Fun idea - no basis in fact -
The gox bots were run by asic manufacturers - driving the price to silly high levels to justify exhorbitant prices for mining equipment, they have now run off with the fiat and delivered the room heaters.
Topic: Do you think Willy and Markus (MtGox bots) were behind the last two BTC bubbles? (Read 6086 times)
October 03, 2014, 04:29:53 AM
October 03, 2014, 04:18:25 AM
Gox bots were behind every BTC bubble.
If not directly the indirectly in both ways there are in the game.
Who knows what will they do next.
October 01, 2014, 08:35:54 PM
I don't think they were behind the bubble. Those are all part of the world's only non-regulated speculative market. The bubble was popped by Gox losing 450k bitcoins. Now people are spooked by unregulated exchanges. Volume will return when people have confidence in exchanges again.
October 01, 2014, 07:37:47 PM
Gox bots were behind every BTC bubble.
October 01, 2014, 03:45:55 PM
Bots were the Viagra (plumbing), but for an epic fuck you need fuel (testo) and excitement (dopamine) too....
October 01, 2014, 03:43:51 PM
Anyone who says the BTC price would've hit 1200 without Willy Bot, isn't aware of the facts.
They are the reason the price went that high. There was nothing "organic" about those price increases whatsoever.
And now that they're gone, we have proof of that.
-B-
They are the reason the price went that high. There was nothing "organic" about those price increases whatsoever.
And now that they're gone, we have proof of that.
-B-
My opinion, too.
Yes, they created interest in Bitcoin which did increase its real value, in effect. But, they've also left many bagholders and delusional hodlers who think bubbles are a natural,repeating phenomena.
This is why the price will always trace backwards, until a real market attracts big buyers. Will that ever happen? Maybe. But until then, up and down with an overall downwards slope.
October 01, 2014, 03:30:51 PM
Anyone who says the BTC price would've hit 1200 without Willy Bot, isn't aware of the facts.
They are the reason the price went that high. There was nothing "organic" about those price increases whatsoever.
And now that they're gone, we have proof of that.
-B-
They are the reason the price went that high. There was nothing "organic" about those price increases whatsoever.
And now that they're gone, we have proof of that.
-B-
October 01, 2014, 01:31:55 PM
Whoever and whatever caused that bubble it did wonderful things for Bitcoin.
There would be no millions and millions of VC money, no Paypals and Overstocks without media coverage and public interest that bubble produced. All that is making Bitcoin infrastructure more robust and that can't do bad thing for Bitcoin.
Prices go up and down on all markets, bitcoin is nothing special in that. Just look EURO and GBP these days. It's a bear market and of course there's no confidence within investors. When that turns up, you'll see plenty of interest.
It's a market, nothing more. Some lost money, some made a killing, some, like me, failed to realize lot of fiat gains, but that's the game.
There would be no millions and millions of VC money, no Paypals and Overstocks without media coverage and public interest that bubble produced. All that is making Bitcoin infrastructure more robust and that can't do bad thing for Bitcoin.
Prices go up and down on all markets, bitcoin is nothing special in that. Just look EURO and GBP these days. It's a bear market and of course there's no confidence within investors. When that turns up, you'll see plenty of interest.
It's a market, nothing more. Some lost money, some made a killing, some, like me, failed to realize lot of fiat gains, but that's the game.
October 01, 2014, 12:29:47 PM
x Missing option:
The bots acted as a catalyst, increasing the bubble well beyound reasonable size. Likely BTC were bought with none existing fiat.
Personal conclusions (ymmv):
The $/BTC price would have never reached the "real" levels. Ranges of 200-300 $/BTC would have been more likely.
The resulting blow to the BTC ecosystem will have long reaching consequences (MTGox wasnt the first, but the biggest) resulting in lost invester confidence.
The resulting spike resulted in to much enthusiasm. This caused unreasonable expenses in directly attached "industries". Especially mining companies will go broke. The attached "stink of fail" will linger for a long time.
Personal opinion:
The bots were very bad for BTC, while the short term price increase looked nice the consquences are detrimental.
Very good points.The bots acted as a catalyst, increasing the bubble well beyound reasonable size. Likely BTC were bought with none existing fiat.
Personal conclusions (ymmv):
The $/BTC price would have never reached the "real" levels. Ranges of 200-300 $/BTC would have been more likely.
The resulting blow to the BTC ecosystem will have long reaching consequences (MTGox wasnt the first, but the biggest) resulting in lost invester confidence.
The resulting spike resulted in to much enthusiasm. This caused unreasonable expenses in directly attached "industries". Especially mining companies will go broke. The attached "stink of fail" will linger for a long time.
Personal opinion:
The bots were very bad for BTC, while the short term price increase looked nice the consquences are detrimental.
Negative consequences about mining companies going broke, very true.
October 01, 2014, 03:44:40 AM
October 01, 2014, 12:16:29 AM
So why did all the other exchanges rise?
sheep following.
emotional panic
no active brain cells
Arbitration
October 01, 2014, 12:09:19 AM
I think the current price drop also contributed by someone unknown
September 30, 2014, 10:43:41 PM
They were a factor but in the end it was China getting into the game. Lots of people getting into Bitcoin=price rise. And because Bitcoin is such a limited commodity it doesn't take millions of individuals to drive the price up exponentially. It doesn't seem like it now, but coins become pretty scarce on the exchanges when buy pressure becomes immense. This is the reason the price rockets up: Once traders believe there is a strong bull market, they take their coins off the books to sell at a higher price.
