $1

The tricky problem is people will increase their input capital from $1 to bigger like $50, $100 and more but they don't reduce their leverage.

When you are familiar with using leverages, you are like leverage addictive and you become a gambler, no longer as a trader or investor. Gambling with leverage is risky in this volatile market and with 125x leverage, a price change less than 1% can liquidate your position, so is it safe to use, even with $1?

Don't think like if you use $1, you will lose only $1 because after 100 times, you will lose $100.

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Quote from: God bless u on January 26, 2024, 07:06:39 AM

Quote from: the rise on January 22, 2024, 11:20:17 AM

maybe what is meant for long term trading, most average futures traders place leverage at 25+, because it usually only works temporarily, like me personally sometimes I increase the leverage to 125 x and only order $1-2 in each trade setting the SL and TP options for Minimizing risk, which Vitalik said is true if we trade for the long term, does not apply to the short term

Basically what you are doing is to make very few dollars. For those people who have a lot of investment, they wait for about three days, four days, five days, sometimes even a month. So I think it's better because it has a lot of benefits because they're giving you a loan, right? will get more benefit if you have thinking about a good future trade.

125x leverage with $1 could actually make quite good profit if done consistently and each day is being done few times. after all if worst goes to worst we only lose $1 people with big money have the advantage to spot trading because small increase is already good enough profit for them frankly speaking its different with small money traded we can be waiting for a whole year to wait for coin to increase 50x and we only get $49 its i don't think really good thats why so many small shrimp trader usually leverage high and that honestly make sense enough
i personally sometime use really high leverage with small money traded for fun and also when some project i think have obvious pattern of dumping or pumping i will just jump in to the future trading and do some good trade with high leverage.
eitherway, there is no wrong in using high leverage as long as we conscious enough to not go all in.

LastKiss

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Quote from: Oshosondy on January 15, 2024, 06:35:28 AM

~snip~
I think using this low leverage is good for traders. But investors should not use leverage at all. Investors should even supposed not to leave coins on exchanges but moved the coins to a noncustodial wallet.

This is also not applicable to many coins that are very volatile in a way that 1x leverage can even lead to liquidation of asset. See what happened to TRB recently that fall from almost $700 to $125.

I used 20x leverages for small capital when trading Bitcoin and for trading Altcoins, I stay away from using leverage cause I once traded altcoins with leverages and got liquidated in just a day lmao. for big capital it's better for me to trade without any leverage cause mostly I hold it for the long term and waiting the best price to sell. As long as we know the risks it's up to someone if they want to use low leverage or high leverage.

Bushdark

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There are people that are using 10x leverage. What do you have to write about them and they are making profits from the market.
It is good when we understand what leverage really means and how we could leverage without hurting our account.
We need to take risk and when we win, people would call us successful. Understanding how risk works is a first step for us to be a winner in the market. We can always make money for ourselves without bothers.

God bless u

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Quote from: the rise on January 22, 2024, 11:20:17 AM

maybe what is meant for long term trading, most average futures traders place leverage at 25+, because it usually only works temporarily, like me personally sometimes I increase the leverage to 125 x and only order $1-2 in each trade setting the SL and TP options for Minimizing risk, which Vitalik said is true if we trade for the long term, does not apply to the short term

Basically what you are doing is to make very few dollars. For those people who have a lot of investment, they wait for about three days, four days, five days, sometimes even a month. So I think it's better because it has a lot of benefits because they're giving you a loan, right? will get more benefit if you have thinking about a good future trade.

EarnOnVictor

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Quote from: Oshosondy on January 15, 2024, 06:35:28 AM

I am referring to Vitalik Buterin, one of the ethereum founders post on Twitter that states that people should not use more than 2x leverage.
It is one of the things he listed as a financial advice. As a trader, what do you think about it? We set some money aside for trading and as for me I still use up to 2.5x leverage for bitcoin to open a long position.

