Topic: El Salvador has become the first country to make #Bitcoin legal tender! 🇸🇻 - page 84. (Read 43241 times)

If we do look back on what they have done when the market had been dripping down then they do even tend to buy even more.
Remember that they had bought when the price hits up 19k.
https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/07/01/el-salvador-purchases-80-additional-bitcoin-at-19k-president-bukele-says/

This does really shows on how dedicated and optimistic the president or the government on such place in regarding about Bitcoin.
They are really that indeed putting up their trust.

Bloomberg and every other website with figures on how much BTC El Salvador owns all got their calculations from various tweets from Nayib Bukele, he usually tweets whenever El Salvador purchases BTC, but not everyone would believe only a tweet without any other proof, such as transaction ID, or the wallets holding the funds.
That prediction is not even possible, except there is a total collapse of the banking system in many countries, and the money people could save from the collapse flows into the BTC network, which i don't think can happen.

I totally agree that less crime will lead to the development of the tourist sector which can indeed contribute to the development of the El Salvadorian economy. But the government is really crackling down on these gangs and many of them have been arrested and imprisoned. Hopefully the efforts of Bukele to reduce the crime rate in this this Bitcoin friendly nation will bear much fruit.

According to Bloomberg El Salvador owns about 2,381 Bitcoins which worth about $41.5 million. Let's assume that Balaji Srinivasan prediction of Bitcoin reaching one million dollars in two months becomes real, El Salvador will have about $2.3 billion. Most of these funds will go to debt services and provisions of basic infrastructures. El Salvador needs more than this amount to achieve economic development and it will take more than Bitcoin investment to give them such funds.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-10/el-salvador-s-bitcoin-holdings-devalue-60-amid-crypto-selloff#:~:text=The%20country's%202%2C381%20Bitcoin%20are,Tweets%20from%20President%20Nayib%20Bukele.

"BTC paradise" and not "crypto paradise", they made only BTC a legal tender, and it is a BTC city they plan to build, their plans are all around BTC and not crypto. Their economy has not changed much from what i have read, i know 'BTC tourists' who want to spend BTC and can go to El Salvador, may do so, and it surely has increased revenue from tourism; but i don't know if it is enough to boost their economy so much.
I don't believe El Salvador can ever become one of the richest countries in the world. I know if we believe Nayib Bukele's tweets on BTC's they've acquired, then they have bought a lot of BTC's, if BTC rises in price they will make very good profit, but it is not enough for a 'poor' country like El Salvador that's in debt to now become of one the richest in the world.

El Salvador wants to become a "crypto paradise" just to help boost its economy. I'd say Bukele's efforts are starting to pay off, as tourists are visiting the country like never before. It was pretty smart to add Bitcoin to the government's balance sheet. If BTC "explodes" in market price, El Salvador could become one of the richest countries in the world. Everything will depend how long Bukele stays in power. If he is replaced by an "Anti-Bitcoin" successor, then all efforts achieved so far will be nothing but lost.

Central banks are already failing, so it should only be a matter of time before more countries follow El Salvador's footsteps by adopting BTC as legal tender. Who knows if we're closer to "hyperbitcoinization" than we've thought before? Just my thoughts

El Salvador is one of the countries in terms of Bitcoin investment.  San Salvador, and El Salvador 2 New Yorkers accused of being chief adviser to Naib Bukile on Bitcoin acceptance.  Max Keizer and Stacy Herbert also invested in Bitcoin ventures in Central American countries and founded a crypto exchange backers that linked to Bitcoin.  El Salvador helped manage the sovereign debt sale.
Bitcoin Salvador

I want to be optimistic, but I believe El Salvador is rather aiming to become a crypto turistic place for people around to world to visit an move to, also some businesses with Bitcoin as core may feel like having their headquarters there eventually.

I think this way because it would make sense with the security plans which have been taken lately by Bukele to cripple the criminal organizations that historically operate in El Salvador, with less crime and more financial insentives, there is more chances for a financial/turistic Hub to form, but it may take years.

I don't know any more articles that contain data about some crypto-friendly countries and among the number of countries mentioned are Germany and America. My question is will these two crypto-friendly countries be forced to backtrack?
Then what kind of "forced back" do you mean. If in the economic sector, maybe Asia is currently included in the continent called the continent that strengthens the crypto increase since the pandemic is declared over.
When likened to a parable, this is clearly a confusing matter.

