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Topic: ★★★ EARN A WHOPPING 25% ON PROFITS - RitzGrandCasino.com ★★★ - page 11. (Read 71352 times)

hero member
Activity: 644
Merit: 500
Weren't you just saying how accurate your feedback was? I bolded it so you can read it properly. Even if he did do it then (I was around then, and never even saw them do that...) You can't provide any proof. It wasn't genuine. You still won't back it up. And if that negative feedback was about your post being removed, I dunno, post about it in Service Discussions? And again, he never paid anybody for 6,500 posts.

i posted the link to the thread as proof but since then the OP has been edited a bunch of times i never screen sniped it as i never felt the need to i will ask theymos if he is willing to look at the edits

How about this:

If he's not doing it now, how will your feedback affect him?

Can'ty you guys just talk it out?

i have no issue with talking to them but all i get is remove your negative feedback or see you in court from them  

Dude tell him you are wrong and pull the feedback....   He specifically said no spam allowed he always said that.  that is why I see you as wrong.   Now I can see why your interpretation is  posted  as your feeling is 6500 posts comes to 217 posts a day.  Which must be spam.   You will lose on that interpretation here is why I think you will lose.  I am retired and I have the time to post 40 posts a day.

I don't think either one of them has to say he was wrong, or the other was. I just think they should just resolve it like it is. They don't even have to be all sappy about it.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
Weren't you just saying how accurate your feedback was? I bolded it so you can read it properly. Even if he did do it then (I was around then, and never even saw them do that...) You can't provide any proof. It wasn't genuine. You still won't back it up. And if that negative feedback was about your post being removed, I dunno, post about it in Service Discussions? And again, he never paid anybody for 6,500 posts.

i posted the link to the thread as proof but since then the OP has been edited a bunch of times i never screen sniped it as i never felt the need to i will ask theymos if he is willing to look at the edits

How about this:

If he's not doing it now, how will your feedback affect him?

Can'ty you guys just talk it out?

i have no issue with talking to them but all i get is remove your negative feedback or see you in court from them  

Dude tell him you are wrong and pull the feedback....   He specifically said no spam allowed he always said that.  that is why I see you as wrong.   Now I can see why your interpretation is  posted  as your feeling is 6500 posts comes to 217 posts a day.  Which must be spam.   You will lose on that interpretation here is why I think you will lose.  I am retired and I have the time to post 40 posts a day.

 I choose to not post on this site all the time and I am on other sites. I could post 40 good posts a day if I only post here and spend my time doing other things like going to the mall with my wife. Watching a movie with my wife.  cooking diner as I like to cook.   going to the Jersey shore etc.

 If my wife was dead (she almost died in the World Trade center)   I would have a lot more time and I might choose to spend it writing 6 to 8 hours a day on this site.   My posts would all make sense and add to the conversations.  I would also start threads on builds of gear/ tweaking gear  etc.    So posting 6500 posts which was his max number appears to invite trouble but it is in no way a guarantee of spamming   especially when he stated he won't pay for spam  from the get-go.   I normally don't stick up for one guy over another but  you are wrong.  You also could be subject to nuisance lawsuits.

  From anyone that was making 300 or 400 posts a month  i.e. earning decent money on this campaign.  If the 10 or more that earned .5 coins a month went after you claiming your attack on ritz  caused ritz to end the campaign you could get sued by them.
    Ritz did say he was ending the program for reasons other then that  so in a way he is still being nice to you.  If his post had said he ended the campaign due to your attack  you could have been looking at a lot of angry people.    He did not do that to you so as much as you may be annoyed and think your are fight the good fight   I would say think about it. Look at me an aging guy trying to help his retirement out .  I am due 360 posts  I would never say it is your fault if ritz decides to not pay me and the rest of us.   But I am a  rational guy level headed yada yada yada how many people on this site due 1 coin or .6 coins are nutty?
administrator
Activity: 5222
Merit: 13032
i posted the link to the thread as proof but since then the OP has been edited a bunch of times i never screen sniped it as i never felt the need to i will ask theymos if he is willing to look at the edits

Here are the edits. (The numbers in <>s are timestamps. They separate each edit.) Looks like you were right.
hero member
Activity: 644
Merit: 500
Weren't you just saying how accurate your feedback was? I bolded it so you can read it properly. Even if he did do it then (I was around then, and never even saw them do that...) You can't provide any proof. It wasn't genuine. You still won't back it up. And if that negative feedback was about your post being removed, I dunno, post about it in Service Discussions? And again, he never paid anybody for 6,500 posts.

i posted the link to the thread as proof but since then the OP has been edited a bunch of times i never screen sniped it as i never felt the need to i will ask theymos if he is willing to look at the edits

How about this:

If he's not doing it now, how will your feedback affect him?

