There is an old saying about success of retail stores - The secret is location, location, location!
If I may paraphrase for altcoins - It would be community, community, community!
Topic: How we crypto-geeks get it wrong & the reality of altcoin success. - page 3. (Read 6521 times)
July 26, 2014, 10:51:52 AM
July 25, 2014, 11:25:28 PM
This thread was like a breath of fresh air frankly. +1
July 25, 2014, 03:15:03 PM
I've seen the altcoin scene quickly devolve since the release of Dogecoin at the end of 2013. The release of new gimmicky coins started to really pick up around that point and then went into full force in early 2014. And it is almost now 100% about creating the next pump-and-dump that will make you a profit. Kind of sad really as people trying to launch a legitimate coin, like it seems you might be trying to do, just get drowned out by all the scamcoins.
Well said. But I think it's a matter of one's investment goals. If you want to profit from short-term trades (riding the pump & dump), or if you want to invest long-term. But those goals must be clear.
The hottest new algo may give you a chance to profit from short-term volatility, but don't kid yourself, that hyped new coin, will die in a few weeks when another technological advance replaces it. If you want to invest long-term, it's the user community, the ones who actually spend the coins that will make the difference.
July 25, 2014, 07:40:08 AM
XST Stealthcoin is a new face in the anonymity scene
Its a piece a shit and ripoff from cloakcoin.
lol your nick
July 25, 2014, 07:18:41 AM
I think you are looking at this the wrong way because most altcoins aren't actually striving for mass user adoption and to build a lasting currency, they are largely just created as pump-and-dump schemes to make people money (either the devs or some traders). And the large majority of people who trade altcoins do it for profit and don't ever actually use the coin (not that you could if you wanted to for many coins anyway). I know when I was trading/mining alts I probably had over 20 different wallets over that period of time and never made any transactions other than sending coins to and from exchanges or mining pools. So alt traders make their money from people who get tricked into believing a certain altcoin was made for any other reason than to make these people money.
I've seen the altcoin scene quickly devolve since the release of Dogecoin at the end of 2013. The release of new gimmicky coins started to really pick up around that point and then went into full force in early 2014. And it is almost now 100% about creating the next pump-and-dump that will make you a profit. Kind of sad really as people trying to launch a legitimate coin, like it seems you might be trying to do, just get drowned out by all the scamcoins.
I've seen the altcoin scene quickly devolve since the release of Dogecoin at the end of 2013. The release of new gimmicky coins started to really pick up around that point and then went into full force in early 2014. And it is almost now 100% about creating the next pump-and-dump that will make you a profit. Kind of sad really as people trying to launch a legitimate coin, like it seems you might be trying to do, just get drowned out by all the scamcoins.
July 25, 2014, 07:12:48 AM
A DISCLAIMER BEFORE YOU KEEP READING - I would like to explain what it is like out in the real world, building a longterm user community, and as a coin Dev can really only speak from my experience. I won't give details about the coin (you can get those from my sig if interested) but can't really tell the story without some reference to it.
Thanks for your report. Yes, I'm sure you're facing a challenge: the same kind of challenge I'll be facing with respect to NFD when I start pounding the virtual pavement. That "Ponzi scheme" buzz is pretty much what I expected after losing 0.5 BTC on JuggaloCoin. That coin had - for this part of the world - a huge amount of mainstream press going for it when it launched. I remember being skeptical about its prospects, as I was worried that the Juggalo community would scoff and reject it. But sure enough, the dev of the coin really was a Juggalo in his heart - he had a good heart - and I was charmed by the backstory of the band. Growing up poor ain't easy, but the ICP guys got through it.
So I bought 0.5 BTC's worth, saw the coin's lackluster debut, and then waited for the inevitable. I don't think it's even listed anymore. Another 0.5 BTC down the drain, which could have saved in this case by remaining skeptical. In fact, a post in a Juggalo forum about JuggaloCoin had a lot of scoffing - including some skeptical words from one of the mods - which was similar to the skepticism you faced.
It sounds like your strategy is an elaboration of "roll with the punch," which is pretty wise.