El Salvador might become in the future financial centre

So far there has been no sign as you said. But at the moment that possibility is difficult, because every country has the right to regulate the state of their money and economy. So I hope they will be the pioneers of the country legalizing Bitcoin as payment. Indeed, the IMF has warned El Salvador, but they stick to their choice. But there is no new news I got from El Salvador after Nayib Bukele will continue to buy Bitcoin. Even if I'm not mistaken, I've read they won't get any financial aid from the IMF.
Perhaps today they are suffering from the drop in the price of Bitcoin. But if later Bitcoin can reach the latest ATH, maybe they will become a rich country. It is even possible that their move will be imitated by many other countries.

I guess we are all on thesame track in this, the government need to make things at every affordability make readily available for the people to enjoy especially the masses, well, as regards the tax of a thing that is ongoing, we could see how other countries were so strict in collecting tax from bitcoin miners or any organizations well identified with bitcoin and i have to take USA and India as a xase study in these, they just don't take it easy when it comes to paying tax despite they are bitcoin friendly countries, let's consider El-Savador and the kind of leadership Nayib Bukele has established with the people, he has always assumed himself been in their shoes before making any declaration of policy as a leader.

Other interest earning organizations can be taxed because they were in for business but the people should be the major target, these are the common citizens that have no much access to afford paying tax from their income, the government of El-Savador is trying to give out to them first, so that everyone can be well established by improving the standard of living before demanding anything like tax related obligations from the citizens.


Obviously no, El-Savador is well known for bitcoin and that only, everything it has been engaging were on the platform of the adoption through bitcoin in other for the people to have a better experience in using this digital currency, you can imagine a centralized government taking much effort towards implementing a rigorous stand for a decentralized network, this shows that bitcoin is not only Nayib Bukele priority and center of focus but the entire people also needs it for them to enjoy decentralization under a centralized government, and they cant compromise this with alts.

I quote your long post @JayJuanGee because I think everything you said is relevant here. You pointed out that "crypto-friendliness" is a vague term, and I would even say it is meaningless for any entity (commercial or private) planning on conducting long-term business or to settle down in a respective place for a longer period of time.

"friendliness", what does that tell you and what does it help you when you want to make a well-considered decision? I can be friendly while hosting you at my home, at the same time hiding ten corpses in my basement.

In my opinion it comes down to two aspects:

1. Has that so called "friendliness" been converted into effective laws, offering a legal foundation for concerned entities to base their decisions on?

2. If 1. is true, is 1. durable? As in, will the rule of law count and hold today and tomorrow based on historical experience?



This is the World Justice Rule of Law Index. I have worked with it for a couple of years and also wrote some scientific papers with the help of it. From my experience, it is a really good source, but here is another one that ends in 2021 for now, but rates more countries.


In this context, "friendliness" obviously didn't bring the influx of cryptocurrency holders and industry that El Salvador was hoping for. That is not because nobody likes the idea and the pioneering role El Salvador is trying to take. It is because the world knows that neither "friendlieness" nor "rule of law" are likely to last.

That is why these moves of countries like El Salvador don't actually move the market at all. If Germany or the USA did the same, the market would certainly move. I mentioned these countries because both have their own set of restrictions or incentives to not do it. Germany won't take the lead because it can only do so in conjunction or in consensus with the European Union. The USA has, in my opinion, other intentions (albeit not against crypto). I am probably going to open a topic on that and discuss what I mean.

I have my doubts about whether the term "crypto-friendly" is appropriate.

Start out by thinking about El Salvador is intending to be bitcoin friendly, and so the fact that it is "bitcoin friendly" then do you conclude that it is automatically "crypto-friendly?"

I have my doubts, even though in one of the more recent announcements, El Salvador is saying that they are friendly to "technological innovation," which still is likely not exactly the same as "crypto-friendly," even though there could be several ways that they tolerate various expectations that relate to bitcoin, which sometimes might end up being affinity scams.   

I would characterize an affinity scam as something that is trying to seem like it is either the same to bitcoin, similar to bitcoin or even building upon bitcoin, yet in the end, it ends up not providing any kind of legitimate service because one or more of its "short-cuts" or "innovations" is actually employing some kind of a deception in which some kind of a scam or misrepresentation is taking place  - or even a kind of "printing of money" in terms of the creation of a token when a token may not be needed or properly disclosed how and when it is created.

From my point of view, there seems to be some tensions in your wanting to characterize (or maybe group in?) El Salvador as "crypto friendly" when that seems to be a term that you are largely just adopting from the various affinity scammers and even various mainstream media, bitcoin naysayers, shitcoin pumpers who love to ambiguate and dilute the ideas of what bitcoin is.  Was that your intention HedgeFx?  or do you actually sufficiently know what bitcoin is in order that you really know what you are talking about when you suggest that El Salvador is "one of the 'crypto-friendly' countries"?

