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Topic: Gary Johnson Debates Obama and Romney Live - page 2. (Read 3670 times)

legendary
Activity: 2478
Merit: 2151
1RichyTrEwPYjZSeAYxeiFBNnKC9UjC5k
October 10, 2012, 11:11:53 PM
#27

i see instant runoff as having all of the benefits of that plus more

vote in order of whoever u want, but u can just leave off who u dont like or vote who you least like the lowest number

1. gary johnson
2. rand paul
3. gill stein
4. Governator
5. mitt romney
6....
7....
8....
..
.
55. turtle in a bathtub
56. Obama

And you end up with Obama (some of the time). The problems with instant runoff are well documented. It is an improvement on first-past-the-post but still ends up with poor selections in quite a large number of cases. It does tick the "one man, one vote" box which is a stumbling point for a lot of people who oppose approval voting. Approval voting does that sometimes as well but it seems as if there's always going to be problems with selecting a very few people to represent a large number. (Though it often applies in other cases such as choosing where to eat). Martin Gardner has an interesting article on it though I have only ever seen it in dead tree form.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 10, 2012, 10:30:11 PM
#26
Runoff voting has its own issues and is a pain to actually apply (I've been through it. Though it is only a short term pain and that shouldn't really affect adoption). Personally, I'm a big fan of approval voting. Though I really don't expect anything to change anytime soon.

explain approval voting?

It's pretty straightforward. Take all the candidates running and apply a "Yes" or "No' against their name. The one with the most "Yes"s win. It's still not perfect but it has a lot going for it and most of the objections that people have straight away usually prove not valid with a bit of thought.

i see instant runoff as having all of the benefits of that plus more

vote in order of whoever u want, but u can just leave off who u dont like or vote who you least like the lowest number

1. gary johnson
2. rand paul
3. gill stein
4. Governator
5. mitt romney
6....
7....
8....
..
.
55. turtle in a bathtub
56. Obama
legendary
Activity: 2478
Merit: 2151
1RichyTrEwPYjZSeAYxeiFBNnKC9UjC5k
October 10, 2012, 10:28:01 PM
#25
Runoff voting has its own issues and is a pain to actually apply (I've been through it. Though it is only a short term pain and that shouldn't really affect adoption). Personally, I'm a big fan of approval voting. Though I really don't expect anything to change anytime soon.

explain approval voting?

It's pretty straightforward. Take all the candidates running and apply a "Yes" or "No' against their name. The one with the most "Yes"s win. It's still not perfect but it has a lot going for it and most of the objections that people have straight away usually prove not valid with a bit of thought.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 10, 2012, 08:57:04 PM
#24
Runoff voting has its own issues and is a pain to actually apply (I've been through it. Though it is only a short term pain and that shouldn't really affect adoption). Personally, I'm a big fan of approval voting. Though I really don't expect anything to change anytime soon.

explain approval voting?
sr. member
Activity: 354
Merit: 250
October 10, 2012, 02:47:30 PM
#23
I really ought to decide which voting scheme I'm most in favor of, but really almost all of them would be better than the current system.

I don't think it's out of the question that at least a few states may adopt a different scheme.
legendary
Activity: 2478
Merit: 2151
1RichyTrEwPYjZSeAYxeiFBNnKC9UjC5k
October 10, 2012, 02:07:48 PM
#22
Runoff voting has its own issues and is a pain to actually apply (I've been through it. Though it is only a short term pain and that shouldn't really affect adoption). Personally, I'm a big fan of approval voting. Though I really don't expect anything to change anytime soon.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 10, 2012, 02:45:31 AM
#21
What we need is not to tout one person to get in there but to tout a fudnamental change to the system

such as iniatiate alternative voting, watch this fantastic video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y3jE3B8HsE
Wow, that's an awesome explanation.  I've been saying for years that we need instant run-off voting.  I even wrote to my state representatives about it, but I got no response.

yeah i better start calling it instant runoff voting Smiley keep my names correct

a similar video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqblOq8BmgM
Aren't they both correct terms?  Personally, I prefer instant runoff because it's more obvious what it means from the name.

