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Topic: Global Standard Bank - the first Bitcoin bank? (Read 10831 times)

full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
Anyone else get a PM from a user who says he sold some BTC to them?
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1000
Global Standard Bank was just deleted from Wikipedia by a vote of 7 to 0.
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1000
Right. They don't have a valid SSL cert.  They're using the default cert for Bluehost.  Which, among other things, means they fail Payment Card Interface standards and can't accept credit cards.

They don't even have a dedicated IP address, let alone a dedicated server. They're on shared hosting with a shared IP address.  Forward DNS for "globalstandardbank.com" returns "box761.bluehost.com [66.147.244.61]".  DomainTools says that 1,294 web sites use that IP address.  That looks like the Bluehost $4.95 per month entry level hosting package. ("From the business owner to the individual who desires full functionality on a small budget, Bluehost provides your complete web hosting solution.") There's nothing wrong with running a minor web site on Bluehost, but a bank? Those guys claim to be opening accounts and accepting deposits.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. This is pathetic.
legendary
Activity: 1358
Merit: 1002
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1003
Notice the lack of replies from "Global Standard Bank" to basic due diligence questions, questions where the accuracy of the response can be checked.

The previous questions about faked pictures were answered by hand-waving.  That's not good enough for an organization which claims to be "a new truly global bank for a new global world".

This appears to be a scam operation until proven otherwise.


Having worked at several startups, his explanations make sense. That stuff (soft launches as betas, mockups making it into production, etc) *does* happen.

That said, I absolutely want answers to the additional due-diligence questions you laid out above.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
Notice the lack of replies from "Global Standard Bank" to basic due diligence questions, questions where the accuracy of the response can be checked.

The previous questions about faked pictures were answered by hand-waving.  That's not good enough for an organization which claims to be "a new truly global bank for a new global world".

This appears to be a scam operation until proven otherwise.

Nobody has reported being scammed yet, and they are at least (now) making an effort towards legitimacy, so I don't want to be too harsh on them. However, I agree that they have been misleading which I take very seriously from a business. Bitcoin has a very vulnerable economy right now and I don't want to see it tarnished.
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1000
Notice the lack of replies from "Global Standard Bank" to basic due diligence questions, questions where the accuracy of the response can be checked.

The previous questions about faked pictures were answered by hand-waving.  That's not good enough for an organization which claims to be "a new truly global bank for a new global world".

This appears to be a scam operation until proven otherwise.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
Some standard due-diligence questions:

  • What is the actual name of your corporation, and in what jurisdiction is it incorporated?
  • What is your D-U-N-S number, for your Dun and Bradstreet rating?
  • "Global Standard Bank" is not listed with Canadian federal corporation search or Quebec corporation search.  Explain.
  • Are your employees bonded? If so, who is your bonding company?
  • Do you carry errors and omissions coverage? If so, who is your carrier?
  • Has any executive employee of your company ever been convicted of a criminal offense?

Good start - anyone else have additional questions?

Relating to these 2 points listed above:
  • What is the actual name of your corporation, and in what jurisdiction is it incorporated?
  • "Global Standard Bank" is not listed with Canadian federal corporation search or Quebec corporation search.  Explain.

Why is the word 'bank' in your company name? (And have you really been granted a registered trademark on it? Or is that more of your 'mock-up').

Here is why I'm asking: From http://corporations.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/cd-dgc.nsf/eng/cs01191.html:
Quote
"Your corporate name cannot suggest, for example, that you are a branch of the government or that you offer services or products governed by financial legislation, such as trusts, loans, insurance and banking. "
Emphasis mine.

Here it is again slightly more detailed:
http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/cd-dgc.nsf/eng/cs01797.html#connoting
Quote
A corporate name containing any of the following words is likely to be rejected unless the words are used in such a way that it is clear that the proposed corporation will not be a financial intermediary nor a bank: (Regulation 22)

    annuity, assurance, assurances
   bank, banc, bancorp, banco, bankco, banker, banking
    casualty, fiduciare, fiduciary, fiducie
    guaranty, indemnity, life, loan, loanco
    mortgage, insurance (unless used with the words "agency, agent, broker, service")
    pret, savings, surety
    trust, trustco, warranty

If you are an actual bank, you will be listed by The Office of the Superintendent of Financial Institutions Canada (OSFI) http://www.osfi.gc.ca/WWWapps/lists/eng.asp?s=1&g=1&i= (but your not).

member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
"Basics Of Generational Dynamics" - Look it up!
Some standard due-diligence questions:

  • What is the actual name of your corporation, and in what jurisdiction is it incorporated?
  • What is your D-U-N-S number, for your Dun and Bradstreet rating?
  • "Global Standard Bank" is not listed with Canadian federal corporation search or Quebec corporation search.  Explain.
  • Are your employees bonded? If so, who is your bonding company?
  • Do you carry errors and omissions coverage? If so, who is your carrier?
  • Has any executive employee of your company ever been convicted of a criminal offense?

