Topic: Good picture to explain the ETF situation (Read 1496 times)

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 11, 2017, 03:46:11 AM

What's correction? It caused by the SEC is believe if all of the business and the service are running on the bitcoin ecosystem is purely illegal and there is no legal aspect of the bitcoin ecosystem. And the SEC try to ignore the bitcoin eth caused by that reason. We will need a long time again to get more countries be accepting bitcoin

You seem to be heavily exaggerating it

The SEC declining the ETF proposal essentially means that they don't want the money of lay people to enter Bitcoin. In other words, they consider Bitcoin too risky and speculative as of yet. It is no use making a mountain out of a molehill here. This decision doesn't in the least make Bitcoin illegal or anything to that tune. I suspect that if it was illegal, the SEC wouldn't even accept the application for the ETF approval in the first place. So you can get some comfort in the fact that they did consider this application after all and didn't throw it out the window right off the bat

Anyway, it's very unpleasant.
It seems to me that the government was simply frightened of what could have happened if there had been a positive decision. Many would start buying bitcoin and this would have made the economic situation of the country worse

Indeed, it would make it worse

Since there is not a single reason why Bitcoin price can be sustainable in the long term unless there is a constant inflow of new money into the system (either new users pouring their money into Bitcoin or old users increasing their stashes). Without real world usage (i.e. as a genuine currency), Bitcoin is basically still a pyramidal scheme, where the income earned by some comes from the losses of the others. Why do you think the twins so desperately want the ETF approved? Because they have around 100M dollar worth of bitcoins. They would be among the first to profit directly from the simple folks once the latter start bringing their dollars to them

So it turns out that in fact, ordinary people do not need any approval? It is only necessary for the brothers. Simple people continue to use bitcoins, making it popular and without approval

That's the point I was trying to make recently

You don't need ETF to invest in Bitcoin. It is a lot easier for more or less tech literate (just computer literate) people to buy bitcoins directly than to buy, say, stock. You don't need brokers and as much capital, since you can buy as little as 0.01 BTC (a little over 10 dollars). But with Bitcoin you are on your own, i.e. to accept all responsibility for all decisions you are going t take. On the other hand, allowing ETF could potentially bring into Bitcoin the money of people that otherwise wouldn't want that (e.g. pension funds) which could just destroy their pension plans

Grdas130979

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Quote from: deisik on March 10, 2017, 01:14:57 PM

Quote from: calkob on March 10, 2017, 01:02:15 PM

I think your right that eventually we will see a bitcoin ETF and i have read a few articles that have been saying now is not the best time to get one anyway. If your a hodler like me it dosnt matter anyway im in the for the long run

Personally, I don't see a lot of sense behind a Bitcoin ETF as such

It is assumed that this ETF would be investing in Bitcoin (as the name suggests), but here's my question. Namely, why would anyone want to buy a share in this ETF if he could just buy bitcoins directly? If you don't have enough dough to buy a whole bitcoin, you can just as easily buy a part of it. The smallest order at almost all major exchanges is around 0.01 BTC nowadays (and at a smaller ones it is even lower than that), so you can buy coins with just a few (dozen) dollars. Such ETF's make sense when you can't buy a stock because it is prohibitively expensive for lay folks to buy just one share of a company directly. For example, not everyone can pay over 200k dollars for a single share of Berkshire Hathaway, but with an ETF that invests in these shares, you can indirectly buy a tiny part of Warren Buffett himself

It will help people who have a lot of money invested in assets to put some money easily in BTC ecosystem without the need to have a wallet, security etc. It will also give a sence of legitimize to BTC

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Quote from: Mario274 on March 11, 2017, 03:50:17 PM

Quote from: deisik on March 11, 2017, 01:52:05 PM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 11, 2017, 03:46:11 AM

What's correction? It caused by the SEC is believe if all of the business and the service are running on the bitcoin ecosystem is purely illegal and there is no legal aspect of the bitcoin ecosystem. And the SEC try to ignore the bitcoin eth caused by that reason. We will need a long time again to get more countries be accepting bitcoin

