Home node question... | Bitcointalksearch.org

achow101_alt

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Quote from: notlist3d on April 27, 2015, 02:34:48 AM

Quote from: Amph on April 27, 2015, 02:20:47 AM

tor is not really that secure, even tor is a bit monitorided, better to use some that don't keep your log, there are many that are free too, or make your own vp network

Very true about Tor. As long as it relays on exit nodes there will always be a risk. I personally would not trust Tor with anything important. It seems to give people a false sense of security.

It is impossible for the tor exit nodes to log your ip. While there are risks with tor exit nodes, tor forces https so that your data is always secure after leaving the exit node. It is in fact rather secure, probably more so than anything you can think of.

Quote from: notlist3d on April 27, 2015, 02:34:48 AM

I personally think there are much better alternatives.

Could you say what these better alternatives are?

notlist3d

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Quote from: Amph on April 27, 2015, 02:20:47 AM

Quote from: achow101_alt on April 26, 2015, 06:55:06 PM

Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:56:24 PM

As for having your ip publicly known as a bitcoin node ip, the problem might be that somebody might funnel a rogue transaction through it, and you'd be on the receiving end of govt thugs trying to find the culprit. This has already happened before. The chance is most likely miniscule for it to happen, but it's worth knowing about. Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored, and perhaps you get an IRS-letter demanding you to declare your "bitcoin stash". This might depend on where you live as well. As the ip is linked directly to your isp-account it's straightforward to find your identity, provided you do use your real identity. I might be splitting hairs here, but I'm just saying..

It is great you want to support the network!

You can't just "funnel a rogue transaction" through someone's node because of the decentralized system. Any transaction sent to that node will be broadcast to the node's peers and thus to everyone. Hence the decentralization.

Quote from: HasherHub on April 26, 2015, 06:05:15 PM

Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:56:24 PM

Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored,

According to who? And by who?

Not necessarily monitored, but all nodes are listed by the getaddr.bitnodes.io project. One way to prevent monitoring or having your node publicly available is to route all node traffic through tor.

tor is not really that secure, even tor is a bit monitorided, better to use some that don't keep your log, there are many that are free too, or make your own vp network

Very true about Tor. As long as it relays on exit nodes there will always be a risk. I personally would not trust Tor with anything important. It seems to give people a false sense of security.

I personally think there are much better alternatives.

Amph

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Quote from: achow101_alt on April 26, 2015, 06:55:06 PM

Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:56:24 PM

As for having your ip publicly known as a bitcoin node ip, the problem might be that somebody might funnel a rogue transaction through it, and you'd be on the receiving end of govt thugs trying to find the culprit. This has already happened before. The chance is most likely miniscule for it to happen, but it's worth knowing about. Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored, and perhaps you get an IRS-letter demanding you to declare your "bitcoin stash". This might depend on where you live as well. As the ip is linked directly to your isp-account it's straightforward to find your identity, provided you do use your real identity. I might be splitting hairs here, but I'm just saying..

It is great you want to support the network!

You can't just "funnel a rogue transaction" through someone's node because of the decentralized system. Any transaction sent to that node will be broadcast to the node's peers and thus to everyone. Hence the decentralization.

Quote from: HasherHub on April 26, 2015, 06:05:15 PM

Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:56:24 PM

Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored,

According to who? And by who?

Not necessarily monitored, but all nodes are listed by the getaddr.bitnodes.io project. One way to prevent monitoring or having your node publicly available is to route all node traffic through tor.

tor is not really that secure, even tor is a bit monitorided, better to use some that don't keep your log, there are many that are free too, or make your own vp network

achow101_alt

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Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 08:12:55 PM

Thanks for the clarification. But since blockchain.info is connected to lots of nodes, let's say I run node A, that connects only to node B. I restrict node A to a single connection. Whenever I send a transaction, then this transaction goes through B, that further propagates it on the network. If blockchain.info has a connection to node B, then node B will be listed as "relayed by ip" at blockchain, right?

Yes, if it is blockchain receives the transaction from it before anyone else.

Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 08:12:55 PM

I'm not sure if the ip of A is automatically logged at node B when issuing the tx, but at least the ip of A will not be shown on blockchain.info. In the event someone looks at the debug.log of node B, they might however see that the transaction came from node A.