Can'ty you guys just talk it out?

i have no issue with talking to them but all i get is remove your negative feedback or see you in court from them 

Then try and resolve it yourself. Probably P.M him about it.
legendary
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
ADT developer
Weren't you just saying how accurate your feedback was? I bolded it so you can read it properly. Even if he did do it then (I was around then, and never even saw them do that...) You can't provide any proof. It wasn't genuine. You still won't back it up. And if that negative feedback was about your post being removed, I dunno, post about it in Service Discussions? And again, he never paid anybody for 6,500 posts.

i posted the link to the thread as proof but since then the OP has been edited a bunch of times i never screen sniped it as i never felt the need to i will ask theymos if he is willing to look at the edits

How about this:

If he's not doing it now, how will your feedback affect him?

Can'ty you guys just talk it out?

i have no issue with talking to them but all i get is remove your negative feedback or see you in court from them 
hero member
Activity: 644
Merit: 500
Weren't you just saying how accurate your feedback was? I bolded it so you can read it properly. Even if he did do it then (I was around then, and never even saw them do that...) You can't provide any proof. It wasn't genuine. You still won't back it up. And if that negative feedback was about your post being removed, I dunno, post about it in Service Discussions? And again, he never paid anybody for 6,500 posts.

i posted the link to the thread as proof but since then the OP has been edited a bunch of times i never screen sniped it as i never felt the need to i will ask theymos if he is willing to look at the edits

How about this:

If he's not doing it now, how will your feedback affect him?

Can'ty you guys just talk it out?
legendary
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
ADT developer
Weren't you just saying how accurate your feedback was? I bolded it so you can read it properly. Even if he did do it then (I was around then, and never even saw them do that...) You can't provide any proof. It wasn't genuine. You still won't back it up. And if that negative feedback was about your post being removed, I dunno, post about it in Service Discussions? And again, he never paid anybody for 6,500 posts.

i posted the link to the thread as proof but since then the OP has been edited a bunch of times i never screen sniped it as i never felt the need to i will ask theymos if he is willing to look at the edits
hero member
Activity: 644
Merit: 500
i smell something fishy here why he is so against ritz?  Roll Eyes i mean ritz is paying his/her worker properly just like those other campaigns but since he/she is the highest one some people is trying to ruin his reputation

i wonder why jelousy needs to be born  Cheesy
Well this is what I'm thinking. If he gave Ritz negative rating for promoting spam (which he isn't), he should give negative rating to the likes of Stunna and others who have these signature campaigns too. I don't really care about this trust rating, and neither should Ritz nor any user around here.

exactly  Grin but why he only chased ritz then? how about the others  Cheesy

Please read this thread and you'll know why Ritz was targetted => https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=499007.1460

I think, if all of us contribute in this thread with proper reasoning, we may take zackclark70 out of trust circle.

ritz was never targeted the feedback that I gave it 100% accurate take a look at it

what you will also find is that ritz has spammed my trust with a boatload of inaccurate negative feedbacks

Are you sure about that?

zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28   0.00000000      paying people up to 2.6 BTC for posting up to 6500 posts a month for his add campaign spamming up the forum and deleting any negative posts

No signature campaign does 6,500 posts a month. None pay up to 2.6BTC. Not to mention, other Signature Campaigns do the same thing. They can't control who spam.

The feedback Ritz sent you:
zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28         This guy calls people a scammer but has no proof, No facts & no evidence. He just decides to call them that, to bully them on board threads. This guy is a loser . AVOID AVOID AVOID.
And don't put up with his trolling, bully tactics.

