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Topic: Filed a request for an administrative ruling with FinCEN this morning. - page 3. (Read 7487 times)

sr. member
Activity: 405
Merit: 250
The guidance doesn't make "anyone" an exchanger because there is an explicit exemption for "users" purchasing goods and services who are not in the business of buying and selling currency, so I disagree on that point as well.

You miss the point.  Anyone who exchanges virtual currency for real currency is an exchanger is one way to interpret the guidance.   So say MtGox becomes a MSB.  Great now every on of MtGox clients would need to also.  They all are "exchanging virtual currency for real currency".  The guidance provides no exclusion that those exchanging with regulated exchangers are themselves exempt.  This would make anyone who ever has or ever will exchange real currency need to register as an MSB.  It seems implausible that is FinCEN intent however by the letter of the guidance it is what is stated.

The guidance is unclear, it is just my opinion but only clarity from FinCEN will resolve that lack of clarity for me.  That is the point of an administrative ruling. It certainly is possible that the AR will result in more clear guidance one that advises that the example in section c is not binding any such trade of BTC for USD constitutes an "exchanger".  The good news is it would remove ambiguity from the definition and force FinCEN to clean up their guidance. Is it FinCEN intent that anyone who ever buys or sells Bitcoins for real currency needs to register as a MSB? I really doubt it but if so the AR will require them to state so in black and white.


I suspect they will alter the wording to encompass anyone who buys or sells bitcoin for "real" currency (legal tender as defined by US law) no matter where or how they obtained them and remove the "creates" part which is confusing and open to challenge/ debate.

Individuals who have low value transactions for personal purchases of goods or services appear to be exempt . I assume that the $1000 threshold would not apply as what can you buy for $ 1000 these days??? Smiley

 The threshold to require registration as a transmitter will probably be clarified at  $1000 dollars. This begs the question is that $1000 per transaction or cumulative over a specified period? ie. if an individual for non commercial use buys or sell bitcoins for cash to values under $1000 ...no need to register as a transmitter.

This would be nice to get an answer to if you get a chance to follow up on any reply they make.
Any entity engaged in the BUSINESS of transmitting (for reward/payment) will definitely be covered with no minimum threshold.

Their response was that ANYONE who buys, then re-sells, etc IS A MONEY TRANSMITTER AND MUST FILE IF EXCHANGE OVER $1,000.
legendary
Activity: 1330
Merit: 1003
I will be looking forward to what they have to say. This could either be very good, or very bad.
sr. member
Activity: 966
Merit: 311
I'm glad you did this D&T. I hope they actually respond to this because it remains a head-scratcher. But, I'm not sure if they know the answer. Maybe they need the courts/congress to decide?
legendary
Activity: 2506
Merit: 1010
Quick question, vaguely on topic - is it legal for two US citizens to exchange fiat currencies with each other? (e.g. pay USD receive EUR, etc)? Or is that technically illegal? Or does it require some sort of registration?

There is an exemption for transacting "infrequently".

Authority: 12 U.S.C. 1829b and 1951–1959; 31 U.S.C. 5311–5314, 5316–5332; title III, sec. 314, Pub. L. 107–56, 115 Stat. 307.
Subpart A—General Definitionstop
§ 1010.100 General definitions.
(ff) ( 8 ) (iii)

( 8 ) Limitation. For the purposes of this section, the term "money services business'' shall not include:
(iii) A natural person who engages in an activity identified in paragraphs (ff)(1) through (ff)(5) of this section on an infrequent basis and not for gain or profit.