Some person might then misinterpret "relayed by ip" as having a direct association with the tx in question, and thus try to get answers from the entity behind that ip. That was my point.

I don't think that bitcoin core will log which ip it receives a transaction from, but a custom client can be written to do so.

Cryptowatch.com

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Quote from: achow101_alt on April 26, 2015, 07:39:08 PM

The relayed ip is not a part of the bitcoin transaction. That is simply something displayed by blockchain.info for the node that relayed the transaction to them. This does not point to the node that originated the transaction and the ip addresses are not a part of anything in transactions or the blockchain.

Thanks for the clarification. But since blockchain.info is connected to lots of nodes, let's say I run node A, that connects only to node B. I restrict node A to a single connection. Whenever I send a transaction, then this transaction goes through B, that further propagates it on the network. If blockchain.info has a connection to node B, then node B will be listed as "relayed by ip" at blockchain, right?

I'm not sure if the ip of A is automatically logged at node B when issuing the tx, but at least the ip of A will not be shown on blockchain.info. In the event someone looks at the debug.log of node B, they might however see that the transaction came from node A.

Some person might then misinterpret "relayed by ip" as having a direct association with the tx in question, and thus try to get answers from the entity behind that ip. That was my point.

achow101_alt

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Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 07:03:11 PM

Quote from: achow101_alt on April 26, 2015, 06:55:06 PM

You can't just "funnel a rogue transaction" through someone's node because of the decentralized system. Any transaction sent to that node will be broadcast to the node's peers and thus to everyone. Hence the decentralization.

You could chose to connect to only one bitcoin-node with your bitcoin client. Would not the relayed ip of your tx then point to that ip, or would it point to your own ip? I'm unsure how 'relayed ip' is inserted to the tx, what I do know is that at least one person had their home raided because of their "Relayed by IP" showing up on blockchain.info. That was a mistake, but still not fun for the person in question. I'm sure some others could bring a link to that case, or any interested could google it. AFAIK, it's not confirmed, but I have no reason to distrust that report, as it is actually likely to happen.

Let's say some transaction gets the attention of law enforcement, and since the officer handling the case might not be the brightest bulb, he just goes to blockchain.info and sees the "Relayed by IP" and then gets the home address from the ISP and raids the house. It's possible.

The relayed ip is not a part of the bitcoin transaction. That is simply something displayed by blockchain.info for the node that relayed the transaction to them. This does not point to the node that originated the transaction and the ip addresses are not a part of anything in transactions or the blockchain.

Cryptowatch.com

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Quote from: achow101_alt on April 26, 2015, 06:55:06 PM

You can't just "funnel a rogue transaction" through someone's node because of the decentralized system. Any transaction sent to that node will be broadcast to the node's peers and thus to everyone. Hence the decentralization.

You could chose to connect to only one bitcoin-node with your bitcoin client. Would not the relayed ip of your tx then point to that ip, or would it point to your own ip? I'm unsure how 'relayed ip' is inserted to the tx, what I do know is that at least one person had their home raided because of their "Relayed by IP" showing up on blockchain.info. That was a mistake, but still not fun for the person in question. I'm sure some others could bring a link to that case, or any interested could google it. AFAIK, it's not confirmed, but I have no reason to distrust that report, as it is actually likely to happen.

Let's say some transaction gets the attention of law enforcement, and since the officer handling the case might not be the brightest bulb, he just goes to blockchain.info and sees the "Relayed by IP" and then gets the home address from the ISP and raids the house. It's possible.

achow101_alt

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Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:56:24 PM

As for having your ip publicly known as a bitcoin node ip, the problem might be that somebody might funnel a rogue transaction through it, and you'd be on the receiving end of govt thugs trying to find the culprit. This has already happened before. The chance is most likely miniscule for it to happen, but it's worth knowing about. Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored, and perhaps you get an IRS-letter demanding you to declare your "bitcoin stash". This might depend on where you live as well. As the ip is linked directly to your isp-account it's straightforward to find your identity, provided you do use your real identity. I might be splitting hairs here, but I'm just saying..

It is great you want to support the network!

