Here is a great write up about DragonChain by Huffington Post!
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/disneys-dragonchain-sends-3-powerful-messages-to-global_us_59e12cd6e4b09e31db9758e6
Topic: Dragonchain Token Sale - page 42. (Read 64394 times)
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation. ....But can we invest in USD? I see usd data is there.
We are not accepting USD contributions, only ETH and BTC.
You missed out on the fact that they didn't bother to clarify it when someone calculated it wrongly. I am not sure how many people read into stuff before they invest, but I have a feeling a good amount don't know what they are getting themselves into.
You are correct, I did make a mistake and I apologize for how long it took me to correct it.
I understand your concerns about the price of BTC/USD, but as we have stated since the beginning, we are not taking that into account. BTC is the standard for our crowdsale. Following the crowdsale two audits will be conducted, one internal and one external, the audits will determine the value of the token.
Feel free to join the telegram, there is someone on 24 hours a day to answer any questions you may have. https://t.me/dragontalk
I get what you are saying, but you are arguing how you think it should be (pegging dragns to USD) and that is not what is happening, whether or not you think it's fair is irrelevant. If you don't like the way they are doing it, don't buy in, I haven't seen one person on here or on their telegram pressuring anyone to actually contribute. In fact, this is probably the least intrusive ICO I have ever seen.
I personally like the way they are doing it. I invest in dragons with BTC, if BTC goes up before they hit the exchanges the value of my dragons also goes up. If BTC goes down before it hits exchanges, I'm in the same position I would have been if I had just bought BTC and can trade it no problem.
You missed out on the fact that they didn't bother to clarify it when someone calculated it wrongly. I am not sure how many people read into stuff before they invest, but I have a feeling a good amount don't know what they are getting themselves into.
Sure your dragons goes up, but is that really what the company is worth? There is a disconnect that you are not realizing.
But BTC is the standard platform for everyone to invest from. In the crypto world most tokens are pegged to BTC, if you want to buy alt coins, 99% of the time you have to first buy BTC. True, you can also buy ETH/LTC from coinbase etc. but if you want to trade that for say BAT or SYS or another alt, you would first have to trade the ETH/LTC for BTC, then use that to purchase your alt coins. Why would USD be any fairer? If it was pegged to USD, wouldn't that in turn be unfair to anyone who's native currency is worth less than USD? BTC is a level playing field.
If I bought 1 BTC at $1000 and you bought 1 BTC at $5000, my BTC is still worth the same as yours. It's like if I bought a '59 Gibson Les Paul in 1959 for $500, it would be worth $50k today. If you wanted to buy that now, $50k is what you would have to pay. Just because I paid less for it doesn't mean it isn't worth that much now.
None of the coins you see on coinmarketcap is pegged to BTC, they all have its own free market. Yes, most of them only have XXX/BTC trading pairs, but that doesn't mean it's pegged to BTC at a certain ratio. For example, LTC isn't always 1/10 of BTC's price, it changes with supply/demand on the exchanges -- but this is the case of DRGN. BTC is further away from a level playing field USD is - simply because it a greater variation than fiat currency.
Your example is true only for BTC, except you are not buying BTC anymore, you are buying DRGN. Why is DRGN pegged to BTC when it shouldn't be? It should be a free market by itself. Putting in 1BTC at $1000 and 1 BTC at $5000 get your the same amount of DRGN, that's absurd. Why is DRGN more expensive today than yesterday just because BTC price changed? Person A buys 1 BTC to invest in DRGN today, and BTC crashes 50% next day, and Person B buys 1 BTC to invest in DRGN tomorrow, why should Person A get the same amount of DRGN as Person B when Person B only spend 50% of the money as Person A? They are not investing in BTC, they are investing in DRGN, it should not be affected by the price of BTC, but it is. Basically, what I am saying they should be using a system of tracking the fiat equivalent of the BTC that is donated such that people receive the equivalent amount of DRGN back -- but they've said it's a bad idea....
I get what you are saying, but you are arguing how you think it should be (pegging dragns to USD) and that is not what is happening, whether or not you think it's fair is irrelevant. If you don't like the way they are doing it, don't buy in, I haven't seen one person on here or on their telegram pressuring anyone to actually contribute. In fact, this is probably the least intrusive ICO I have ever seen.
