Hey Bitcoiners Choose Simplicity Over Complex Technicalities

taufik123

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Quote from: panganib999 on October 24, 2023, 12:50:21 AM

-snip-
Most of the newbies I know will always stick to whatever's the most accessible and easy to get around, which is why electrum and hot wallets as well as exchange wallets are a staple among these newbies. Although there will be those ambitious enough to push for the more advanced side of the crypto industry and actually use air-gapped wallets or something along those lines and then wonder why their coins are inaccessible lol. It's been like that ever since.

You and I have even been beginners and what you said about beginners looking for the easiest way to use a wallet or store their assets is to use a wallet that is widely recommended for beginners, easy to access.

Even when I just created an account on this forum and joined the bounty, I used CEX wallet to receive coin payments, yes and in the end, I couldn't retrieve the coins and that was a learning experience for me as a beginner.

The technical stuff is needed when you have a pretty good understanding of how to use a wallet, and differentiate between different wallets and how they function.
It just takes some adaptation and initial knowledge.

Those who are ambitious enough to push to the more advanced side are good ambitions, because they will find new knowledge from what they want to learn.

panganib999

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pretty sure you wouldn't go for any of the more advanced options and disciplines even if you want to if you're a confirmed newbie in the crypto space. Most of the newbies I know will always stick to whatever's the most accessible and easy to get around, which is why electrum and hot wallets as well as exchange wallets are a staple among these newbies. Although there will be those ambitious enough to push for the more advanced side of the crypto industry and actually use air-gapped wallets or something along those lines and then wonder why their coins are inaccessible lol. It's been like that ever since.

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Quote from: Blitzboy on October 22, 2023, 04:06:18 AM

You are 100% correct when you say that most people dont need or benefit from the difficulty of a multi-signature wallet. Why do that when there are easier choices like Electrum?

Multisig (Multi signature) wallet is a new type of Bitcoin wallet to secure your wallet and your bitcoin better. It's an advance development from Single Signature wallet for Bitcoin.

But you misunderstood that Bitcoin MultiSig wallets can be set up by many Bitcoin wallet softwares. Electrum is one of Bitcoin wallet softwares can be used to set up a multisig wallet.

Bitcoin multisig wallet is not Electrum wallet and your post is like with Electrum wallet software, you can not set up a multisig wallet. In fact, you can do it with Electrum.

Multisig wallet (Electrum documentation).
Creating a multisig wallet with Electrum.

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Quote from: mvdheuvel1983 on October 20, 2023, 09:36:52 AM

As a Bitcoin enthusiast, I want to say briefly that you shouldn't sacrifice simplicity for technicality. You are more likely to lose your bitcoins because of too much technicality than to scammers or hackers. An example of keeping things simple is that instead of storing your Bitcoin in a multi signature wallet that you do not understand how it works or have no experience in setting up, store your Bitcoin in a soft like Electrum wallet where the process of setting up is pretty straight forward. Another example is using simpler and recommended ways to protect your seed phrase instead of some ways that has too much complexities and technicality to it any mistake can result in its loss forever.

In summary, it is more practical to stick with user-friendly options that you understand well than advanced options. Simplicity and a strong foundation of knowledge are your best allies in safeguarding your bitcoin.

I totally agree. Too many Bitcoin users mistake complexity for intelligence in the world of Bitcoin and the crypto-economy as a whole, which changes very quickly. We're not talking about some obscure mathematical theory. These are real assets, and mistakes can cost dearly. Technicalities just for the sake of them can lead to terrible mistakes. You are 100% correct when you say that most people dont need or benefit from the difficulty of a multi-signature wallet. Why do that when there are easier choices like Electrum?

However, lets not stop there. Everything in crypto is based on this one concept. Deeply involving yourself in complex setups might not only add more layers of safety, but also more levels of danger. User-friendly doesnt mean amateur; it means practical. Yes, knowledge is power. But how can simple application of knowledge keep it safe? To do that is to really have power in crypto. Make sure your assets are safe and your methods are easy to understand.

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Quote from: Traderbtcc on October 21, 2023, 06:53:51 PM

You're absolutely right! Keeping things simple is important, but with all the hacks and scams happening lately, it's crucial to be cautious. That's why many people opt for multi-signature setups or storing their coins on exchanges like Binance. However, in my opinion, using a Ledger is a wise choice. It's one of the safest and easiest ways to secure your coins, especially if multi-signature is too technical for some. Stay safe and secured

do remember that it is never a smart idea storing your coins in exchanges. you have no control with your funds here. just go for electrum if you want a simple one. and once you learn more things, that's when you can move to other solid and secure options like ledger.
electrum for me is more than enough if you have no big funds to store with. just make sure you are very careful in every transaction that you make and not fall from the bait of these scammers.

