Fiat currency (centralized system) | Bitcointalksearch.org

yudi09

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Quote from: Swordsoffreedom on December 25, 2022, 03:50:22 AM

Quote from: yudi09 on December 25, 2022, 03:13:00 AM

Quote from: Moeda on December 24, 2022, 04:40:20 PM

-snip-

To convince people that Bitcoin is not only the best investment but also a viable transaction tool for daily use is not an easy task because not all regions and not all sectors accept Bitcoin as a means of payment.
If in an area where we have a business and accept Bitcoin as payment, then it will be an unusual thing for those who see it.

In my opinion, it is not convincing, but socializing to them what Bitcoin is and how it functions if applied in our business.

Fact that it's not that popular yet, I think bitcoin's barrier is its volatility. It will be difficult to accept a highly volatile asset as a means of payment, no one wants their asset value to drop suddenly. Even though we, longtime bitcoin investors are also not willing to use our bitcoins as a payment method, so it is not easy to convince others. It is honest to say that I would prefer to hold more bitcoins rather than spend even the tiniest amount of them.

That should be what we need to do now, not to convince everyone because if they experience something unexpected then we who convinced them will be blamed.
There are exceptions, namely if a country has implemented official rules regarding the estimation of Bitcoin as legal tender. Likewise with businesses that accept Bitcoin as a means of payment only for long-term savings as a substitute for fiat deposits in banks.

serjent05

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Quote from: Outhue on December 24, 2022, 01:49:40 AM

Quote from: gantez on December 23, 2022, 12:12:06 PM

Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

What Nigeria government is doing is not about bitcoin but about what they want for their country to reduce physical money in circulation because they thinking it is the reason they are having devaluation. Bitcoin is far from the regulation in Nigeria, it is separate . They trying that people started to have cashless system and to use the CBDC if that can help the fiat and economy.

See? That's the problem, they think reducing physical money in circulation will make naira more valuable? I don't think this will work on the long run, this is not what creates value for Fiat money, the bad actors of the country are still running things behind the scene mate, bad actors need to be dealt with or else a new way will arise and the Naira will keep losing it's value.

Well, the "genius" of that nation studies it. and they are willing to do sacrifices in order to limit the amount of cash circulating the market. It is true that limiting the supply can somehow put more demand on an item, but they have forgotten that what they are limiting is not the production of that money but the movement of that money. they are not doing the country a favor but rather destroying the country's economy. We just need to wait a little and see how people will take action on the injustice their central bank had implemented. I will not be surprised if the economy of Nigeria falls negatively.

Instead of implementing development, they implement not so wise stuff.

Leviathan.007

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Quote from: Solosanz on December 23, 2022, 01:11:25 AM

So you're come from Nigeria, well there's someone create a new thread about this before [1] and there's a recent news about a hope for your country, since they're consider to unban Bitcoin [2]. As a citizens, no one can do anything to convince the government, but since your fiat currency is start to suffer due to high inflation. I believe they will know they can't use their fiat currency to store a value.

[1] https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/central-bank-of-nigeria-to-limit-cash-withdrawals-5426093
[2] https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/hope-for-cryptocurrency-in-nigeria-5430921

I'm not sure about Nigeria or if it's just a rule for some countries but even in my own country, there is a limit from the government's side and all the banks should obey the rules and they cannot withdraw huge amounts of money even in a weekly period of the time, so I guess even if he is from Nigeria where there is a high inflation rate that's totally normal to see the government make some limitations like this one to try to control the infraction rate, however, they are wrong and by doing this, people will show even more interest to hold other assets instead of the fiat currency.

Swordsoffreedom

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Quote from: yudi09 on December 25, 2022, 03:13:00 AM

Quote from: Moeda on December 24, 2022, 04:40:20 PM

What is our task is how to convince all parties that Bitcoin is feasible to be used as a transaction tool in everyday life, not just as an investment.

To convince people that Bitcoin is not only the best investment but also a viable transaction tool for daily use is not an easy task because not all regions and not all sectors accept Bitcoin as a means of payment.
If in an area where we have a business and accept Bitcoin as payment, then it will be an unusual thing for those who see it.

