Gox Gone, Insolvent | Bitcointalksearch.org

richmke

full member

Activity: 126

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Quote from: ex-trader on February 25, 2014, 03:38:59 PM

That's because they are an advance payment for services, thus are correctly held on financial statements as prepayments.

Security deposits at Apartments are not pre-payments.

Quote

The only time Gox or any exchange can claim a piece is when a transaction fee is charged.

And for purchases/sales, profit/loss on trades, etc.

If you are going to commit to selling 1 BTC for $600, they need to know that you have the 1 BTC, and then to withdraw the BTC when the trade is executed. Like it or not, they have to have control of your BTC if you want to transact business. The question is whether they control the BTC on their books (and thus shows up on their balance sheet), or whether a 3rd party holds them and does the transactions at their direction.

ex-trader

sr. member

Activity: 298

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Quote from: richmke on February 25, 2014, 01:53:35 PM

However, there are some companies, like utilities, apartment complexes, etc., that hold customer deposits in their accounts. Even if the accounts are physically separate, they are under the control of the Company. As such, they are company assets with an offsetting liability. Thus, they show up on the Company's financial statements.

That's because they are an advance payment for services, thus are correctly held on financial statements as prepayments.

No one who sends cash or coins to an exchange is doing anything other than asking them to be held on their behalf as client funds, which should be segregated. The only time Gox or any exchange can claim a piece is when a transaction fee is charged.

richmke

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Quote from: Minor Miner on February 25, 2014, 10:45:13 AM

If you read their documents, you will see that Mt Gox STILL does not understand that customer deposits are NOT "assets of Mt. Gox". It is a complete shit show and I cannot wait for the perp walks because maybe that will wake some idiots up that this is not a game.

Depends upon who holds the deposits. Some brokerage firms have a third party Trustee hold the Customer Deposits. In that instance, the customer deposit is never an asset of the Company, and will not show up on the Company's financial statements.

However, there are some companies, like utilities, apartment complexes, etc., that hold customer deposits in their accounts. Even if the accounts are physically separate, they are under the control of the Company. As such, they are company assets with an offsetting liability. Thus, they show up on the Company's financial statements.

Rampion

legendary

Activity: 1148

Merit: 1018

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on February 25, 2014, 12:05:45 PM

Quote from: Minor Miner on February 25, 2014, 10:45:13 AM

If you read their documents, you will see that Mt Gox STILL does not understand that customer deposits are NOT "assets of Mt. Gox". It is a complete shit show and I cannot wait for the perp walks because maybe that will wake some idiots up that this is not a game.

That is the crazy thing. Customer deposits should never be listed on a company balance sheet unless that company is a bank. Customer deposits should be segregated, independent of the company's accounts. The revenue (in the form of fees) deducted from the customer deposits are transferred to the company's books as they occur (or daily in batches).

Well, that is so crazy that is almost unbelievable IMO. If those leaked documents are even half true (which I cannot believe), then the people at Gox are just a bunch of criminals. Customer funds are just that, customer funds: and they should be kept completely segregated and should be 100% independent of the company's accounts. If they are considering customer funds "assets" they probably deserve to rot a long time in jail.

usabitcoinbuyer

newbie

Activity: 57

Merit: 0

Quote from: digimag on February 25, 2014, 12:03:59 PM

Like if I needed protection Shocked

Thanks Gox, very helpful.

They're getting magnanimous - it's to protect us from them!

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1079

Gerald Davis

Quote from: Minor Miner on February 25, 2014, 10:45:13 AM

If you read their documents, you will see that Mt Gox STILL does not understand that customer deposits are NOT "assets of Mt. Gox". It is a complete shit show and I cannot wait for the perp walks because maybe that will wake some idiots up that this is not a game.

That is the crazy thing. Customer deposits should never be listed on a company balance sheet unless that company is a bank. Customer deposits should be segregated, independent of the company's accounts. The revenue (in the form of fees) deducted from the customer deposits are transferred to the company's books as they occur (or daily in batches).

atta2k15

sr. member

Activity: 315

Merit: 250

Quote from: digimag on February 25, 2014, 12:03:59 PM

Like if I needed protection Shocked

Thanks Gox, very helpful.