I think Vitalik Buterin should keep his advice to himself, people have the right to their money and they can use it as they like depending on their risk affinity. Even as he prefers that people do not use more than 2x, many people will prefer to stick to 1x, while some will use way more than 2x depending on the money they have in their accounts. He can't tell me to have $50 in my account and still stick to his uninformed advice of using the leverage of 2x. How much will I be making with that amount if the market is not so encouraging in movements? If I do not want to invest, I will know I am idle of it instead of wasting my time and energy over it.

This is not to mention those who have a lower amount of dollars in their crypto accounts. This is why I think his advice is just nonsense and rich-incline as trading advice should not be general. Investment advice should be based on factors, and in this case, if he is wise, he would have added an account size to it to be more constructive to justify his advice. You can think of it, if you have $5 in your crypto account, can you still follow his advice? We plan trading and investment based on our expertise and the amount we have, for me, it can't be general.

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Quote from: 2girls on January 22, 2024, 12:27:21 PM

It occurred to me that 2x leverage would be used by people who have a lot of money, and people who don't have money, even if they have a little money. The extra that is saved for trading is what leverage they are going to increase so that they can make more loss in a few seconds, so I think it's a risky thing, the more leverage you use.

It can give you both in loss and profit if you have more amount then leverage if you use less then you can effort if you have less money and you are using more than 2x leverage you may have a problem

people with low amount of money to begin wind tend to over leverage because they feel there's nothing to lose here, just some measly money can be earned by working but the chance of getting rich is in front of our eyes of course i will call such behaviour too reckless because some altcoin market are too full of manipulation, when there are many futures ready to be liquidated, they will change the tide of the market, to force liquidate all these derivates orders and bet against them.
thats what happening sometime i think with derivative being affected greatly by sudden move in spot market. im sure you've also seen plenty of altcoin that suddenly increase at correction and suddenly dumps at rally.
i think it has something to do with the fact that there are effort to force liquidate all the derivative contracts in some random altcoin with relatively low market capitals.

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Quote from: mirakal on January 22, 2024, 05:37:10 AM

Quote from: boyptc on January 15, 2024, 05:37:03 PM

I guess there is one point of Vitalik's life that he did more than 2x leverage and he lost and he's done with it. It's a good advise for someone who's conservative in investing but in trading, traders should also consider what he's said.

If someone is going to follow his advise, that's good and it helped what he said. But if not, no matter who's saying these advises, we're on our own as we trade.

Good thing with Vitalik is that, he's got his own platform through his social media and I am sure that many newbies that admires him follows him a lot.

Trading with leverage will certainly increase your potential profits, but it should be perform wisely, otherwise you will lose all your funds in just a blink of an eye. Probably that’s why Vitalik made it as a financial advise because majority of the traders or investors still lose in the process, most particularly for those who take leverage.

It is not for everyone and that's why he's advising to just go on a safe route with minimal risk.

Quote from: mirakal on January 22, 2024, 05:37:10 AM

However, if you are still beginning to learn the process, it would be much better to stay away using leverage, you can safely trade or invest without compromising its own risk.

Stay on the spot and don't do leverage. Whether it's 2x or more, if you're not used to it and it's best to avoid it because not everyone survives the trauma of being liquidated.

It's the most painful thing that you'll ever get with your trades if you just so don't know about it as a beginner.

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Quote from: Oshosondy on January 15, 2024, 06:35:28 AM

I am referring to Vitalik Buterin, one of the ethereum founders post on Twitter that states that people should not use more than 2x leverage.

Don't use >2x leverage. Just don't.

It is one of the things he listed as a financial advice. As a trader, what do you think about it? We set some money aside for trading and as for me I still use up to 2.5x leverage for bitcoin to open a long position.

I think using this low leverage is good for traders. But investors should not use leverage at all. Investors should even supposed not to leave coins on exchanges but moved the coins to a noncustodial wallet.

This is also not applicable to many coins that are very volatile in a way that 1x leverage can even lead to liquidation of asset. See what happened to TRB recently that fall from almost $700 to $125.