Good start - anyone else have additional questions?
hero member
Activity: 616
Merit: 500
Firstbits.com/1fg4i :)
Some standard due-diligence questions:

  • "Global Standard Bank" is not listed with Canadian federal corporation search or Quebec corporation search.  Explain.

I think he said it's registred just as a number to have a soft start
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1000
Some standard due-diligence questions:

  • What is the actual name of your corporation, and in what jurisdiction is it incorporated?
  • What is your D-U-N-S number, for your Dun and Bradstreet rating?
  • "Global Standard Bank" is not listed with Canadian federal corporation search or Quebec corporation search.  Explain.
  • Are your employees bonded? If so, who is your bonding company?
  • Do you carry errors and omissions coverage? If so, who is your carrier?
  • Has any executive employee of your company ever been convicted of a criminal offense?
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 251
I don't know about you guys but a few lines of text don't make me trust. but i guess that's up to you guys, and what you do with your bitcoins.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 101
Shouldn't the thread title be changed, at least until we have more than a suspicion ?

I already changed it once per request here, and I'm not a moderator, I don't feel like changing things back and forth. I'm not here to work.'

edit:

fine
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1015
Honestly though, if they wanted to participate in the community you're stuck in the newbie zone for the first 5 posts, and for professional groups that represent outside interests I believe that requirement is waived with a simple request, right?
That is correct.
hero member
Activity: 616
Merit: 500
Firstbits.com/1fg4i :)
Shouldn't the thread title be changed, at least until we have more than a suspicion ?
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 502
The last answer about introducing services that mirror traditional banking made me laugh, atleast for a few seconds.

We are trying to move away from traditional offerings which would surely involve traditional fees.
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
"Basics Of Generational Dynamics" - Look it up!
Response:

Quote
> Hi James,
>
> Lets start off with the basics here, we can get into things like project capitalization, in a subsequent email....

Hi Atom,

Thank you for the opportunity of answering your questions and responding to your concerns. I am following the format herein so as not to miss any of the points you have touched on.


>
> With the stated 5000BTC per depositor guarantee (roughly 70,000USD at current value), and with the stated purpose of reaching a more mainstream market than those already "in the community", why do all the public views of your operation seem to be, frankly, cheaply faked?

It is our view that "cheaply faked" is a matter of opinon, and while there have been several comments like this from members of the Bitcoin Forum, the overall response to our website has been very positive.  Some have said that our website looks great, and others have compared it to established Bitcoin sites which have put little effort into design. Also, when we learned that another bank offering was launching on June 30th, we decided to fast track our launch in effort not to lose market share.

>
> Specifically, why did you
> 1) Use a free, no-name, no-exposure press release site

We used free-press release and other readily available marketing tools like social networking sites because we had decided on a soft launch as a form of beta testing. We can make all the predictions in the world, but there is no substitute for real world marketing and actual clients.
>
> 2) Use an exterior shot of another, similarly named bank with the name of the bank edited out?

Yes we did have a picture of a random building with a similar name and logo to ours in our original pages. This photo, and the artwork contained within were part of a mock up we made of our site prior to launch, and projects an image of where we would like to take the bank in the future. Just as you have modified photos on your own website to include the Bitcoin logo, it is simply a marketing image.  At no point did we say that it was our building, nor did the building have the name of our bank or our logo. Due to the change in timetable we decided to leave them in temporarily, but as you are aware they have been since replaced with actual photos of our office.
>
> 3) Use an interior shot from a different bank in Florida, when you claim to operate in Canada?

The photo you are referring to did not appear on our website, but on our flickr page, along with many random photos of everything from world flags to television images. We did not modify any of the photos in any way, but merely added a tag line "First Global Bank begins operations July 2011" This was done as a marketing effort to draw attention to the bank, which it has. As this has offended some people the photos have been removed.

>
> 4) Basically set off every "This is a scam" alert you could with your website, ranging from registration by a designer, rather than your corp. who does not seem to be related to your operation or responsive in any way, have a domain only registered for a year, etc, require lots of identification to apply but offer very little information about your own company... etc...

