Energy FUD!!! - page 2. | Bitcointalksearch.org

Mr.right85

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Quote from: Bitstar_coin on September 07, 2022, 09:17:00 AM

What do you think?

I think the study is inconclusive! Like, why center on bitcoin just because they wish to ruin it!! It's just not fair to the developing currency but the one thing I know and like about bitcoin is the fact that, every FUD serves to its promotion. So they could spread the FUD all they want, there are those that would still see the truth in there lies.

I think they should look at other fields too and talk about emissions from crude oil processing companies, the nuclear weapon testing, dump site emissions and disposal of radioactive substances. There are a lot of things that harms the environment and humans but still, we are managing them. Why should bitcoin be any different.

livingfree

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: livingfree on September 07, 2022, 01:13:07 PM

Whether it's accurate or not.

Let's all just accept that these people that are against bitcoin will always find a way to spread FUD about bitcoin. Remember that when it was always Tweeted by Elon about the "green mining" about bitcoin.

They always describe bitcoin as the bad actor but neglecting the other industries that are causing more harm to its surroundings than of those mining farms and solo miners of bitcoin.

And even when the majority of the mining farms are using green and renewable energy, they'll always have the same words to say about it being bad and likely consuming all the energy in the world.

Cryptocurrency couldn't please everyone and that includes the government. People will always provide FUD just to ruin the reputation of Bitcoin so spread fear, guilt, and even hatred. I don't think this information is reliable but still, we have to accept the fact that information will be biased especially when it comes to Bitcoin energy consumption. We can't expect good news or positive information regarding it.

And those that spread FUD, I think most of them are not part of government. But, they have that agenda because bitcoin is hitting their business and that's why they have to do what they have to do.

The same goes for those that are spreading FUD, they have their own reasons like they just want to see bitcoin at a cheap rate so everything they can describe things at their comfort for bitcoin's negativity.

There's always those biased people because they're not sincere of what they do but only tell things so that it will be at their advantage like these FUDs about bitcoin's electricity consumption.

Webetcoins

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Quote from: dothebeats on September 07, 2022, 02:13:04 PM

I wonder if that chart is accurate. That's a lot of energy being wasted, though I understand that it is unavoidable since our current technology doesn't allow for lossless energy transfer just yet. But 154k TWh? That seems a lot, and in comparison to bitcoin mining's total energy usage per annum, mining wouldn't even make a mark on the pie chart. But yeah, these talks will never end as advocates of efficient energy use will always find a way to go against bitcoin. It makes you look like you're concerned for the environment, when in reality you are not.

I think it's not accurate since the number shown in the pic is too much. I don't think people will waste so much energy because they know that their electric bills are also going to be expensive if they do and I think so many appliances or gadgets right now have an energy saving feature so there is only less to none energy that are going to be wasted. Energy fuds like this can be normal and it is the same as other kinds of fuds in btc.

As long as there is bitcoin, there will also be bitcoin haters. They will think of anything and they will use it only to destroy the image of btc. We need to ignore them because if you will argue it, the more they will become happy.

BIT-BENDER

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Let's be frank with ourselves, the energy consumption of Bitcoin mining is high, that's why many miners can not keep up with the competition and the cost of effectively running Bitcoin mining is very huge. As we all know high power consumption is equal to high Energy emissions which can lead to environmental hazards.
This isn't to say that Bitcoin mining is the chief cause of all global environmental, climate issues. But still I think it can be tackled.

The world always will be evolving and I think Crypto-currency and bitcoin should too, no that Crypto-currency is part of our future so it's impacts on us financially, and also environmentally. If there is any mean for Bitcoin to run on an power efficient and low carbon emission source this would improve this.