To me it comes off as you don't really know the topic well enough or even appreciate what El Salvador is doing and attempting to do, if you are suggesting that it is "crypto-friendly," and I will admit that I might not know about some of the ways in which El Salvador might be more "crypto-friendly" or crypto tolerant than I had presumed it to be, merely because it is promoting the use and adoption of bitcoin in its country and the various ways of recognizing what is valid legal tender.  I will grant that it could be possible that El Salvador was a bit too broad and non-specific in their definitions in regards to what is bitcoin in terms of its own legal tender laws?  Which may well not be any kind of a problem unless there could be some ways that it overly invites and allows some affinity scams to get their foot in the door and to suggest that they are being "technologically innovative."   I am not going to proclaim to know all of the possible boundaries and ambiguities, and I would imagine that there are quite a few tensions that continue to exist, even between the kinds of motivations that a sound money like bitcoin creates as compared with various aspects of existing fiat systems, and surely in recent times, we are seeing some of those tensions unfold in terms of various bank failures and then some of the blame that is thrown at crypto and bitcoin, but still bitcoin and crypto are not the same thing, so some of the blame and attempts to address "what went wrong" might not be being presented in very clear ways either.

My fear is always the same: that these "crypto-friendly" countries will sooner or later be forced to backtrack. Global finance is worse than the Mafia, and does gold business with governments: any country that breaks away from their system and their rules is a potential enemy.

I know what you mean by saying that it is a double-edged sword because of the risk that the government of El Salvador must really understand, right? It seems you don't really know who the president of El Salvador is. You need to know that the president of El Salvador is a person who really loves, really likes and really appreciates Bitcoin so that the government made the decision to legalize Bitcoin in the country of El Salvador which of course really understood the risks before making that decision.

The success and progress of a country does depend on several factors, and of the three factors you mentioned, I think the environmental security factor is very influential in increasing economic and political growth as well as tourism there in El Salvador. If you often read tweets made by Nayib Bukele, of course you know that Nayib Bukele has succeeded in making the environment of the country of El Salvador very safe from the previously very frequent murders.

The adoption that has been and is being carried out by the Government of El Salvador is the right step in improving and organizing their economy with a better system. Isn't this something that needs to be supported?
Pros and cons of something will definitely exist but over time things that lead to goodness will always get support.
We read that since the adoption of Nayyib Bukele, El Salvador has started to gain the attention of many investors coupled with their seriousness in producing rules and laws.

So where is the problem that you think could be a double-edged knife.

Edit:
Or are you looking for attention by saying so.

All you said is just common words: which exact underwater stones do you mean? We discussed many things which can be risky in this case during tens of pages of this topic, so we know that things can go as right as wrong. But what do you exactly mean?

When I look at what the gov of El Salvador does I guess they read what we discuss here and if something has sense they try to do their best to improve it. At least I saw that first we discussed something and then there was some news saying that they did something in that direction. So if you see any concrete possible problems then just name them, it can probably help to avoid them.

We can see the adoption of Bitcoin by the state of El Salvador as legal tender as an innovative step, but we still need to see if this is a sustainable innovation in the long term. Because the adoption of this technology can be a double-edged knife and there is always a risk of deviating from the original path. Governments need to be careful in their approach to bitcoin adoption, and they need to ensure that their policies and actions are in line with their overall goals and key objectives.

Ultimately, the success of any government policy depends on a variety of factors, including the political and economic environment, the availability of resources, and the ability to adapt and evolve over time. It remains to be seen whether Bitcoin adoption in El Salvador will prove to be a successful and sustainable innovation. I think this is an interesting experiment that every country should pay close attention to.

That is correct, and only the early adopters can potentially earn the most benefit. Just like using Bitcoin. Of course things can go bad, its not the first time a wonderful project gets crushed by "external" events (like a coup). This is a disease of our developing countries. My country currently has no light at the end of the tunnel, but at least El Salvador has. We can only cheer for Salvadorians to keep this going and shine the light to the rest of the world.

Tax rates are important for business but aren't on first place. Stable rules and fair court mean much more. And it takes lot of time to gain business confidence. El Salvador is on the right way but I don't think that corporations will rush with their decisions of relocating headquarters somewhere. In the same time I think that Bitcoin city project if right organized can attract some corporations to open local branches to grab their piece of the pie. I'm sure many are following the situation in El Salvador in this vein.