[GLBSE] Bitdust - Make your bitdust work for you

Sukrim

legendary

Activity: 2618

Merit: 1007

I'd recommend to follow up on my questions in https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/reading-the-block-chain-with-a-library-77650 - It's really uncanny, as I planned to do something similar ("bitdust" was even a ticker symbol I considered) as soon as the dividend API would be released. Before that it wouldn't really make sense and I hate poor and/or rushed execution...

Anyways, you can calculate for each second since the blockchain started how many BTC 1 MH/s (or 1 KH/s) would have generated... then just sum up accordingly for hours or days and pay as dividend. All you need is either a running bitcoind + asking for the block headers via RPC or running bitcoind + armory and having it already nicely packaged. Libbitcoin might also work, I haven't tried that one yet.

If I only read "some day I'll do the work to pay out correctly" I start looking like this --> Angry

Even if it's tiny amounts of money, you're still resposible for it and should put in some effort (it's not even hard, my scripts were finished in under 2 hours) instead of looking for a quick payment.

Gladamas

sr. member

Activity: 294

Merit: 250

Bitcoin today is what the internet was in 1998.

To avoid over/underpayments due to rounding, couldn't you pay out when the amount is a whole number of satoshis, rather than paying out per day/other time-based scale? Is this even feasible?

Gomeler

hero member

Activity: 697

Merit: 500

Turns out the GLBSE API does not support paying out dividends to shares at the moment but Nefario has assured me that feature will be available soon. I've got everything situated so I'm going to let that script start running and improve it over the weekend. I'll stick a preliminary contract up in this thread to solicit some feedback.

Quote from: finkleshnorts on June 14, 2012, 06:39:50 PM

I'll just stick to browser mining with my iPhone

I appreciate your incredibly helpful comment.

finkleshnorts

sr. member

Activity: 336

Merit: 250

I'll just stick to browser mining with my iPhone

Gomeler

hero member

Activity: 697

Merit: 500

Alright, I think I have a preliminary solution for the script that will run this thing. Due to not wanting to scrape the blockchain info(I'm azy) to see exactly when a difficulty change occurs, I will instead be calculating the amount of BTC earned every hour with the difficulty listed on blockexplorer.com/q/getdifficulty. Working now to support polling bitcoind from my p2pool server to avoid depending on blockexplorer.com. Someday I'll do the work to calculate precisely on a difficulty change.

I will keep a running "balance" per share which will store the total amount of BTC generated per share to the limits of what python provides. I will payout from this balance per share to each share on GLBSE at the granularity bitcoin supports which is 1 millionth of a BTC.

So, between payouts, each share will accumulate a few millionths of a BTC that will be rolled over to the next payout. The downside of this is that if you buy-in and sell between one of these periods you could miss out on this bonus payout.

I now need to see if GLBSE's API supports paying out shares from the issuers GLBSE balance. With that last piece in place it'll then be possible to just have this script run on a cron job every 3600 seconds and payout every 86400 seconds.

xkrikl

full member

Activity: 159

Merit: 100

Quote from: Gomeler on June 14, 2012, 12:20:36 PM

Quote from: Gladamas on June 14, 2012, 02:22:47 AM

IMO the price should be 0.0003 (for 1 kh/s) rather than 0.003 BTC. More liquidity; put those hundredths of a bitcent to work!

Anyways nice idea!

Excellent point, the 10 KH/s was pretty arbitrary. 1 KH/s should be fine but I'll have to check the math on the rounding of payments. We're going to end up with something like a million share IPO Cheesy

Well, if you go for 1Hh/s it's fine but then you have to be careful about payouts rounding ... and it would get even worse if the difficulty would go up.

