How Bitcoin dies? | Bitcointalksearch.org

notme

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Quote from: imanikin on February 10, 2013, 01:04:56 PM

Quote from: Roger_Murdock on February 10, 2013, 12:43:09 PM

...If you attempt to "change the fundamental rules," you won't end up with 51% control of Bitcoin. You'll end up with 100% control of FedPal. In that scenario, I'll stick with Bitcoin.

Agreed, but who will constitute Bitcoin's mining and processing power, if the largest miners keep getting "nationalized"? And how many people besides you will stick with Bitcoin then?

I will keep mining bitcoin, and the network will automatically adjust to however much mining power there is. As for who would stick with bitcoin, everyone would, because in such a situation all coins accounted for before the fork would be spendable twice: once on the continuing bitcoin chain, and once on the new FedCoin chain.

giszmo

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WalletScrutiny.com

Quote from: foggyb on February 10, 2013, 04:44:09 PM

Quote from: giszmo on February 10, 2013, 11:03:43 AM

The fact that US government could crush bitcoin in no time and the fact that they did not do it despite the fact that it clearly made it onto just about every agency's agenda is proof enough for me that Bitcoin already has the blessing of the US government.

(If you doubt that Bitcoin can still be destroyed, please put into relation the $250,000 economy to the $50,000,000,000 printed every month and what a tiny fraction it would take to pay 1000 smart guys to hack every garage shop bitcoin business, buy 20PH/s ASICS, launch child porn portals operating with bitcoin, etc. The window to shut Bitcoin down will not close until the Bitcoin market value is some orders of magnitude higher.)

What about basic human character flaws such as arrogance, complacency, incompetence, compartmentalization, and a little sprinkle of corruption?

Many government agencies were responsible for the failures on 9/11, despite many warnings. Bitcoin must seem much less important than terrorism to the common man.

IE. 'We can crush bitcoin any time we like'. "Maybe next term'.

I like bitcoin drama so I would be in for some decent show down(s) Grin

foggyb

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Quote from: giszmo on February 10, 2013, 11:03:43 AM

The fact that US government could crush bitcoin in no time and the fact that they did not do it despite the fact that it clearly made it onto just about every agency's agenda is proof enough for me that Bitcoin already has the blessing of the US government.

(If you doubt that Bitcoin can still be destroyed, please put into relation the $250,000 economy to the $50,000,000,000 printed every month and what a tiny fraction it would take to pay 1000 smart guys to hack every garage shop bitcoin business, buy 20PH/s ASICS, launch child porn portals operating with bitcoin, etc. The window to shut Bitcoin down will not close until the Bitcoin market value is some orders of magnitude higher.)

What about basic human character flaws such as arrogance, complacency, incompetence, compartmentalization, and a little sprinkle of corruption?

Many government agencies were responsible for the failures on 9/11, despite many warnings. Bitcoin must seem much less important than terrorism to the common man.

IE. 'We can crush bitcoin any time we like'. "Maybe next term'.

giszmo

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WalletScrutiny.com

I like MtGox cause there I always get a solid estimate of the current exchange rate. Grin

Quote from: kiba on February 10, 2013, 01:23:54 PM

Quote from: 21after2 on February 10, 2013, 01:10:29 PM

Quote from: flix on February 10, 2013, 11:34:35 AM

The genius behind Bitcoin is that it is not worth attacking when it is small and vulnerable, and it is extremely resilient once it becomes big enough.

Excellent summary of what I feel is the US government's current stance on Bitcoin. In the US, at least, Bitcoin is not big enough of a "problem" for them to waste time and resources on. My hope is that Bitcoin will have shed most of the misconception surrounding its use by the time that it does become big enough for them to deal with. Maybe it'll see acceptance instead of condemnation. Or, at the least, apathy on their part.

Do they even know it's there?! Maybe the CIA knows it, or a couple of senators know it...but everyone will be like "What's bitcoin?"

Say "my toy porject XYZ will crush governments" and the CIA/FBI/… will notice it. At least their filters will get triggered if you and your friends say it more than once. With bitcoin this has been said over and over again. Of course bitcoin did not go unnoticed. Gavin was at the CIA and the FBI made a paper on Bitcoin.

matthewh3

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Quote from: imanikin on February 10, 2013, 01:28:45 PM

Quote from: matthewh3 on February 10, 2013, 01:01:39 PM

Very cool but Chrome translator is not the best.

This one says:

Quote

Updated original post: added description of new command-line options, and also instruction for starting the wallet with permanent IP address.

Update 08.02.2013
Big update:
implemented incoming i2p-connections,
added the ability to generate i2p-addresses (option - generatei2pdestination),
added the ability to start the wallet with permanent i2p-address (option - mydestination),
many small fixes and improvements.

