Topic: How to Turn Bitcoin Into the Top Payment Network and the Currency of the Future - page 2. (Read 9354 times)

It's been argued to death. The infrastructure behind it being accepted at all is not limited by the card itself-- that technology is already being used today by every credit card outside of the USA-- the requirements are from the POS developers and service providers. It's not a technology issue, it's a standards issue. Good luck with it as all I can say.

An evil POS or hacked version could display the wrong amount, and charge you for way more? I dunno, I guess that is something that could happen already - but when dealing with something that is irreversible, I tend to be more cautious.

So, um, what was the problem with the idea of having one simple keyfob-sized device with one button, whose only function is to sign transactions pushed to it when it's swiped, without giving out the private key?

Until we have major buy-in and therefore stability, there is no way any sane merchant will try to price his service in only BTC. This enables merchants to get a predictable amount of USD for their services each month, with no work really needing to be done. The decentralized online automatic reoccurring bill-pay!

I just can't picture carrying a stack of what are essentially gift cards with varying amounts in my wallet.  I hate going into Jamba Juice and handing them a card with 5 cents on it and then digging around to find another card with 12 cents on it.

A cheap camera phone could sign a transaction and then give it to the merchant to relay.  No need for the customer to have internet access or an expensive smart phone.  We have a system that doesn't require trusting merchants.  Lets keep it that way.

I also think having one device (yes, even one with batteries) is better than a bunch of plastic or paper.  I see physical coins as a system for trading when there isn't electricity/internet around and as something to help people who are used to paper cash and coins transition away towards a digital currency.

Wow, parallel thinking.. me like!
Only, why bother with USD conversion? If we can make the system work just for Bitcoins, fair enough!

What you describe is what I envision for home use, for the majority of people bitcoin banks in cooperation with credit card companies are probably the solution.

Somebody has just gotta do it.

Let me bring this to another level:
Women LOVE credit cards. Women DONT LOVE disposable self-printed paper wallet bills with QR codes.

Au contraré, only in grade school would you define people as 'good' or 'bad' and not weigh individual risks and annoyances by people based on their views, attitudes, etc.

I've already seen you admit to not being 100% accurate twice in the past few days. It's a breathtaking change of pace for sure, but you still live in a glass house and have got quite a ways to go.

This is something that I have been turning over in my head for many months, in relation to such things as paying for a monthly service (VPS for example). My idea was to use a protocol such as iCalendar or some such, and integrate it into a client to automatically pay out of a wallet the necessary amount each month (after approval by the wallet owner). That way, the price could be specified in USD by the merchant, and the client would automatically fetch the current BTC <> USD value each month and tell the wallet owner how much to pay out to the service.

Or better build pull systems on TOP of Bitcoin.

Cash = push only
Credit cards, Debit Cards, ACH, etc = pull payment systems built on top of cash.

Bitcoin = push only
something, something else, also something else = pull payment systems built on top of Bitcoin

Allow me to protest! In principle, fiat banknotes and coins are push-only, too. Unless we're talking about having your dollars pulled from your back pocket.

Turning Bitcon into a pull-system would be as simple as updating the client to allow incoming pull requests and upon verification using key-pairs or something have the BTC auto-sent.

If your coins were stored in a bitcoin bank, what's to keep you from using a credit card in a store which allows the merchant to make a quick check on liquidity on your account and then send a pull request to your bank? The bank then sends the coins to the vendor.

And Boss gets to spend his bitcoins using a credit card, hooray!


edit: typo

Come on, Matthew, you know I am not a bad guy. This isn't grade school.

You tend to agree with Atlas? Probably want to keep that one to yourself.

I tend to agree with the OP's line of thinking.  I believe this guy knows what he is talking about.  I don't think those who disagree with him are "wrong", but he clearly gets a concept that many of us do not seem to grasp.

Yes, many people (myself included) will prefer smartphones as a way to transfer bitcoins.  But it will be a huge leap of progress when trading Bitcoins through tangible objects becomes more commonplace.

I don't envision plastic cards - I envision disposable self-printed paper wallet bills with QR codes - where the standard methodology is you allow the QR code to be scanned by a merchant, and it swipes the money off the private key, leaving behind change (on the honor system - consistent with OP's vision).  The control against theft is you just don't put that much money on a single code - or secondarily, the change can be sent to another address not controlled by the merchant (e.g. another paper wallet in the holder's physical wallet). Most merchants are going to be honest, that's just the way things are.

I don't envision vending machines with any sort of touchscreens or any crap needed to accept bitcoins other than a QR code scanner.  With a QR scanner, you show your code, buy what you want, it takes bitcoins off your address and sends back the change to the same address it took them from.  That's the level of convenience the OP insists (and which I agree) Bitcoin needs to be taken seriously as an everyday currency.

PG to the rescue (take a nap, Matt):

Wait, I just realized the best way to handle money....minted paper and coins! We should make some kind of... I don't even have the energy to finish this joke.

Reading through this thread just proves that different people/situations prefer/require different payment methods.   

I don't see why the existing credit card architectures couldn't also be used with bitcoin.  I swipe my card, Discover tells the store I am legit and transaction is recorded on Discover's private servers.  I take the shot of whisky put the card back in my velcro pocket and dive back into the surf.  One month later if I didn't complain, Discover posts a TX to the merchant (minus fee) and sends me a bill (plus fee).

             

Totally. Worst of all, you still need an external power supply so these cards need to be swiped/plugged in somewhere to actually do anything. We're a few innovations away from getting something that thin working cheaply, but when it does work, it'd be the ideal transport for Bitcoin.

Virtex doesn't have much volume/liquidity [ yet? ] for it to be as useful as one would like in an
exchange. There is also not an easy way of moving CAD and/or USD to and from other exchanges
to take advantage of good arbitrage opportunities. Even when paxum was in the bitcoin business
and even though it was based in Canada it didn't offer much to Canadians. 

I feel like I have to move to America or someone else just to participate, as fully as I would like,
in the Bitcoin game. 

I am more of an investor than a trader and I have been able to take part in some good action there
now and then, so I won't complain too much... but it would be so nice if Grady2000 and Virtex would
make some agreements to start working with bitinstant or the like.   

There are some smartcards capable of ECC and SHA-256.  Performance likely is bad but you are only doing a few computations per transactions.  Smartcards tend to have very limited flashrom though so space would be "tight".  The fact that Bitcoin uses a "weird" ECC curve doesn't help either.