Topic: [Flag] Lutpin - Known Alt Donation funds. (Read 864 times)

Further reading here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/timelord2067-funds-held-by-me-201920-5158127

*edit* June 29th 2019

Four of my posts in this thread have been deleted by "mods" in this case Cyrus giving a distorted slant to this thread.

You can read the full archive of this thread (including my four deleted posts here: https://web.archive.org/web/20190625021522/https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5157840.0;all

I've just PM'ed you.

You can do with it as you please as long as it keeps the known alts of anyone running. I can give the donation to either address you'd prefer and then I'll trust your judgement to do what's best for the longevity of the thread.

Only thing I'd like in exchange is for this thread to be locked and no further mention of lutpin owing anything and no flags regarding this matter to ever come up. If you'd be cool with that, I'm happy and everyone can just keep doing what they are good at .

I'm trying to choose my words carefully here.

I appreciate your offer, it's not the outcome I wanted in so far as who handed over the donated funds. However, it then becomes an issue between you and Lutpin (or not as you choose) to recover the donated funds that he is holding.

I created two donation addresses 1KNoWNMK34nGWz2sJy1JzihZdLCGTKcziw and 1KnownXXXNtrjT539vAWckYqWi77jgUXs6 that I've previously posted, are you meaning that you want a third wallet address?

Would you want those funds to be held in that wallet address until such time as the members of the known alts thread ask that they be distributed, or, would you be ok with them being moved sideways into one of the two wallet addresses stated just above.  (I only ask so that I can organise a wallet address according to your wishes.)

I'll hold off responding any further to the previous posts until you've had a chance to respond.

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For the record, I believe Lutpin is holding the donation funds against money he is owed by mexxer-2 and that any notion that Lutpin makes that he and mexxer-2 are going to sit down and discuss the distribution of donation funds is simply lip service by Lutpin in the hope that I will go away.

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I'm going to be away for almost three days, but will try to look in while I'm on the road.

I have to quote this again:

IIRC I literally quoted your words at the bottom of that post. You didn't read whole post? Well, that's not my problem.

I like your work Timelord, I also like Lutpin a lot.

Would it make any difference if you setup a new donation address for MKIII and I donate 0.017975 BTC? Just to lay this flag, thread, detrimental thread to rest?

[quote author=Quickseller link=topic=5157840.msg51585799#msg51585799 date=1561389496]
I think it was pretty clear what the intention of the donation address was for.

Being that the thread has been closed for quite some time now, it is probably best to distribute the donations as per the terms of how he said they would be distributed.

At this time I am not supporting the flag.
[/quote]

Lutpin has given two differing versions of how he would distribute the funds, one that it is for administering the thread list, the other for who contributed the most.  As @LoyceV's list shows the tally is not matching the OP of the Mk I thread.

In any case I have previously stated:

[quote author=Timelord2067 link=topic=2544574.msg50887271#msg50887271 date=1556933804]
*IF* people were ok with me holding any donation funds I have an idea of using said funds to bid on a slot in the semi weekly advertising spot below the first post on a page to advertise the Known Alt thread to a wider audience.

I don't feel giving pennies to a couple of dozen people, or proportionally a dollar to one person and nickels and dimes to a handful of others based on the number of posts is the way to go.
[/quote]

and I also said:

[quote author=Timelord2067 link=topic=2544574.msg51506691#msg51506691 date=1560831926]
(snip)

As to the remaining donation funds, I actually don't want any; I've said as much a few pages back.  But, I'd appreciate it if Lutpin could delve into the logic mexxer-2 and he used to arrive at their determination who got how much?

So, let's start with an easy question:  As I am listed as in second place on mexxer-2's list, how come identical funds were distributed to me and presumably Joel_Jantsen, whywefight and mexxer-2?  You state the donations are for taking the time to review, but it looks like you based the payment on yourself being out in front...   

My follow up question concerning mexxer-2 is if he's owed you money for at least two years,



How are you planing to have a discussion with mexxer-2 about how to distribute the remaining funds?  Are you also planing on creating a Flag to recover the funds mexxer-2 owes you?

(snip)
[/quote]

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See also: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.13920280 post by Lutpin.

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[quote author=marlboroza link=topic=5157840.msg51587325#msg51587325 date=1561397331]
Lutpin said to Timelord that he will send them their share which timelord refused IIRC and created tag type 3.
[/quote]

Wrong.

I have provided Lutpin with a wallet address which he used in this TX.  There are also the two Known Alt donation addresses as well as my signed wallet address in my signature and my donation address in my signature also.

Are you sure you're reading my posts?


Please show me where it has been established Lutpin's account has been hacked? (more than two years ago ??  I'm sure someone would have noticed by now)

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[quote author=The Pharmacist link=topic=5157840.msg51587411#msg51587411 date=1561397898]
[quote author=LFC_Bitcoin link=topic=5157840.msg51587110#msg51587110 date=1561396196]
Lutpin went rogue a long time ago.
[/quote]What you wrote is true, but after reading this thread I've got way more information than I had before about the donations and such.  I wasn't even aware there were any before Timelord2067's accusation.  If he distributes them now, all would be well, right?  If they were for a thread that's locked or inactive and not the new thread(s), why is anyone holding anything at this point?

I'm not supporting this flag right now.
[/quote]

Thank you for your post.

Naturally I would not have started a thread if Lutpin had simply distributed the donation funds, however his last post in the know alts thread was:

[quote author=Lutpin link=topic=2544574.msg51543085#msg51543085 date=1561085120]
[quote author=Timelord2067 link=topic=2544574.msg51538902#msg51538902 date=1561052221]
he has no intention of responding to the request
[/quote]
I did so in my previous post, I told you I won't hand over the funds.