I personally like the way they are doing it. I invest in dragons with BTC, if BTC goes up before they hit the exchanges the value of my dragons also goes up. If BTC goes down before it hits exchanges, I'm in the same position I would have been if I had just bought BTC and can trade it no problem.
If Dragonchain sells all tokens then at the price of 24 cents per token that would make almost 100 million marketcap when it hits the markets. That is a bit to high for someone aiming for a short term ROI flip.
Isn't market capitalizaion defined based only on the circulating amount - so on 55% of 433MLN.
This will give 50M if the price per DRAGON is 24 cents total market capitalizaion - which is still a significant number
But BTC is the standard platform for everyone to invest from. In the crypto world most tokens are pegged to BTC, if you want to buy alt coins, 99% of the time you have to first buy BTC. True, you can also buy ETH/LTC from coinbase etc. but if you want to trade that for say BAT or SYS or another alt, you would first have to trade the ETH/LTC for BTC, then use that to purchase your alt coins. Why would USD be any fairer? If it was pegged to USD, wouldn't that in turn be unfair to anyone who's native currency is worth less than USD? BTC is a level playing field.
If I bought 1 BTC at $1000 and you bought 1 BTC at $5000, my BTC is still worth the same as yours. It's like if I bought a '59 Gibson Les Paul in 1959 for $500, it would be worth $50k today. If you wanted to buy that now, $50k is what you would have to pay. Just because I paid less for it doesn't mean it isn't worth that much now.
None of the coins you see on coinmarketcap is pegged to BTC, they all have its own free market. Yes, most of them only have XXX/BTC trading pairs, but that doesn't mean it's pegged to BTC at a certain ratio. For example, LTC isn't always 1/10 of BTC's price, it changes with supply/demand on the exchanges -- but this is the case of DRGN. BTC is further away from a level playing field USD is - simply because it a greater variation than fiat currency.
Your example is true only for BTC, except you are not buying BTC anymore, you are buying DRGN. Why is DRGN pegged to BTC when it shouldn't be? It should be a free market by itself. Putting in 1BTC at $1000 and 1 BTC at $5000 get your the same amount of DRGN, that's absurd. Why is DRGN more expensive today than yesterday just because BTC price changed? Person A buys 1 BTC to invest in DRGN today, and BTC crashes 50% next day, and Person B buys 1 BTC to invest in DRGN tomorrow, why should Person A get the same amount of DRGN as Person B when Person B only spend 50% of the money as Person A? They are not investing in BTC, they are investing in DRGN, it should not be affected by the price of BTC, but it is. Basically, what I am saying they should be using a system of tracking the fiat equivalent of the BTC that is donated such that people receive the equivalent amount of DRGN back -- but they've said it's a bad idea....
Let's clear this up.
Let’s say you put in 1 BTC.
Total raise is 10 BTC.
You get 10% of all dragons in public sale pool.
If contributing ETH, we convert to BTC at least daily based upon Bittrex closing price of ETH/BTC and use that value in the calculation. Market price for Dragons will be determined at close of sale based upon total amount raised (against fixed supply available in public sale [55% of total supply] = 238,421,940 Dragons]).
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation.
Most ICOs assign an arbitrary value to their token, come up with a hard cap, and offer bonuses and discounts to entice people to buy as quickly as possible. FOMO. We are choosing not to do that. We are letting the market set the price of DRGNs and by doing this we are hoping to create a more stable token and prevent dumping when DRGNs hit exchanges.
Let’s say you put in 1 BTC.
Total raise is 10 BTC.
You get 10% of all dragons in public sale pool.
If contributing ETH, we convert to BTC at least daily based upon Bittrex closing price of ETH/BTC and use that value in the calculation. Market price for Dragons will be determined at close of sale based upon total amount raised (against fixed supply available in public sale [55% of total supply] = 238,421,940 Dragons]).
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation.
Most ICOs assign an arbitrary value to their token, come up with a hard cap, and offer bonuses and discounts to entice people to buy as quickly as possible. FOMO. We are choosing not to do that. We are letting the market set the price of DRGNs and by doing this we are hoping to create a more stable token and prevent dumping when DRGNs hit exchanges.