Quote from: Gomeler on June 14, 2012, 12:20:36 PM

Quote from: xkrikl on June 14, 2012, 02:34:26 AM

The idea is interesting ... the sub 1Mhash/s bonds are rare ...
If you do 100% PPS or more it will be attractive ...
otherwise holder of your bonds would need to check if they have enough your shares for 1 "better" larger bond to not lose on lower %PPS and that's probably tedious work
are you planning on paying daily dividends? how are you going to round? ... as that might be already important in your case
anyway if blazr puts out the blazrbond it would be superior offer ... so consider sticking at 100% PPS

True, if blazr releases their 0.15 MH/s bonds it would be a superior offer for individuals looking for a long-term mining bond. My goal however is not to run a traditional mining company but rather provide a service for the gap between bitdust and the 1+ MH/s bonds available to users. I do NOT want to divert my full 16 GH/s(another machine came online Grin

) towards this venture. Think of it more as a temporary solution for your bit dust rather than a permanent solution.

I plan on daily dividends. I need to script up the auto-payment and see how much overpayment would occur with the rounding.

Well there are some bonds/shares smaller than 1Mh/s as mine is ... but they are still very big compared to 10Kh/s or even 1Kh/s. My point for my offering was to have enough liquidity with relatively small offering ... but you brought it level higher. :-)

Gomeler

hero member

Activity: 697

Merit: 500

Quote from: Gladamas on June 14, 2012, 02:22:47 AM

IMO the price should be 0.0003 (for 1 kh/s) rather than 0.003 BTC. More liquidity; put those hundredths of a bitcent to work!

Anyways nice idea!

Excellent point, the 10 KH/s was pretty arbitrary. 1 KH/s should be fine but I'll have to check the math on the rounding of payments. We're going to end up with something like a million share IPO Cheesy

Quote from: xkrikl on June 14, 2012, 02:34:26 AM

The idea is interesting ... the sub 1Mhash/s bonds are rare ...
If you do 100% PPS or more it will be attractive ...
otherwise holder of your bonds would need to check if they have enough your shares for 1 "better" larger bond to not lose on lower %PPS and that's probably tedious work
are you planning on paying daily dividends? how are you going to round? ... as that might be already important in your case
anyway if blazr puts out the blazrbond it would be superior offer ... so consider sticking at 100% PPS

True, if blazr releases their 0.15 MH/s bonds it would be a superior offer for individuals looking for a long-term mining bond. My goal however is not to run a traditional mining company but rather provide a service for the gap between bitdust and the 1+ MH/s bonds available to users. I do NOT want to divert my full 16 GH/s(another machine came online Grin

) towards this venture. Think of it more as a temporary solution for your bit dust rather than a permanent solution.

I plan on daily dividends. I need to script up the auto-payment and see how much overpayment would occur with the rounding.

xkrikl

full member

Activity: 159

Merit: 100

The idea is interesting ... the sub 1Mhash/s bonds are rare ...
If you do 100% PPS or more it will be attractive ...
otherwise holder of your bonds would need to check if they have enough your shares for 1 "better" larger bond to not lose on lower %PPS and that's probably tedious work
are you planning on paying daily dividends? how are you going to round? ... as that might be already important in your case
anyway if blazr puts out the blazrbond it would be superior offer ... so consider sticking at 100% PPS

Garr255

legendary

Activity: 938

Merit: 1000

What's a GPU?

I like the above idea -- even more liquidity.

Good approach to a mining bond though. Since this will be the only option for small investors in other assets until someone clones it, I'm sure you'll do well.

Gladamas

sr. member

Activity: 294

Merit: 250

Bitcoin today is what the internet was in 1998.

IMO the price should be 0.0003 (for 1 kh/s) rather than 0.003 BTC. More liquidity; put those hundredths of a bitcent to work!

Anyways nice idea!

Gomeler

hero member

Activity: 697

Merit: 500

Thanks for the discussion everyone. In the next day or two I'll sort out all the numbers and contract so I can go about organizing the IPO for this experiment.

btharper

sr. member

Activity: 389

Merit: 250

Sending pretty much any amount to the faucet would be seen as a "loss" by many and probably work well to discourage long term holding compared to other mining stocks. Sending it specifically to the fountain would be a great way to give back. Maybe even give it away each month to a different bitcoin charity?