[quote author=Timelord2067 link=topic=2544574.msg51538902#msg51538902 date=1561052221]
he has no intention of justifying his actions.
[/quote]
My previous post has a lengthy explanation of my decision.
You might not like it, you might disagree, but it's there.

[quote author=Timelord2067 link=topic=2544574.msg51538902#msg51538902 date=1561052221]
At that time I'll have to step up my depute if no response occurs.
[/quote]
Do whatever you think is necessary.
Just keep in mind that you're not in the right here, and any action you take might amount to a violation, eg if you attempt to start a flag.
[/quote]

There's nothing about asking for time to work out who to give the funds to, nore why two and a half years after the first thread was suddenly locked he is still holding onto the donation funds.

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Am still working my way through the various posts and replys, but here's a question before I forget to post it elsewhere:

How does @Lutpin propose refunding a donation that was made either through a coin mixer, or, a lightning coin swap service?  I'm pretty sure there's one of each... 

(or from say Cryptopia or any other exchange that has folded for that matter?)

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[quote author=LFC_Bitcoin link=topic=5157840.msg51587417#msg51587417 date=1561397937]
Thank you marlboroza, I’ve removed my support for the moment.

@Timelord - Why did you refuse to give Lutpin an address for your share to be sent to?
[/quote]

I didn't - it's FUD by @Marlboroza - notice he doesn't cite a reference?  He only uses the tried and trusted "IIRC"

[quote author=marlboroza link=topic=5157840.msg51587325#msg51587325 date=1561397331]
Lutpin said to Timelord that he will send them their share which timelord refused IIRC and created tag type 3.

Sorry for editing post few times.
[/quote]

Unless he's removed that comment by the time you go back and review it.

'Hello, I want money for creating a thread somewhat similar to one created 4 years prior that received donations. There was no written agreement that I would get those donations, but because the previous two threads were locked I de facto should receive them.

Unfortunately, the person who held the funds for the first thread won't hand them over. Even though it was clearly stated on the thread that he has control over the donations and can distribute them at his will, and everyone donating agreed to those terms intrinsically, I believe he is a scammer for not distributing them how I want him to.'

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Opposed. Get real.

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Neither of these things have happened.

I was one of the top contributors in the old thread. If you check the 'Level of awesomeness', I'm at rank 3 after Lutpin & Timelord. To start with, I don't support this Flag, neither it is an appropriate flag type as far as TL's issues are concerned. Lutpin isn't the type of member who'd argue over holding 0.017975 BTC. The entire point of creating the Known Alt.. thread was to contribute constructively to the forum and of course, find alt accounts. Donations were introduced later and IIRC, I got paid once. No one did it just for the heck of donations. As long as the funds are concerned, I don't really believe in dragging conversations over a few pennies especially when a reputed member like Lutpin is involved.

@TL: I understand you want those funds to be distributed to the contributors (including yourself) but taking the amount and the people involved into consideration, I'd say keep the thread for an open-ended conversation without an accusation.

'Level of awesomeness' was the measure introduced by Mexx so that will be it I guess...

From your own quote, that's up to "Lutpin, in coordiation with mexxer-2". Checking 1000+ posts will be a lot of work. I was surprised to see I made 14 posts in that thread (as it was my early days on this forum), but I don't need anything. I guess that goes for more users, and some are banned. This just looks like a loose end that should have been tied up years ago.

As a suggestion that's not much work: pick 10-20 random numbers from 1-1287, use that as the post number, and whoever posted that gets a share (if and only if their post contributed anything and they didn't get banned).

Yes but:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/known-alts-of-anyone-user-generated-1206112

It is clearly written that funds are for mexxer's thread. Thread is locked so it would be fair to distribute donations to contributors who contributed in that thread, not to send funds for new thread.

Perhaps donators and other contributors from mexxer's thread can say a word or two, me, as contributor to threads started by lauda and timelord don't agree with this. I don't feel like I should get part of donations for thread I have never ever contributed.

Question is, how these funds should be shared? Equally to every contributor or shares based on contribution? I can't find this in mexxer's thread.

If timelord doesn’t wish to receive any donations, he doesn’t have standing to create a flag because he has no damages. There is no basis for him to ask to manage the donation address.

He may have meant that he doesn't want the personal payment that was offered but still wants Lutpin to hand over the donations to the current thread.

Isn't this enough to make the whole flag worthless? If Timelord2067 refuses the money, he can't be a victim and thus can't create this flag.
Update: What suchmoon says in the next post makes sense Although it still doesn't make Timelord2067 a victim.

Thank you marlboroza, I’ve removed my support for the moment.

@Timelord - Why did you refuse to give Lutpin an address for your share to be sent to?

What you wrote is true, but after reading this thread I've got way more information than I had before about the donations and such.  I wasn't even aware there were any before Timelord2067's accusation.  If he distributes them now, all would be well, right?  If they were for a thread that's locked or inactive and not the new thread(s), why is anyone holding anything at this point?

I'm not supporting this flag right now.

What I am trying to say is that timelord's flag has nothing to do with signature campaign nor that lutpin's account is maybe hacked or something (which is assumption).

Timelord confirmed this:

He literally said he will    

Here, in specific case:


Sorry for editing post few times.

I think there’s enough evidence there to support this specific flag. Maybe Lutpin can come into this thread & explain why he won’t distribute those funds.

Until then I’ll leave my support for this flag. The OP gives damning evidence imo.

Supporting the flag means you're agreeing with the accusation referenced by the flag, not some other accusation. You might want to create a separate flag for Lutpin's campaign payment shenanigans instead.

I think somebody must have bought his account or it got hacked or something. Lutpin was one of the most trustworthy, likeable people here at one stage.

It was like a total personality swap, he totally changed.