Do you think countries should leave the EU?

KingScorpio

sr. member

Activity: 1470

Merit: 325

Quote from: paramind22 on December 15, 2018, 05:15:25 AM

Hungarian Foreign Minister: We Are Fed Up With 'Politically Correct, Hypocritical' European Union
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FE5Re77Xahs

England, seems like soon France and some other nations...the United Nations is enough, EU looks more scary then good.

nope what i am thinking is we should decentralise the financial system in the EU

dogtana

member

Activity: 845

Merit: 56

Quote from: Carlton Banks on December 17, 2018, 08:46:07 AM

Quote from: SCheek on December 17, 2018, 07:27:48 AM

Legislation can only be proposed by the unelected commission. The only elected institutions are the council of Europe and the parliament and all they ever do is rubber stamp and approve/disapprove (respectively) bills.

Again, be careful

If that point of view was popular, guess what the European commission would do? Give everyone the vote. They know how to manipulate public opinion, and it would only make the commission more legitimate, not less. And it would also be one more step on the road to changing the EU into the United States of Europe.

Yes, be careful, especially if you are in the US.

SCheek

copper member

Activity: 70

Merit: 2

Quote from: Carlton Banks on December 17, 2018, 08:46:07 AM

Quote from: SCheek on December 17, 2018, 07:27:48 AM

Legislation can only be proposed by the unelected commission. The only elected institutions are the council of Europe and the parliament and all they ever do is rubber stamp and approve/disapprove (respectively) bills.

Again, be careful

If that point of view was popular, guess what the European commission would do? Give everyone the vote. They know how to manipulate public opinion, and it would only make the commission more legitimate, not less. And it would also be one more step on the road to changing the EU into the United States of Europe.

If they did that they would sow their own destruction. Euroscepticism is rising in the EU. If given votes on the EU the Italians and french amongst others would leave.

Carlton Banks

legendary

Activity: 3430

Merit: 3080

Quote from: SCheek on December 17, 2018, 07:27:48 AM

Legislation can only be proposed by the unelected commission. The only elected institutions are the council of Europe and the parliament and all they ever do is rubber stamp and approve/disapprove (respectively) bills.

Again, be careful

If that point of view was popular, guess what the European commission would do? Give everyone the vote. They know how to manipulate public opinion, and it would only make the commission more legitimate, not less. And it would also be one more step on the road to changing the EU into the United States of Europe.

SCheek

copper member

Activity: 70

Merit: 2

The EU is the most ANTI-Democratic organisation we've seen in Western Europe in the last 70 years. Legislation can only be proposed by the unelected commission. The only elected institutions are the council of Europe and the parliament and all they ever do is rubber stamp and approve/disapprove (respectively) bills. Not to mention economically it promotes heavy inefficiencies.

cryptomaster420

member

Activity: 256

Merit: 10

The EU is not "the free market".
The EU is a bunch of bureaucrats who are keeping the free market as a hostage. "You stop giving us money and power, you lose the ability to trade freely".
It's nothing short of a mafia organization.
I can't wait to see more countries leave it, everyone will be better off this way. Centralized government is even worse for humanity than centralized cryptocurrencies

Carlton Banks

legendary

Activity: 3430

Merit: 3080

Quote from: jackg on December 16, 2018, 05:38:55 PM

Quote from: dogtana on December 15, 2018, 12:58:40 PM

No, I don't. Sure, EU has many faults, but they can be resolved. The EU has many advantages for its citizens that we like to forget. And it is again up to us to VOTE people into the parliament that will follow what the people want.

When did we get to vote on this stuff?
I don’t recall polling stations being open for the president of the EU or whatever his title is.

Careful.

If there were elections for major roles in the EU parliament, it will help to legitimize those positions. If you don't want a strong EU, don't vote on EU matters, or encourage more EU elections.

The EU could have avoided all these problems if the EU hadn't bred it's own class of politicians. If the EU parliament and the European Council (and the Euro) had never happened, then the EU could have realistically maintained their claim that it was a pro-democracy endeavor. Free trade and free movement of people is good for business.

But the politicians were greedy, they saw a chance to create a centralised top-down political structure, and are now pushing that on people that don't really want it. People in Europe know already that national government is corrupt and self-serving, concentrating that corruption into one place over the 30 or so states is obviously going to make corruption and unaccountability worse, not better.

jackg

copper member

Activity: 2856

Merit: 3071

https://bit.ly/387FXHi lightning theory

Quote from: dogtana on December 15, 2018, 12:58:40 PM

No, I don't. Sure, EU has many faults, but they can be resolved. The EU has many advantages for its citizens that we like to forget. And it is again up to us to VOTE people into the parliament that will follow what the people want.