And the "infrequent basis" threshold in a McGladrey paper shows "fives times or less" per year:
 - http://mcgladrey.com/pdf/review_florida_bankers_aml_conference.pdf
full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
Quick question, vaguely on topic - is it legal for two US citizens to exchange fiat currencies with each other? (e.g. pay USD receive EUR, etc)? Or is that technically illegal? Or does it require some sort of registration?

newbie
Activity: 38
Merit: 0

It's right there in the guidance, near the beginning, in clear language:

"A user who obtains convertible virtual currency and uses it to purchase real or virtual goods or services is not an MSB under FinCEN's regulations.8 Such activity, in and of itself, does not fit within the definition of "money transmission services" and therefore is not subject to FinCEN's registration, reporting, and recordkeeping regulations for MSBs.9"

Perhaps folks are only aware of parts of the guidance for some reason, so here it the link to the entire document:

http://fincen.gov/statutes_regs/guidance/html/FIN-2013-G001.html

Some definitions have exemptions. It is easy to get the wrong impression if you only read parts of the guidance. The guidance should be read and understood in it's totality.


I know its right there, I'm saying that the point of the regulation is missed: they don't hinder what they're supposedly trying to stop from happening at all, and the wording is vague and unclear.


The portion of when a user becomes an exchanger only applies to "users" who "create coins." Some people have argued that "mining" isn't creating coins at all. How is anyone going to determine which coins were mined? This is why i brought up the purchase of goods.

bitcoins -> cash = no
bitcoins -> goods -> cash = ok

really? gosh, that'll stop all the crooks.


Here is the section on exemptions, from 31 CFR § 1010.100(ff)(1-7) which is cited...


Code:
(ff)  Money services business. A person wherever located doing business, whether or not on a regular basis or as an organized or licensed business concern, wholly or in substantial part within the United States, in one or more of the capacities listed in paragraphs (ff)(1) through (ff)(7) of this section. This includes but is not limited to maintenance of any agent, agency, branch, or office within the United States.

(1)  Dealer in foreign exchange. A person that accepts the currency, or other monetary instruments, funds, or other instruments denominated in the currency, of one or more countries in exchange for the currency, or other monetary instruments, funds, or other instruments denominated in the currency, of one or more other countries in an amount greater than $1,000 for any other person on any day in one or more transactions, whether or not for same-day delivery.

(2)  Check casher--(i) In general. A person that accepts checks (as defined in the Uniform Commercial Code), or monetary instruments (as defined at § 1010.100(dd)(1)(ii), (iii), (iv), and (v)) in return for currency or a combination of currency and other monetary instruments or other instruments, in an amount greater than $1,000 for any person on any day in one or more transactions.

(ii)  Facts and circumstances; Limitations. Whether a person is a check casher as described in this section is a matter of facts and circumstances. The term "check casher'' shall not include:

(A)  A person that sells prepaid access in exchange for a check (as defined in the Uniform Commercial Code), monetary instrument or other instrument;

(B)  A person that solely accepts monetary instruments as payment for goods or services other than check cashing services;

(C)  A person that engages in check cashing for the verified maker of the check who is a customer otherwise buying goods and services;

(D)  A person that redeems its own checks; or

(E)  A person that only holds a customer's check as collateral for repayment by the customer of a loan.

(3)  Issuer or seller of traveler's checks or money orders. A person that

(i)  Issues traveler's checks or money orders that are sold in an amount greater than $1,000 to any person on any day in one or more transactions; or

(ii)  Sells traveler's checks or money orders in an amount greater than $1,000 to any person on any day in one or more transactions.

(4)  Provider of prepaid access--(i) In general. A provider of prepaid access is the participant within a prepaid program that agrees to serve as the principal conduit for access to information from its fellow program participants. The participants in each prepaid access program must determine a single participant within the prepaid program to serve as the provider of prepaid access.

(ii)  Considerations for provider determination. In the absence of registration as the provider of prepaid access for a prepaid program by one of the participants in a prepaid access program, the provider of prepaid access is the person with principal oversight and control over the prepaid program. Which person exercises "principal oversight and control'' is a matter of facts and circumstances. Activities that indicate "principal oversight and control'' include:

(A)  Organizing the prepaid program;

(B)  Setting the terms and conditions of the prepaid program and determining that the terms have not been exceeded;

(C)  Determining the other businesses that will participate in the prepaid program, which may include the issuing bank, the payment processor, or the distributor;

(D)  Controlling or directing the appropriate party to initiate, freeze, or terminate prepaid access; and

(E)  Engaging in activity that demonstrates oversight and control of the prepaid program.

