goons are crashing the market again | Bitcointalksearch.org

Alex Beckenham

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Quote from: Dude65535 on June 17, 2011, 08:54:38 PM

If the difficulty went that high without much higher prices first the price of bitcoin would go to $0. Because the only way that much computing power would be set to mining at current prices is if the owner of the computing power wanted to kill bitcoin. With enough computing power to drive difficulty that high they would succeed.

That was just an example figure, meant to show 'an increase in difficulty'. I could have chosen 877221.666667 (1 more than the current difficulty), but my example would have lacked impact, while still retaining it's point.

Dude65535

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Quote from: Alex Beckenham on June 17, 2011, 08:26:13 PM

Quote from: TheGer on June 17, 2011, 07:44:48 PM

Directly no. Indirectly through its psychological effect on those mining coins yes.

Quote from: justusranvier on June 17, 2011, 11:50:05 AM

Quote from: Vanquistador on June 17, 2011, 11:41:56 AM

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)?

The price of bitcoins is not determined by the difficulty of mining them.

This argument comes up so many times on this forum.

Imagine if the difficulty rose tomorrow to 10,000,000,000,000,000,000.

Do you think miners will want to sell you any coins for today's low low prices?

Or do you think they'll hold out for higher prices since the prospect of them mining more tomorrow is now diminished?

If the difficulty went that high without much higher prices first the price of bitcoin would go to $0. Because the only way that much computing power would be set to mining at current prices is if the owner of the computing power wanted to kill bitcoin. With enough computing power to drive difficulty that high they would succeed.

malditonuke

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Quote from: Alex Beckenham on June 17, 2011, 08:26:13 PM

Quote from: TheGer on June 17, 2011, 07:44:48 PM

Directly no. Indirectly through its psychological effect on those mining coins yes.

Quote from: justusranvier on June 17, 2011, 11:50:05 AM

Quote from: Vanquistador on June 17, 2011, 11:41:56 AM

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)?

The price of bitcoins is not determined by the difficulty of mining them.

This argument comes up so many times on this forum.

Imagine if the difficulty rose tomorrow to 10,000,000,000,000,000,000.

Do you think miners will want to sell you any coins for today's low low prices?

Or do you think they'll hold out for higher prices since the prospect of them mining more tomorrow is now diminished?

The cart pushes the horse.

Alex Beckenham

full member

Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Quote from: TheGer on June 17, 2011, 07:44:48 PM

Directly no. Indirectly through its psychological effect on those mining coins yes.

Quote from: justusranvier on June 17, 2011, 11:50:05 AM

Quote from: Vanquistador on June 17, 2011, 11:41:56 AM

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)?

The price of bitcoins is not determined by the difficulty of mining them.

This argument comes up so many times on this forum.

Imagine if the difficulty rose tomorrow to 10,000,000,000,000,000,000.

Do you think miners will want to sell you any coins for today's low low prices?

Or do you think they'll hold out for higher prices since the prospect of them mining more tomorrow is now diminished?

TheGer

hero member

Activity: 602

Merit: 500

Directly no. Indirectly through its psychological effect on those mining coins yes.

Quote from: justusranvier on June 17, 2011, 11:50:05 AM

Quote from: Vanquistador on June 17, 2011, 11:41:56 AM

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)?

The price of bitcoins is not determined by the difficulty of mining them.

killer2021

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Activity: 84

Merit: 10

Quote from: imperi on June 17, 2011, 10:18:31 AM

I sell my Bitcoins when they get down to $10-$13 because I might lose everything.

I buy Bitcoins when they are at $25, because then they are doing well.

Buy high, sell low.

I do opposite

but all kidding aside.

Thats what most buyers/sellers do. When the price is dropping they panic and sell, "before they lose everything" and when the price starts going back up, they buy, "before they miss out." The end result is sell low buy high. Greed and fear at its finest.

opticbit

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PGP: 6EBEBCE1E0507C38

Quote from: imperi on June 17, 2011, 10:18:31 AM

I sell my Bitcoins when they get down to $10-$13 because I might lose everything.

I buy Bitcoins when they are at $25, because then they are doing well.

Buy high, sell low.

any time your on otc I'll buy them from you at $10 and sell back at $25, we can repeat the process as many times a day as you like.

