As already pointed out, you are confusing things by mixing investment types. Forget the GLBSE dividend paying investments for a moment. For me to invest I would need to see the following occur.
Get an independent market valuation from a licensed valuer. Provide statements of exact amounts of tax owing. Work out your equity by subtracting tax owing from valuation. Sign a legally binding mortgage to a trusted third party escrow. (If the third party escrow has sufficient reputation in the bitcoin securities world, you would not need to publicly reveal your address. A statement from the escrow that they hold a mortgage would be enough.) Get an independent valuation of the rent that would be payable on an
arm's length basis. Either you, or preferably the third party, issues GLBSE assets for no more than 80 % of the equity. You sell at least enough to cover the tax, but more if you like. Proceeds are used first pay off your tax. Each month, you pay to the third party escrow 80 % (or whatever percentage of assets issued) of the market rent for the house, and this rent is distributed as dividends. You may deduct any genuine expenses for the house from the rental income by providing the thrid party escrow with receipts. If you own some of the GLBSE assets yourself, you get some of the rent back. If you issue more assets than is needed to pay the tax, you can invest some of this in dividend paying GLBSE investments. If these go well, you keep all the income yourself and use it to help pay your rent. If your investments bomb, you are still up for rental payments, and if you stop paying rent, the investors can choose to evict you and put someone else in or foreclose on the house.
I would be interested in seeing something like this happen. It would be a novel concept to the bitcoin world (although not the first mortgage). I would need to see the valuations and rent appraisal before deciding whether I would invest in such a venture.
Thank you for your excellent suggestions.
I would also happily have a representative vist me here.
Who is paying rent to whom? I currently pay no rent and wish to continue doing so. Reinvesting the value of the shares in funds that pay dividends is simply adding more functionality to a simple investment instrument, it is not illegal, it promises guaranteed regular payments and anyone suggesting that investing on GLBSE is excessively risky shouldn't be investing in the first place? (To answer a poster elsewhere.)
There are ETFs on GLBSE that have no such stringent requirements and they are only backed by the funds themselves, you want me to put the collateral up and pay rent?
A home equity loan requires no rental, why should one based on Bitcoin? Banks use collateral to make money all the time?
Dear investors;
I have been in private contact with punningclan and his tone is somewhat different in PM; he has spurned every advance I have made towards representing him on this deal with CPA as a PR firm and/or insurance or notarization agent, and has so far talked around signing any kind of contract which would be legally binding. He has, to his credit, remained polite. But his reasons are simply that "he wants to trust the GLBSE", "trust this" and "trust that"; it basically boils down to "trust me, I'm not a crook! I am not a crook!"
This does not mean that punningclan is a fraud; it just means that for whatever reason, he refuses to be held legally accountable in any way for his actions with this issue. The term "buyer beware" is appropriate here; He has announced his house is about to be seized by the government and he refuses to sign a real, legally binding contract tying him to his house or his issue. If you invest with him and this turns out to be a fraud, or even if it's not a fraud and the government gets involved and takes the house, you will have
no recourse, none. You won't be able to sue, you won't even be able to report him to the police.
If punningclan wishes to open up discussions and sign a real, legally binding contract with CPA, we'd be pleased to represent his issue.
You are failing to mention the #1 source of risk, which is that you don't pay out the dividends you own to investors, and/or don't pay back the principle (i.e. buy back the shares). For example, because you invest that principle in GLBSE assets which could underperform.
Seriously, red flags, man.
Isn't that a red flag against all GLBSE dividend baring stocks any one of them could stop paying the dividends but then the value of the stock would plummet to everyones misfortune, including mine. The dividends will be based on the returns from the reinvested funds based on their performance.
I'm beginning to see the difficulty in my approach, instead of just one banker I have to appeal to hundreds, but I beleive it's worth it to avoid paying interest for loaned money that does not exist.
The idea is that if the house goes up in value then the shares should be more valuable, is that a problem?
You don't need to appeal to "hundreds" of people if you appeal to the right ones ;-)
I don't think you realize how difficult it will be to have your issue listed. You are not a business, you are a private HELOC. You have NO way of paying dividends on your issue. NO ONE will invest with you. You stated your house was going to be seized. You shot yourself in the foot by saying that.
Please consider that there are currently NO such issues (collateral loans) on the GLBSE right now. It is not like people have not tried. Most recently ciuciu tried to start a COOP, and there have been real-estate discussions before. They end up going nowhere.
I'd like to help you get listed and make your venture profitable. What you do once you are listed and selling shares is up to you. I can pretty much guarantee you that if you don't hire me or someone else, you will simply not be able to list. There are just too many red flags, and you did in fact say the house was about to be seized in the OP.
I may be wrong, you could be able to list and succeed on your own; I just don't think it is likely.
Good luck!
I'm not sure how usagi has taken it upon himself to say that I have "spurned his every advance" since I only see one advance telling me how unlikely I'll be to succeed without his help. I'm sure his help would be appreciated, but I can't help wondering what this sentence means "I can pretty much guarantee you that if you don't hire me or someone else, you will simply not be able to list. "?
Are you really saying that all the Bitcoineers you profess to stand for have completely decried collateral based loans even given they are the foremost loan instrument in the world? And if so why do you think you can manage it?
The poster also needs to keep abreast of the current facts in this proposal.
Thank you again.