You seem to be heavily exaggerating it

The SEC declining the ETF proposal essentially means that they don't want the money of lay people to enter Bitcoin. In other words, they consider Bitcoin too risky and speculative as of yet. It is no use making a mountain out of a molehill here. This decision doesn't in the least make Bitcoin illegal or anything to that tune. I suspect that if it was illegal, the SEC wouldn't even accept the application for the ETF approval in the first place. So you can get some comfort in the fact that they did consider this application after all and didn't throw it out the window right off the bat

Anyway, it's very unpleasant.
It seems to me that the government was simply frightened of what could have happened if there had been a positive decision. Many would start buying bitcoin and this would have made the economic situation of the country worse

Indeed, it would make it worse

Since there is not a single reason why Bitcoin price can be sustainable in the long term unless there is a constant inflow of new money into the system (either new users pouring their money into Bitcoin or old users increasing their stashes). Without real world usage (i.e. as a genuine currency), Bitcoin is basically still a pyramidal scheme, where the income earned by some comes from the losses of the others. Why do you think the twins so desperately want the ETF approved? Because they have around 100M dollar worth of bitcoins. They would be among the first to profit directly from the simple folks once the latter start bringing their dollars to them

So it turns out that in fact, ordinary people do not need any approval? It is only necessary for the brothers. Simple people continue to use bitcoins, making it popular and without approval

Not only for the brothers. I'm sure they had many wealthy investors lined up to go in. Many people would earn a lot of money if it got approved: bankers investors even small traders and if the price started to skyrocket, holders and small fish like me. This was only one of many attempts to establish a large investment platform. Now it's time to review the documents, and put money to work. Grease the gears of the machine if you know what I mean Wink

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Quote from: deisik on March 11, 2017, 01:52:05 PM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 11, 2017, 03:46:11 AM

What's correction? It caused by the SEC is believe if all of the business and the service are running on the bitcoin ecosystem is purely illegal and there is no legal aspect of the bitcoin ecosystem. And the SEC try to ignore the bitcoin eth caused by that reason. We will need a long time again to get more countries be accepting bitcoin

You seem to be heavily exaggerating it

The SEC declining the ETF proposal essentially means that they don't want the money of lay people to enter Bitcoin. In other words, they consider Bitcoin too risky and speculative as of yet. It is no use making a mountain out of a molehill here. This decision doesn't in the least make Bitcoin illegal or anything to that tune. I suspect that if it was illegal, the SEC wouldn't even accept the application for the ETF approval in the first place. So you can get some comfort in the fact that they did consider this application after all and didn't throw it out the window right off the bat

Anyway, it's very unpleasant.
It seems to me that the government was simply frightened of what could have happened if there had been a positive decision. Many would start buying bitcoin and this would have made the economic situation of the country worse

Indeed, it would make it worse

Since there is not a single reason why Bitcoin price can be sustainable in the long term unless there is a constant inflow of new money into the system (either new users pouring their money into Bitcoin or old users increasing their stashes). Without real world usage (i.e. as a genuine currency), Bitcoin is basically still a pyramidal scheme, where the income earned by some comes from the losses of the others. Why do you think the twins so desperately want the ETF approved? Because they have around 100M dollar worth of bitcoins. They would be among the first to profit directly from the simple folks once the latter start bringing their dollars to them

So it turns out that in fact, ordinary people do not need any approval? It is only necessary for the brothers. Simple people continue to use bitcoins, making it popular and without approval

deisik

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Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 11, 2017, 03:46:11 AM

What's correction? It caused by the SEC is believe if all of the business and the service are running on the bitcoin ecosystem is purely illegal and there is no legal aspect of the bitcoin ecosystem. And the SEC try to ignore the bitcoin eth caused by that reason. We will need a long time again to get more countries be accepting bitcoin

You seem to be heavily exaggerating it

The SEC declining the ETF proposal essentially means that they don't want the money of lay people to enter Bitcoin. In other words, they consider Bitcoin too risky and speculative as of yet. It is no use making a mountain out of a molehill here. This decision doesn't in the least make Bitcoin illegal or anything to that tune. I suspect that if it was illegal, the SEC wouldn't even accept the application for the ETF approval in the first place. So you can get some comfort in the fact that they did consider this application after all and didn't throw it out the window right off the bat

Anyway, it's very unpleasant.
It seems to me that the government was simply frightened of what could have happened if there had been a positive decision. Many would start buying bitcoin and this would have made the economic situation of the country worse