One would think Scam Alert, would be when someone is actually scammed, and not when people do not like your site design and use of images. Our site was registered by Gary, whom  de facto, is our webmaster. Although he did not design the site himself, he takes care of technical aspects of it. I cannot answer for him as to why he did not respond to an email enquiry, but I can suppose that perhaps he did not want to enter into any controversy or create any conflict between his client, and the public. It seems odd to me that someone with questions would email Gary in the first place, instead of contacting us directly. We have several of our e-mail addresses listed on our site, as well as our address, and telephone numbers, and nothing to hide. As to why our domain is only registered for a year - I have no idea, but I imagine that it is no different than annual renewals of everything from insurance to corporations.

Our requirement for identification is only in keeping with FINTRAC (Financial Transactions and Report Analysis Centre of Canada) requirements. Other than proprietary information, we are transparent in our operations, such as providing our office address, phone number, and how it works. The mechanism for our accounts, the legal aspects and our policies can all be found on our website. We make no claims of paying interest, or fail to explain how this is accomplished.

>
> 5) Deny affiliation with the Wikipedia poster, when it seems nobody not involved with your operation even knew you existed until the wikipedia edits showed up?  Are you standing by your statement that none of your business associates either officially or of their own volition modified you into the Bitcoin wikipedia article?

I cannot speak to what people may do of their on volition, but officially we did not make a page on Wikipedia. In fact I discovered the Wikipedia article when searching Yahoo.com to see if our website had made it to their listing. As to wether it was posted by a member of our staff is unknown to us at this time. However, your question about Wikipedia is somewhat a moot point, as the denial of knowing this person is not that we disassociate ourselves but to make a point that the "owner" of our company was not engaged in any edit war with anyone. This is the fact, and of course we stand by it.
>
> And some more background....
>
> Who are you?

I am the VP of Marketing and Client Services at Global Standard.
>
> What is your goal?

Our goal at Global Standard is to add value to the community and our business by being a responsible corporate citizen, taking excellent care of our customers, and providing positive returns for our stakeholders. My personal goal is to to the very best job I can.

> How long have you personally worked with Bitcoins?  How did you get your start?

I had never heard of Bitcoin before coming to work at Global Standard, but I am now converted, and see the huge potential of the project and the possible global impact of the currency. I am proud to be part of the Bitcoin revolution.

> What is your background?

My personal background is traditional banking, where I was recruited to Global Standard after 10 years with a Major Canadian bank. My background is not different from many of us at Global Standard that come from traditional bricks and mortar professions. To my knowledge, none of us have been involved in online business start-ups like Global Standard, with the exception of a couple of engineers that are working with us that may have had some experience in this regard.

> How large is your company?

Because we are entering into a new market, and we face the potential of stiff competition in the near future - our actual number of employees is confidential information, but of the publicly visible personnel we have is 5 in Montreal and 3 in Toronto, and a myriad of others on a contractual basis, providing everything from IT support to marketing and design.



> How long have you been in business?

We have been in business since 2010 and operated as a Canadian Numbered Corporation, until July 5 2011 when we launched our website.


> Do you have any references?

Are you offering me a job?  

> Do you have any investors from the community who are familiar with your project?

No, all of our investors are from outside the Bitcoin community.

> If not, what are your investors backgrounds and goals with this project?

The background of our investors is business, financial services, investments and sales, I cannot speak to the personal goals of individual investors, but I am sure they share the same goal as that of the company, which is to create value.
>
> I think that a real bitcoin bank is needed, and I think the model you're putting forward makes a bunch of sense, but at the same time the way the bank has chosen to enter the market has not given you much credibility, we look forward to your responses.  You're also not the first bitcoin bank, FlexCoin launched last month, and it appears you launched on July 5  Will you be keeping that branding?

They say the proof is in the pudding, and as such I am confident that the Bank will build creditability over time. We have made significant investment in our project and intend to be here for the long haul, and not for immediate gains. As for not being the first Bitcoin bank, that remains to be seen. By the looks of it, FlexCoin seems more like a e-wallet and mining pool than a bank, and the details of how it all works appear ambiguous. We wish them well because we can not imagine a world with only one Bitcoin bank since we firmly believe in its' huge potential.

At Global Standard our initial offerings are only a taste of what we have planned. Within the near future, we plan on introducing other financial products and services that mirror that of traditional banking.

Thanks again for your questions, we look forward to hearing your show.

