Down Jones intrinsic values?? - page 2.

BrewMaster

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Quote from: Broly46 on October 27, 2020, 12:40:27 AM

Gold intrinsic values is gold mining from earth crust the man-power and their valuable life, the logistics of gold delivery.

Bitcoin intrinsic value is the mining rigs, the difficulty curve, the supply, the miner valuable life, the risk of delivery bitcoin to buyer without getting hacked.

but you just explained production cost not intrinsic value. and neither gold nor bitcoin are not products being sold so that we can put their production cost + tax + profit as the final value.
this definition specifically doesn't work for bitcoin because its production cost depends directly on its value not the other way around (thanks to the way difficulty is defined).

for example you can spend a lot of money to recycle urine into drinkable water (what NASA does for astronauts) but you can't sell the water at a high price just because your production cost were high.

value should only be defined by considering factors such as utility and scarcity. since we can't put numbers on it people end up using "production cost" which is wrong if you ask me.

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What’s down joke intrinsic value? I think it’s backed by ever changing bluechips that won’t existed in the next tens or so years?

it provides a good utility. it helps gamblers make bets and lost money while the elite get fatter from their money Wink

el kaka22

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This is the reason why big names in nasdaq do not care about crypto all that much and some of them think we will go down in the end. How could you put mining rigs of bitcoin creation as value for bitcoin itself, but all those TRILLIONS of dollars worth of companies as nothing? All those workers, all those products, all those buildings, even the simplest hand held stuff have a huge value without even putting all the work into it, but somehow some graphic cards are more value than them?

If we keep this silly fight going instead of trying to get allied with wall street, we will be the ones who will lose, they constantly buy at cheap, they let you sell at low and basically work the media all the way they want just to kick you off from crypto, get friendship with them and maybe crypto small timers could survive.

Salauddin1994

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The intrinsic value of a share of the down jones underlying value or the current value of any future cash flow with no protection expected is the exact discounted discount rate. In order to get insights from comparative firms that differ with comparative assessment forms internal assessment simply assesses the underlying value of a particular business on its own most of the time novice investors get entangled in jargon words and get nothing out of them the same part goes for a distinct value.

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Quote from: Broly46 on October 27, 2020, 12:40:27 AM

Gold intrinsic values is gold mining from earth crust the man-power and their valuable life, the logistics of gold delivery.

So, what happens with a company that is involved in gold mining and it's listed on stock exchanges, like Glencore or Rio Tinto, do they have intrinsic value or not? Now speaking strictly of Dow, do the oil fields owned by Chevron have intrinsic value or not? Grin

But, as I always tell people that think something is worthless if you have some shares in those companies that you consider worthless I have no problem buying them a thousand for a satoshi!

That aside I'm starting to get the feeling some people are going totally nuts, for them, this new so-called crypto-revolution means that everything that existed in the past was an illusion and it's going to be worthless, forget Coca-Cola or Amazon, westernunion and moneygram were supposed to be killed half a decade ago and they are still up and doing pretty good for themselves.

Quote from: mu_enrico on October 27, 2020, 05:21:34 AM

For example, Marxist lovers will think the intrinsic value is about labor (cost).

Yeah, no wonder every single time they fail, they should start measuring it by multiplying the labor effort with an IQ score for a start.

mu_enrico

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You are confusing the term BOOK VALUE with INTRINSIC VALUE.
Plus, intrinsic value is not a rigid/absolute term. It can mean many things. For example, Marxist lovers will think the intrinsic value is about labor (cost).
While economists generally define intrinsic value as a value that can be measured objectively.

Anyway, about book value, corporations have fixed and current assets that can be measured objectively.

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Quote from: Broly46 on October 27, 2020, 01:59:15 AM

The researcher believe intrinsic value is the underlying value of an items, it’s said the items will always return to its underlying value after a prolonged period, but if down jokes has no intrinsic value, then what give it’s underlying value? What’s the future hold for down jones without an intrinsic value?