Links for download:
Executable files for linux x64: http://rusfolder.com/34903950
08.02.2013
MD5: 45e8261e3217ecc7fa0cd5b2f0b1e031 *bitcoin-qt
SHA1: d9c81d199fc9f3956ff9a05a6598a116e39e2902 *bitcoin-qt

MD5: d32082b0bd3e85341284cc221c41cc25 *bitcoind
SHA1: 51e22ad41bbf198fa71243446194ca14c05e2824 *bitcoind

For Windows platform, the executable files will be ready in the near future (~~after the ongoing task of writing the server part is solved~~ already in the works!)

Thanks, its up to the main I2p dev's and organisers if this qualifies for the bounty but I think it should if it works but I don't know a lot about it yet. I don't think its a fork but that's as much as I really know?

CurbsideProphet

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I still believe Mt.Gox is the single largest threat to Bitcoin. They claim to do 80% of all Bitcoin trade and I feel that number is plausible. To have a single, privately-owned entity control that percentage of trade is very disturbing. Granted the transition away from Mt.Gox is happening every day but until their market share is spread out to a much higher degree, Bitcoin remains in a precarious situation. While it's correct that Mt.Gox =/= Bitcoin, you cannot deny or ignore its influence.

flix

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Quote from: Roger_Murdock on February 10, 2013, 12:43:09 PM

Bitcoin is a consensus-based system NOT a democracy. If you acquire 51% hashing power, that gives you a lot of power, but contrary to what some people seem to think, it doesn't give you unlimited power. If you attempt to "change the fundamental rules," you won't end up with 51% control of Bitcoin. You'll end up with 100% control of FedPal. In that scenario, I'll stick with Bitcoin.

Exactly.

The blockchain is a hydra. Cut off one head and see others replace it.

imanikin

hero member

Activity: 702

Merit: 503

Quote from: matthewh3 on February 10, 2013, 01:01:39 PM

Quote from: imanikin on February 10, 2013, 12:36:29 PM

I haven't tried it yet, but if i understand right, our guys already have this going on:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=138588.new;boardseen#new

Very cool but Chrome translator is not the best.

Does it qualify for the bounty?

imanikin

hero member

Activity: 702

Merit: 503

Quote from: matthewh3 on February 10, 2013, 01:01:39 PM

Very cool but Chrome translator is not the best.

This one says:

Quote

Updated original post: added description of new command-line options, and also instruction for starting the wallet with permanent IP address.

Update 08.02.2013
Big update:
implemented incoming i2p-connections,
added the ability to generate i2p-addresses (option - generatei2pdestination),
added the ability to start the wallet with permanent i2p-address (option - mydestination),
many small fixes and improvements.

Links for download:
Executable files for linux x64: http://rusfolder.com/34903950
08.02.2013
MD5: 45e8261e3217ecc7fa0cd5b2f0b1e031 *bitcoin-qt
SHA1: d9c81d199fc9f3956ff9a05a6598a116e39e2902 *bitcoin-qt

MD5: d32082b0bd3e85341284cc221c41cc25 *bitcoind
SHA1: 51e22ad41bbf198fa71243446194ca14c05e2824 *bitcoind

For Windows platform, the executable files will be ready in the near future (~~after the ongoing task of writing the server part is solved~~ already in the works!)

21after2

member

Activity: 112

Merit: 16

Quote from: kiba on February 10, 2013, 01:23:54 PM

Quote from: 21after2 on February 10, 2013, 01:10:29 PM

Quote from: flix on February 10, 2013, 11:34:35 AM

The genius behind Bitcoin is that it is not worth attacking when it is small and vulnerable, and it is extremely resilient once it becomes big enough.

Excellent summary of what I feel is the US government's current stance on Bitcoin. In the US, at least, Bitcoin is not big enough of a "problem" for them to waste time and resources on. My hope is that Bitcoin will have shed most of the misconception surrounding its use by the time that it does become big enough for them to deal with. Maybe it'll see acceptance instead of condemnation. Or, at the least, apathy on their part.

Do they even know it's there?! Maybe the CIA knows it, or a couple of senators know it...but everyone will be like "What's bitcoin?"

Didn't someone here on the forums post an FBI file containing a general Bitcoin analysis? At any rate, your post is kind of what I mean: most people in the government don't have a clue what it is and the few who do probably don't think of it as a threat right now.

kiba

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Merit: 1020

Quote from: 21after2 on February 10, 2013, 01:10:29 PM

Quote from: flix on February 10, 2013, 11:34:35 AM

The genius behind Bitcoin is that it is not worth attacking when it is small and vulnerable, and it is extremely resilient once it becomes big enough.