Vandroiy

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Goons bring the market up, goons bring it to crash, whoever is smarter than them makes money in between.

Everything good as long as something's happening. And if people are in for long-term speculations... well, since no smart speculator put everything on one card, the drop increases the buy-in size of those speculating on a rise.

So why would one complain -- because the earnings could have been higher? Oh well, I also sold some too low in the first drop, you can't get it perfect every time.

On correct mid-term predictions, a speculator makes good money. The ones who should complain are those wanting to use Bitcoin; traders will be annoyed by the jumping prices.

justusranvier

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Quote from: Vanquistador on June 17, 2011, 11:41:56 AM

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)?

The price of bitcoins is not determined by the difficulty of mining them.

unk

member

Activity: 84

Merit: 10

Quote from: Vanquistador on June 17, 2011, 11:41:56 AM

Quote from: TheGer on June 17, 2011, 10:59:57 AM

Difficulty goes up! Price goes down!

Tiger Blood!!!!!

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)? (Aside from the notion that the price falls every weekend, since it is currently friday.... and the prices usually haven't dipped (at least last week they didn't) until Saturday).

except for the mild, easily predicted (and thus priced), and temporary decrease in supply following a difficulty retarget to a higher level, there isn't the slightest reason to think that rising difficulty should cause an increased price. there's no reason at all to think it should in the steady state.

as an analogy, if i'm pumping natural gas from an underground well, and someone else starts pumping gas from that same underground well in a way that doesn't change overall production but simply reallocates it, what effect do you think it would have on price?

any other effects people notice either confuse correlation for causation or posit some hard-to-measure empirical conjecture about the psychology of miners, none of which has proven to be true long-term, and none of which is grounded on anything but speculation.

imperi

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Quote from: Vanquistador on June 17, 2011, 11:41:56 AM

Quote from: TheGer on June 17, 2011, 10:59:57 AM

Difficulty goes up! Price goes down!

Tiger Blood!!!!!

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)? (Aside from the notion that the price falls every weekend, since it is currently friday.... and the prices usually haven't dipped (at least last week they didn't) until Saturday).

All the miners say "This sucks. I quit" and then never look at Bitcoin again.

Vanquistador

newbie

Activity: 28

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Quote from: TheGer on June 17, 2011, 10:59:57 AM

Difficulty goes up! Price goes down!

Tiger Blood!!!!!

I don't get how the price is going down after a difficulty increase... anyone able to englighten me (and others)? (Aside from the notion that the price falls every weekend, since it is currently friday.... and the prices usually haven't dipped (at least last week they didn't) until Saturday).

Durr

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Quote from: piuk on June 17, 2011, 10:16:52 AM

I feel like posting this again.

https://i.imgur.com/uBkiS.jpg

Hold that bag as tight as you can.

TheGer

hero member

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Merit: 500

Difficulty goes up! Price goes down!

Tiger Blood!!!!!

Oldminer

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Quote from: imperi on June 17, 2011, 10:18:31 AM

I sell my Bitcoins when they get down to $10-$13 because I might lose everything.

I buy Bitcoins when they are at $25, because then they are doing well.

Buy high, sell low.

This is called capitalism

Maxxx

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 11

Quote from: imperi on June 17, 2011, 10:18:31 AM

I sell my Bitcoins when they get down to $10-$13 because I might lose everything.

I buy Bitcoins when they are at $25, because then they are doing well.

Buy high, sell low.

Words of wisdom that everyone should follow.

dayfall

sr. member

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Quote from: bitbot on June 17, 2011, 10:32:41 AM

EVERYONE SELL NOW AND BUY BACK WHEN IT GOES DOWN TO 12 TOMORROW

YES, SELL SELL. That is what I want you to do!

Ok, seriously. Who am I taking this money from? How can I have more BTC and more USD than when I started? Man, this stuff is crazy.

stic.man

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Activity: 168

Merit: 100

15 has a pretty decent bid in place to stop a drop, guess we'll see

bitbot

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EVERYONE SELL NOW AND BUY BACK WHEN IT GOES DOWN TO 12 TOMORROW

bittersweet

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Activity: 222

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Goons are trying to sell their overpriced bitcoins too high!

This is getting fucking ridiculous!! don't buy people you're playing into their hands!!

Topic: goons are crashing the market again (Read 7274 times)