(iii)  Prepaid program. A prepaid program is an arrangement under which one or more persons acting together provide(s) prepaid access. However, an arrangement is not a prepaid program if:

(A)  It provides closed loop prepaid access to funds not to exceed $2,000 maximum value that can be associated with a prepaid access device or vehicle on any day;

(B)  It provides prepaid access solely to funds provided by a Federal, State, local, Territory and Insular Possession, or Tribal government agency;

(C)  It provides prepaid access solely to funds from pre-tax flexible spending arrangements for health care and dependent care expenses, or from Health Reimbursement Arrangements (as defined in 26 U.S.C. 105(b) and 125) for health care expenses; or

(D) (1)  It provides prepaid access solely to:

(i)  Employment benefits, incentives, wages or salaries; or

(ii)  Funds not to exceed $1,000 maximum value and from which no more than $1,000 maximum value can be initially or subsequently loaded, used, or withdrawn on any day through a device or vehicle; and

(2)  It does not permit:

(i)  Funds or value to be transmitted internationally;

(ii)  Transfers between or among users of prepaid access within a prepaid program; or

(iii)  Loading additional funds or the value of funds from non- depository sources.

(5)  Money transmitter--(i) In general.

(A)  A person that provides money transmission services. The term "money transmission services'' means the acceptance of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency from one person and the transmission of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency to another location or person by any means. "Any means'' includes, but is not limited to, through a financial agency or institution; a Federal Reserve Bank or other facility of one or more Federal Reserve Banks, the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System, or both; an electronic funds transfer network; or an informal value transfer system; or

(B)  Any other person engaged in the transfer of funds.

(ii)  Facts and circumstances; Limitations. Whether a person is a money transmitter as described in this section is a matter of facts and circumstances. The term ``money transmitter'' shall not include a person that only:

(A)  Provides the delivery, communication, or network access services used by a money transmitter to support money transmission services;

(B)  Acts as a payment processor to facilitate the purchase of, or payment of a bill for, a good or service through a clearance and settlement system by agreement with the creditor or seller;

(C)  Operates a clearance and settlement system or otherwise acts as an intermediary solely between BSA regulated institutions. This includes but is not limited to the Fedwire system, electronic funds transfer networks, certain registered clearing agencies regulated by the Securities and Exchange Commission ("SEC''), and derivatives clearing organizations, or other clearinghouse arrangements established by a financial agency or institution;

(D)  Physically transports currency, other monetary instruments, other commercial paper, or other value that substitutes for currency as a person primarily engaged in such business, such as an armored car, from one person to the same person at another location or to an account belonging to the same person at a financial institution, provided that the person engaged in physical transportation has no more than a custodial interest in the currency, other monetary instruments, other commercial paper, or other value at any point during the transportation;

(E)  Provides prepaid access; or

(F)  Accepts and transmits funds only integral to the sale of goods or the provision of services, other than money transmission services, by the person who is accepting and transmitting the funds.

(7)  Seller of prepaid access. Any person that receives funds or the value of funds in exchange for an initial loading or subsequent loading of prepaid access if that person:

(i)  Sells prepaid access offered under a prepaid program that can be used before verification of customer identification under § 1022.210(d)(1)(iv); or

(ii)  Sells prepaid access (including closed loop prepaid access) to funds that exceed $10,000 to any person during any one day, and has not implemented policies and procedures reasonably adapted to prevent such a sale.

(8)  Limitation. For the purposes of this section, the term "money services business'' shall not include:

(i)  A bank or foreign bank;

(ii)  A person registered with, and functionally regulated or examined by, the SEC or the CFTC, or a foreign financial agency that engages in financial activities that, if conducted in the United States, would require the foreign financial agency to be registered with the SEC or CFTC; or

(iii)  A natural person who engages in an activity identified in paragraphs (ff)(1) through (ff)(5) of this section on an infrequent basis and not for gain or profit.