July 25, 2014, 07:04:18 AM
I dont think you crypto geeks get it wrong, your op is perfectly right 
It seems only coin that meets your criteria is wankcoin, you can actually use it for something while infront of your pc coding
It seems only coin that meets your criteria is wankcoin, you can actually use it for something while infront of your pc coding
July 25, 2014, 07:01:28 AM
July 25, 2014, 06:49:30 AM
We believe that another key is for it to be completely open-source and to have the community innovative and execute. Too many alts rely 100% on the creator to do all the work, but the coins that truly succeed including Bitcoin have communities who contribute. 1 person can only develop and code so many features over a month, but 10 people working on 10 projects might be release 6 things in a month and keep a coin relevant. this is something we are focusing on with GreenBacks once we launch.
Then keep your eye on Nxt. An active dev community is precisely what they have going for them.
July 25, 2014, 04:56:55 AM
"Although the battle for the anon coins is worth some investment, IMHO"
Fine words OP and couldn't agree more, especially with the above line. I hope the rest of guys involved with anon coins become as level-headed as you in helping the coins and the technologies behind them achieve awesome things!
Fine words OP and couldn't agree more, especially with the above line. I hope the rest of guys involved with anon coins become as level-headed as you in helping the coins and the technologies behind them achieve awesome things!
July 24, 2014, 08:26:29 PM
I have to post this, it is just too funny, and illustrates my point about the foolishness of crypto geeks. 
I just read this in the Poloniex Exchange Chat Box (I have removed the real userids):
xxxxx1: redd is about to go PoSV in what, 8 or 9 days?
xxxxx2: august 3rd, so 10 days I think
xxxxx1: yeah 10 days. I suggest investing as much as you can into redd and holding out to sell as high as you can
Yep, like the user community really cares about PosV?!?!?
I just read this in the Poloniex Exchange Chat Box (I have removed the real userids):
xxxxx1: redd is about to go PoSV in what, 8 or 9 days?
xxxxx2: august 3rd, so 10 days I think
xxxxx1: yeah 10 days. I suggest investing as much as you can into redd and holding out to sell as high as you can
Yep, like the user community really cares about PosV?!?!?
July 24, 2014, 07:54:22 PM
An update from the field...
We have had so many support requests from users who just can't get their head around concepts (that we crypto geeks take for granted) like wallets, mining, blocks, pools, faucets; that we had to add a section in our forum, walking them through each step, just one at a time.
You can see that here, if interested: Getting Started
As I posted at the beginning of this thread, these users have no interest at all in the latest algorithms, etc. that we crypto geeks are so proud of.
We have had so many support requests from users who just can't get their head around concepts (that we crypto geeks take for granted) like wallets, mining, blocks, pools, faucets; that we had to add a section in our forum, walking them through each step, just one at a time.
You can see that here, if interested: Getting Started
As I posted at the beginning of this thread, these users have no interest at all in the latest algorithms, etc. that we crypto geeks are so proud of.
+100
Mass adoption = simple, intuitive, secure, useable WALLET
If you build it .. They will come ..
Triff ..
July 24, 2014, 07:49:04 PM
We believe that another key is for it to be completely open-source and to have the community innovative and execute. Too many alts rely 100% on the creator to do all the work, but the coins that truly succeed including Bitcoin have communities who contribute. 1 person can only develop and code so many features over a month, but 10 people working on 10 projects might be release 6 things in a month and keep a coin relevant. this is something we are focusing on with GreenBacks once we launch.
July 24, 2014, 07:42:44 PM
bitcoin desperately needs at least one alternative.
Business needs to keep incoming separate from outgoing because bitcoin can be traced through the blockchain.
Using mixers might be illegal in the US, even if your intent is not to launder money, it seems using services where the purpose is to obfuscate the source might violate money laundering laws.
A stable altcoin allows you to sell incoming btc for that altcoin on one exchange and buy bitcoin with that altcoin on another exchange for your outgoing, thus keeping incoming and outgoing compartmentalized.
There probably need to be several successful altcoins.
Also, having just one crypto-currency is a single point of failure should a serious problem occur in bitcoin that prevents buying/selling with it.