That video's not bad, but I liked the jungle animals even better. Smiley

yup. we're turtle & owl voters
sr. member
Activity: 354
Merit: 250
October 10, 2012, 02:01:21 AM
#20
What we need is not to tout one person to get in there but to tout a fudnamental change to the system

such as iniatiate alternative voting, watch this fantastic video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y3jE3B8HsE
Wow, that's an awesome explanation.  I've been saying for years that we need instant run-off voting.  I even wrote to my state representatives about it, but I got no response.

yeah i better start calling it instant runoff voting Smiley keep my names correct

a similar video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqblOq8BmgM
Aren't they both correct terms?  Personally, I prefer instant runoff because it's more obvious what it means from the name.

That video's not bad, but I liked the jungle animals even better. Smiley
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 10, 2012, 01:16:23 AM
#19
What we need is not to tout one person to get in there but to tout a fudnamental change to the system

such as iniatiate alternative voting, watch this fantastic video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y3jE3B8HsE
Wow, that's an awesome explanation.  I've been saying for years that we need instant run-off voting.  I even wrote to my state representatives about it, but I got no response.

yeah i better start calling it instant runoff voting Smiley keep my names correct

a similar video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqblOq8BmgM
sr. member
Activity: 354
Merit: 250
October 09, 2012, 08:39:57 PM
#18
What we need is not to tout one person to get in there but to tout a fudnamental change to the system

such as iniatiate alternative voting, watch this fantastic video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y3jE3B8HsE
Wow, that's an awesome explanation.  I've been saying for years that we need instant run-off voting.  I even wrote to my state representatives about it, but I got no response.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 09, 2012, 04:44:41 PM
#17
but the more they squeeze the still more people get squeeze harder that are left inside their grasp

Those are the people who will be finally forced to get off their lazy butts and learn about things like Tor and Bitcoin.

so we have a megasecretupload site coming from kim utilizing these techniques?

Doubt it, but we do have a bunch of file storage websites switching from PayPal/VISA to Bitcoin, meaning people using them will be forced to learn about BTC.

tell me some sites, I didn't know about them

promise I'm not FBI
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 09, 2012, 04:27:56 PM
#16
but the more they squeeze the still more people get squeeze harder that are left inside their grasp

Those are the people who will be finally forced to get off their lazy butts and learn about things like Tor and Bitcoin.

so we have a megasecretupload site coming from kim utilizing these techniques?

Doubt it, but we do have a bunch of file storage websites switching from PayPal/VISA to Bitcoin, meaning people using them will be forced to learn about BTC.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 09, 2012, 01:34:24 PM
#15
but the more they squeeze the still more people get squeeze harder that are left inside their grasp

Those are the people who will be finally forced to get off their lazy butts and learn about things like Tor and Bitcoin.

so we have a megasecretupload site coming from kim utilizing these techniques?
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 09, 2012, 01:22:23 PM
#14
but the more they squeeze the still more people get squeeze harder that are left inside their grasp

Those are the people who will be finally forced to get off their lazy butts and learn about things like Tor and Bitcoin.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 09, 2012, 11:28:45 AM
#13
but the more they squeeze the still more people get squeeze harder that are left inside their grasp
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 09, 2012, 09:38:50 AM
#12
After discovering Bitcoin, and being introduced to things like Tor, 3D printing, mesh networking, and other distributed projects, I've come to the conclusion that the best, and likely only way to fix this whole problem is to just make all of the politicians irrelevant. Let them pass laws about what we can browse and download, what we can buy or give money to, what we can use our web connections for, or what we can build and own. Silk Road and Pirate Bay have shown me that eventually people will just shrug their shoulders at the law and ignore it, and the politicians will be powerless to do anything about it.

you're not shook off what happened to kim dotcom?