You can't just "funnel a rogue transaction" through someone's node because of the decentralized system. Any transaction sent to that node will be broadcast to the node's peers and thus to everyone. Hence the decentralization.

Quote from: HasherHub on April 26, 2015, 06:05:15 PM

Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:56:24 PM

Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored,

According to who? And by who?

Not necessarily monitored, but all nodes are listed by the getaddr.bitnodes.io project. One way to prevent monitoring or having your node publicly available is to route all node traffic through tor.

HasherHub

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Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:56:24 PM

Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored,

According to who? And by who?

Cryptowatch.com

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Quote from: MoreBloodWine on April 26, 2015, 05:28:36 PM

Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:19:02 PM

Quote from: MoreBloodWine on April 26, 2015, 04:54:58 PM

Oh and as for the VPS, I did do that once and ran out of disk which is why I went to the home node idea where all I have to do is add disk to the laptop.

Yes, you need sufficient disk space. It's not too expensive these days. But of course, it's cheaper to use disk space you already have at home.

Also, your home-ip will be registered many places as a bitcoin-node ip, you might like that, or you might not like that. Some people do not like that, so they use a VPS instead.

Ya I don't mind my IP being known because even if I didn't run a home node. If someone wanted to fuck with me via IP it's easily enough found if your determined.

But ya, I got a static though my ISP for $5 a month.

Still curious about the flag thing in my last reply if anyone knows of anything. Even if it's not a "deny seeding" flag for the 0.10.0 client.

Sorry, don't know about any config flag more than you. Did you check the docs?

As for having your ip publicly known as a bitcoin node ip, the problem might be that somebody might funnel a rogue transaction through it, and you'd be on the receiving end of govt thugs trying to find the culprit. This has already happened before. The chance is most likely miniscule for it to happen, but it's worth knowing about. Also, I'm not sure if this is implemented already, but certainly in the future, all bitcoin node ip's will be monitored, and perhaps you get an IRS-letter demanding you to declare your "bitcoin stash". This might depend on where you live as well. As the ip is linked directly to your isp-account it's straightforward to find your identity, provided you do use your real identity. I might be splitting hairs here, but I'm just saying..

It is great you want to support the network!

MoreBloodWine

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Quote from: Cryptowatch.com on April 26, 2015, 05:19:02 PM

Quote from: MoreBloodWine on April 26, 2015, 04:54:58 PM

Oh and as for the VPS, I did do that once and ran out of disk which is why I went to the home node idea where all I have to do is add disk to the laptop.

Yes, you need sufficient disk space. It's not too expensive these days. But of course, it's cheaper to use disk space you already have at home.

Also, your home-ip will be registered many places as a bitcoin-node ip, you might like that, or you might not like that. Some people do not like that, so they use a VPS instead.

Ya I don't mind my IP being known because even if I didn't run a home node. If someone wanted to fuck with me via IP it's easily enough found if your determined.

But ya, I got a static though my ISP for $5 a month.

Still curious about the flag thing in my last reply if anyone knows of anything. Even if it's not a "deny seeding" flag for the 0.10.0 client.

Cryptowatch.com

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Quote from: MoreBloodWine on April 26, 2015, 04:54:58 PM

Oh and as for the VPS, I did do that once and ran out of disk which is why I went to the home node idea where all I have to do is add disk to the laptop.

Yes, you need sufficient disk space. It's not too expensive these days. But of course, it's cheaper to use disk space you already have at home.

Also, your home-ip will be registered many places as a bitcoin-node ip, you might like that, or you might not like that. Some people do not like that, so they use a VPS instead.

MoreBloodWine

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FWIW, my home node is / has been fully synced for some time so it's just normal ins and outs.

Are there any flags I can use in the config file to say be a dick and not be someones seed for their node and just process normal usage data for trans etc, keeping in mind commands usable on 0.10.0 that may not be available to previous versions.

Oh and as for the VPS, I did do that once and ran out of disk which is why I went to the home node idea where all I have to do is add disk to the laptop.

As for my cap, apparently I'm one of the less than 3% affected by it lol.

Cryptowatch.com

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I'm running a full node and you can see stats here:

http://node.cryptowatch.com/

With a 2x1gbit connection, you're looking at a monthly bandwidth usage in excess of 300GiB with that setup.

