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Topic: How do freshly mined bitcoins look like? (Read 2061 times)

legendary
Activity: 4228
Merit: 1313
March 22, 2015, 01:30:27 PM
#24
I have a Casacius Bar that I mined directly to from Eligius. It's loaded with fresh new coins. (Eligius doesn't pay from a wallet)

From experience I have to admit it's harder to spend new coin haha!

What makes it harder to spend them? Do you have to wait for more confirmations than the six required for normal transactions? I didn't think there would be any difference between new and old coins when spending them.

Yes, the coinbase transaction takes 100 blocks to mature.  (And the 6 transactions are not "required", btw.  ;-)   )

See:
Quote
Bitcoins that are distributed by the network for finding a block can only be used after 100 confirmations e.g. 100 discovered blocks. The classic bitcoin client won't display the coins earned for solving a block until there are 120 confirmations.[7]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoin_network

Quote
The UTXO of a coinbase transaction has the special condition that it cannot be spent (used as an input) for at least 100 blocks. This temporarily prevents a miner from spending the transaction fees and block reward from a block that may later be determined to be stale (and therefore the coinbase transaction destroyed) after a block chain fork.
https://bitcoin.org/en/developer-guide
sr. member
Activity: 348
Merit: 250
I have a Casacius Bar that I mined directly to from Eligius. It's loaded with fresh new coins. (Eligius doesn't pay from a wallet)

From experience I have to admit it's harder to spend new coin haha!

What makes it harder to spend them? Do you have to wait for more confirmations than the six required for normal transactions? I didn't think there would be any difference between new and old coins when spending them.
sr. member
Activity: 308
Merit: 250
( -_・)ノ-=≡[$(∞)$]
what do you mean with fresh bitcoin? really confused here  Huh

perhaps you mean owing the entire block without splitting it with others?

Im also confused and don't understand. Tongue
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
I have a Casacius Bar that I mined directly to from Eligius. It's loaded with fresh new coins. (Eligius doesn't pay from a wallet)

From experience I have to admit it's harder to spend new coin haha!
hero member
Activity: 854
Merit: 1001
**snipped a bit**
Some people have no concept of ethics at all.  Danny does.  The bitcoin community is very short on people with ethics.

Now give me my $15!

English ethics joke, with a Discworld flavour:

" Ëthics, Igor, ever heard of the concept ? "

" That'th eathy..... it'th jutht thouth of Thuffolk, Marthter "

 Roll Eyes

I'll get me coat.......
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 250
I was the first one to give a complete answer.  You asked for a complete answer.  I delivered

You are mistaken.

You failed to answer the second part of his second question.

Specifically he asked:

Are they just in one address without a trail to it?

And your answer does not explain that an address can at the same time have both freshly mined coins AND old coins that have a long chain of transactions leading to them.

Here's your answer to that question:


2) Fresh bitcoin has no previous ownership

Therefore, I personally would not consider your answer to be the "first one to give a complete answer".

The OP will need to decide if your answer was sufficient for his needs, but he may need to give the bitcoins to someone that answered after you.
My answer is perfect and clear.  What don't you like about it?

OP is a tramp and he owes me money.
legendary
Activity: 3472
Merit: 4801
I was the first one to give a complete answer.  You asked for a complete answer.  I delivered

You are mistaken.

You failed to answer the second part of his second question.

Specifically he asked:

Are they just in one address without a trail to it?

And your answer does not explain that an address can at the same time have both freshly mined coins AND old coins that have a long chain of transactions leading to them.

Here's your answer to that question:


2) Fresh bitcoin has no previous ownership

Therefore, I personally would not consider your answer to be the "first one to give a complete answer".

The OP will need to decide if your answer was sufficient for his needs, but he may need to give the bitcoins to someone that answered after you.
legendary
Activity: 3066
Merit: 1047
Your country may be your worst enemy
That was an interesting question, but it also shows the difference between BTC and fiat.

When it comes to banknotes, I like it better to have new ones, than old notes which have been through hundreds of hands. Now regarding BTC in my wallet, one mined in 2010 is exactly the same than one mined last week.
legendary
Activity: 3248
Merit: 1070
what do you mean with fresh bitcoin? really confused here  Huh

perhaps you mean owing the entire block without splitting it with others?

Bitcoin has an algorithm for creating and distributing new coins. That's the reward miners receive. You can read more about it here: http://www.coindesk.com/information/how-bitcoin-mining-works/

(edit: changed link to a more relevant explanation)

ah ok, i didn't understand at first, i was thinking he was referring to something else, instead he just mean "new generated coins"

those are the one without transactions i guess, good to know
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 250
There are a lot of good answers, I didn't expect so many. I would prefer to donate the $15 to an address proposed here (good cause or something), is this ok?