When did we get to vote on this stuff?
I don’t recall polling stations being open for the president of the EU or whatever his title is.

Sure, the eu has some great merits but it’s also got a lot of faults that don’t seem to have been addressed so far.

I think the UK government also know what was voted for, they seem to be going for as hard a bee it as possible. The backstop was a bit stupid and they’ll never get a negotiation on that area that the Republic of Ireland and the north will be happy with. I feel the Republic of Ireland will start to want to leave with the uk. Scotland aren’t legally allowed to ever leave the uk, I think the north of Ireland might be the same but I’m not sure (obviously a new treaty can potentially be made if they do want to leave but it would be more difficult without an article 50).

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

Quote from: Jet Cash on December 16, 2018, 03:14:02 PM

The question is not "Should countries leave the EU", but how can countries escape the morphed British Empire that controls the EU. You can see what happens by looking at Brexit. The Oxford/Eton elite controls the Government and the Civil Service in the UK, and this is why there has been no attempt at all to honour the referendum. The last two years has been spent in trying to nullify the escape, by calling various options "soft Brexit" Macron was a Rothschild banker, and they are trying to stop France gaining independence. They crushed Greece when it tried. Clinton was a Rhodes scholar at Oxford, and he and other recent US presidents are part of the same globalist group. Thank goodness Trump is grasping a few throats.

This is so crazy. Do not honor the referendum.

I thought that in UK you had more serious institutions...
We had a similar situation in Brazil in 2005. The workers party made a referendum asking if people would like to ban guns. They lost, as the population said it wanted to keep the guns...

Worker's party just ignored the referendum and banned it anyway.

I hope UK can win this fight against globalism, I had no idea they were trying a "soft" brExit. I will research about it. Which kind of journals do you recommend that I can read free online to keep updated about Europe politics.?

InvoKing

legendary

Activity: 2142

Merit: 1065

✋(▀Ĺ̯ ▀-͠ )

EU failed to be like the United States. The European are selfish and cannot agree too long for anything. Germany and France are the major actors and the rest are just followers... Immigration causes a major problem, Italy and Spain mainly as the first arrival zone. The other countries just try to close the doors and keep away this problem. Every country that has a stable and positive growth will start thinking about escaping and keeping its money inside its country rather than paying Brussels.

Jet Cash

legendary

Activity: 2814

Merit: 2472

https://JetCash.com

The question is not "Should countries leave the EU", but how can countries escape the morphed British Empire that controls the EU. You can see what happens by looking at Brexit. The Oxford/Eton elite controls the Government and the Civil Service in the UK, and this is why there has been no attempt at all to honour the referendum. The last two years has been spent in trying to nullify the escape, by calling various options "soft Brexit" Macron was a Rothschild banker, and they are trying to stop France gaining independence. They crushed Greece when it tried. Clinton was a Rhodes scholar at Oxford, and he and other recent US presidents are part of the same globalist group. Thank goodness Trump is grasping a few throats.

The EU is dead, and needs to lie down, but the puppet masters haven't yet finalised it's replacement. One option is a newly formed British Commonwealth that includes the US. Thank goodness we are getting out, and hopefully we can avoid more money being sucked out to stall the collapse of Deutsche Bank and Commerze bank. Let the bankers lose their money, but they won't. It will be the pension funds, and the servile countries like Greece who will sell their assets to satisfy the treasonous masters.

dogtana

member

Activity: 845

Merit: 56

Quote from: Spendulus on December 15, 2018, 05:12:11 PM

Quote from: dogtana on December 15, 2018, 12:58:40 PM

Other countries should stay out of this. If Britain, Greece or whichever country wants to leave the EU, fine, but that is between them and the EU, not the rest of the world.

Maybe people in the US have had enough of other people getting involved in our political processes.

That includes all this silly "open borders" propaganda and funding to create chaos at our southern border.

Maybe some of you could use a dose of your own medicine?

Are you comparing calls for humanity to calls for ENDING the EU? Really? Is the US so incompetent it can't handle some refugees at the southern border? How about every blue state should leave the US to resist the tyrant dictator Trump?

jjjfff

copper member

Activity: 182

Merit: 18

Crypto.BI

Centralization is bad, regardless where it happens.

Every attempt to build one massive block instead of having hundreds of pulverized units will fail in the long run.

If the EU is centralized, then it will fail. The only way for the EU to work is to leave all states fully independent and then meet just to solve collective problems.

The immigration and economic policies of the EU are a disaster. Anyone older than 30 who lived in some EU countries before the Euro knows that the transition from national currency to Euro completely fucked up the middle class.