Its not really that a good recommendation when it comes on not to use more that 2x leverage but we know that people are naturally greedy on which it isnt really shocking that their normal threshold
would be sitting around 10x or even 20x leverage on which we know that this one could really be pertain out to be gambling but since you are able to applying out some analysis then it wont really be
completely be that considered to be gambling on which it isnt really shocking that there would really be those people who would really be testing out this kind of option on which they do know
that once they do hit up the right prediction then expect profits to be something more comparing when you do make spot on having 1x-2x on which this has been the typical or in default.

Its not really that bad on taking up such advise on which i do see its relevance but well each person does have their own choice on which it would really be having that
kind of preference on how we would really be gonna handling ourselves.

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Quote from: cute nmp on January 22, 2024, 02:26:28 PM

Agreed Over leveraging is one of the quickest way one can lose his trading account ,It's much better to aims for gradual growth instead of blowing up the whole trading account . Its a very dangerous habit when it comes to trading .

Because the more you increase leverage, you have more chance of losing your funds taking high leverage is just like gambling so I don't take any trade in gambling using leverage I just hold assets and sell them after they hit my goals i do not even take any trade in spot beace trading is also a risky part for those who have less portfolio. Taking more trades is a bad habit well if you want to do trade put the only money you are willing to lose otherwise do not take trade Yes if trade goes in your favour it can make good money for you as well.

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Quote from: leonair on January 17, 2024, 01:12:56 PM

Quote from: cute nmp on January 15, 2024, 03:10:18 PM

Totally agreed .Its very risky for any traders to over leverage when opening positions will be much better to accumulate small profits than go for a huge one and get liquidated easily ,I have lost so much over-leveraging during my days as a new trader with time i have since learnt my lessons and refrain from such bad trading habits.

When one trades with high leverage the chances of liquidation are high because when you go to trade with a $100 budget and use 10x leverage it will trade an amount equal to $1000 and if the price of your chosen coin is up 10% or Down and if it is against your entry you will lose your $100 and the trade will be cancelled. There if you take 2x leverage then the price of that coin has to change by 50% for you to liquidate. High leverage means more profit and more loss. So it is better to use less leverage to be less risk

The higher the leverage the higher the risk and the chances of getting liquidated very quick , I think greediness and getting rich quickly prompted many newbies traders to opt for high leverage of more than 2x without taking into consideration high volatility in the prices of cryptocurrencies, from personal experience I had once use a leverage of 10x when future trading a crypto pair on Binance exchange immediately the price reverses and went against my entry point I got liquidated in a very short period of time though I traded with small fund which I can afford to lose just to learn and have a feel of high leverage trading unfortunately it was a bad experience.

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Quote from: jaberwock on January 24, 2024, 01:54:33 PM

Quote from: mirakal on January 22, 2024, 05:37:10 AM

Trading with leverage will certainly increase your potential profits, but it should be perform wisely, otherwise you will lose all your funds in just a blink of an eye. Probably that’s why Vitalik made it as a financial advise because majority of the traders or investors still lose in the process, most particularly for those who take leverage.

However, if you are still beginning to learn the process, it would be much better to stay away using leverage, you can safely trade or invest without compromising its own risk.

Without doing it, we still can increase our potential profits. What's better is, we can do it in a less risky way. It is by increasing our knowledge on doing normal trades. If we want to, we can also use more money although this might start to increase our risks, but this is still better than doing leverage trades. No matter how wise we are, there is that one moment where we can lose.

So, guts is also needed here and it's better to use only amounts that we can afford to lose. Like I said earlier, there is still a risk in a normal trade, so how much more if the ones who are doing it are the newbies? They still lack in knowledge, so I won't say they can do it safely.

Everyone's principles are of course different, all trading certainly has its own risks, however, some people choose to take risks, both big and small, they are ready for everything, if you say that this is about guts, I really agree, there is no harm in trading using leverage, of course. with good trading skills

Topic: Do not use more than 2x leverage (Read 599 times)