No Way!!  I was the first one to give a complete answer.  You asked for a complete answer.  I delivered only because I thought you'd be honest and give the money that you promised.  Bitcoin promises - huh!  Now, after the fact, you want to re-allocate the reward?  That is fraud.  Bullshit fraud.  You, like so many other bitcoiners are purely a scammer.  Don't bother starting a business you are not qualified as you are another dishonest scammer.  So typical in the bitcoin community.  Scam, scam, scam.  Why does bitcoin attract such scum?

You should ask the first person that gave you a satisfactory answer if they would prefer to receive the bitcoins, or if they would be willing to donate them.  Based on the commitment you made when you started this thread, the bitcoins belong to them, and it isn't right for you to steal their bitcoins and give them away.
Totally true.  Some people have no concept of ethics at all.  Danny does.  The bitcoin community is very short on people with ethics.

Now give me my $15!
full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
Invest & Earn: https://cloudthink.io
Thank you for all the answers, they are comprehensive and well documented.

Thank you Danny, I understand it now.

Do you guys think people would want to buy them for privacy reasons? I mean they would be the cleanest bitcoins you can get your hands on if I can provide a no-logs-kind of service.
I understand the principle in "A bitcoin is a bitcoin" but that's just for people who do not completely understand the consequences that comes with depositing bitcoins used in SR or any other shady stuff into an exchange which has your ID.

legendary
Activity: 3472
Merit: 4801
Thank you for the answers! I understand now.

Two more, last ones:

Where would one go to find this magical coins? (buy them)

As soon as they are sent to you, they are no longer "freshly mined".  The very act of sending them to you creates a transaction with inputs and a trail.  The only way to transfer "freshly mined" bitcoins without creating a transaction would be to give you the private key.  But then you'd have to trust the person that sold them to you not to steal them after they have your money (since they'll still know what the private key is).

Would there be a high demand for this kind of coins? I am planning to make a service which sells only virgin coins for a fee (3-5%) I believe people would want them for privacy reasons and novelty reasons. What do you think?

I think that anyone dumb enough to buy a private key from someone is going to lose a lot of money when that private key is used to steal their bitcoins.

There are a lot of good answers, I didn't expect so many. I would prefer to donate the $15 to an address proposed here (good cause or something), is this ok?

You really shouldn't make promises that you don't intend to keep.

You should ask the first person that gave you a satisfactory answer if they would prefer to receive the bitcoins, or if they would be willing to donate them.  Based on the commitment you made when you started this thread, the bitcoins belong to them, and it isn't right for you to steal their bitcoins and give them away.
legendary
Activity: 3472
Merit: 4801
1) Can someone explain to me how to check if a bitcoin address contains only fresh mined bitcoins?

It depends on your level of technical knowledge.

You could just look the address up on a block explorer.  For example, if you search for the address 1J6Ar4Kw4iQotPXAq9wVpFzFjpwBnppHjd at blockchain.info you'll discover that it has only ever received 1 transaction, and that transaction looks like this on their website:



If all the transactions that have ever been sent to the address all indicate "No Inputs (Newly Generated Coins)" at blockchain.info, then the address has only ever contained "freshly mined bitcoins".

If you are writing software that is capturing bitcoin transactions directly from the bitcoin network, and attempting to determine if the transaction is creating "freshly mined bitcoins", then you'll need to look at the broadcast blocks.  Transactions that create newly mined bitcoins are not sent on the network unless they included as part of a mined block.  It will always be the first transaction in the block, and it will look like this:

Code:
decoderawtransaction 01000000010000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000ffffffff0804ffff001d02db00ffffffff0100f2052a0100000043410415cf72a1f6afb54376d751647b22b78d53f6ff01bacf47082d255fa69905194d621675dd6421027e4d79153ad0b1283ed0b5e3e728f98efb3bddbfd0b52e4203ac00000000

{
    "txid" : "866eb68a77bd457c3c0dab400b948aa911effce03e4700fa49857f46f6091cef",
    "version" : 1,
    "locktime" : 0,
    "vin" : [
        {
            "coinbase" : "04ffff001d02db00",
            "sequence" : 4294967295
        }
    ],
    "vout" : [
        {
            "value" : 50.00000000,
            "n" : 0,
            "scriptPubKey" : {
                "asm" : "0415cf72a1f6afb54376d751647b22b78d53f6ff01bacf47082d255fa69905194d621675dd6421027e4d79153ad0b1283ed0b5e3e728f98efb3bddbfd0b52e4203 OP_CHECKSIG",
                "hex" : "410415cf72a1f6afb54376d751647b22b78d53f6ff01bacf47082d255fa69905194d621675dd6421027e4d79153ad0b1283ed0b5e3e728f98efb3bddbfd0b52e4203ac",
                "reqSigs" : 1,
                "type" : "pubkey",
                "addresses" : [
                    "1J6Ar4Kw4iQotPXAq9wVpFzFjpwBnppHjd"
                ]
            }
        }
    ]
}

Notice the lack of "txid", "vout", and "scriptSig" in the "vin".