It's your place and Ritz's to resolve this. Talk it out, jeez.


at the time I posted the feedback they were offering up to 2.6BTC a month I cant remember what the price per post was but that is what they were offering at the time i am sure someone remembers that

also someone should point out where i said he is a scammer all i did was leave negative trust rating because genuine questions were deleted from a self moderated thread and that he was paying people to post up to 6500 posts a month there is nothing in my feedback that says he is a scammer

Weren't you just saying how accurate your feedback was? I bolded it so you can read it properly. Even if he did do it then (I was around then, and never even saw them do that...) You can't provide any proof. It wasn't genuine. You still won't back it up. And if that negative feedback was about your post being removed, I dunno, post about it in Service Discussions? And again, he never paid anybody for 6,500 posts.
legendary
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
ADT developer
at the time I posted the feedback they were offering up to 2.6BTC a month I cant remember what the price per post was but that is what they were offering at the time i am sure someone remembers that

also someone should point out where i said he is a scammer all i did was leave negative trust rating because genuine questions were deleted from a self moderated thread and that he was paying people to post up to 6500 posts a month there is nothing in my feedback that says he is a scammer

Perhaps you didn't mean to say Ritz is a scammer, but you certainly must understand by now that that is the perception that sticks when you see a large red "Warning: Trade with extreme caution!" next to someone. Sure people should look at what the feedback is about, but they often don't, particularly newer members that may be less familiar with the system.

Also, I sort of agree that a self-moderated thread is not a great start, but considering the amount of members that were at that time accusing Ritz of everything from the casino not being provably fair, to her not having intentions of paying out and what not, I can understand why it would be required to have a greater control of a thread like this. On top of it, someone coming in and then giving Ritz negative feedback doesn't really help the situation, and only sort of ensures it will get worse.

Lastly, I can't help but feel that you left the negative feedback for Ritz alone, and for something that most other campaigns were doing already: PD was certainly already paying members to post throughout the board with little restrictions, and you now have even more campaigns that do the same, and with ever larger incentives. Yet you didn't bother with leaving feedback for them. And I guess you can argue that most (but not all) others don't have self moderated threads and that Ritz is still untrustworthy because of this, but the truth is there have already been several months of Ritz paying the members of the campaign with little to no problems. So, why haven't you removed the negative feedback, or if you really care about people spamming the boards, given it also to UpDown, FXO, PD, Gaw Miners, etc.?


if ritz had talked to me about resolving the issues I mentioned on the posts that were deleted the feedback would have been removed instantly but due to ritz spamming my trust and demanding I remove the feedback or they will take legal action I decided it was best to leave the feedback as a matter of principle

please remember that there is no neutral feedback option and my feedback wasn't positive so that left me with no option but negative

the issue with ritz having negative total feedback due to someone that left me feedback having default trust is an issue with the trust system not me

( if I had left the same feedback as positive it would probably have given ritz a +1 feedback and that's something i didn't want as my trust wasn't positive )


it is never to late for ritz to apologise for spamming my feedback and calling me a scammer then they might just be able to talk to me about my concerns and get the feedback removed

i didn't just pick on 1 person doing sig campaigns i talked to a fair amount of the other people that were doing the same things and they listened to what i had to say and some even made changes to the rules making sure people posted more constructive posts

legendary
Activity: 2562
Merit: 1071
at the time I posted the feedback they were offering up to 2.6BTC a month I cant remember what the price per post was but that is what they were offering at the time i am sure someone remembers that

also someone should point out where i said he is a scammer all i did was leave negative trust rating because genuine questions were deleted from a self moderated thread and that he was paying people to post up to 6500 posts a month there is nothing in my feedback that says he is a scammer

Perhaps you didn't mean to say Ritz is a scammer, but you certainly must understand by now that that is the perception that sticks when you see a large red "Warning: Trade with extreme caution!" next to someone. Sure people should look at what the feedback is about, but they often don't, particularly newer members that may be less familiar with the system.

Also, I sort of agree that a self-moderated thread is not a great start, but considering the amount of members that were at that time accusing Ritz of everything from the casino not being provably fair, to her not having intentions of paying out and what not, I can understand why it would be required to have a greater control of a thread like this. On top of it, someone coming in and then giving Ritz negative feedback doesn't really help the situation, and only sort of ensures it will get worse.

