Fiat banking in Portugal worsens - page 2.

lihuajkl

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Quote from: LiteCoinGuy on July 31, 2014, 06:36:45 PM

germany will bail out us all Roll Eyes

They couldn't provide too much cash to bail out other single country. They have to consider all aspects of interest and loss before making any decision. If it doesn't fit their interest, he can choose other options, leaving Euro, or imposing strict conditions to it etc.

TaunSew

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Looks like the urbanism bubble just popped - people around the world may have to start returning to the rurals.

devphp

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Quote from: polynesia on August 03, 2014, 01:15:21 AM

There is a chance that other European countries will not take kindly to printing more Euros and the resulting inflation.

Well, they already took it in the past few years, kindly or not, doesn't matter.
There is a choice: to write off losses and shut half of the banks overnight together with all depositors' funds because most banks will then have a lot of failed assets on their books and effectively become bankrupt right there or print money to make that debt smaller through inflation. Google 'hyperinflation episodes in the history of money', they always chose the latter in the past.

polynesia

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Quote from: devphp on August 03, 2014, 12:42:47 AM

Quote from: Mobius on August 02, 2014, 04:32:48 PM

This kind of arrangement is very risky, and is not guaranteed for Portugal. There are obviously limits as to how much the ECB will be willing to print in order to bail out a specific country. It should be noted that printing money will result in inflation that will affect countries that were not bailed out.

Sure it will result in inflation.
But not printing money will result in quick collapse of the banking system, because failed banks' shares and bonds are other banks' assets, the entire banking system is interconnected.
So it's either quick death or slow blood shed in the form of printing money and resulting inflation. The past history shows that in almost 100% of similar situations the slow blood shed was chosen, no reason to expect otherwise this time.

There is a chance that other European countries will not take kindly to printing more Euros and the resulting inflation.

devphp

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Quote from: Mobius on August 02, 2014, 04:32:48 PM

This kind of arrangement is very risky, and is not guaranteed for Portugal. There are obviously limits as to how much the ECB will be willing to print in order to bail out a specific country. It should be noted that printing money will result in inflation that will affect countries that were not bailed out.

Sure it will result in inflation.
But not printing money will result in quick collapse of the banking system, because failed banks' shares and bonds are other banks' assets, the entire banking system is interconnected.
So it's either quick death or slow blood shed in the form of printing money and resulting inflation. The past history shows that in almost 100% of similar situations the slow blood shed was chosen, no reason to expect otherwise this time.

Mobius

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Quote from: devphp on July 31, 2014, 08:47:19 AM

Quote from: kerafym on July 31, 2014, 06:25:46 AM

Quote from: devphp on July 29, 2014, 10:47:00 AM

Quote from: kerafym on July 29, 2014, 08:55:39 AM

So, after 4 years, they still have not managed to solve the debt problems?

The only way to solve it is default on debt obligations or printing money/taxing (bail-outs/bail-ins) citizens. Or a combination of all those means. In any case it will be a nasty looking affair.

The debt is denominated in other currency, they ca't print money out of their way.

Sure they can. Of course, not that bank or Portugal, but the European central bank, they have all legislation in place for that and they are doing it. They also have legislation for bail-ins in place. Doesn't matter what debt is denominated in, they can devalue euro to buy dollars if the debt is in dollars.

This kind of arrangement is very risky, and is not guaranteed for Portugal. There are obviously limits as to how much the ECB will be willing to print in order to bail out a specific country. It should be noted that printing money will result in inflation that will affect countries that were not bailed out.

LiteCoinGuy

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In Satoshi I Trust

germany will bail out us all Roll Eyes

devphp

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Quote from: kerafym on July 31, 2014, 06:25:46 AM

Quote from: devphp on July 29, 2014, 10:47:00 AM

Quote from: kerafym on July 29, 2014, 08:55:39 AM

So, after 4 years, they still have not managed to solve the debt problems?

The only way to solve it is default on debt obligations or printing money/taxing (bail-outs/bail-ins) citizens. Or a combination of all those means. In any case it will be a nasty looking affair.

The debt is denominated in other currency, they ca't print money out of their way.

Sure they can. Of course, not that bank or Portugal, but the European central bank, they have all legislation in place for that and they are doing it. They also have legislation for bail-ins in place. Doesn't matter what debt is denominated in, they can devalue euro to buy dollars if the debt is in dollars.

yayayo

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That's serious, because Portugal is connected to the whole eurozone. So it has a much higher relevance thant the default of Argentina, that was long anticipated. It's funny to see (yet again) the shameless lies of the country's government to the people ("Everything is under control, the bank has no problems.").

And I'm sure, that this will only be the beginning of further problems in other european countries.

ya.ya.yo!

kerafym

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THE GAME OF CHANCE. CHANGED.

Quote from: devphp on July 29, 2014, 10:47:00 AM

Quote from: kerafym on July 29, 2014, 08:55:39 AM

So, after 4 years, they still have not managed to solve the debt problems?

The only way to solve it is default on debt obligations or printing money/taxing (bail-outs/bail-ins) citizens. Or a combination of all those means. In any case it will be a nasty looking affair.

The debt is denominated in other currency, they ca't print money out of their way.

BitchicksHusband

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Interesting that the bank's name is: Holy Spirit Bank

Apparently, "Holy Spirit" is the name of the family that owns it. I knew they named themselves after Jesus, but this is the first time I saw anyone named "Holy Spirit".

devphp

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Quote from: kerafym on July 29, 2014, 08:55:39 AM

So, after 4 years, they still have not managed to solve the debt problems?

The only way to solve it is default on debt obligations or printing money/taxing (bail-outs/bail-ins) citizens. Or a combination of all those means. In any case it will be a nasty looking affair.

kerafym

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THE GAME OF CHANCE. CHANGED.

So, after 4 years, they still have not managed to solve the debt problems?

giveBTCpls

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They can come at me anytime, they will not find much, most of my poverty money is going to be put into BTC anyway.

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: tyz on July 29, 2014, 06:23:28 AM

Cyprus 2.0 coming soon!

Hmm... I have a feeling that Portugal Haircut will be much worse than the one that occurred in Cyprus. In Cyprus, the government only targeted hard cash lying in the savings accounts. I fear that in this case, they will seize other forms of property as well (such as real estate, fixed deposits, equities, mutual funds, bullion bars, antiques and art).

btchaste

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If all the population would know about bitcoins, maybe they could live better without banks.

deepestfear

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Yep, and Portugal's a much larger economy, 10mn pop.
Bad times, they are a-coming...

tyz

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Cyprus 2.0 coming soon!

Cranky4u

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Fiat risks in Portugal deepens with $550B targeted for longer term refinancing which means government backed banks are planning a bail out by the general citizens.

http://www.linkedin.com/today/post/article/20140728225838-4628733-european-reality-check-portugal-s-banking-system?trk=nus-cha-roll-art-title

Topic: Fiat banking in Portugal worsens - page 2. (Read 2486 times)