...at least its safe....somewhere.... Cool

digimag

full member

Activity: 138

Merit: 100

Like if I needed protection Shocked

Thanks Gox, very helpful.

atta2k15

sr. member

Activity: 315

Merit: 250

Minor Miner

legendary

Activity: 2380

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Be A Digital Miner

Quote from: ex-trader on February 25, 2014, 04:50:45 AM

If that document is correct they have lost 90% of all customer assets, though they may have recovered some by buying back at the low prices.

Under the laws of every major country, at this point they cannot simply carry on trading and hope to get out of it. They are insolvent and have done so negligently with customer assets. They should be closed, liquidated and the remaining assets distributed. No one will ever trust them and the moment they re-open only a fool would do anything other than withdraw any coins/cash they could.

What does it take for the Bitcoin world to realise that many of the rules and regulations that exist with Fiat and Banks are there to protect customers. All exchanges should be properly audited and publish audited statements proving their solvency.

Bitcoin = wild west = scam/idiots, sadly yet again..... (so much promise that continues to be wasted by a community that accepts these behaviours)

If you read their documents, you will see that Mt Gox STILL does not understand that customer deposits are NOT "assets of Mt. Gox". It is a complete shit show and I cannot wait for the perp walks because maybe that will wake some idiots up that this is not a game.

Klestin

hero member

Activity: 493

Merit: 500

From their facebook page:

Quote

We are in a process of being acquired, at the current time I am not in the position to give you further information. I can only reassure you, that your funds are securely kept in our cold storage.

An official statement is to be released tomorrow.

dewdeded

legendary

Activity: 1232

Merit: 1011

Monero Evangelist

Quote from: equinox9 on February 25, 2014, 06:36:55 AM

Out of curiosity - the logo they are using for the new site, is that their official logo or a placeholder?

It's so ugly it must be a placeholder.

Lauda

legendary

Activity: 2674

Merit: 2965

Terminated.

Quote from: dewdeded on February 24, 2014, 11:54:58 PM

rebranding with 1 month downtime

This is why we should sue them for every single cent that was stolen, so that they never come back.

dewdeded

legendary

Activity: 1232

Merit: 1011

Monero Evangelist

Quote from: bitfreak! on February 25, 2014, 02:35:11 AM

Which means they are still short 312K BTC.

It's a strategy draft from outsiders. It's a target, they want/propose to cover 50%.
It's not the current situation.

harkonnen

full member

Activity: 210

Merit: 100

Quote from: jhansen858 on February 25, 2014, 01:00:48 AM

Honestly,

If they don't make people whole, this WILL be the end of Bitcoin. It could be the fatal flaw of bitcoin, its too hard to secure.

You simply do not understand the bitcoin. Bitcoin is designed so that 'trust' can be out of formula in transactions. People 'trusted' MtGox. That's the problem, not with bitcoin. One of our intern recommended MtGox as trustworthy when I was searching for exchange services. I didn't trust it and I was right.

But in order to make a transaction, trust must be somewhere in the process, paradoxical, it seems. Because our society, whether you like it or not, is based on trust.

harkonnen

full member

Activity: 210

Merit: 100

Quote from: ISAWHIM on February 25, 2014, 12:14:46 AM

You guys are too damn funny...

How are your other exchanges doing, BTW... Rising like a bat out of hell... right... lol.

Gox will be back up in a few minutes. As always.

Stage one!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C3%BCbler-Ross_model#Stages

grifferz

full member

Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Quote from: equinox9 on February 25, 2014, 06:36:55 AM

Out of curiosity - the logo they are using for the new site, is that their official logo or a placeholder?

How can we possibly know until it is published on an actual mtgox site (mtgox.com or gox.com) or that document is verified or Karpeles makes a verified statement? I'm sure when any of that happens it will be all over these boards.

equinox9

newbie

Activity: 40

Merit: 0

Out of curiosity - the logo they are using for the new site, is that their official logo or a placeholder?

grifferz

full member

Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Quote from: Albertarocks on February 25, 2014, 12:51:46 AM

A lot of people are having a good time laughing at us, but they don't appreciate that several weeks ago Gox started disallowing BTC withdrawals. In other words, they closed the god damned bank door.

Plenty of people were still putting funds in, even with the "bank door closed". Greed beyond reason.

But given the years of troubles MtGox has had it is hard to have sympathy for people still using it at the point where they halted withdrawals.

weryo

full member

Activity: 126

Merit: 100

The source code of the empty page on https://www.mtgox.com/ says: 'put announce for mtgox acq here'

maybe they're spnning it as a takeover

Topic: Gox Gone, Insolvent (Read 13033 times)