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation. ....But can we invest in USD? I see usd data is there.
Let's clear this up.
Let’s say you put in 1 BTC.
Total raise is 10 BTC.
You get 10% of all dragons in public sale pool.
If contributing ETH, we convert to BTC at least daily based upon Bittrex closing price of ETH/BTC and use that value in the calculation. Market price for Dragons will be determined at close of sale based upon total amount raised (against fixed supply available in public sale [55% of total supply] = 238,421,940 Dragons]).
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation.
Most ICOs assign an arbitrary value to their token, come up with a hard cap, and offer bonuses and discounts to entice people to buy as quickly as possible. FOMO. We are choosing not to do that. We are letting the market set the price of DRGNs and by doing this we are hoping to create a more stable token and prevent dumping when DRGNs hit exchanges.
Let’s say you put in 1 BTC.
Total raise is 10 BTC.
You get 10% of all dragons in public sale pool.
If contributing ETH, we convert to BTC at least daily based upon Bittrex closing price of ETH/BTC and use that value in the calculation. Market price for Dragons will be determined at close of sale based upon total amount raised (against fixed supply available in public sale [55% of total supply] = 238,421,940 Dragons]).
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation.
Most ICOs assign an arbitrary value to their token, come up with a hard cap, and offer bonuses and discounts to entice people to buy as quickly as possible. FOMO. We are choosing not to do that. We are letting the market set the price of DRGNs and by doing this we are hoping to create a more stable token and prevent dumping when DRGNs hit exchanges.
The problem with that is, people who put in $1000 and $3000 can potentially end up owning the same amount of dragons, in this current world, where BTC isn't standard currency, this is pretty much a joke.
If ICOs assigned an arbitrary value, say $10, to their token, then $1000 spent is $1000 spent, you won't be penalized or profit just because the BTC value crashed/jumped due to other external factors that's not related to dragons. You are effectively creating "FOMO" because people might be afraid that tomorrow's BTC might be even more expensive and that they need to buy BTC now(!) so they can get the same allotment of DRGNs with less USD today.
You are not letting the market to set the price of DRGNs, you are letting BTC to decide the price of DRGNs when you are basing your evaluation off of price from BTC's market price (and price of BTC isn't majorly affected by DRGN, so really, that statement is really false).
Currently on the funding page, you are showing you've raised ~7700ETH and ~203BTC, which is ~3.8mil. (approx 7700ETH*$330 + 203BTC*$5800 -- even this is questionable, you guys suppose to exchange ETH into BTC everyday at the closing according to your FAQ, why is it still showing how much ETH you've raised?! You should be showing everything as BTC). Now, hypothetically, if the market crashed, and ETH and BTC worth only 50% of the current value, you would only have raised ~1.9mil instead. That's....kind of unwise. Unless you sell off coins into fiat (USD) as they come in, then you can at least guarantee that you've raised actual USD to pay off the whatever bills the company needs to pay. If THAT is the case, then a person who bought 1 BTC at $2000, and a person that bought 1 BTC at $4000, contributed different amount to the company, yet, they will receive the same amount of dragons. Hummmm, so however you want to spin it as "We are choosing not to do that. We are letting the market set the price of DRGNs and by doing this we are hoping to create a more stable token and prevent dumping when DRGNs hit exchanges", it is actually better off to have assigned the dollar value to each DRGN tokens instead of this "i hope i'm lucky that i purchased my btc when it is cheap". Your system would've worked if people's bank accounts are in BTC units, but they are not. People need to exchange them using USD, that adds an extra layer that you guys did not consider apparently.
Another thing, Market price for Dragons will be determined at close of sale based upon total amount raised, just exactly how did you guys come up with this and decide it is a good idea?? If, IF, BTC is worth $100k a piece, and you have raised 600BTC, that makes you a $60mil company. But if BTC is only worth $1000, you are only worth $600k. You are not letting the market to determine your company's worth, you are letting the BTC's market to determine your company's worth instead - for now at least - this isn't very good either...
In short, I find the system to be questionable, and people that is interested should really look into the math behind how they determine how much drgn you are assigned
Let's clear this up.