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Quote from: mvdheuvel1983 on October 20, 2023, 09:36:52 AM

As a Bitcoin enthusiast, I want to say briefly that you shouldn't sacrifice simplicity for technicality. You are more likely to lose your bitcoins because of too much technicality than to scammers or hackers. An example of keeping things simple is that instead of storing your Bitcoin in a multi signature wallet that you do not understand how it works or have no experience in setting up, store your Bitcoin in a soft like Electrum wallet where the process of setting up is pretty straight forward. Another example is using simpler and recommended ways to protect your seed phrase instead of some ways that has too much complexities and technicality to it any mistake can result in its loss forever.

In summary, it is more practical to stick with user-friendly options that you understand well than advanced options. Simplicity and a strong foundation of knowledge are your best allies in safeguarding your bitcoin.

You're absolutely right! Keeping things simple is important, but with all the hacks and scams happening lately, it's crucial to be cautious. That's why many people opt for multi-signature setups or storing their coins on exchanges like Binance. However, in my opinion, using a Ledger is a wise choice. It's one of the safest and easiest ways to secure your coins, especially if multi-signature is too technical for some. Stay safe and secured

taufik123

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Quote from: Stepstowealth on October 21, 2023, 12:28:49 PM

-snip-
I have heard simple cases of people who have tried to make their access password to their simple devices very complex and ended up forgetting it, do not things that you are not used to especially now that money is involved.

That's an example of people being too paranoid about security being too simple.
Even though if something simple is well maintained and without any mistakes from the user it will also remain safe.

But some people who already understand the security used, make it a little complicated and technical it is their own responsibility.

Creating a new layer of security that is difficult for anyone to penetrate.
It involves a lot of effort to keep it safe and don't be too stupid to do technical things but don't fully understand what you're doing.

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Quote from: mvdheuvel1983 on October 20, 2023, 09:36:52 AM

As a Bitcoin enthusiast, I want to say briefly that you shouldn't sacrifice simplicity for technicality. You are more likely to lose your bitcoins because of too much technicality than to scammers or hackers. An example of keeping things simple is that instead of storing your Bitcoin in a multi signature wallet that you do not understand how it works or have no experience in setting up, store your Bitcoin in a soft like Electrum wallet where the process of setting up is pretty straight forward. Another example is using simpler and recommended ways to protect your seed phrase instead of some ways that has too much complexities and technicality to it any mistake can result in its loss forever.

In summary, it is more practical to stick with user-friendly options that you understand well than advanced options. Simplicity and a strong foundation of knowledge are your best allies in safeguarding your bitcoin.

Electrum has the option to create a multisig wallet but I get the point you're trying to make. A single signature wallet is sufficient for most people. A standard Electrum wallet is a practical choice for beginners. Multisig and Shamir backups require a higher degree of responsibility but if someone has the technical understanding they should not be discouraged from considering options that may provide better security.

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Quote from: mvdheuvel1983 on October 20, 2023, 09:36:52 AM

In summary, it is more practical to stick with user-friendly options that you understand well than advanced options. Simplicity and a strong foundation of knowledge are your best allies in safeguarding your bitcoin.

Simplicity especially when you are not used to technicalities will save you from a lot of stress and heartache that you may cause for yourself from trying something you are not used to. Simple safety steps can also be very effective if practiced correctly. You can choose technicalities if you are good with technical things and simply have an understanding for them, technicalities will be easy for you. I have heard simple cases of people who have tried to make their access password to their simple devices very complex and ended up forgetting it, do not things that you are not used to especially now that money is involved.

tjtonmoy

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If you want to have the best, you will have to learn the best. There is no other way around it. Doing anything that you don't understand is a foolish decision but if you don't do anything, you won't learn anything. So in order to safeguard our privacy, our assets and our security we need to learn it no matter what. I don't think it is too much complicated. Yeah, it is true you won't understand it at a single glance, but that's the thing with everything. You never know until you try it. And the more you try, the better you become.

The thing you adore the most, won't you keep it safe? You can keep your Bitcoin in a software wallet for the time being until you learn the complex thing. And when you learn it, it is not as complex as you think. For instance when we were in first grade things were difficult. As we move to the second grade what we learned in the first grade becomes easier. Everything happens the same way. When you learn it, it becomes easier.

If you have the time to invest and learn then don't be lazy. You could have saved all of your assets if you had only to spare some of your time to learn the complex thing. Don't chicken out on learning. Knowledge is everything.

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I agree that simplicity is important, but perhaps to a certain point. The op mentions Electrum as a simple wallet, and while I agree with that, I believe that there are people who find Electrum more difficult than, say, popular exchanges. And exchanges, of course, use that point, an example of which is the famous phrase by the CEO of Binance that 99% of people who hold cryptos on their on will lose the money. I don't agree with that, I think people are capable of responsible self-custody and don't need exchanges to store their coins (they may need exchanges for trading or to exchange coins occasionally, but that's a different matter).

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Quote from: mvdheuvel1983 on October 20, 2023, 09:36:52 AM

As a Bitcoin enthusiast, I want to say briefly that you shouldn't sacrifice simplicity for technicality.