(6)  U.S. Postal Service. The United States Postal Service, except with respect to the sale of postage or philatelic products.

(7)  [Reserved].

(8)  Limitation. For the purposes of this section, the term "money services business'' shall not include:

(i)  A bank or foreign bank;

(ii)  A person registered with, and functionally regulated or examined by, the SEC or the CFTC, or a foreign financial agency that engages in financial activities that, if conducted in the United States, would require the foreign financial agency to be registered with the SEC or CFTC; or

(iii)  A natural person who engages in an activity identified in paragraphs (ff)(1) through (ff)(5) of this section on an infrequent basis and not for gain or profit.


The portion relevant to "human individuals", is the exemption to them as "money service businesses."


(iii)  A natural person who engages in an activity identified in paragraphs (ff)(1) through (ff)(5) of this section on an infrequent basis and not for gain or profit.



So where is frequency and what "not for gain or profit" means 'clearly stated'?

Is it a sound defense that someone sold their bitcoins FOR FUN because "bitcoins are neato"! and they just happened to profit? Likewise purchasing? Even your statement of "its not a business, its a personal activity" is not so clear when you look at their definition of an MSB as applicable to btc.






 
member
Activity: 64
Merit: 140
The guidance doesn't make "anyone" an exchanger because there is an explicit exemption for "users" purchasing goods and services who are not in the business of buying and selling currency, so I disagree on that point as well.

You miss the point.  Anyone who exchanges virtual currency for real currency is an exchanger is one way to interpret the guidance.   So say MtGox becomes a MSB.  Great now every on of MtGox clients would need to also.  They all are "exchanging virtual currency for real currency".  The guidance provides no exclusion that those exchanging with regulated exchangers are themselves exempt.  This would make anyone who ever has or ever will exchange real currency need to register as an MSB.  It seems implausible that is FinCEN intent however by the letter of the guidance it is what is stated.

The guidance is unclear, it is just my opinion but only clarity from FinCEN will resolve that lack of clarity for me.  That is the point of an administrative ruling. It certainly is possible that the AR will result in more clear guidance one that advises that the example in section c is not binding any such trade of BTC for USD constitutes an "exchanger".  The good news is it would remove ambiguity from the definition and force FinCEN to clean up their guidance.  Is it FinCEN intent that anyone who ever buys or sells Bitcoins for real currency needs to register as a MSB?  I really doubt it but if so the AR will require them to state so in black and white.

OK, I did miss that point on virtual -> real currency exchanges (as opposed to real->virtual) as that would not be entitled to the "Users" exemption as written, but I also think the regulation is clear enough on that activity, as I shall explain.

Even if you sell bitcoins for dollars, whether on an exchange or in a park in NYC, I disagree that "Anyone" is a money transmitter for that reason. The wording is: "An administrator or exchanger that (1) accepts and transmits a convertible virtual currency or (2) buys or sells convertible virtual currency for any reason is a money transmitter under FinCEN's regulations, unless a limitation to or exemption from the definition applies to the person.10"

You still have to be an "administrator" or "exchanger" to fit that definition. Those terms are defined near the top of the guidance and both definitions state the person is "engaged as a business". That is the core issue from a legal point of view.

If I sell some bitcoins for dollars occasionally on mt gox, I consider that a personal activity. I'm not engaged as a business when I perform these actions. This is also why selling some Euros to a friend after a vacation is not a felony. However, if I advertised and held an auction for my bitcoins to a group of exchanges every week, then I'd be a business and would be covered by regulation.

It comes down to the definition of "business" and FinCen seems pretty confident that these terms have sufficient legal precedent (see the following link). I tend to agree. I know I am not engaged as a business with respect to my bitcoin activities and am confident a judge or jury would agree.