The feature GLBSE is missing that would really help this kind of venture out is being able to place buy orders to execute once sufficient funds are available. This would eliminate the need to watch GLBSE like a hawk to take advantage, and then you could come in less frequently to sell shares and buy more expensive ones or whatever else you'd like to.

totaleclipseofthebank

sr. member

Activity: 451

Merit: 250

Gomeler

hero member

Activity: 697

Merit: 500

Quote from: PinkBatman on June 13, 2012, 03:43:26 PM

What about sending like 25% to the faucet?

That is a very interesting idea. Bitdust could donate a portion of the income to https://freebitcoins.appspot.com/ and other various pro-bitcoin establishments. I like it, will have to figure out the various percentage of income to divert to pay for power and such.

PinkBatman

sr. member

Activity: 267

Merit: 250

What about sending like 25% to the faucet?

Gomeler

hero member

Activity: 697

Merit: 500

Any thoughts on the discouragement of holding these bonds for extended periods of time? Should I not worry about this? Or find another way to discourage this?

I would also like to not run this operation at a loss, so the difference between the mining PPS and the payout PPS would help pay the powerbill. Ideally these will be running on my Enterpoint Cairnsmore quads(the first of which arrived today) so the powerbill should be manageable($4/month).

PinkBatman

sr. member

Activity: 267

Merit: 250

I like it. I personally feel there are too many of the ol' 1MH/s securities on GLBSE. I like the idea of 1% of 1MH/s also, it's very straight forward.

OgNasty

donator

Activity: 4760

Merit: 4323

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

I think investment options are good. I like this idea.

Gomeler

hero member

Activity: 697

Merit: 500

Quote from: pieppiep on June 13, 2012, 02:08:47 PM

I really doubt if anyone will use it the way you describe.
Personally I have invested around 24 BTC on glbse (planning on buying more bitcoin) and consider myself as a small investor.
At the moment I have around 0.11 BTC in my balance.
For 0.003 BTC each I can buy 36 of your shares, they will give me 0.000004574320992 BTC a day extra, on a year it is 0.00166962716208
0.00166962716208 / 24 * 100 = 0,006956779842% extra profit.

/edit
Your bitdust profit/day is wrong, should be 0.0000063532235831
Will give me 0.0002287160489916 a day, 0.083481357881934 a year.
0.083481357881934 / 24 * 100 = 0.347838991174725% extra profit for me.

For smaller investors it will be better, someone with a total of 2.4 BTC invested will have 3.478% extra profit.

I made a mistake in the initial calculations. Easier to script/debug/run versus plugging things in to a calculator.

edit: In the end this would let people min/max their GLBSE balances versus letting their dust do nothing. I understand in the end we are talking trivial fractions of a USD. It would be roughly equivalent to purchasing fractions of a normal mining share for those people who check the GLBSE like a hawk.

pieppiep

hero member

Activity: 1596

Merit: 502

I really doubt if anyone will use it the way you describe.
Personally I have invested around 24 BTC on glbse (planning on buying more bitcoin) and consider myself as a small investor.
At the moment I have around 0.11 BTC in my balance.
For 0.003 BTC each I can buy 36 of your shares, they will give me 0.000004574320992 BTC a day extra, on a year it is 0.00166962716208
0.00166962716208 / 24 * 100 = 0,006956779842% extra profit.

/edit
Your bitdust profit/day is wrong, should be 0.0000063532235831
Will give me 0.0002287160489916 a day, 0.083481357881934 a year.
0.083481357881934 / 24 * 100 = 0.347838991174725% extra profit for me.

For smaller investors it will be better, someone with a total of 2.4 BTC invested will have 3.478% extra profit.

Topic: [GLBSE] Bitdust - Make your bitdust work for you (Read 3519 times)