Business needs to keep incoming separate from outgoing because bitcoin can be traced through the blockchain.
Using mixers might be illegal in the US, even if your intent is not to launder money, it seems using services where the purpose is to obfuscate the source might violate money laundering laws.
A stable altcoin allows you to sell incoming btc for that altcoin on one exchange and buy bitcoin with that altcoin on another exchange for your outgoing, thus keeping incoming and outgoing compartmentalized.
There probably need to be several successful altcoins.
Also, having just one crypto-currency is a single point of failure should a serious problem occur in bitcoin that prevents buying/selling with it.
There are so many alt coins.. it's not just one alternative anymore. There's just so many out there - that the average user doesn't know which one to pick, except for BTC
But I think some alt coins serve special interests groups, as a value for exchange.
July 24, 2014, 07:38:52 PM
bitcoin desperately needs at least one alternative.
Business needs to keep incoming separate from outgoing because bitcoin can be traced through the blockchain.
Using mixers might be illegal in the US, even if your intent is not to launder money, it seems using services where the purpose is to obfuscate the source might violate money laundering laws.
A stable altcoin allows you to sell incoming btc for that altcoin on one exchange and buy bitcoin with that altcoin on another exchange for your outgoing, thus keeping incoming and outgoing compartmentalized.
There probably need to be several successful altcoins.
Also, having just one crypto-currency is a single point of failure should a serious problem occur in bitcoin that prevents buying/selling with it.
Business needs to keep incoming separate from outgoing because bitcoin can be traced through the blockchain.
Using mixers might be illegal in the US, even if your intent is not to launder money, it seems using services where the purpose is to obfuscate the source might violate money laundering laws.
A stable altcoin allows you to sell incoming btc for that altcoin on one exchange and buy bitcoin with that altcoin on another exchange for your outgoing, thus keeping incoming and outgoing compartmentalized.
There probably need to be several successful altcoins.
Also, having just one crypto-currency is a single point of failure should a serious problem occur in bitcoin that prevents buying/selling with it.
July 24, 2014, 07:30:11 PM
An update from the field...
We have had so many support requests from users who just can't get their head around concepts (that we crypto geeks take for granted) like wallets, mining, blocks, pools, faucets; that we had to add a section in our forum, walking them through each step, just one at a time.
You can see that here, if interested: Getting Started
As I posted at the beginning of this thread, these users have no interest at all in the latest algorithms, etc. that we crypto geeks are so proud of.
We have had so many support requests from users who just can't get their head around concepts (that we crypto geeks take for granted) like wallets, mining, blocks, pools, faucets; that we had to add a section in our forum, walking them through each step, just one at a time.
You can see that here, if interested: Getting Started
As I posted at the beginning of this thread, these users have no interest at all in the latest algorithms, etc. that we crypto geeks are so proud of.
July 15, 2014, 10:17:21 AM
99.9% of users of altcoins only care about one thing; Bitcoin.
That's why most alts fail. It doesn't matter how innovative the coin is, if it gains in value, there's enough people to drive it to the ground. It happens time and time again.
If you wanted a coin to have any long term value, you'd keep it off exchanges, and focus entirely on building infrastructure to use the coin directly for purchasing goods and services.
That's why most alts fail. It doesn't matter how innovative the coin is, if it gains in value, there's enough people to drive it to the ground. It happens time and time again.
If you wanted a coin to have any long term value, you'd keep it off exchanges, and focus entirely on building infrastructure to use the coin directly for purchasing goods and services.
VERY well said, some great points there.
The #1 objective for most users, whether they're miners, devs, speculators, etc is to increase their wealth in Bitcoins. Altcoins are a means of achieving this and that's pretty much all it seems to boil down to as far as altcoins are concerned.
The mistake we make here, is that we view this forum as the world. It is not. As we have found in pounding the streets, building our user base, 80% of those we talk to, do not even know what bitcoin is.
I don't believe we need to go so far as removing an altcoin from the exchanges, as market liquidity is important. Just recognize that the value set by the members of this forum is miniscule compared to the potential longterm value of a successful altcoin.