Then they banned it, the price dropped, they unbanned it, the price went up, banned again, price down, etc until all the original Chinese speculators were out of the market.
It's an easier explanation to believe than a bot, or group of bots, could supply that much buying pressure.
Then they banned it, the price dropped, they unbanned it, the price went up, banned again, price down, etc until all the original Chinese speculators were out of the market.
It's an easier explanation to believe than a bot, or group of bots, could supply that much buying pressure.
September 30, 2014, 08:42:07 PM
So why did all the other exchanges rise?
sheep following.
emotional panic
no active brain cells
September 30, 2014, 08:15:33 PM
So why did all the other exchanges rise?
September 30, 2014, 05:26:09 PM
Don't know if them, but I'm pretty sure the last bubble at least has linked to GOX in some sense and would not start without them.
That's why I doubt we will see another bubble any time soon
That's why I doubt we will see another bubble any time soon
September 30, 2014, 05:03:16 PM
x Missing option:
The bots acted as a catalyst, increasing the bubble well beyound reasonable size. Likely BTC were bought with none existing fiat.
Personal conclusions (ymmv):
The $/BTC price would have never reached the "real" levels. Ranges of 200-300 $/BTC would have been more likely.
The resulting blow to the BTC ecosystem will have long reaching consequences (MTGox wasnt the first, but the biggest) resulting in lost invester confidence.
The resulting spike resulted in to much enthusiasm. This caused unreasonable expenses in directly attached "industries". Especially mining companies will go broke. The attached "stink of fail" will linger for a long time.
Personal opinion:
The bots were very bad for BTC, while the short term price increase looked nice the consquences are detrimental.
The bots acted as a catalyst, increasing the bubble well beyound reasonable size. Likely BTC were bought with none existing fiat.
Personal conclusions (ymmv):
The $/BTC price would have never reached the "real" levels. Ranges of 200-300 $/BTC would have been more likely.
The resulting blow to the BTC ecosystem will have long reaching consequences (MTGox wasnt the first, but the biggest) resulting in lost invester confidence.
The resulting spike resulted in to much enthusiasm. This caused unreasonable expenses in directly attached "industries". Especially mining companies will go broke. The attached "stink of fail" will linger for a long time.
Personal opinion:
The bots were very bad for BTC, while the short term price increase looked nice the consquences are detrimental.
Agree completely with your points. Especially with the bots being a catalyst that took whatever bubble was happening and "teased" it up faster and higher than it would have gone on its own. Lots of money was pouring in; from China especially. The bots amplified it.
September 30, 2014, 03:17:37 PM
x Missing option:
The bots acted as a catalyst, increasing the bubble well beyound reasonable size. Likely BTC were bought with none existing fiat.
Personal conclusions (ymmv):
The $/BTC price would have never reached the "real" levels. Ranges of 200-300 $/BTC would have been more likely.
The resulting blow to the BTC ecosystem will have long reaching consequences (MTGox wasnt the first, but the biggest) resulting in lost invester confidence.
The resulting spike resulted in to much enthusiasm. This caused unreasonable expenses in directly attached "industries". Especially mining companies will go broke. The attached "stink of fail" will linger for a long time.
Personal opinion:
The bots were very bad for BTC, while the short term price increase looked nice the consquences are detrimental.
The bots acted as a catalyst, increasing the bubble well beyound reasonable size. Likely BTC were bought with none existing fiat.
Personal conclusions (ymmv):
The $/BTC price would have never reached the "real" levels. Ranges of 200-300 $/BTC would have been more likely.
The resulting blow to the BTC ecosystem will have long reaching consequences (MTGox wasnt the first, but the biggest) resulting in lost invester confidence.
The resulting spike resulted in to much enthusiasm. This caused unreasonable expenses in directly attached "industries". Especially mining companies will go broke. The attached "stink of fail" will linger for a long time.
Personal opinion:
The bots were very bad for BTC, while the short term price increase looked nice the consquences are detrimental.
September 30, 2014, 02:01:49 PM
MtGox was 10-20% above the other exchanges for a very long time.
People at other exchanges looked at how non-existing BTC was bought with non-existing USD at emptygox at higher and higher prices and bought the other exchanges as a result.
There was also a handful of people allowed to do "arbitrage" (which really wasn't) and they market bought the other exchanges without a second thought since those select few could immediately sell at an immense profit at MtGox - which was great for them until that "profit" vaporized along with their initial investment.
MtGox bots were definitively a big factor. They were certainly not the only one (China was and still is the most important factor) but they did have a big impact.
People at other exchanges looked at how non-existing BTC was bought with non-existing USD at emptygox at higher and higher prices and bought the other exchanges as a result.
There was also a handful of people allowed to do "arbitrage" (which really wasn't) and they market bought the other exchanges without a second thought since those select few could immediately sell at an immense profit at MtGox - which was great for them until that "profit" vaporized along with their initial investment.
MtGox bots were definitively a big factor. They were certainly not the only one (China was and still is the most important factor) but they did have a big impact.
September 30, 2014, 01:53:21 PM
Perhaps disclose you are short before posting fud?
Are you talking about me? I just posted the poll trying to be as neutral as possible and to let people discuss about what I think is an important topic.The Willy and Markus trades were clearly visible on the leaked Gox Data.
Are you saying you don't believe that leaked data was in fact from Mtgox?
Or simply that the author of the Willy Report makes too many assumptions?
PS: I added your option in the poll.
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