In my opinion, it is not convincing, but socializing to them what Bitcoin is and how it functions if applied in our business.

Fact that it's not that popular yet, I think bitcoin's barrier is its volatility. It will be difficult to accept a highly volatile asset as a means of payment, no one wants their asset value to drop suddenly. Even though we, longtime bitcoin investors are also not willing to use our bitcoins as a payment method, so it is not easy to convince others. It is honest to say that I would prefer to hold more bitcoins rather than spend even the tiniest amount of them.

yudi09

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Quote from: Moeda on December 24, 2022, 04:40:20 PM

What is our task is how to convince all parties that Bitcoin is feasible to be used as a transaction tool in everyday life, not just as an investment.

To convince people that Bitcoin is not only the best investment but also a viable transaction tool for daily use is not an easy task because not all regions and not all sectors accept Bitcoin as a means of payment.
If in an area where we have a business and accept Bitcoin as payment, then it will be an unusual thing for those who see it.

In my opinion, it is not convincing, but socializing to them what Bitcoin is and how it functions if applied in our business.

Obari

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Although am a newbie in the forum but i having a lot since i got here and i think cryptocurrency needs to be adopted by many of the so called government and their egos of controlling citizens funds through fiat system.

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k. This news caused serious agitation through out the country as the limit set for the withdrawal is really inconvenient with citizens. This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

This is really bad and that is why Bitcoin is the hope of the common man.
I once wrote a reply on a topic talking about the possibility of government joining Bitcoin since they couldn't fight Bitcoin. I also came across this news and I was also told that, the government had to impose such law into your country so as to force it's citizens to use the country's electronic money( E NAIRA) and this is also a sign that the government of your country despite it's barn on crypto and Bitcoin, they are also diving into tye industry and have also launched it's first electronic and digital currency.
Bitcoin is the way out and I will crave everyone never to give up on crypto.

Moeda

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Although am a newbie in the forum but i having a lot since i got here and i think cryptocurrency needs to be adopted by many of the so called government and their egos of controlling citizens funds through fiat system.

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k. This news caused serious agitation through out the country as the limit set for the withdrawal is really inconvenient with citizens. This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

In particular, this cryptocurrency is very relevant to be used as a transaction tool. Besides being able to make fast transactions, it is also transparent. We cannot say someone has not paid if the proof of transaction will be recorded and visible to the public. However, it is different from the fiat transactions used by the banking system through the RTGS network. Apart from the non-transparent transaction, one can still tell that the transaction has not been completed. Perhaps this is the most basic difference between crypto and fiat transactions.

But a tool that will be useful if used together. For example, if we have a high-tech smartphone, while our friends don't have a smartphone, then the sophisticated smartphone that we use is useless because we can't communicate with our friends. Bitcoin is very good in all aspects, but this is useless if only we use it while the government doesn't approve, in the end the policy makers will issue burdensome rules for those of us who use Bitcoin.

What is our task is how to convince all parties that Bitcoin is feasible to be used as a transaction tool in everyday life, not just as an investment.

Outhue

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Quote from: gantez on December 23, 2022, 12:12:06 PM

Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

What Nigeria government is doing is not about bitcoin but about what they want for their country to reduce physical money in circulation because they thinking it is the reason they are having devaluation. Bitcoin is far from the regulation in Nigeria, it is separate . They trying that people started to have cashless system and to use the CBDC if that can help the fiat and economy.

See? That's the problem, they think reducing physical money in circulation will make naira more valuable? I don't think this will work on the long run, this is not what creates value for Fiat money, the bad actors of the country are still running things behind the scene mate, bad actors need to be dealt with or else a new way will arise and the Naira will keep losing it's value.

Darker45

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I'm not sure if Satoshi ever mentioned about governments' control over how much a person could withdraw from his/her very own money, but this is definitely one of the setbacks of having a currency that you do not truly own. I'm pretty sure we have heard or read the news of a man in Beirut who robbed a bank of his very own money. This is one of the shortcomings of the fiat system.

With Bitcoin, you can truly own your money. What's yours is truly yours. You can withdraw it, move it anytime of the day to whoever and wherever you want. That's simply not possible with fiat.