Lastly, I can't help but feel that you left the negative feedback for Ritz alone, and for something that most other campaigns were doing already: PD was certainly already paying members to post throughout the board with little restrictions, and you now have even more campaigns that do the same, and with ever larger incentives. Yet you didn't bother with leaving feedback for them. And I guess you can argue that most (but not all) others don't have self moderated threads and that Ritz is still untrustworthy because of this, but the truth is there have already been several months of Ritz paying the members of the campaign with little to no problems. So, why haven't you removed the negative feedback, or if you really care about people spamming the boards, given it also to UpDown, FXO, PD, Gaw Miners, etc.?
legendary
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
ADT developer
i smell something fishy here why he is so against ritz?  Roll Eyes i mean ritz is paying his/her worker properly just like those other campaigns but since he/she is the highest one some people is trying to ruin his reputation

i wonder why jelousy needs to be born  Cheesy
Well this is what I'm thinking. If he gave Ritz negative rating for promoting spam (which he isn't), he should give negative rating to the likes of Stunna and others who have these signature campaigns too. I don't really care about this trust rating, and neither should Ritz nor any user around here.

exactly  Grin but why he only chased ritz then? how about the others  Cheesy

Please read this thread and you'll know why Ritz was targetted => https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=499007.1460

I think, if all of us contribute in this thread with proper reasoning, we may take zackclark70 out of trust circle.

ritz was never targeted the feedback that I gave it 100% accurate take a look at it

what you will also find is that ritz has spammed my trust with a boatload of inaccurate negative feedbacks

Are you sure about that?

zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28   0.00000000      paying people up to 2.6 BTC for posting up to 6500 posts a month for his add campaign spamming up the forum and deleting any negative posts

No signature campaign does 6,500 posts a month. None pay up to 2.6BTC. Not to mention, other Signature Campaigns do the same thing. They can't control who spam.

The feedback Ritz sent you:
zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28         This guy calls people a scammer but has no proof, No facts & no evidence. He just decides to call them that, to bully them on board threads. This guy is a loser . AVOID AVOID AVOID.
And don't put up with his trolling, bully tactics.

It's your place and Ritz's to resolve this. Talk it out, jeez.


at the time I posted the feedback they were offering up to 2.6BTC a month I cant remember what the price per post was but that is what they were offering at the time i am sure someone remembers that

also someone should point out where i said he is a scammer all i did was leave negative trust rating because genuine questions were deleted from a self moderated thread and that he was paying people to post up to 6500 posts a month there is nothing in my feedback that says he is a scammer

good point, I just hope people solve their issues without resorting to this kind of things, Ritz payed for the last 3 months so he is legit, and I think negative feedback should be kept to scammy business rather than something like this. I'm pretty sure if you Zack remove your feedback, Ritz will do the same if you talk it out

they are way past talking and i decided that i will never remove the first feedback and left the 2nd feedback at the time they tried to force me to remove the feedback

they could have avoided this by not deleting genuine questions of there self moderated threads
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
I think you two can just be honest about it and say that you want to join one of the other campaigns as soon as possible. After all, anyone who looks at your recent posts will know that already. Grin
Ok I'll be honest Yeah I want to join other Campaign if this one is ending ..! no on asked you to pass a judgement on my posts they are somehow better than yours..! and if you go through once again ..! Ok forget it I don't want to indulge in any kind of argument further on this thread and would like to keep it clean Thanks # Peace .  

I didn't mean to say that your posts were in any way bad, nor did I try to compare them to mine; I just meant to say that anyone could easily tell of your intentions to join another campaign by looking at them, so there was no need to beat around the bush, so to speak. After all, everyone else signed in this campaign is probably thinking the same thing already.  Wink

Well one thing there is a fear factor for people that made the effort to post good posts.  Did not go nuts and post  1000 posts.