Given your cap is at 300Gb/mo you could go for one of these options:

1. Upgrade your bandwidth cap, if possible and desirable.
2. Limit the bandwith used by your bitcoin daemon. This could be limited in many ways (%, pr. day, pr. week, pr. month) ,and I'm sure there are various programs for windows that could let you alter this in a neat GUI.
3. Scrap running on your home connection and get yourself a VPS, it's not very difficult to set up. The cost is not too large, but since the US has enough nodes already, seting ut up outside the US would be a good idea. If you'd need some assistance give me a shout and I'd give you a hand.

fast2fix

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Quote from: MoreBloodWine on April 25, 2015, 09:12:33 PM

Ok, so I got a node at home that's running client 0.10.0.

So here's my question.

If my ISP's internet usage is allotted at 300Gb per month... with all the in's and outs of processing god knows what data. How much data might the home node use on average per day ?

I ask because I seem to be using quite a bit of data and I'm trying to see what's been sucking it up and the only thing I can come to is the node.

Ty.

it's recommended to have unlimited bandwidth if you're going to run a full node/ limit the bandwidth.
visit this thread (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/how-much-bandwidth-is-involved-in-running-a-full-node-1010849) some good answers there.

notlist3d

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Quote from: krile on April 26, 2015, 01:57:22 AM

The inbound traffic is minimal, like already mentioned, a block is about 1MB.

But if a node connects that is downloading the whole blockchain it will eat your upload.

I can give you a rough number, in the first week running my node the DL was under a GB. The upload was around 10GB.

But this can be solved simply by limiting the bandwidth, in your case limiting it to 512 Kbps for example in the upload would prevent maxing out your 300GB - it would take more than a month (about 55 days) to download 300GB at 512Kbps...so problem solved.

Or if you use the Raspberry Pi option you could easily take it to a friends house without the cap. Go there and download the blockchain.

It's hard to tell without speed being known but you could possibly have it done in a few day's. After catching up to current then bring the Raspberry Pi back to your own house and hook it up then to your internet.

krile

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The inbound traffic is minimal, like already mentioned, a block is about 1MB.

But if a node connects that is downloading the whole blockchain it will eat your upload.

I can give you a rough number, in the first week running my node the DL was under a GB. The upload was around 10GB.

But this can be solved simply by limiting the bandwidth, in your case limiting it to 512 Kbps for example in the upload would prevent maxing out your 300GB - it would take more than a month (about 55 days) to download 300GB at 512Kbps...so problem solved.

notlist3d

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Quote from: MoreBloodWine on April 25, 2015, 09:12:33 PM

Ok, so I got a node at home that's running client 0.10.0.

So here's my question.

If my ISP's internet usage is allotted at 300Gb per month... with all the in's and outs of processing god knows what data. How much data might the home node use on average per day ?

I ask because I seem to be using quite a bit of data and I'm trying to see what's been sucking it up and the only thing I can come to is the node.

Ty.

I would do as suggest monitor it. I think with so little GB per month I would not run a full node. Maybe get a VPS or something online if you really want to run a full node to help network, or a Raspberry Pi at someone's house who does not have the limit.

I would never be able to be to go that low with how i switched from satellite to streaming netflix, and a few other services. I just got my internet bumped to 50 Mbps, looks like today's usage was 24 Hour Total = 60.35 GB

achow101_alt

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Your node will vary it's data usage
Some days it might spike up to several gigs because it is syncing another node. Other times, it might only be a few hundred megs for all the blocks and transactions each day. There is software you can get which will monitor your nodes days usage. Just Google it.

MoreBloodWine

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Well, I installed a network meter gadget on the Vista laptop the nodes on and in the short time it's been running it's showing ~~161+ Mb out with 6+ Mb in~~, assuming the up "green" arrow is out and the down "yellow" arrow is in.

Striken: Was misreading it lol, but will still let it run for two days to get a good avg., but ya, I got data goin somewhere.

Gonna do a reset on the gadget and just let it run for 2 days to see what the daily seems to be.

All though in hindsight I don't know if the gadget somehow meters the actual network or just the data of the laptop lol

Topic: Home node question... (Read 1572 times)