As I stated earlier, it is not clear how miners escape these regulations and that is where further clarification might help. One could argue that they are engaged as a business.

http://www.americanbanker.com/issues/178_104/fincen-chief-q-and-a-what-we-expect-from-digital-currency-firms-1059485-1.html?zkPrintable=1&nopagination=1
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
The guidance doesn't make "anyone" an exchanger because there is an explicit exemption for "users" purchasing goods and services who are not in the business of buying and selling currency, so I disagree on that point as well.

You miss the point.  Anyone who exchanges virtual currency for real currency is an exchanger is one way to interpret the guidance.   So say MtGox becomes a MSB.  Great now every on of MtGox clients would need to also.  They all are "exchanging virtual currency for real currency".  The guidance provides no exclusion that those exchanging with regulated exchangers are themselves exempt.  This would make anyone who ever has or ever will exchange real currency need to register as an MSB.  It seems implausible that is FinCEN intent however by the letter of the guidance it is what is stated.

The guidance is unclear, it is just my opinion but only clarity from FinCEN will resolve that lack of clarity for me.  That is the point of an administrative ruling. It certainly is possible that the AR will result in more clear guidance one that advises that the example in section c is not binding any such trade of BTC for USD constitutes an "exchanger".  The good news is it would remove ambiguity from the definition and force FinCEN to clean up their guidance.  Is it FinCEN intent that anyone who ever buys or sells Bitcoins for real currency needs to register as a MSB?  I really doubt it but if so the AR will require them to state so in black and white.
member
Activity: 64
Merit: 140
newbie
Activity: 38
Merit: 0
I actually called the IRS and asked about having to be registered as a money transmitter.

There response was that ANYONE who buys, then re-sells, etc IS A MONEY TRANSMITTER AND MUST FILE IF EXCHANGE OVER $1,000.

If you report your BitCoin income, then audited, and not registered you will be in trouble.

You're talking about something different. The IRS is not FinCEN.

Registering as a money transmitter is necessary to comply with anti-money laundering and other regulations.

Income and capital gains taxes is another matter.

I believe the point was that if you report your income, then you get audited, that audit includes seeing if you were acting as a transmitter.

aka - you can't only be "partially legal" in a worst case scenario.



A lot of this hinges on the semantics of things, but one thing is clear: fincen has considered it a "convertible virtual currency" which means anyone on either end of the cash <-> bitcoin exchange was acting as a transmitter via:

"An administrator or exchanger that  ... (2) buys or sells convertible virtual currency for any reason is a money transmitter under FinCEN's regulations, unless a limitation to or exemption from the definition applies to the person."

They're using the terms administrator, exchanger and person interchangeably here. Are they? Everyone in the US that bought or sold bitcoins at all, directly or indirectly, is being considered? BUT the semantic issue is what are those "limitations to or exemptions from?" in that case?


TC states "If FinCEN wants to define regulation then they are obligated to provide clear and exact lines.  Regulation which is vague, arbitrary, capricious, and overbroad is generally overtuned. "

That's what's bizarre about the current wording. Last I checked someone going to a bank or currency exchange to exchange currency isn't considered a "money transmitter." Why would bitcoiners be now?

In a recent speech, Fincen Director Jennifer Shasky Calvery said the new guidance aims "to protect [digitial currency] systems from abuse and to aid law enforcement in ensuring that they are getting the leads and information they need to prosecute the criminal actors." She reiterated that the guidance does not apply to everyday users who pay or accept bitcoin for goods and services.



But what about paying bitcoin to buy a good, then selling the good for some other currency? And so on...

member
Activity: 64
Merit: 140
You seem fixated on the definitions within the Decentralized Virtual Currency section. What about the definitions that are present elsewhere, like this one:

"An administrator or exchanger that (1) accepts and transmits a convertible virtual currency or (2) buys or sells convertible virtual currency for any reason is a money transmitter under FinCEN's regulations, unless a limitation to or exemption from the definition applies to the person."

Well that is the entire point.  This "guidance" on virtual currencies is incompatible with the specific guidance given for decentralized virtual currencies (which of the three subclasses is the only one even remotely applicable to Bitcoin).