Let’s say you put in 1 BTC.
Total raise is 10 BTC.
You get 10% of all dragons in public sale pool.
If contributing ETH, we convert to BTC at least daily based upon Bittrex closing price of ETH/BTC and use that value in the calculation. Market price for Dragons will be determined at close of sale based upon total amount raised (against fixed supply available in public sale [55% of total supply] = 238,421,940 Dragons]).
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation.
Most ICOs assign an arbitrary value to their token, come up with a hard cap, and offer bonuses and discounts to entice people to buy as quickly as possible. FOMO. We are choosing not to do that. We are letting the market set the price of DRGNs and by doing this we are hoping to create a more stable token and prevent dumping when DRGNs hit exchanges.
Let’s say you put in 1 BTC.
Total raise is 10 BTC.
You get 10% of all dragons in public sale pool.
If contributing ETH, we convert to BTC at least daily based upon Bittrex closing price of ETH/BTC and use that value in the calculation. Market price for Dragons will be determined at close of sale based upon total amount raised (against fixed supply available in public sale [55% of total supply] = 238,421,940 Dragons]).
We do NOT consider USD price in the calculation.
Most ICOs assign an arbitrary value to their token, come up with a hard cap, and offer bonuses and discounts to entice people to buy as quickly as possible. FOMO. We are choosing not to do that. We are letting the market set the price of DRGNs and by doing this we are hoping to create a more stable token and prevent dumping when DRGNs hit exchanges.
What do you mean "your 1 BTC from when it's $2000 is worth the same as the 1 BTC that you buy today (~$5700)" Of course it is, there aren't multiple values of BTC. Are you saying that it isn't fair in some way because some people invested earlier and their investments appreciated in value?
I don't think they are claiming that the value of BTC doesn't fluctuate relative to USD, they are just not taking that into account. You are thinking of it as if BTC to USD has to be done, I actually like the idea of BTC being the standard.
You are exactly that right that it isn't fair, especially when you want to place a "dollar" value on the drgn at the end of ICO. BTC shouldn't be the standard imo because it prevents a standard platform for everyone to invest from. And also it seems like they are calculating how much they have raised by converting the BTC to USD, and then they want to back-assign how much drgn you receive by the BTC value...it just doesn't make much sense to have peg the drgn value to BTC. But this is the only ICO i've looked into, I'm assuming all ICO works this way....not a huge fan, but just my opinion.
Regardless, the previous quote from my post is still incorrect. It is calculated incorrectly.
But BTC is the standard platform for everyone to invest from. In the crypto world most tokens are pegged to BTC, if you want to buy alt coins, 99% of the time you have to first buy BTC. True, you can also buy ETH/LTC from coinbase etc. but if you want to trade that for say BAT or SYS or another alt, you would first have to trade the ETH/LTC for BTC, then use that to purchase your alt coins. Why would USD be any fairer? If it was pegged to USD, wouldn't that in turn be unfair to anyone who's native currency is worth less than USD? BTC is a level playing field.
If I bought 1 BTC at $1000 and you bought 1 BTC at $5000, my BTC is still worth the same as yours. It's like if I bought a '59 Gibson Les Paul in 1959 for $500, it would be worth $50k today. If you wanted to buy that now, $50k is what you would have to pay. Just because I paid less for it doesn't mean it isn't worth that much now.
Disney's blockchain project, it would be awesome. So all the fund will share the 400M dragonchain tokens if I understand correctly, right? Is there any bonus for us?
What do you mean "your 1 BTC from when it's $2000 is worth the same as the 1 BTC that you buy today (~$5700)" Of course it is, there aren't multiple values of BTC. Are you saying that it isn't fair in some way because some people invested earlier and their investments appreciated in value?
I don't think they are claiming that the value of BTC doesn't fluctuate relative to USD, they are just not taking that into account. You are thinking of it as if BTC to USD has to be done, I actually like the idea of BTC being the standard.