You missed the most important aspect of this topics, Security. I do agree that I tend to choose wallet which more simple, but I wouldn't sacrifice the Security.

Quote from: mvdheuvel1983 on October 20, 2023, 09:36:52 AM

You are more likely to lose your bitcoins because of too much technicality than to scammers or hackers. An example of keeping things simple is that instead of storing your Bitcoin in a multi signature wallet that you do not understand how it works or have no experience in setting up, store your Bitcoin in a soft like Electrum wallet where the process of setting up is pretty straight forward.

There is a solution if you don't want to learn the complex technicality, and that is Hardware Wallet. It's very straight forward, you invest your money to protect your fund with better security. If you don't want to invest your money at least you should invest your time to learn more about the security so you can minimize the possibility of your fund get stolen.

Don't get me wrong, I also simple Electrum wallet, and sometimes even Exchange wallet, but only on the case that I need the fund to be quickly transferred or exchanged. But for the fund that you hodl, hadrware wallet is the way.

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Stick to the bare minimum, which is to use a good wallet, in an airgapped device or burn an operating system to flash and create the seed, extract the public key and track your coins from that key.
There are not many complications in this plan and a person with limited knowledge should have the ability to perform such numbers.
A multi-signature wallet is necessary for situations such as a war, a dam collapse, or a hurricane. Then you will think of alternative plans or multiple options if the specific disaster occurs, and creating such a wallet requires only two or three hours of your time to learn and 15 minutes to implement.

taufik123

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Sacrificing simplicity for technicality will it look bad?
It even depends on how a Bitcoin enthusiast learns the complex and technical stuff.

Bitcoin enthusiasts should certainly know what steps to take, learning the technicalities to support the ever-evolving technology and innovation.

Don't let simplicity be the reason for not being able to learn technical things.
I also like simplicity because it's not too complicated.
But when you are able to level up and learn the technical ones, you will have more knowledge.

And the example you gave about storing Bitcoin in software like Electrum is not easy at all for beginners who don't know anything.
It requires precision and technical knowledge as well.

Storing Bitcoin on a multi-signature device is just an extension of storing on software like Electrum.

lionheart78

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We are talking about security here, meaning we are looking for complex systems so that hackers will be having a hard time cracking our security. There is nothing weight more than having a complex system that makes hackers doubt their hacking skills but of course, but of course, the option to choose is from the users themselves. I prefer this kind of complex system when implementing security. I bet those who are in the right mind have recorded the step-by-step and all important things in applying this complicated system. Only lazy and overconfident will fail to record important details when setting up a complicated security.

If one has huge funds in the wallet address, I bet he will even hire experts to teach him how to securely store his funds. Grin

It will be another story if we only intend the address to be our hot wallet for spending and transactions. Still security shouldn't be overlook in this scenario.

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If you don't have enough knowledge on that, you should take a pause. We must exercise caution because money is involved. Others believe that multisig is more secure than a single signature wallet since it requires more than one signature to confirm a transaction. As I previously stated, it is only applicable to people who have sufficient knowledge of it. Personally, I prefer a one signature wallet because it is far more efficient. The only thing more important to me as a secure wallet is an open-source, non-custodial wallet like electrum.

Z-tight

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Inventing your own method of security isn't recommended, such as obscuring your seed phrase backup or importing the same wallet into different devices, things like these would only mean you'll either lock yourself out of your funds or lose it another way. But it is great to learn how to use recommended methods of protecting your funds, even if they may be a little bit complicated to you, methods such as setting up an airgapped wallet, extending your seed phrase with a passphrase, running your own node or Electrum server, etc, you must know what you are doing before implementing these solutions, but it is recommended you learn how to implement them for better security and privacy.

Cryptomultiplier

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There is so much wisdom in this post and its simple presentation sure buttresses the point you, OP has made.

I would like to use a good example of the difference between Binance and Bitget. While the Binance features are more easier to understand and navigate for beginners and intermidiate users, Bitget offers a rather complex navigational features with the inclusion of AI bots to assist professional or big long time merchant traders.

Same goes for wallets, it is good to use a simple wallet that wouldn't require much looking after to secure it, because the phrase 'not your keys, not your coins,' means if a user loses or forgets their seed phrase, the coins will remain lost without any claim or access to it.

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There are always choices in how to store one’s Bitcoin and I would even suggest people choosing more than one method. For many users it is a tightrope of how to store your coins though. They want simplicity without someone being able to get their private key from a sticky note on their monitor, but also don’t want to mess something up and lose all their coins.

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One must have a basic knowledge of the functionality of a wallet. I do not think that multi-sig is that complex since there are already lots of tutorials on how it can be done online. Besides there are other available tools that can simplify storing Bitcoin like hardware wallets, storing private keys in a fire, water, and rust-proof box. I don't think this kind of security is too complex for non-technical people.

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