July 12, 2014, 11:42:03 PM
Reading the OP now, and like, especially the niche aspect. Can't wait to read the rest, hoping I'm not disappointed. Thanks.
July 12, 2014, 08:46:21 PM
Innovations come out of altcoins all the time, most of them are useless but few are good and will help. Almost all coins will die but the innovations will remain.
I don't know if the next big crypto will be decided by users and will not be created like altcoins are now.
I don't know if the next big crypto will be decided by users and will not be created like altcoins are now.
I feel the greatest success will come from the coin that your average consumer embraces. Build a coin that is tailored for the consumer and you will have great success. Build an innovative client with built-in support for other coins and you will conquer.
https://www.gldtalk.org/index.php?topic=2616.0
July 12, 2014, 06:56:05 PM
I do have an Idea for a coin.. Cigarette coin [CIG] but it would need an Android wallet from the rip... so you could use it on the street.
I'm a smoker, many of my friends are smokers... They all have one thing in common, they mooch my Cigarette's and steal my lighters. LOL
I personally could use a android Cigarette mooch tracker app. CIGcoin could do that. And It doesn't hurt that Cigarette's are a 500bn dollar a year worldwide industry. The value could be one Cigarette. Trade a CIG for a Cigarette or vice versa. fuck the exchanges! most coins have little to zero street use, only exchange value. But I'm not a DEV so it will stay an idea unless I can find a DEV to create it or steal it from me... Lol
I think it has some of the quality's u mention in the OP. And it has a real world use, as long as the bureau of ATF don't freak out about it.
I'm a smoker, many of my friends are smokers... They all have one thing in common, they mooch my Cigarette's and steal my lighters. LOL
I personally could use a android Cigarette mooch tracker app. CIGcoin could do that. And It doesn't hurt that Cigarette's are a 500bn dollar a year worldwide industry. The value could be one Cigarette. Trade a CIG for a Cigarette or vice versa. fuck the exchanges! most coins have little to zero street use, only exchange value. But I'm not a DEV so it will stay an idea unless I can find a DEV to create it or steal it from me... Lol
I think it has some of the quality's u mention in the OP. And it has a real world use, as long as the bureau of ATF don't freak out about it.
You should look into making an app based on Ripple for this. Ripple is all about issuing IOUs, so someone could use the app to send you 1 CIG to your Ripple wallet when they mooch one, and that means you have one IOU for a cigarrette which you can either redeem from them, or even trade it and pass it onto other people so they could end up paying back the mooched cigarrette to someone else.
It would need fast transaction and conformation. I'm Not a real ripple guru, but the IOU feature fit's the idea.
Ripple has near instant transaction times. If you go down that route you could also allow people to send IOUs to friends for other things, like a beer or a meal, and post offers to trade like: I will trade 10 cigs (10 cig IOUS, issued by someone else or themselves) for 1 beer. You could have it so that the app presents relevant offers from their friends, so if they had 10 cigarrette IOUs in their app wallet it would tell them that their mate John was willing to trade them for a beer.
You can only receive IOUs from people you have formally trusted for that asset so you could only trade someone elses cig IOU with someone else who knows and trusts that same friend. This would protect people from being owed things by or owing things to someone they don't know.
I know a bit about Ripple and have been active in the community for a while, and thought about doing something like this myself in the past, but I tried and pretty much failed to learn how to write code and I can't afford to pay for a developer. If you do go ahead with this and decide to use Ripple I would love to be a part of it in some way and help you with concept development and community relations / marketing in the Ripple community.
EDIT: Just noticed that you said yourself your not a dev. Any App developers out there want to work with us on this?
That would be cool. I was thinking about hitting BCT Member: VUAL up on this https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/all-bountys-done-here-625225 he does android wallets and a bunch of other stuff, not sure how ripple savvy he is tho.. Going clubbing tonight so I will hit him up 2mro. Any other dev's feel free to PM me or profitofthegods. It would be cool to get somthing going for [CIG] Cigarette coin
Thanks to the OP for the motivation!
Cool. Ripple has a bunch of Javacript APIs and I'm lead to believe its not too difficult to deal with. Let me know what he says.
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