Everything you wanted to know about Grayscale BTC Trust but were afraid to ask! - page 22.

JayJuanGee

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Quote from: Husires on June 28, 2022, 01:53:49 PM

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n a Monday letter to investors, Grayscale said that of the more than 11,400 letters the United States Securities and Exchange Commission, or SEC, had received in regards to its proposed Bitcoin (BTC) investment vehicle, “99.96 percent of those comment letters were supportive of Grayscale’s case” as of June 9. According to Grayscale, roughly 33% of the letters questioned the lack of a spot BTC ETF in the U.S., given the SEC had already approved investment vehicles linked to Bitcoin futures, as was the case for ProShares and Valkyrie.

Will this change or should we not set high hopes?
All the talk from the director may not be accurate or impartial at the moment, but is there any chance, even a small percentage, to convert shares of its Bitcoin Trust (GBTC) into a physically-backed fund

Where's the link?

Husires

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Quote

n a Monday letter to investors, Grayscale said that of the more than 11,400 letters the United States Securities and Exchange Commission, or SEC, had received in regards to its proposed Bitcoin (BTC) investment vehicle, “99.96 percent of those comment letters were supportive of Grayscale’s case” as of June 9. According to Grayscale, roughly 33% of the letters questioned the lack of a spot BTC ETF in the U.S., given the SEC had already approved investment vehicles linked to Bitcoin futures, as was the case for ProShares and Valkyrie.

Will this change or should we not set high hopes?
All the talk from the director may not be accurate or impartial at the moment, but is there any chance, even a small percentage, to convert shares of its Bitcoin Trust (GBTC) into a physically-backed fund

Link: https://cointelegraph.com/news/grayscale-reports-99-of-sec-comment-letters-support-spot-bitcoin-etf

fillippone

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Quote from: Daltonik on June 20, 2022, 04:54:57 AM

The discount on the shares of the Grayscale Bitcoin trust (GBTC) went even further and is at a historic low and reached a value of -34.08% on June 17, considering that by that time bitcoin had not yet fallen below $18,000, but was trading at about the same levels as now, is it possible that the discount will be even lower.

I genuinely tought that low market price and hefty discount would have been beneficial to Grayscale. But I was wrong.
They had some flows, but the premium didn’t move substantially.

This is not good for them…

Daltonik

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The discount on the shares of the Grayscale Bitcoin trust (GBTC) went even further and is at a historic low and reached a value of -34.08% on June 17, considering that by that time bitcoin had not yet fallen below $18,000, but was trading at about the same levels as now, is it possible that the discount will be even lower.

fillippone

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I spoke about optimism in the air until a couple of days ago.
Spot ETF conversion is helping the cause, but apparently, the path is not set so clearly defined.

However, the discount on GBTC is telling a different story:

The discount on the premium should be telling the probability of an ETF conversion happening soon. Instead, the premium is still hovering around -30%. Still too low compared to the local minimum in my opinion.

Also, the volumes seem quite flat during the last few sessions:

Yes, they are somewhat higher than in recent weeks but bear in mind that in case of extreme variations, usually, we observe higher volumes.

Also snatching a bitcoin in GBTC means buying the implied BTC at 14,000.
Not bad at all!

Zanab247

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I believe many people will like to be part of this moving train so that they will become a better person in future. Now that many people are looking for where to acquire a good profit to be successful in their investment, I think they will have something good to achieve from this Grayscale BTC because there are a lot of things people need to know about this Grayscale BTC that will really help them now and in future.

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Quote from: Lucius on June 11, 2022, 08:40:03 AM

Quote from: fillippone on June 10, 2022, 06:12:04 PM

Optimism is in the air?

I don't know if it's optimism or the SEC has finally given in to the pressure from Grayscale and some other companies. Perhaps the threats of lawsuits and meetings have borne fruit, though the SEC is a tough nut to crack on this particular issue.

Maybe it's not about the pressure on SEC, but about the fact that SEC has its own plans for bitcoin. After all, we can't know what is happening and being discussed in their offices. Optimism is a good thing, but I adhere to the idea of realism, therefore, I suggest waiting for the final result and then we will find out if SEC will approve Bitcoin.

In general, any organizations, whether commercial or governmental, always pursue their own interests and only their own in the first place. I'm not sure that they care about ordinary bitcoin holders and worry about their well-being.

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Quote from: fillippone on June 10, 2022, 06:12:04 PM

Optimism is in the air?

I don't know if it's optimism or the SEC has finally given in to the pressure from Grayscale and some other companies. Perhaps the threats of lawsuits and meetings have borne fruit, though the SEC is a tough nut to crack on this particular issue.

fillippone

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Optimism is in the air?

Why is that?