There is no intrinsic value for Dow Jones or other equity indices because they measure stock markets. Equity indices can be created and abolished at regulated index providers’ will. That’s why equity indices get hit hard when most stocks in their market crash. The underlying value is the stocks themselves.

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Quote from: Broly46 on October 27, 2020, 12:40:27 AM

Bitcoin intrinsic value is the mining rigs, the difficulty curve, the supply, the miner valuable life, the risk of delivery bitcoin to buyer without getting hacked.

There is no fundamental metric with which to judge intrinsic value. While some of these factors you mentioned are qualities of Bitcoin, they are somewhat not constant. Also the cost of production does not translate to intrinsic value.
The way I see it, assets like bitcoin represents different things to different people, so it's value is subjective.

Quote from: Yogee on October 27, 2020, 01:27:38 AM

I am not really into stocks but it's something about what's expected of the investment asset in the next few years. Where will the company stand and how much money they can make or dividends they can give to investors.

This is the speculative value of the asset, intrinsic value is not expected, nor is it the profits for investors.

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Quote from: Yogee on October 27, 2020, 01:27:38 AM

I am not really into stocks but it's something about what's expected of the investment asset in the next few years. Where will the company stand and how much money they can make or dividends they can give to investors. That's the simplest way I can put it. There are tons of articles on the internet if you want to get more technical.

The internet advocate it’s life changing experience, down jones make many people very wealthy, many people life changing to better, they invest for retirement that come to fruition all the time, everybody make money in down jokes, nobody will believe the soaring index make nobody rich.

Broly46

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Quote from: exstasie on October 27, 2020, 01:44:46 AM

Quote from: Broly46 on October 27, 2020, 12:40:27 AM

Gold intrinsic values is gold mining from earth crust the man-power and their valuable life, the logistics of gold delivery.

Bitcoin intrinsic value is the mining rigs, the difficulty curve, the supply, the miner valuable life, the risk of delivery bitcoin to buyer without getting hacked.

What’s down joke intrinsic value? I think it’s backed by ever changing bluechips that won’t existed in the next tens or so years?

"Blue chips" and "ever changing" don't exactly go together. Something tells me Apple, Microsoft, Mcdonald's, and Coca-Cola will still exist in 10 years. Cheesy

The Dow 30 doesn't have intrinsic value because it's an index. But you can calculate the intrinsic value of individual stocks. In fact, it's much easier to apply to stocks than BTC or gold because public companies have analyzable financials, cash flows, returns, etc.

These are examples based on discounted cash flow analysis, P/E ratio, or asset-based valuation:

Quote

Intrinsic value = (CF1)/(1 + r)^1 + (CF2)/(1 + r)^2 + (CF3)/(1 + r)^3 + ... + (CFn)/(1 + r)^n where

CF1 is cash flow in year 1, CF2 is cash flow in year 2, etc.
r is the rate of return you could get by investing money elsewhere

Let's say you want to perform a discounted cash flow analysis for the stock of RoboBasketball, a fictional company that makes a remote-controlled drone that looks like a basketball (ticker: DUNK). You look at its current cash flow statement and see that it generated cash flow of $100 million over the last 12 months. Based on the company's growth prospects, you estimate that RoboBasketball's cash flow will grow by 5% annually. If you use a rate of return of 4%, the intrinsic value of RoboBasketball would be a little over $2.8 billion using discounted cash flows going out for 25 years.