Indeed, it would make it worse

Since there is not a single reason why Bitcoin price can be sustainable in the long term unless there is a constant inflow of new money into the system (either new users pouring their money into Bitcoin or old users increasing their stashes). Without real world usage (i.e. as a genuine currency), Bitcoin is basically still a pyramidal scheme, where the income earned by some comes from the losses of the others. Why do you think the twins so desperately want the ETF approved? Because they have around 100M dollar worth of bitcoins. They would be among the first to profit directly from the simple folks once the latter start bringing their dollars to them

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Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 11, 2017, 03:46:11 AM

Quote from: lordquanta on March 11, 2017, 01:59:33 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on March 11, 2017, 12:32:30 AM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 11, 2017, 03:46:11 AM

If ETF will be denied, there's no need to see the price of bitcoin dropping. Whether it will be approved or not.

Still we will see the price of bitcoin to keep on increasing, bitcoin is created that way as long as there are new comers that will invest.

And if there are people that will keep on using it, ETF will just make a small difference but of course I want it to be approved. Grin

I guess the approval by SEC is the little part of the bitcoin journey. And i think i don't like the approval caused by it seems like just a business. So more money will flow to the bitcoin and the twin winklevoss will take the advantage by the SEC approval with a lot of the partnership in the future. and they will become billionaire and currently they're millionaire.

There's no need to hope anymore, the decision is simply denied. Let's move on and keep the fate and believing the price of bitcoin to pump.

I expected this to happen and many holders did panic selling I will sorry for them. Too bad that they loss a lot of potential profit.

Let's get back to reality and now hope the price will pump before the year ends.

if the decision is really denied, then its better we continue from what we do and gets prepare for anything that will happen in future, we need to watch and learn about what will happen in the market and i think that we can see a little panic from the traders like last night when we see the price is getting pump so high.

The decision is rejection and it caused correction. This is indeed good lesson for all those who were believing price is going to moon just because of ETF. Hopefully some ongoing correction will continue and market will stay positive.

What's correction? It caused by the SEC is believe if all of the business and the service are running on the bitcoin ecosystem is purely illegal and there is no legal aspect of the bitcoin ecosystem. And the SEC try to ignore the bitcoin eth caused by that reason. We will need a long time again to get more countries be accepting bitcoin

You seem to be heavily exaggerating it

The SEC declining the ETF proposal essentially means that they don't want the money of lay people to enter Bitcoin. In other words, they consider Bitcoin too risky and speculative as of yet. It is no use making a mountain out of a molehill here. This decision doesn't in the least make Bitcoin illegal or anything to that tune. I suspect that if it was illegal, the SEC wouldn't even accept the application for the ETF approval in the first place. So you can get some comfort in the fact that they did consider this application after all and didn't throw it out the window right off the bat

Anyway, it's very unpleasant.
It seems to me that the government was simply frightened of what could have happened if there had been a positive decision. Many would start buying bitcoin and this would have made the economic situation of the country worse

deisik

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Quote from: lordquanta on March 11, 2017, 01:59:33 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on March 11, 2017, 12:32:30 AM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

Quote from: lordquanta on March 11, 2017, 01:59:33 AM

If ETF will be denied, there's no need to see the price of bitcoin dropping. Whether it will be approved or not.

Still we will see the price of bitcoin to keep on increasing, bitcoin is created that way as long as there are new comers that will invest.

And if there are people that will keep on using it, ETF will just make a small difference but of course I want it to be approved. Grin

I guess the approval by SEC is the little part of the bitcoin journey. And i think i don't like the approval caused by it seems like just a business. So more money will flow to the bitcoin and the twin winklevoss will take the advantage by the SEC approval with a lot of the partnership in the future. and they will become billionaire and currently they're millionaire.

There's no need to hope anymore, the decision is simply denied. Let's move on and keep the fate and believing the price of bitcoin to pump.

I expected this to happen and many holders did panic selling I will sorry for them. Too bad that they loss a lot of potential profit.

Let's get back to reality and now hope the price will pump before the year ends.

if the decision is really denied, then its better we continue from what we do and gets prepare for anything that will happen in future, we need to watch and learn about what will happen in the market and i think that we can see a little panic from the traders like last night when we see the price is getting pump so high.