It is possible since this is just a guidance letter than the phrasing used in the "section c" is an error however it warrants clarification from FinCEN rather than an assumption.  However the general definition is overly broad.  It would by the letter of the guidance make anyone an "exchanger" even if they use a licensed "exchanger" maybe that is FinCEN intent but once again it seems excessive and vague. 

If FinCEN wants to define regulation then they are obligated to provide clear and exact lines.  Regulation which is vague, arbitrary, capricious, and overbroad is generally overtuned.  Now FinCEN may lack sufficient understanding of the mechanics of Bitcoin to properly define those lines and hence provide conflicting and confusing guidance but if they intend to regulate it they damn better understand it in order to answer very exact questions on which activities fall inside or outside of their scope.

I disagree that the different sections of guidance are incompatible. If ANY of the definitions apply to you and there is no exception defined, then you are covered. You can't cherry pick parts of the guidance.

The guidance doesn't make "anyone" an exchanger because there is an explicit exemption for "users" purchasing goods and services who are not in the business of buying and selling currency, so I disagree on that point as well.

Also I disagree with your last point. The guidance is not that bad from my point of view. They are capturing the activity they want to regulate with language that is about as precise as I would expect from a regulation of this sort.

The only vague definiton in my view is whether a miner or mining pool who confirms transactions is a money transmitter. The question is whether a miner "accepts such de-centralized convertible virtual currency from one person and transmits it to another person as part of the acceptance and transfer of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency." It is hard to see how miners who confirm transactions avoid this definition. And they can't use the purchasing exemption that regular "Users" could to avoid regulation. You can ask for further clarification on this but you may not like the answer.

donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
You seem fixated on the definitions within the Decentralized Virtual Currency section. What about the definitions that are present elsewhere, like this one:

"An administrator or exchanger that (1) accepts and transmits a convertible virtual currency or (2) buys or sells convertible virtual currency for any reason is a money transmitter under FinCEN's regulations, unless a limitation to or exemption from the definition applies to the person."

Well that is the entire point.  This "guidance" on virtual currencies is incompatible (or at least illogical) with the specific guidance given for decentralized virtual currencies (which of the three subclasses is the only one even remotely applicable to Bitcoin). It is possible since this is just a guidance letter than the phrasing used in the "section c" is an error however it warrants clarification from FinCEN rather than an assumption.  However the general definition is overly broad.  It would by the letter of the guidance make anyone an "exchanger" even if they use a licensed "exchanger" maybe that is FinCEN intent but once again it seems excessive and vague.  

If FinCEN wants to define regulation then they are obligated to provide clear and exact lines.  Regulation which is vague, arbitrary, capricious, and overbroad is generally overtuned.  Now FinCEN may lack sufficient understanding of the mechanics of Bitcoin to properly define those lines and hence provide conflicting and confusing guidance but if they intend to regulate it they damn better understand it in order to answer very exact questions on which activities fall inside or outside of their scope.
legendary
Activity: 1304
Merit: 1015
Perhaps you should also include in your request the possibility of bitcoin autonomous agents that send and receive bitcoins who have no human persons controlling them and see how they respond.  These autonomous agents could buy bitcoins with litecoin or ripple and could potentially be MSBs.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Agents
legendary
Activity: 1050
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I actually called the IRS and asked about having to be registered as a money transmitter.

There response was that ANYONE who buys, then re-sells, etc IS A MONEY TRANSMITTER AND MUST FILE IF EXCHANGE OVER $1,000.

If you report your BitCoin income, then audited, and not registered you will be in trouble.

You're talking about something different. The IRS is not FinCEN.

Registering as a money transmitter is necessary to comply with anti-money laundering and other regulations.

Income and capital gains taxes is another matter.
member
Activity: 64
Merit: 140
#1: Answer: Who creates the bitcoins is irrelevant to the transmission and exchange functions. The special case of "creating and selling" is really a subcase of exchanging and probably was unnecessary to call out as it is already covered by other guidance. Regardless, it does not seem to apply to bitcoin miners unless they are in the business of selling their bitcoins for currency.