Unfortunately, however, with how centralized platforms are spreading, people are now beginning to complain about locked accounts, frozen funds, and so on. It's ironic and sad that a financial innovation that provides full ownership and control of one's money is being exploited by custodians and centralized platforms. But the saddest thing of all is that people allow it.

Hydrogen

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

I wonder how common this ideolgy has spread throughout today's world?

These types of ideas, used to be fringe ideology. Limited to a small subset demographic of society who pursued financial independence. It may be only recently that people have had their eyes opened to alternatives. The 2008 economic crisis served as a trigger event for the rise of this methodology. The global pandemic of 2020 and other crisis, could further accelerate the adoption of alternate views on economics and finance.

The irony of the topic is we have seen leaders in government like David Walker warn about these types of crisis since 2009.

Quote

Campaign for fiscal responsibility

Walker has compared the present-day United States to the Roman Empire in its decline, saying the U.S. government is on a "burning platform" of unsustainable policies and practices with fiscal deficits, expensive overcommitments to government provided health care, swelling Medicare and Social Security costs, the enormous expense of a prospective universal health care system, and overseas military commitments threatening a crisis if action is not taken soon.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_M._Walker_(U.S._Comptroller_General)#Campaign_for_fiscal_responsibility

When David Walker did a nationwide tour on these topics back in 2009, I thought people would pay attention, wake up and the worst of it would be averted. However it seems that things did not go that way.

Merit.s

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Government will prefer using their fiat currency which can be properly monitored by them,they are in charge and most act like that,in other for the citizens not have the right to go against their polices. With btc adoption by governments, the government will benefit less and might not be able to control the country's economy properly as banks will have less customers. If you go against the government or the government have issues with you,your account can be freezed up. The government enjoys more benefits in using fiat than crypto this is why they are refusing btc adoption.

Fortify

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Although am a newbie in the forum but i having a lot since i got here and i think cryptocurrency needs to be adopted by many of the so called government and their egos of controlling citizens funds through fiat system.

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k. This news caused serious agitation through out the country as the limit set for the withdrawal is really inconvenient with citizens. This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

It sounds like the government of your country is particularly incompetent if they have gotten to the point of imposing capital controls on currency and it's easy to see why a lot of trust can be lost. However the reality of the situation is that cryptocurrency in it's present form is incapable of performing all the transactions that happen in the world in a timely manner, especially in comparison to existing payment networks like Paypal or credit / debit cards. I hope in future the transparency of cryptocurrency and the decentralization it is based on is capable of meeting that demand - while being impervious to things like the 51% attack, but we're still at step one of that process until people figure it out.

serjent05

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Although am a newbie in the forum but i having a lot since i got here and i think cryptocurrency needs to be adopted by many of the so called government and their egos of controlling citizens funds through fiat system.

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k. This news caused serious agitation through out the country as the limit set for the withdrawal is really inconvenient with citizens. This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

I think Bitcoin is created to give us an alternative option if we feel tired of the centralized fiat currency. I do not think that Bitcoin has the power to liberate us 100% from the grasp of the centralization authority. After all, we are still under the government's grasp no matter how hard we deny it. The government will adopt Bitcoin but it will not use Bitcoin as a national currency to deprive them of its power. They adopt Bitcoin to take advantage of its technology and the community for profit purposes only.

vv181

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Although am a newbie in the forum but i having a lot since i got here and i think cryptocurrency needs to be adopted by many of the so called government and their egos of controlling citizens funds through fiat system.

The so-called governments as you have said, are very unlikely to implement a favourable regulation toward cryptocurrency, as it which the opposite of wholly controlling funds.

Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k. This news caused serious agitation through out the country as the limit set for the withdrawal is really inconvenient with citizens. This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

As firstly stated, we can't expect the government to increase bitcoin adoption in one country on its own premise, an exception is where it is accepted as legal tender like El Salvador, so, unless the adoption is widely accepted in everyday living, I think in our circumstances, the fiat financial system will keep being a hands-on choice for many people.

tjtonmoy

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In order to prevent situations like this, everyone on this community has been saying this till today. We need the legalization of BTC. While using traditional currency, you own that, but you have no control over it on how to spend it. Or the government can take it away from you. In my county, there's a written statement on every note. "চাহিবা মাত্র দিতে বাধ্য থাকিবে" - Translate to "You are obliged to give it back whenever asked". That's how all this fiat works.
We need BTC not fiat. We want BTC not fiat.

gantez

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

What Nigeria government is doing is not about bitcoin but about what they want for their country to reduce physical money in circulation because they thinking it is the reason they are having devaluation. Bitcoin is far from the regulation in Nigeria, it is separate . They trying that people started to have cashless system and to use the CBDC if that can help the fiat and economy.

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Although am a newbie in the forum but i having a lot since i got here and i think cryptocurrency needs to be adopted by many of the so called government and their egos of controlling citizens funds through fiat system.

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k. This news caused serious agitation through out the country as the limit set for the withdrawal is really inconvenient with citizens. This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

So you're saying government has to adopt decentralized monetary system because they are opposing it? Doesn't really make any sense though!

Governments may never allow their citizens to have complete freedom over their monetary usage unless the users bring a revolution and force them to change. Yes we need to change the hands who are controlling the power and need strong reasons to make it happen.

Die_empty

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Quote from: NotATether on December 23, 2022, 10:14:24 AM

Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k.

That's equivalent to a little less than $50 daily / $250 weekly.

My goodness, how do you guys cope with stuff like this? Hopefully, this does not affect bank-to-bank transfers as well. For instance, a service or public building could charge you $100 for something, and suddenly you can't use your bank account to pay for it, would be really awful.

The government have recently reviewed the policy and individuals can withdrawal up to N500,000 and N5 million for organization. The Nigerian economy is mainly dominated by cash fiat transactions. It is not strange to see people in banks withdrawing Millions of Naira from the bank and putting them in big bags. This government policy affects only physical cash withdrawals. Other transactions option like bank transfers are open to Nigerians. Individual account holders can do transfers to the tune of N25 million and companies can transfer as much as N250million. The government wants to promote its cashless policy so it is encourage its citizens to use other payments channels beside cash transactions.

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Quote from: Maidak on December 23, 2022, 10:14:14 AM

Quote from: maikrothaman on December 23, 2022, 09:55:58 AM

Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Although am a newbie in the forum but i having a lot since i got here and i think cryptocurrency needs to be adopted by many of the so called government and their egos of controlling citizens funds through fiat system.

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k. This news caused serious agitation through out the country as the limit set for the withdrawal is really inconvenient with citizens. This made think, all this and more maybe was the reason why bitcoin was created to liberate we all from such Fiat control financial system.

Fiat money is essentially a Ponzi scheme at a national/global level. People who received the money invested it in a variety of assets, including cash, real estate, investments, businesses, and savings accounts. The liquidity required by governments to support their currencies is never there. Bitcoin offers you only one thing. That offer is 1 bitcoin = 1 bitcoin.

Although fiat has a lot of problems, I don't think it's a Ponzi scheme, you don't have to smear it and exaggerate the divinity of bitcoin. If fiat is a Ponzi, then everything in the world is a scam because fiat has been used everywhere in the world for centuries. I assure you, you and your family are also using fiat and depend on it daily, without fiat you wouldn't be able to survive. Bitcoin is also priced in fiat, the story of 1 bitcoin = 1 bitcoin is just a belief to comfort people should believe in bitcoin. That is not a claim that bitcoin will replace fiat as the world currency.

When I use the term "ponzi," I mean when people own more money than they are backed by. The US dollar liquidity is, I suppose, backed by a minuscule percentage, perhaps as high as 5%.

NotATether

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Quote from: Mr.suevie on December 23, 2022, 12:29:57 AM

Few weeks back my country government decided to pass a bill that set everyone withdrawals limit to 20 thousand naira daily and weekly withdrawal at 100k.

That's equivalent to a little less than $50 daily / $250 weekly.

My goodness, how do you guys cope with stuff like this? Hopefully, this does not affect bank-to-bank transfers as well. For instance, a service or public building could charge you $100 for something, and suddenly you can't use your bank account to pay for it, would be really awful.

Topic: Fiat currency (centralized system) (Read 237 times)