You are exactly that right that it isn't fair, especially when you want to place a "dollar" value on the drgn at the end of ICO. BTC shouldn't be the standard imo because it prevents a standard platform for everyone to invest from. And also it seems like they are calculating how much they have raised by converting the BTC to USD, and then they want to back-assign how much drgn you receive by the BTC value...it just doesn't make much sense to have peg the drgn value to BTC. But this is the only ICO i've looked into, I'm assuming all ICO works this way....not a huge fan, but just my opinion.
Regardless, the previous quote from my post is still incorrect. It is calculated incorrectly.
Umm, I'm pretty sure this is the wrong calculation? This is from their FAQ
With the BTC hardfork around the corner , is it best to wait to invest, as BTC may be higher now than it will be in 3 weeks?
Actually, the BTC/USD price will not be a factor -
We are doing all calculations for token distribution based upon BTC price with no consideration for USD or other fiat pricing.
1 BTC on Oct 2 = 1 BTC on Nov 2.
So you wouldn't be evaluating with ETH@250, you would be evaluating what how much BTC your ETH converts to on the day of you sending it in. And BTC value is "pegged" to USD - how they determine how much they've raised....(probably on the date of the audit/closing). They don't care what the value of your BTC is, only how many. So your 1 BTC from when it's $2000 is worth the same as the 1 BTC that you buy today (~$5700). Both BTC get you the same amount of DRGN token. So contrary to what they are saying, the BTC/USD price will be a factor for people that's buy/sending btc/eth into the sale.
What do you mean "your 1 BTC from when it's $2000 is worth the same as the 1 BTC that you buy today (~$5700)" Of course it is, there aren't multiple values of BTC. Are you saying that it isn't fair in some way because some people invested earlier and their investments appreciated in value?
I don't think they are claiming that the value of BTC doesn't fluctuate relative to USD, they are just not taking that into account. You are thinking of it as if BTC to USD has to be done, I actually like the idea of BTC being the standard.
Approx how many coins will I get for 1 ether if 100 million usd is raised?
In my calculation that is;
100.000.000 / 433,494,437 = 0,23 dollar cent
Eth 250 dollar / 0,23 = 1087 tokens
This is essentially correct, although I would just like to reiterate that any speculation on price or amount raised at this point is purely speculation. There will be a full professional audit following the completion of the crowdsale to determine the actual price of the token.
This is wrong as only 55% of tokens will be distributed during crowd sale. So only about 550 tokens.
Als a question - so the ERC20 token will not be converted to a novel dragonchain token in the future!?
You are correct, sorry about that. The token sale pool if 238,421,940 DRGNs.
I'm awaiting confirmation on the answer to the token question.
Umm, I'm pretty sure this is the wrong calculation? This is from their FAQ
With the BTC hardfork around the corner , is it best to wait to invest, as BTC may be higher now than it will be in 3 weeks?
Actually, the BTC/USD price will not be a factor -
We are doing all calculations for token distribution based upon BTC price with no consideration for USD or other fiat pricing.
1 BTC on Oct 2 = 1 BTC on Nov 2.
So you wouldn't be evaluating with ETH@250, you would be evaluating what how much BTC your ETH converts to on the day of you sending it in. And BTC value is "pegged" to USD - how they determine how much they've raised....(probably on the date of the audit/closing). They don't care what the value of your BTC is, only how many. So your 1 BTC from when it's $2000 is worth the same as the 1 BTC that you buy today (~$5700). Both BTC get you the same amount of DRGN token. So contrary to what they are saying, the BTC/USD price will be a factor for people that's buy/sending btc/eth into the sale -- since people are still using fiat to acquire BTC.
Holy crap, Ed Fries is on the advisory board?
Here is a great write up on DragonChain!
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/dragonchain-originally-developed-at-disney-announces-expert-advisory-board-300533839.html
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/dragonchain-originally-developed-at-disney-announces-expert-advisory-board-300533839.html
It has good features like sustainable token and i like dragon name
Watch our Devs live on Facebook now!
https://www.facebook.com/Dragonchaingang/videos/1706841056056014/
https://www.facebook.com/Dragonchaingang/videos/1706841056056014/
Hey guys - any proof this is actually a real thing by Disney?
DragonChain is currently listed on Disney's Open Source site https://disney.github.io/
You also have a bounty program for your project?
While we may in the future, we do not currently have any bounty programs.
You also have a bounty program for your project?
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