Miners who create currency and keep it or buy things are not covered in the guidance, as far as I can tell. A lot of your post seems confused by that issue and seems to be fishing for different definitions in order to understand how the act of creating the currency, by itself, is regulated. But it isn't. That is not the money transmission or exchange function that FinCen is interested in.

#2: Answer: If you don't sell the units to another person, then you are NOT covered by this clause: "a person that creates units of convertible virtual currency and sells those units to another person for real currency or its equivalent is engaged in transmission to another location and is a money transmitter." BUT YOUR MAY BE COVERED BY OTHER CLAUSES.

Based on the following it does not seem like you are reading the entire guidance:


The "accepted" interpretation of FinCEN guidance is that anyone who exchanges virtual currency for real currency is an "exchanger" (unless an exception applies as defined by existing MSB & MT regulations).  

However the actual text of the guidance does NOT say that:
Quote
In addition, a person is an exchanger and a money transmitter if the person accepts such de-centralized convertible virtual currency from one person and transmits it to another person as part of the acceptance and transfer of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency.


You seem fixated on the definitions within the Decentralized Virtual Currency section. What about the definitions that are present elsewhere, like this one:

"An administrator or exchanger that (1) accepts and transmits a convertible virtual currency or (2) buys or sells convertible virtual currency for any reason is a money transmitter under FinCEN's regulations, unless a limitation to or exemption from the definition applies to the person."

hero member
Activity: 980
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member
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'That Guy'
I actually called the IRS and asked about having to be registered as a money transmitter.

There response was that ANYONE who buys, then re-sells, etc IS A MONEY TRANSMITTER AND MUST FILE IF EXCHANGE OVER $1,000.

If you report your BitCoin income, then audited, and not registered you will be in trouble.
legendary
Activity: 905
Merit: 1000
Nice work.

Possible minor edit:
Issue #2: What isf the exchanger doesn't involve a "another person"?
legendary
Activity: 1050
Merit: 1002
I also brought up the scenario of operating an eWallet which involve only a single virtual currency and no real currency:
BTC: Person A -----> Wallet Provider -----> Person B
USD:  None

That's the question I had, since the guidance states:

Quote
The term "money transmission services" means "the acceptance of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency from one person and the transmission of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency to another location or person by any means.

It doesn't matter if no "real" currency is handled. The more recently released comments from FinCEN say it a bit more clearly:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/new-fincen-report-on-bitcoin-181708

Quote
Those who are intermediaries in the transfer of virtual currencies from one person to
another person, or to another location, are money transmitters that must register with FinCEN as
MSBs unless an exception applies.
Some virtual currency exchangers have already registered
with FinCEN as MSBs, though they have not necessarily identified themselves as money
transmitters.

Is it the end of unregistered exchanges?

This makes it more of a pain in the rear to operate any kind of Bitcoin/crypto-currency (or other virtual currency) exchange if you're based in the U.S., at least in a complying above ground way.

Still, I think this quote deserves emphasis:

Quote
The guidance explains how FinCEN’s “money transmitter” definition applies to certain exchangers and system administrators of virtual currencies depending on the facts and circumstances of that activity. Those who use virtual currencies exclusively for common personal transactions like receiving payments for services or buying goods online are not affected by this guidance.

Since Bernanke doesn't consider gold to be money I imagine buying gold coins online with bitcoins is not affected by the FinCEN guidance. Smiley
legendary
Activity: 2506
Merit: 1010
I also brought up the scenario of operating an eWallet which involve only a single virtual currency and no real currency:
BTC: Person A -----> Wallet Provider -----> Person B
USD:  None

That's the question I had, since the guidance states:

Quote
The term "money transmission services" means "the acceptance of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency from one person and the transmission of currency, funds, or other value that substitutes for currency to another location or person by any means.

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