The decision is rejection and it caused correction. This is indeed good lesson for all those who were believing price is going to moon just because of ETF. Hopefully some ongoing correction will continue and market will stay positive.

What's correction? It caused by the SEC is believe if all of the business and the service are running on the bitcoin ecosystem is purely illegal and there is no legal aspect of the bitcoin ecosystem. And the SEC try to ignore the bitcoin eth caused by that reason. We will need a long time again to get more countries be accepting bitcoin

You seem to be heavily exaggerating it

The SEC declining the ETF proposal essentially means that they don't want the money of lay people to enter Bitcoin. In other words, they consider Bitcoin too risky and speculative as of yet. It is no use making a mountain out of a molehill here. This decision doesn't in the least make Bitcoin illegal or anything to that tune. I suspect that if it was illegal, the SEC wouldn't even accept the application for the ETF approval in the first place. So you can get some comfort in the fact that they did consider this application after all and didn't throw it out the window right off the bat

VanDeinsberg12

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Quote from: traderethereum on March 11, 2017, 12:32:30 AM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

Quote from: lordquanta on March 11, 2017, 01:59:33 AM

If ETF will be denied, there's no need to see the price of bitcoin dropping. Whether it will be approved or not.

Still we will see the price of bitcoin to keep on increasing, bitcoin is created that way as long as there are new comers that will invest.

And if there are people that will keep on using it, ETF will just make a small difference but of course I want it to be approved. Grin

I guess the approval by SEC is the little part of the bitcoin journey. And i think i don't like the approval caused by it seems like just a business. So more money will flow to the bitcoin and the twin winklevoss will take the advantage by the SEC approval with a lot of the partnership in the future. and they will become billionaire and currently they're millionaire.

There's no need to hope anymore, the decision is simply denied. Let's move on and keep the fate and believing the price of bitcoin to pump.

I expected this to happen and many holders did panic selling I will sorry for them. Too bad that they loss a lot of potential profit.

Let's get back to reality and now hope the price will pump before the year ends.

if the decision is really denied, then its better we continue from what we do and gets prepare for anything that will happen in future, we need to watch and learn about what will happen in the market and i think that we can see a little panic from the traders like last night when we see the price is getting pump so high.

The decision is rejection and it caused correction. This is indeed good lesson for all those who were believing price is going to moon just because of ETF. Hopefully some ongoing correction will continue and market will stay positive.

What's correction? It caused by the SEC is believe if all of the business and the service are running on the bitcoin ecosystem is purely illegal and there is no legal aspect of the bitcoin ecosystem. And the SEC try to ignore the bitcoin eth caused by that reason. We will need a long time again to get more countries be accepting bitcoin.

deisik

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Quote from: traderethereum on March 11, 2017, 12:32:30 AM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on March 11, 2017, 12:32:30 AM

If ETF will be denied, there's no need to see the price of bitcoin dropping. Whether it will be approved or not.

Still we will see the price of bitcoin to keep on increasing, bitcoin is created that way as long as there are new comers that will invest.

And if there are people that will keep on using it, ETF will just make a small difference but of course I want it to be approved. Grin

I guess the approval by SEC is the little part of the bitcoin journey. And i think i don't like the approval caused by it seems like just a business. So more money will flow to the bitcoin and the twin winklevoss will take the advantage by the SEC approval with a lot of the partnership in the future. and they will become billionaire and currently they're millionaire.

There's no need to hope anymore, the decision is simply denied. Let's move on and keep the fate and believing the price of bitcoin to pump.

I expected this to happen and many holders did panic selling I will sorry for them. Too bad that they loss a lot of potential profit.

Let's get back to reality and now hope the price will pump before the year ends.

if the decision is really denied, then its better we continue from what we do and gets prepare for anything that will happen in future, we need to watch and learn about what will happen in the market and i think that we can see a little panic from the traders like last night when we see the price is getting pump so high.