Best Regards
Jim

member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
"Basics Of Generational Dynamics" - Look it up!
Ok, heres the first email sent

Hi James,

Lets start off with the basics here, we can get into things like project capitalization, in a subsequent email....

With the stated 5000BTC per depositor guarantee (roughly 70,000USD at current value), and with the stated purpose of reaching a more mainstream market than those already "in the community", why do all the public views of your operation seem to be, frankly, cheaply faked?

Specifically, why did you
1) Use a free, no-name, no-exposure press release site

2) Use an exterior shot of another, similarly named bank with the name of the bank edited out?

3) Use an interior shot from a different bank in Florida, when you claim to operate in Canada?

4) Basically set off every "This is a scam" alert you could with your website, ranging from registration by a designer, rather than your corp. who does not seem to be related to your operation or responsive in any way, have a domain only registered for a year, etc, require lots of identification to apply but offer very little information about your own company... etc...

5) Deny affiliation with the Wikipedia poster, when it seems nobody not involved with your operation even knew you existed until the wikipedia edits showed up?  Are you standing by your statement that none of your business associates either officially or of their own volition modified you into the Bitcoin wikipedia article?

And some more background....

Who are you?
What is your goal?
How long have you personally worked with Bitcoins?  How did you get your start?
What is your background?
How large is your company?
How long have you been in business?
Do you have any references?
Do you have any investors from the community who are familiar with your project?
If not, what are your investors backgrounds and goals with this project?

I think that a real bitcoin bank is needed, and I think the model you're putting forward makes a bunch of sense, but at the same time the way the bank has chosen to enter the market has not given you much credibility, we look forward to your responses.  You're also not the first bitcoin bank, FlexCoin launched last month, and it appears you launched on July 5  Will you be keeping that branding?


-Atom
Host, BitTalk with Atlas & Atom
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
"Basics Of Generational Dynamics" - Look it up!
Looks like they're willing to talk, but prefer indirect text.   If we get boilerplate/evasive responses I will request a follow up via vox.

Question list so far ( no particular order, I will order them before they go out)

*Who is Brenda Sufer , and what role does she serve in your organization.

*With the stated 5000BTC per depositor guarantee (roughly 70,000USD at current value), and with the stated purpose of reaching a more mainstream market than those already "in the community", why do all the public views of your operation seem to be, frankly, cheaply faked? 
Related Issues: Given the capital required for this type of operation, why did you:
1) Use a free, no-name, no-exposure press release site
2) Use an exterior shot of another, similarly named bank with the name of the bank edited out?
3) Use an interior shot from a bank in Florida, when you claim to operate in Canada?
4) Basically set off every "This is a scam" alert you could with your website, ranging from registration by a private individual who does not seem to be related to your operation or responsive in any way, have a domain only registered for a year, etc, require lots of identification to apply but offer very little information about your own company... etc...

I think this one is a followup question depending on what kind of response we get to some of the above
*How do you expect to be a trusted bank when you start your business in an unethical way? Ie. fake images, lies (claiming to not knowing about the wikipedia article).

*How will you go about proving that you can really guarantee 5000 BTC worth for every account?

*Who are you?
*Are you licensed with any governments?  Whose regulatory authority do you fall under, if any?
*Your literature mentions you may freeze account balances when for example recieving checks through the mail, with the purpose of protecting the bank (and its depositors) - What if any other circumstances would result in you freezing customer funds?  What process/standards will you follow in resolving any such freeze?


Quote
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: James Moore <[email protected]>
Date: Tue, Jul 12, 2011 at 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: Interview Request
To: Bit Talk <[email protected]>


Hi Atom,

Thank you for the email. We are happy to answer any questions, or address any concerns from the community. Please send us a list of your questions, and we will gladly send you our response.

Jim

On 2011-07-12, at 10:40 AM, Bit Talk wrote:

> Hi Jim,
> we've been following the growing controversy over your project Global Standard Bank/the bitcoin community, and wanted to give you an opportunity to get out in front of this - Up for answering some questions?
>
> Let us know what time/tech works best for you.
>
> -Atom
> Host, BitTalk with Atlas & Atom

NEED MORE QUESTIONS! POST MOAR
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
Question:

1. How do you expect to be a trusted bank when you start your business in an unethical way? Ie. fake images, lies (claiming to not knowing about the wikipedia article).
2. Why is the web site registrated in the name of a web-designer and not your company? (Apparently this web designer does not answer e-mail according to this thread)
3. How will you go about proving that you can really guarantee 5000 BTC worth for every account?

If you're in fact legit, I wish you the best of luck, if you're not, you could crash and burn.
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