Excellent summary of what I feel is the US government's current stance on Bitcoin. In the US, at least, Bitcoin is not big enough of a "problem" for them to waste time and resources on. My hope is that Bitcoin will have shed most of the misconception surrounding its use by the time that it does become big enough for them to deal with. Maybe it'll see acceptance instead of condemnation. Or, at the least, apathy on their part.

Do they even know it's there?! Maybe the CIA knows it, or a couple of senators know it...but everyone will be like "What's bitcoin?"

kiba

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Activity: 980

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Bitcoin will die when we become so rich that we don't need money anymore! Instead, bitcoin will be a retired technology.

21after2

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Activity: 112

Merit: 16

Quote from: flix on February 10, 2013, 11:34:35 AM

The genius behind Bitcoin is that it is not worth attacking when it is small and vulnerable, and it is extremely resilient once it becomes big enough.

Excellent summary of what I feel is the US government's current stance on Bitcoin. In the US, at least, Bitcoin is not big enough of a "problem" for them to waste time and resources on. My hope is that Bitcoin will have shed most of the misconception surrounding its use by the time that it does become big enough for them to deal with. Maybe it'll see acceptance instead of condemnation. Or, at the least, apathy on their part.

Anon136

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Merit: 1217

the centralized nature of exchanges is bitcoins greatest weakness at this point. If i am not mistaken however ripple will provide us with a decentralized exchange mechanism. If this is the case and this feature is infact implemented in ripple than it could make the whole argument put forward in this blog moot.

imanikin

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Activity: 702

Merit: 503

Quote from: Roger_Murdock on February 10, 2013, 12:43:09 PM

...If you attempt to "change the fundamental rules," you won't end up with 51% control of Bitcoin. You'll end up with 100% control of FedPal. In that scenario, I'll stick with Bitcoin.

Agreed, but who will constitute Bitcoin's mining and processing power, if the largest miners keep getting "nationalized"? And how many people besides you will stick with Bitcoin then?

matthewh3

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Quote from: imanikin on February 10, 2013, 12:36:29 PM

Quote from: matthewh3 on February 10, 2013, 12:22:33 PM

There is a I2p bitcoin app/fork being developed - http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/18684y/bitcoin_has_a_i2p_darknetdeepnet_port_proxy/ - there is also a large bounty for its development.

I haven't tried it yet, but if i understand right, our guys already have this going on:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=138588.new;boardseen#new

Very cool but Chrome translator is not the best.

Roger_Murdock

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Quote from: imanikin on February 10, 2013, 12:16:26 PM

My prediction remains that if and when the banks and gov's go against B, they will buy out or "nationalize" >51% of the largest pools and miners.

That way they can change the fundamental rules and turn B into a p2p FedPal.

Bitcoin is a consensus-based system NOT a democracy. If you acquire 51% hashing power, that gives you a lot of power, but contrary to what some people seem to think, it doesn't give you unlimited power. If you attempt to "change the fundamental rules," you won't end up with 51% control of Bitcoin. You'll end up with 100% control of FedPal. In that scenario, I'll stick with Bitcoin.

imanikin

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Quote from: matthewh3 on February 10, 2013, 12:22:33 PM

There is a I2p bitcoin app/fork being developed - http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/18684y/bitcoin_has_a_i2p_darknetdeepnet_port_proxy/ - there is also a large bounty for its development.

I haven't tried it yet, but if i understand right, our guys already have this going on:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=138588.new;boardseen#new

notig

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Bitcoin could be killed with the terrorist card. The terrorist card essentially allows a government to do anything it wants. If the government simply said "you are a terrorist or you are aiding and abetting them if you use bitcoin" then not many people would use it. There was just some news article about how the president can kill any american citizen with a drone attack if they think you are a terrorist or something. We are in a neverending war because governments used terrorism. It plays off the psychological fears of people and empowers governments. It's their perfect ally.

matthewh3

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Quote from: Deafboy on February 10, 2013, 11:58:50 AM

As matthewh3 said, we need to go dark. Because no matter what, some people will always take bitcoins (unless the fatal flaw in system is discovered) for exchange of something. IF the services and infrastructure is created and secured before SHTF, we have a huge advantage. If not, USD price of BTC will fall near zero for sure, but will recover after some time on black market.

Quote

you can pay 1000 hackers for one year to make the bitcoin experience as painful as possible

Yeah... and not a single one of them is going to leak anything.

There is a I2p bitcoin app/fork being developed - http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/18684y/bitcoin_has_a_i2p_darknetdeepnet_port_proxy/ - there is also a large bounty for its development.

Topic: How Bitcoin dies? (Read 3343 times)