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Intrinsic value = Earnings per share (EPS) x (1 + r) x P/E ratio where r = the expected earnings growth rate

Let's say that RoboBasketball generated earnings per share of $3.30 over the last 12 months. Assume that the company will be able to grow its earnings by around 12.5% over the next five years. Finally, let's suppose the stock currently has a P/E multiple of 35.5. Using these figures, RoboBasketball's intrinsic value is:

($3.30 per share) x (1 + 0.125) x 35.5 = $131.79 per share

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Intrinsic value = (Sum of a company's assets, both tangible and intangible) – (Sum of a company's liabilities)

What is RoboBasketball's intrinsic value using this approach? Let's assume the company's assets totaled $500 million. Its liabilities totaled $200 million. Subtracting the liabilities from the assets would give an intrinsic value of $300 million for the stock.

https://www.fool.com/investing/how-to-invest/stocks/intrinsic-value/

The researcher believe intrinsic value is the underlying value of an items, it’s said the items will always return to its underlying value after a prolonged period, but if down jokes has no intrinsic value, then what give it’s underlying value? What’s the future hold for down jones without an intrinsic value?

exstasie

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Quote from: Broly46 on October 27, 2020, 12:40:27 AM

Gold intrinsic values is gold mining from earth crust the man-power and their valuable life, the logistics of gold delivery.

Bitcoin intrinsic value is the mining rigs, the difficulty curve, the supply, the miner valuable life, the risk of delivery bitcoin to buyer without getting hacked.

What’s down joke intrinsic value? I think it’s backed by ever changing bluechips that won’t existed in the next tens or so years?

"Blue chips" and "ever changing" don't exactly go together. Something tells me Apple, Microsoft, Mcdonald's, and Coca-Cola will still exist in 10 years. Cheesy

The Dow 30 doesn't have intrinsic value because it's an index. But you can calculate the intrinsic value of individual stocks. In fact, it's much easier to apply to stocks than BTC or gold because public companies have analyzable financials, cash flows, returns, etc.

These are examples based on discounted cash flow analysis, P/E ratio, or asset-based valuation:

Quote

Intrinsic value = (CF1)/(1 + r)^1 + (CF2)/(1 + r)^2 + (CF3)/(1 + r)^3 + ... + (CFn)/(1 + r)^n where

CF1 is cash flow in year 1, CF2 is cash flow in year 2, etc.
r is the rate of return you could get by investing money elsewhere

Let's say you want to perform a discounted cash flow analysis for the stock of RoboBasketball, a fictional company that makes a remote-controlled drone that looks like a basketball (ticker: DUNK). You look at its current cash flow statement and see that it generated cash flow of $100 million over the last 12 months. Based on the company's growth prospects, you estimate that RoboBasketball's cash flow will grow by 5% annually. If you use a rate of return of 4%, the intrinsic value of RoboBasketball would be a little over $2.8 billion using discounted cash flows going out for 25 years.

Quote

Intrinsic value = Earnings per share (EPS) x (1 + r) x P/E ratio where r = the expected earnings growth rate

Let's say that RoboBasketball generated earnings per share of $3.30 over the last 12 months. Assume that the company will be able to grow its earnings by around 12.5% over the next five years. Finally, let's suppose the stock currently has a P/E multiple of 35.5. Using these figures, RoboBasketball's intrinsic value is:

($3.30 per share) x (1 + 0.125) x 35.5 = $131.79 per share

Quote

Intrinsic value = (Sum of a company's assets, both tangible and intangible) – (Sum of a company's liabilities)

What is RoboBasketball's intrinsic value using this approach? Let's assume the company's assets totaled $500 million. Its liabilities totaled $200 million. Subtracting the liabilities from the assets would give an intrinsic value of $300 million for the stock.

https://www.fool.com/investing/how-to-invest/stocks/intrinsic-value/

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I am not really into stocks but it's something about what's expected of the investment asset in the next few years. Where will the company stand and how much money they can make or dividends they can give to investors. That's the simplest way I can put it. There are tons of articles on the internet if you want to get more technical.

Broly46

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Gold intrinsic values is gold mining from earth crust the man-power and their valuable life, the logistics of gold delivery.

Bitcoin intrinsic value is the mining rigs, the difficulty curve, the supply, the miner valuable life, the risk of delivery bitcoin to buyer without getting hacked.

What’s down joke intrinsic value? I think it’s backed by ever changing bluechips that won’t existed in the next tens or so years?

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