There are only 2 ways to check what a bitcoin address "contains".  One is to scan the blockchain and process all transactions that have ever been sent to that address keeping track of which outputs have been spent, and the other is to use a service (either one you've created, or one provided by a third party) that has already done that and request the information from the service.

2) Fresh bitcoins don't have any previous ownership?

Correct.

Are they just in one address without a trail to it?

They are just 1 transaction without a trail to it.  It could be one address. It could be multiple addresses.  There could be a trail to the address from other transactions.  If you are asking technical questions, then it is very important to understand that at the protocol level, BITCOIN DOES NOT WORK THE WAY YOU ASSUME IT WORKS.  The protocol doesn't know anything about "addresses". It doesn't know anything about "balances".  There are only "inputs" and "outputs".  Inputs are always specifically identified previously unspent "outputs".  Outputs are always a value that has been encumbered with a requirement that must be met to be allowed to use that output as an input.

3) Do pools give out only bitcoins from the bitcoin reward or you can expect to get bitcoins which have been mined some time before?

It depends on the pool.  A pool can get the bitcoins that they give as a reward from anywhere they like, as long as the pool participants agree or don't care.

4) Can someone provide an example address which contains fresh bitcoins?

1J6Ar4Kw4iQotPXAq9wVpFzFjpwBnppHjd
hero member
Activity: 658
Merit: 500
Where would one go to find this magical coins? (buy them)

The easiest (but not cheapest) way would be to actually mine them. The other option is to find a miner willing to sell them before they have any transactions.

Would there be a high demand for this kind of coins? I am planning to make a service which sells only virgin coins for a fee (3-5%) I believe people would want them for privacy reasons and novelty reasons. What do you think?

I don't think so. Bitcoin is meant to be fungible, so 25 recently mined coins should have the same exact value as 25 coins mined in 2009. Maybe there are eccentric people willing to pay more for them, but in my opinion it's kind of stupid.
legendary
Activity: 2940
Merit: 1865
...

Joshuar

Pictures, or it didn't happen!   Smiley

*   *   *

OP raises a point I have seen (somewhere).  How does one go about "getting" any of those "Newly Generated Coins"?  I would bet that one of the mining pools could sell them at some kind of a premium.

There is a thread here (somewhere) where one guy does not want "tainted" coins, those used somewhere along the way perhaps in drug transactions or other illegal stuff.  Most of the comments I read said "a Bitcoin is a Bitcoin" (like cash is, many $20s have been used for something illegal).  

But, maybe one of the pools could find a way to "sell freshly minted BTC" at a nice premium, I am sure that there would be some who would pay more.

Who knows, maybe there would be some numismatic value to Bitcoins ("Brilliant Uncirculated!") from Block No. 500000 when we get there...  

Smiley
full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
Invest & Earn: https://cloudthink.io
March 21, 2015, 11:45:41 AM
#9
Thank you for the answers! I understand now.

Two more, last ones:

Where would one go to find this magical coins? (buy them)

Would there be a high demand for this kind of coins? I am planning to make a service which sells only virgin coins for a fee (3-5%) I believe people would want them for privacy reasons and novelty reasons. What do you think?

There are a lot of good answers, I didn't expect so many. I would prefer to donate the $15 to an address proposed here (good cause or something), is this ok?
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
eidoo wallet
March 21, 2015, 11:31:21 AM
#8
Can't tell you what they look like. But, I can tell you they have that brand new car smell.
legendary
Activity: 4466
Merit: 3391
March 21, 2015, 11:16:28 AM
#7
1) Check the transactions sending the bitcoins to the address. They will tell you.
2) Freshly mined bitcoins have no inputs. They are created by a "coinbase" transaction.
3) Pool miners are generally paid by the pool from the coins mined by the pool, but the details depend on the pool.
4) https://blockchain.info/address/1Ebb8NfVmKMoGuMJCAEbVMv2dX8GnzgxSa
hero member
Activity: 658
Merit: 500
March 21, 2015, 11:13:53 AM
#6
what do you mean with fresh bitcoin? really confused here  Huh

perhaps you mean owing the entire block without splitting it with others?

Bitcoin has an algorithm for creating and distributing new coins. That's the reward miners receive. You can read more about it here: http://www.coindesk.com/information/how-bitcoin-mining-works/

(edit: changed link to a more relevant explanation)
legendary
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
March 21, 2015, 11:12:56 AM
#5
This is rather a odd question. Why does this interest you?

1) You go to the blockchain, search an address and when you see this:


2) Depends on what you consider fresh. If you consider coins that haven't been moved since they've been mined then yes. It has no trail behind it. If you use the blockchain you will see the image above on each transaction.

3) This really depends on the pool. They can do whatever suits them more.

4) https://blockchain.info/address/152f1muMCNa7goXYhYAQC61hxEgGacmncB
This is the address from BTCChina Pool.


Update: Looks like some people partially beat me to it. I don't care about the tip though. OP if you have more questions please address them while I have free time.
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