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Quote from: TECSHARE on December 15, 2018, 04:51:16 PM

Quote from: ATMD on December 15, 2018, 03:39:41 PM

The European Union commission do not have power to create any law, they can only create regulations, and these are also specific to those treaties that have already been signed.

https://www.quora.com/Is-the-EU-a-dictatorship

Regulations are EVEN MORE totalitarian than laws, because with regulations you have no DUE PROCESS, you are just summarily ruled in violation and penalties applied.

In the USA, regs are based on signed agreement. If you don't like what a reg has done to you, you can rescind your signature and take the whole thing to common law jury court.

Cool

Spendulus

legendary

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Merit: 1386

Quote from: dogtana on December 15, 2018, 12:58:40 PM

Other countries should stay out of this. If Britain, Greece or whichever country wants to leave the EU, fine, but that is between them and the EU, not the rest of the world.

Maybe people in the US have had enough of other people getting involved in our political processes.

That includes all this silly "open borders" propaganda and funding to create chaos at our southern border.

Maybe some of you could use a dose of your own medicine?

BADecker

legendary

Activity: 3906

Merit: 1373

Quote from: squatz1 on December 15, 2018, 02:43:10 PM

Quote from: BADecker on December 15, 2018, 07:31:36 AM

No! Rather, let the people leave the countries. After all, people are not designed to be slaves. And that is what they make themselves to be when they turn their allegiance over to a country.

In America, Canada, Great Britain, Australia, partially India, South American Guyana, and a few other place around the world, the common law rules. What is this common law? It is based in jury nullification. Any local jury can nullify any law in any local location with regard to the case they are judging.

The problem is that the people don't know this, and how to use the jury properly. Google "jury nullification" to see the power that the common law juries have.

Cool

You do though understand that this would only work in cases that have a jury... Because once you leave criminal cases, then you're going to be entering all of the trials without a jury.

Jury nullification is cool and all, I've seen the video on it. But it's not something I would proclaim is like this 'saving grace' for all of humanity.

Actually, the USA has both civil and criminal juries. The 6th and 7th Amendments guarantee them.

Jury nullification and other decisions are based on what the jurors think. It is true that in many cases you would be better off without a jury because of the ways that people think nowadays. Let the magistrate/judge make the ruling. If he/she doesn't rule according to the law, or if you don't like the ruling, you can sue him/her. And, you always can appeal to the jury.

The thing that makes a jury be able to nullify is, common law. You can have civil law juries all over the place in civil law countries. All they can do is rule according to what the law says. Common law juries can get rid of a particular law in the case before them.

Cool

TECSHARE

legendary

Activity: 3318

Merit: 2008

First Exclusion Ever

Quote from: ATMD on December 15, 2018, 03:39:41 PM

The European Union commission do not have power to create any law, they can only create regulations, and these are also specific to those treaties that have already been signed.

https://www.quora.com/Is-the-EU-a-dictatorship

Regulations are EVEN MORE totalitarian than laws, because with regulations you have no DUE PROCESS, you are just summarily ruled in violation and penalties applied.

ATMD

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 12

The European Union commission do not have power to create any law, they can only create regulations, and these are also specific to those treaties that have already been signed.

https://www.quora.com/Is-the-EU-a-dictatorship

TECSHARE

legendary

Activity: 3318

Merit: 2008

First Exclusion Ever

The European Union is a dictatorship which annexed its nations without the consent of its peoples. Furthermore a European Union was in fact the end goal of Hitler's 4th Reich, but hey, I am sure it will be different this time. The EU serves globalist corporate cartels, and it doesn't care what nations it has to destroy or subvert to take control.

squatz1

legendary

Activity: 1666

Merit: 1285

Flying Hellfish is a Commie

Quote from: BADecker on December 15, 2018, 07:31:36 AM

No! Rather, let the people leave the countries. After all, people are not designed to be slaves. And that is what they make themselves to be when they turn their allegiance over to a country.

In America, Canada, Great Britain, Australia, partially India, South American Guyana, and a few other place around the world, the common law rules. What is this common law? It is based in jury nullification. Any local jury can nullify any law in any local location with regard to the case they are judging.

The problem is that the people don't know this, and how to use the jury properly. Google "jury nullification" to see the power that the common law juries have.

Cool

You do though understand that this would only work in cases that have a jury... Because once you leave criminal cases, then you're going to be entering all of the trials without a jury.

Jury nullification is cool and all, I've seen the video on it. But it's not something I would proclaim is like this 'saving grace' for all of humanity.

Topic: Do you think countries should leave the EU? (Read 376 times)