 Hey I have close to 400 posts this month at hero rates it is around .52 btc   I would like to get it.  But frankly the signature campaign needs to be tiered :

member rate
 0-25 =      0.0
25-50 =     0.01
50 -100 =  0.02
100 or more = .025

hero rates higher

now I always have posted 200 -300 posts a month sometimes more.  I have been around  for 2 years but I got active last  year.

from august 2012 to may 2013 I made 200 posts.

from may 2013 to may 2014 I made 3000 posts.   I rounded but close to exact
legendary
Activity: 2562
Merit: 1071
I think you two can just be honest about it and say that you want to join one of the other campaigns as soon as possible. After all, anyone who looks at your recent posts will know that already. Grin
Ok I'll be honest Yeah I want to join other Campaign if this one is ending ..! no on asked you to pass a judgement on my posts they are somehow better than yours..! and if you go through once again ..! Ok forget it I don't want to indulge in any kind of argument further on this thread and would like to keep it clean Thanks # Peace .  

I didn't mean to say that your posts were in any way bad, nor did I try to compare them to mine; I just meant to say that anyone could easily tell of your intentions to join another campaign by looking at them, so there was no need to beat around the bush, so to speak. After all, everyone else signed in this campaign is probably thinking the same thing already.  Wink
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 501
i smell something fishy here why he is so against ritz?  Roll Eyes i mean ritz is paying his/her worker properly just like those other campaigns but since he/she is the highest one some people is trying to ruin his reputation

i wonder why jelousy needs to be born  Cheesy
Well this is what I'm thinking. If he gave Ritz negative rating for promoting spam (which he isn't), he should give negative rating to the likes of Stunna and others who have these signature campaigns too. I don't really care about this trust rating, and neither should Ritz nor any user around here.

exactly  Grin but why he only chased ritz then? how about the others  Cheesy

Please read this thread and you'll know why Ritz was targetted => https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=499007.1460

I think, if all of us contribute in this thread with proper reasoning, we may take zackclark70 out of trust circle.

ritz was never targeted the feedback that I gave it 100% accurate take a look at it

what you will also find is that ritz has spammed my trust with a boatload of inaccurate negative feedbacks

Are you sure about that?

zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28   0.00000000      paying people up to 2.6 BTC for posting up to 6500 posts a month for his add campaign spamming up the forum and deleting any negative posts

No signature campaign does 6,500 posts a month. None pay up to 2.6BTC. Not to mention, other Signature Campaigns do the same thing. They can't control who spam.

The feedback Ritz sent you:
zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28         This guy calls people a scammer but has no proof, No facts & no evidence. He just decides to call them that, to bully them on board threads. This guy is a loser . AVOID AVOID AVOID.
And don't put up with his trolling, bully tactics.

It's your place and Ritz's to resolve this. Talk it out, jeez.

good point, I just hope people solve their issues without resorting to this kind of things, Ritz payed for the last 3 months so he is legit, and I think negative feedback should be kept to scammy business rather than something like this. I'm pretty sure if you Zack remove your feedback, Ritz will do the same if you talk it out
hero member
Activity: 644
Merit: 500
i smell something fishy here why he is so against ritz?  Roll Eyes i mean ritz is paying his/her worker properly just like those other campaigns but since he/she is the highest one some people is trying to ruin his reputation

i wonder why jelousy needs to be born  Cheesy
Well this is what I'm thinking. If he gave Ritz negative rating for promoting spam (which he isn't), he should give negative rating to the likes of Stunna and others who have these signature campaigns too. I don't really care about this trust rating, and neither should Ritz nor any user around here.

exactly  Grin but why he only chased ritz then? how about the others  Cheesy

Please read this thread and you'll know why Ritz was targetted => https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=499007.1460

I think, if all of us contribute in this thread with proper reasoning, we may take zackclark70 out of trust circle.

ritz was never targeted the feedback that I gave it 100% accurate take a look at it

what you will also find is that ritz has spammed my trust with a boatload of inaccurate negative feedbacks

Are you sure about that?

zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28   0.00000000      paying people up to 2.6 BTC for posting up to 6500 posts a month for his add campaign spamming up the forum and deleting any negative posts

No signature campaign does 6,500 posts a month. None pay up to 2.6BTC. Not to mention, other Signature Campaigns do the same thing. They can't control who spam.