Apparently in the comments someone is really positive on next request for approval round:

Since we are here, this is the last round of ETF approval deadlines:

fillippone

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Grayscale committed to launching their first ETF in Europe:

Grayscale Launches European 'Future of Finance' ETF Tracking Crypto Firms

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The fund is based on the Bloomberg Grayscale Future of Finance Index (BGFOF), which tracks the performance of financial services companies “projected to be leaders of the emerging digital economy.”

This new ETF is not a Bitcoin ETF. But I guess there is a plan to quote a Spot Bitcoin ETF in Europe, something like the ones from 21Shares or the one from ETC group.

Once they have a Spot bitcoin ETF approved in Europe, they will have another bullet to fire at the SEC, when they refuse (once again) the GBTC conversion.

fillippone

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Greyscale is usually quite downbeat on their effort to lobby the SEC. Given the considerable amount of fees they collect every day, I suggested that the stance to have the GBTC converted into an ETF, causing an immediate halt to this fee river in their chests, was more or less a showoff without any real traction.

I reckon this changed over the last few months. Above all, they saw different products approved by the SEC, and they know that being the first approved vehicle would be enormously beneficial to their business (example: BITO).

So they started reporting and pushing their effort.
Here you can find the latest news report (remember that Coindesk'parent company is the same as Grayscale) about yey another presentation n they gave to the sec:

Grayscale Had ‘Productive’ Meeting With SEC on Bitcoin ETF Conversion

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Grayscale Investments LLC recently met with the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) to better make its case for turning the Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (GBTC) into a spot bitcoin exchange-traded fund (ETF).
“Following a productive meeting, we remain encouraged by our ongoing engagement with the SEC,” a Grayscale spokesperson told CoinDesk. “At Grayscale, we intend to maintain an open dialogue with regulators and policymakers as we look ahead to July 6.”

You can find the presentation here:

I guess the meeting was productive, but the TERRA/LUNA debacle certainly didn't help the cause.

fillippone

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Quote from: Husires on May 08, 2022, 06:04:31 AM

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But Gilbertie was not convinced of the effectiveness a such a tack arguing, “It would take years. The SEC is not going to succumb to that kind of pressure… unless you get a change in leadership who have a sea-change in how they are looking at things… they want to see crypto coins completely surveilled… I don’t see how they’re going to back down from that when they’re all about investor protection.”

Each day without an ETF conversion is more and more difficult for the SEC to justify such a delay.
In the meantime investors are obliged to subscribe to something very different from the Bitcoin risk they want exposure to, and if they can take risk on Bitcoin, trough Pension Plan in Fidelity, for example, haven't the flexibility only a spot ETF could provide.

I sadly agree with Gilbertie: it could take years, but the SEC'position is very clear, even if unrelatable.

Husires

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Quote from: fillippone on May 07, 2022, 06:27:24 PM

Yet another effort from Grayscale: Jameson Loop makes us aware that GBTC asked every subscriber to post comment to the SEC.

I'll quote Sal Gilbertie, CEO of Teucrium's response to CNBC you can find it here https://www.cnbc.com/2022/05/03/sec-lays-out-path-to-coveted-spot-bitcoin-etf-but.html?__source=iosappshare%7Ccom.apple.UIKit.activity.CopyToPasteboard

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But Gilbertie was not convinced of the effectiveness a such a tack arguing, “It would take years. The SEC is not going to succumb to that kind of pressure… unless you get a change in leadership who have a sea-change in how they are looking at things… they want to see crypto coins completely surveilled… I don’t see how they’re going to back down from that when they’re all about investor protection.”

I think his analysis is closer to reality, and such pressures will not affect SEC decisions in a way that makes them change their view.

Is there one of GBTC holders is considered a political figure?

fillippone

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Yet another effort from Grayscale: Jameson Loop makes us aware that GBTC asked every subscriber to post comment to the SEC.

They appear t one more actively pushing for the conversion.
They probably are sensing that an approval is getting more probable, and they don't want to lose their main role, as we say with BITO how big is the first comer advantage.

fillippone

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Quote from: Oshosondy on May 06, 2022, 03:22:35 PM

It has been announced on Twitter by Grayscale that they have moved further as GBTC is now trading on Robinhood.

Yet another way not to buy GBTC.
The discount is not because there are rare no ways to buy the shares, but because the shares are a bad match tracking the underlying Afghan

Oshosondy

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It has been announced on Twitter by Grayscale that they have moved further as GBTC is now trading on Robinhood.

https://twitter.com/Grayscale/status/1522567545651347458?s=20&t=xzVMkY4axtFdsFMJgTaHvQ
There's two new ways to access crypto on
@RobinhoodApp
You can start trading $GBTC and $ETHE today.