Kim Dotcom would not have been caught if MegaUpload was behind Tor and used Bitcoin for payments. Things like the Kim Dotcom  incident, as well as RIAA crackdowns, are what will push people into using those unregulatable technologies more and more, with the phrase "the more they squeeze, the more will run through their fingers" applying very well to the situation.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 09, 2012, 01:45:45 AM
#11
After discovering Bitcoin, and being introduced to things like Tor, 3D printing, mesh networking, and other distributed projects, I've come to the conclusion that the best, and likely only way to fix this whole problem is to just make all of the politicians irrelevant. Let them pass laws about what we can browse and download, what we can buy or give money to, what we can use our web connections for, or what we can build and own. Silk Road and Pirate Bay have shown me that eventually people will just shrug their shoulders at the law and ignore it, and the politicians will be powerless to do anything about it.

you're not shook off what happened to kim dotcom?
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1035
October 09, 2012, 01:24:43 AM
#10
After discovering Bitcoin, and being introduced to things like Tor, 3D printing, mesh networking, and other distributed projects, I've come to the conclusion that the best, and likely only way to fix this whole problem is to just make all of the politicians irrelevant. Let them pass laws about what we can browse and download, what we can buy or give money to, what we can use our web connections for, or what we can build and own. Silk Road and Pirate Bay have shown me that eventually people will just shrug their shoulders at the law and ignore it, and the politicians will be powerless to do anything about it.
420
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
October 08, 2012, 04:20:25 AM
#9
What we need is not to tout one person to get in there but to tout a fudnamental change to the system

such as iniatiate alternative voting, watch this fantastic video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y3jE3B8HsE
full member
Activity: 183
Merit: 100
October 07, 2012, 11:55:17 AM
#8
I wish the guy had a chance, but I hope more that someone kicks the current creep out.
This is exactly the kind of attitude that prevents him from "having a chance". Elections are about voting for someone who in your opinion represents your views best. Not about kicking the current creep out. (and putting in another one, besides the other creep does not seem to be much better in my opinion anyway). The more people vote for GJ the more of that chance he'll get, even if he wont win this time the votes he'll gather will give him a momentum to build on for the next elections. Forget the two creeps and all that spoiler bullshit, just vote for the right guy. (and convince others to do the same)

BTW, GJ "swings both ways": http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2012/09/cnn-gary-johnson/ , see also for instance http://www.kckansan.com/2012/10/why-im-voting-for-gary-johnson-and.html
Quote
4. Johnson's not a spoiler candidate - he's a candidate who threatens both major candidates

Based on the state polling, Johnson has taken support away from Obama in New Mexico and Colorado, while Johnson's hurt Romney in Ohio and Virginia. Assuming Johnson is only a spoiler for Romney is a myth.

There are policies Johnson has that appeals to small-government types like myself and those polices that appeal to my liberal friends who love personal freedom, privacy and support gay rights. Since most of our readers live in Kansas, Johnson will not a spoiler. Romney is 100 percent certain to win the state of Kansas.

If you are displeased Republican or a displeased Democrat, I encourage you to hop on the Johnson bandwagon. Do not let your two-party friends bully you into voting against Johnson if you believe he's the best candidate. It's not the Libertarians who let the economy crash. It's not the Libertarians who are doing their best to avoid any accountability. It's not us who accumulated a $16 trillion debt. It's the two major parties who have done those things.

5. A third-party threat is needed to shake up government

After Ross Perot won nearly 20 percent of the vote in the 1992 election, change happened believe it or not. Perot's biggest campaign issue in '92 was the debt. What happened after Perot won 20 percent in 1992? Former President Clinton and the Newt Gingrich-led Republican Congress balanced the budget for the first time in a few decades.

Clinton and Gingrich both deserve credit, but I also believe Perot raising awareness of the debt and earning a significant third-party vote forced the issue. If Johnson can win just 10 percent of the vote nation-wide, it would scare the Democrats and Republicans into straightening up a little more. And I think even a lot of Democrats and Republicans would agree that's a good thing!
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