The feedback Ritz sent you:
zackclark70 1: -0 / +2(2)   2014-02-28         This guy calls people a scammer but has no proof, No facts & no evidence. He just decides to call them that, to bully them on board threads. This guy is a loser . AVOID AVOID AVOID.
And don't put up with his trolling, bully tactics.

It's your place and Ritz's to resolve this. Talk it out, jeez.
legendary
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
ADT developer
i smell something fishy here why he is so against ritz?  Roll Eyes i mean ritz is paying his/her worker properly just like those other campaigns but since he/she is the highest one some people is trying to ruin his reputation

i wonder why jelousy needs to be born  Cheesy
Well this is what I'm thinking. If he gave Ritz negative rating for promoting spam (which he isn't), he should give negative rating to the likes of Stunna and others who have these signature campaigns too. I don't really care about this trust rating, and neither should Ritz nor any user around here.

exactly  Grin but why he only chased ritz then? how about the others  Cheesy

Please read this thread and you'll know why Ritz was targetted => https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=499007.1460

I think, if all of us contribute in this thread with proper reasoning, we may take zackclark70 out of trust circle.

ritz was never targeted the feedback that I gave it 100% accurate take a look at it

what you will also find is that ritz has spammed my trust with a boatload of inaccurate negative feedbacks
hero member
Activity: 1372
Merit: 783
better everyday ♥
I'm not sure why some posters don't follow the terms and conditions.  It's laid out on the original post:

Quote
Payments for casino wins will be paid as detailed in our terms and conditions on our site.

You cannot spam or just post rubbish for the hell of filling up posts. Rubbish will not be paid.
An example posting rubbish:
Trolling
bumping
Spamming
I agree with....
A single image
Posting something that is not topic related in a thread.

Pretty simple and straight forward.  You don't follow rules, you shouldn't get paid.
It tells us only rubbish will not be paid and I believe I have 80% posts up to standard.I have seen many others on this campaign Bumping their threads for business.
I didn't know if we had some rubbish posts we would be disqualified to receive any payment.I thought only those posts would not be counted.

80% is a pretty bad percentage in my opinion.  If you posted 500 times, as an example, and only 400 were constructive, that's grounds for dismissal from the program.  100 just filler posts, bumps and spam especially if it's continuous, shouldn't be tolerated.

Once or twice here and there, if you're selling something, but that link RGC posted, doesn't really help your case.
legendary
Activity: 1414
Merit: 1000
I'm not sure why some posters don't follow the terms and conditions.  It's laid out on the original post:

Quote
Payments for casino wins will be paid as detailed in our terms and conditions on our site.

You cannot spam or just post rubbish for the hell of filling up posts. Rubbish will not be paid.
An example posting rubbish:
Trolling
bumping
Spamming
I agree with....
A single image
Posting something that is not topic related in a thread.

Pretty simple and straight forward.  You don't follow rules, you shouldn't get paid.
It tells us only rubbish will not be paid and I believe I have 80% posts up to standard.I have seen many others on this campaign Bumping their threads for business.
I didn't know if we had some rubbish posts we would be disqualified to receive any payment.I thought only those posts would not be counted.
hero member
Activity: 798
Merit: 1000
If any of the posts are spam he should not pay for them.That is it. It doesn't mean you don't post at all other than constructive.At least I don't see this way.
Also I feel suffice to promote my business in an announcement thread.That's none of your business.

Yeah and I'm sure you've been messaging him at the end of the month to let him know how many of your posts aren't constructive  Roll Eyes. Follow the OP and you get paid. Simple  

If you have a paid sig and you want to bump threads daily then expect for the advertiser to not be too happy. I'm sure you wouldn't.  
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 252
REAL-EYES || REAL-IZE || REAL-LIES||
I think you two can just be honest about it and say that you want to join one of the other campaigns as soon as possible. After all, anyone who looks at your recent posts will know that already. Grin
Ok I'll be honest Yeah I want to join other Campaign if this one is ending ..! no on asked you to pass a judgement on my posts they are somehow better than yours..! and if you go through once again ..! Ok forget it I don't want to indulge in any kind of argument further on this thread and would like to keep it clean Thanks # Peace .  
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