The decision is rejection and it caused correction. This is indeed good lesson for all those who were believing price is going to moon just because of ETF. Hopefully some ongoing correction will continue and market will stay positive

What we have just seen is no more than a knee-jerk reaction (as I said earlier)

And most likely somewhat accelerated and exaggerated by manipulators to knock bitcoins from the weak hands with the aim of buying up while prices are low. I guess in a matter of a few days (if not hours) the prices will revert to well over 1,200 dollars per coin (and likely stay there). As to me, there was no real hype linked to the ETF approval expectations (as I also mentioned earlier) since the market expected that the ETF proposal would be rejected. In other words, the price growth we have seen as of recent was organic, not juiced up on rabid hype and mass hysteria

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Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

Quote from: traderethereum on March 11, 2017, 12:32:30 AM

If ETF will be denied, there's no need to see the price of bitcoin dropping. Whether it will be approved or not.

Still we will see the price of bitcoin to keep on increasing, bitcoin is created that way as long as there are new comers that will invest.

And if there are people that will keep on using it, ETF will just make a small difference but of course I want it to be approved. Grin

I guess the approval by SEC is the little part of the bitcoin journey. And i think i don't like the approval caused by it seems like just a business. So more money will flow to the bitcoin and the twin winklevoss will take the advantage by the SEC approval with a lot of the partnership in the future. and they will become billionaire and currently they're millionaire.

There's no need to hope anymore, the decision is simply denied. Let's move on and keep the fate and believing the price of bitcoin to pump.

I expected this to happen and many holders did panic selling I will sorry for them. Too bad that they loss a lot of potential profit.

Let's get back to reality and now hope the price will pump before the year ends.

if the decision is really denied, then its better we continue from what we do and gets prepare for anything that will happen in future, we need to watch and learn about what will happen in the market and i think that we can see a little panic from the traders like last night when we see the price is getting pump so high.

The decision is rejection and it caused correction. This is indeed good lesson for all those who were believing price is going to moon just because of ETF. Hopefully some ongoing correction will continue and market will stay positive.

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Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

If ETF will be denied, there's no need to see the price of bitcoin dropping. Whether it will be approved or not.

Still we will see the price of bitcoin to keep on increasing, bitcoin is created that way as long as there are new comers that will invest.

And if there are people that will keep on using it, ETF will just make a small difference but of course I want it to be approved. Grin

I guess the approval by SEC is the little part of the bitcoin journey. And i think i don't like the approval caused by it seems like just a business. So more money will flow to the bitcoin and the twin winklevoss will take the advantage by the SEC approval with a lot of the partnership in the future. and they will become billionaire and currently they're millionaire.

There's no need to hope anymore, the decision is simply denied. Let's move on and keep the fate and believing the price of bitcoin to pump.

I expected this to happen and many holders did panic selling I will sorry for them. Too bad that they loss a lot of potential profit.

Let's get back to reality and now hope the price will pump before the year ends.

if the decision is really denied, then its better we continue from what we do and gets prepare for anything that will happen in future, we need to watch and learn about what will happen in the market and i think that we can see a little panic from the traders like last night when we see the price is getting pump so high.

Yes, we need to do the best with the situation we have. Everyone should be prepared for the ETF deny. The panic isn't good, I just hope the traders see there isn't reason for panic, that Bitcoin will continue its way as it was until now. As OP picture says, if we weren't to the moon, we will go later, Crypto-Currency is unstopped now.

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Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

Quote from: VanDeinsberg12 on March 10, 2017, 06:35:42 AM

If ETF will be denied, there's no need to see the price of bitcoin dropping. Whether it will be approved or not.

Still we will see the price of bitcoin to keep on increasing, bitcoin is created that way as long as there are new comers that will invest.

And if there are people that will keep on using it, ETF will just make a small difference but of course I want it to be approved. Grin

I guess the approval by SEC is the little part of the bitcoin journey. And i think i don't like the approval caused by it seems like just a business. So more money will flow to the bitcoin and the twin winklevoss will take the advantage by the SEC approval with a lot of the partnership in the future. and they will become billionaire and currently they're millionaire.

There's no need to hope anymore, the decision is simply denied. Let's move on and keep the fate and believing the price of bitcoin to pump.

I expected this to happen and many holders did panic selling I will sorry for them. Too bad that they loss a lot of potential profit.

Let's get back to reality and now hope the price will pump before the year ends.

if the decision is really denied, then its better we continue from what we do and gets prepare for anything that will happen in future, we need to watch and learn about what will happen in the market and i think that we can see a little panic from the traders like last night when we see the price is getting pump so high.

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