BlackHatCoiner

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As told by Lucius, the energy attacks on bitcoin, and Proof-of-Work in general, have a bright future. Governments have kicked the hornet's nest, and the sociopolitical consequences from ECG are heading towards us. I expect tremendous numbers of environmental propaganda, many of which will have to do with bitcoin mining. Some have already begun: https://nitter.net/DWhitmanBTC/status/1567915248149209089

Some have even introduced penalty mechanisms. Which country will be the bitcoin mining paradise?

stompix

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Quote from: HeRetiK on September 08, 2022, 04:55:13 AM

Looking at the recent hashrate increase there's still a distortion due to the Jul 2021 hashrate drop though, ie. a lot of the growth of the last 365 days is presumably hardware coming back online after having been relocated. So compared to last year's peak of ~180.66 EH/s we are currently only up ~27% at ~230 EH/s [1]. Accounting for the improved hashrate and efficiency of current mining hardware [2] it actually looks more like there's been a decrease in deployed hardware, as old ASICs become deprecated and are replaced, leading to slightly less energy consumption overall (assuming miners are still trying to make a profit, which seems likely). This would also fit with current Bitcoin price declines and increased energy prices.

[1] https://www.blockchain.com/charts/hash-rate
[2] https://www.asicminervalue.com/efficiency/sha-256

Peaks are quite irrelevant, as consumption in those statistics are generalized for the entire quarter.
So if we take the 188 Twh for the Q3 IN 2021:
https://bitcoinminingcouncil.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/2021.10.19-Q3-BMC-Presentation-Materials-Final.pdf

It covers this period:

which is around a 100Exa average.
Compared to this, in this whole last quarter, we have the lowest value at 202Exa, so at least a 100% increase in hashrate for the lowest point compared to an approximate growth of only 33% in energy consumption, to me is a bit of wishful thinking to consider that much new gear has been deployed when the prices for it were though the roof the whole period, we actually have reached periods of 3 years ROI to some s19 versions.

HeRetiK

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Quote from: Lucius on September 08, 2022, 03:47:13 AM

Quote from: stompix on September 07, 2022, 11:17:01 AM

And of course, it has grown, have you seen how the hashrate went up from last year?

I keep reading that there was an increase in the hash rate, but I didn't know until now that it was such a big increase, and then it makes sense that the energy consumption has also increased quite a bit. It seems that the on-duty critics still haven't got hold of the new data, which will surely serve them for new attacks at a time when we have a real energy crisis anyway.

Looking at the recent hashrate increase there's still a distortion due to the Jul 2021 hashrate drop though, ie. a lot of the growth of the last 365 days is presumably hardware coming back online after having been relocated. So compared to last year's peak of ~180.66 EH/s we are currently only up ~27% at ~230 EH/s [1]. Accounting for the improved hashrate and efficiency of current mining hardware [2] it actually looks more like there's been a decrease in deployed hardware, as old ASICs become deprecated and are replaced, leading to slightly less energy consumption overall (assuming miners are still trying to make a profit, which seems likely). This would also fit with current Bitcoin price declines and increased energy prices.

[1] https://www.blockchain.com/charts/hash-rate
[2] https://www.asicminervalue.com/efficiency/sha-256

Lucius

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Quote from: stompix on September 07, 2022, 11:17:01 AM

And of course, it has grown, have you seen how the hashrate went up from last year?

I keep reading that there was an increase in the hash rate, but I didn't know until now that it was such a big increase, and then it makes sense that the energy consumption has also increased quite a bit. It seems that the on-duty critics still haven't got hold of the new data, which will surely serve them for new attacks at a time when we have a real energy crisis anyway.

Kakmakr

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The fabricated "Energy crisis" are just a political play to fund large projects, where opportunities for bribes are created in a partnership between large Private companies and top government officials. Angry

So, what they do for example : They do not maintain the power plants and the supporting infrastructure, so that it eventually fails. When it fails... it creates a fabricated "crisis" that needs emergency funding. The Tender processes are hastened to "manage" the crisis and in that process... a lot of money for the project are siphoned to pay for inflated costs to rush those projects. (This "extra" money are then used to pay bribes to the people that approved the tenders) Roll Eyes

pooya87

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Quote from: Bitstar_coin on September 07, 2022, 09:17:00 AM

I can't seem to understand why btc is tagged as the bad guy consuming all the energy the planet~

Forget about the energy and you'll see that every couple of years there is a new topic they use to bash bitcoin. The reason is that from the first day that Bitcoin was introduced it scared a lot of corrupt people and organizations that felt threatened since bitcoin could replace what they offered or at least significantly reduce their dominance.