It is also announced that people can also trade ether without trading the asset directly on Robinhood which is $ETHE.

fillippone

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The grayscale Bitcoin Trust premium has demonstrated some kind of resilience during the last weeks:

After touching a historical low at almost -30%, it has crawled back to -23%.
The cause of this could be seen in the new round of spot Bitcoin approval in Australia.
AUSTRALIA Approves first BITCOIN SPOT ETF

Even if the impact of those ETFs could be minimal, adding another legislation (in a common law system, I would add), is going to put more pressure on the SEC to approve the GBTC conversion from TRUST to ETF, with all the obvious consequences on the price.
So, the discount can be interpreted as a measure of the amount of expectation by the market for this event to occur (the lower the discount, the higher the probability), was marginally reduced.

fillippone

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Quote from: Oshosondy on April 19, 2022, 03:24:14 AM

Quote from: fillippone on March 29, 2022, 05:02:01 PM

Grayscale is on the attacking side against the SEC:

Grayscale Considers Flipping the Script and Suing SEC Over Bitcoin ETF

It is awhile I left posting on this thread but I read about Exchange Traded Fund (ETF) recently which is linked to how Grayscale wants United States SEC to approve Spot ETF but did not.

What I know is that Spot ETF has not be approved in United States before but Future ETF has been approved. Did Grayscale provide future ETF for their customers now or only seeking for SpotETF? All I know is GBTC.

Some organizations belive investors prefers spot ETF because it requires buying at the spot price of bitcoin which investors may consider real compare to Future ETF that requires contracts in a way the price differs as the market differs while investors may prefer spot because it uses the real price of bitcoin.

But what is confusing me is that SEC approves future ETF but said that spot ETF can lead to manipulation. I am very confused about this, I do not think it is true when organizations like grayscale see investors preference of spot ETF over future ETF.

Grayscale wants the SEC to approve a spot ETF.

You can learn more about future based Funds here:
Everything you wanted to know about a future Based ETF and were afraid to ask

But the main point is future based ETF are a very unpractical way of getting exposure do bitcoin price.

Oshosondy

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Quote from: fillippone on March 29, 2022, 05:02:01 PM

Grayscale is on the attacking side against the SEC:

Grayscale Considers Flipping the Script and Suing SEC Over Bitcoin ETF

It is awhile I left posting on this thread but I read about Exchange Traded Fund (ETF) recently which is linked to how Grayscale wants United States SEC to approve Spot ETF but did not.

What I know is that Spot ETF has not be approved in United States before but Future ETF has been approved. Did Grayscale provide future ETF for their customers now or only seeking for SpotETF? All I know is GBTC.

Some organizations belive investors prefers spot ETF because it requires buying at the spot price of bitcoin which investors may consider real compare to Future ETF that requires contracts in a way the price differs as the market differs while investors may prefer spot because it uses the real price of bitcoin.

But what is confusing me is that SEC approves future ETF but said that spot ETF can lead to manipulation. I am very confused about this, I do not think it is true when organizations like grayscale see investors preference of spot ETF over future ETF.

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Grayscale in the press release announces the rebalancing of funds for Q1 2022 GDLC Fund, DeFi Fund and GSCPxE Fund, now Avalanche (AVAX) and Polkadot (DOT) were added to the Digital Large Cap Fund, SushiSwap (SUSHI) and Synthetix (SNX) were removed from the DeFi Fund, Cosmos (ATOM) was added to the GSCPxE Fund as of April 5 , the funds have the following structure:

Digital Large Cap Fund : DeFi Fund : GSCPxE Fund :

-Bitcoin (BTC) - 60.07% -Uniswap (UNI) - 42.34% -Solana (SOL) - 26.47%

-Ethereum (ETH) - 28.57% -Curve (CRV) - 17.56 -Cardano (ADA) - 25.12%

-Solana (SOL) - 3.06% -Aave (AAVE) - 13.27% -Avalanche (AVAX) - 14.95%

-Cardano (ADA) - 2.74% -Amp (AMP) - 9.58% -Polkadot (DOT) - 13.95%

-Avalanche (AVAX) - 1.77% -MakerDAO (MKR) - 8.32% -Polygon (MATIC) - 7.54%

-Polkadot (DOT) - 1.56% -Compound (COMP) - 5.86% -Cosmos (ATOM) - 5.23%

-Litecoin (LTC) - 0.62% -Yearn Finance (YFI) - 3.07% -Stellar (XLM) - 3.43%
-Chainlink (LINK) - 0.57% -Algorand (ALGO) - 3.31%
-Uniswap (UNI) - 0.55%
-Bitcoin Cash (BCH) - 0.49%

Topic: Everything you wanted to know about Grayscale BTC Trust but were afraid to ask! - page 22. (Read 17091 times)