Consequently we have seen all kinds of lies spread about bitcoin, from bitcoin being a Ponzi scheme and used to buy drugs all the way to the most recent ones about energy consumption and price following US stock market.

The energy FUD is specifically hot these days since most of the Western world where majority of FUDs originate from are facing a very serious energy crisis.

dothebeats

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I wonder if that chart is accurate. That's a lot of energy being wasted, though I understand that it is unavoidable since our current technology doesn't allow for lossless energy transfer just yet. But 154k TWh? That seems a lot, and in comparison to bitcoin mining's total energy usage per annum, mining wouldn't even make a mark on the pie chart. But yeah, these talks will never end as advocates of efficient energy use will always find a way to go against bitcoin. It makes you look like you're concerned for the environment, when in reality you are not.

livingfree

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Whether it's accurate or not.

Let's all just accept that these people that are against bitcoin will always find a way to spread FUD about bitcoin. Remember that when it was always Tweeted by Elon about the "green mining" about bitcoin.

They always describe bitcoin as the bad actor but neglecting the other industries that are causing more harm to its surroundings than of those mining farms and solo miners of bitcoin.

And even when majority of the mining farms are using green and renewable energy, they'll always have those the same words to say about it being bad and likely consuming all the energies in the world.

stompix

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Quote from: Lucius on September 07, 2022, 10:37:55 AM

I'm not an expert and I can't say if it makes sense that the energy consumption has increased so much, or if it's photoshop, given that the source is a telegram channel.

Here is the Q2 report, 253 TWh:
https://bitcoinminingcouncil.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/2022.07.19-BMC-Presentation-Q2-22-Presentation.pdf

And of course, it has grown, have you seen how the hashrate went up from last year?

Lucius

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Quote from: jackg on September 07, 2022, 09:37:05 AM

I wonder where those figures come from and if they're even accurate.

A previous source of this infographic was the Bitcoin Mining Council and I know I've seen it many times on the forum. What has changed in this infographic from the OP is the total consumption that Bitcoin mining has on an annual level, and compared to before (188 TWh), it now amounts to 247 TWh.

I'm not an expert and I can't say if it makes sense that the energy consumption has increased so much, or if it's photoshop, given that the source is a telegram channel.

jackg

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I wonder where those figures come from and if they're even accurate.

Afaik 8000TWh is likely to be used by the grid to import your energy to you (going through two transformers to ensure no extra energy is lost in transit and that seems like a lot compared with the 50TWh, are we then also including cars stopping at red lights and fridges giving off heat out the back, or people using old light bulbs that have to gest up to produce light instead of LEDs which can make it almost instantly.

NeuroticFish

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Quote from: Bitstar_coin on September 07, 2022, 09:17:00 AM

I can't seem to understand why btc is tagged as the bad guy supposedly consuming all the energy the planet has to offer while about 50,000 TWh is being wasted

Well, this is simple imho.

There's a deep energy related problem because politicians have made some some policies they didn't think them over good enough.
But, as we know, politicians' main goal is to get re-elected. So they have to divert attention and find culprits.
So.. what entity or industry is consuming energy, and they can blame all this on and still make them look good? Bitcoin.
Their banker friends will be happy, older existing energy-hungry industry owners will be happy, bitcoin needs some bashing to "protect" the fiat and the printing machine... it's really the closest to a win-win scenario.

Ah, some geeks will be unhappy about all this? So what?
...or you thought those politicians and media (owned or under contract with politicians) do care about you, or us?!

Bitstar_coin

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I can't seem to understand why btc is tagged as the bad guy supposedly consuming all the energy the planet has to offer while about 50,000 TWh is being wasted Roll Eyes

According to the below infographic, the number of energy that is wasted globally is much higher than what all miners can ever consume, although am not very sure of the data accuracy but I want to believe it is close to accurate, btc mining can not be the monster of energy consumption the media and most especially government are presenting it to be.

Image source

What do you think?

Topic: Energy FUD!!! - page 2. (Read 351 times)