I could be wrong but what if? | Bitcointalksearch.org

yahoo62278

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Quote from: Adbitco on June 29, 2022, 02:43:52 AM

Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 28, 2022, 03:53:48 PM

This is so bad then, is there no need to track those who are deliberately cheating in bounty campaign?
From most of the compliant I have seen I noticed they are ever ready to cheat irrespective of how much accounts that has been ban or Redtrusted even reported yet we can still found much of them still cheating.

Quote from: DVlog on June 12, 2022, 09:08:49 AM

Concerning a user enrolling 10 accounts or more don't you think is a bot programed accounts because i can't just wonder how a user will line up his alt account the same time in a sheet without any mixed up.

As mentioned by BitcoinGirl, most companies don't care if users are enrolling alts. They're paying in a token with little to no value at first. The manager is the person who is more concerned about the alts. We cannot just go accusing users without proof though, so we are looking for duplicate addresses or browsing through the alts thread. Bounty hunters are helpful too as they turn others in because they know less participants = more reward.

Adbitco

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Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 28, 2022, 03:53:48 PM

This is so bad then, is there no need to track those who are deliberately cheating in bounty campaign?
From most of the compliant I have seen I noticed they are ever ready to cheat irrespective of how much accounts that has been ban or Redtrusted even reported yet we can still found much of them still cheating.

Quote from: DVlog on June 12, 2022, 09:08:49 AM

Concerning a user enrolling 10 accounts or more don't you think is a bot programed accounts because i can't just wonder how a user will line up his alt account the same time in a sheet without any mixed up.

examplens

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Quote from: BitcoinGirl.Club on June 28, 2022, 04:16:37 PM

Bounty team are looking for free marketing. They do not care who is alt and who is real. As long as the keyword typed and spreading around the internet, they are happy.

Exactly. If one person can promote in a good way, the manager may not complain that it is one person behind multiple accounts.

I believe KYC in bounty is likely to turn down real users because they don’t want to just share personal information, while hunters with bot accounts will already find a way to pass KYC. it seems that it will only lower the quality of the campaign participants.

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Quote from: Adbitco on June 28, 2022, 04:51:55 AM

Do you think as a bounty manager or campaign manager, KYC will be better?

Pay them real money or at least by existing established coin, there will be many who will join campaign without hesitating for KYC. But when you are paying them with worthless tokens, asking for KYC is too much. I will not be surprised if you get less than 1% of the hunters that usually a campaign receives.

Bounty team are looking for free marketing. They do not care who is alt and who is real. As long as the keyword typed and spreading around the internet, they are happy.

yahoo62278

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Quote from: Adbitco on June 28, 2022, 04:51:55 AM

Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 13, 2022, 08:15:27 AM

A solution has to go further then rank.

Do you think as a bounty manager or campaign manager, KYC will be better?
If yes then managers has to implement a KYC system to limit those farming accounts in a single campaign. I don't if a user can actually provide about 9 to 15 separates KYC details to receive payment. The process can be done manually and the kyc details has to be recorded in a separate sheet, this will take 10 to 30 second video video to prove real ownership otherwise no way to prevent scammers or cheaters.
Most at times if KYC is implemented you will notice they always apply with their real account before anything else.

You could implement KYC into a bounty but then your participants shrink to nearly 0 IMO. I don't think many bounty hunters would be interested in sharing their info. Definitely would help in solving the problem though.

Adbitco

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Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 13, 2022, 08:15:27 AM

A solution has to go further then rank.

Do you think as a bounty manager or campaign manager, KYC will be better?
If yes then managers has to implement a KYC system to limit those farming accounts in a single campaign. I don't if a user can actually provide about 9 to 15 separates KYC details to receive payment. The process can be done manually and the kyc details has to be recorded in a separate sheet, this will take 10 to 30 second video video to prove real ownership otherwise no way to prevent scammers or cheaters.
Most at times if KYC is implemented you will notice they always apply with their real account before anything else.

BitcoinGirl.Club

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Quote from: DVlog on June 15, 2022, 12:03:10 AM

Actually, the problem is bounty managers are looking for mass workers, not quality workers. If only quality work is accepted I can bet 80% of participants will leave this work after a few campaigns. Also recently some low-rank bounty manager appears who doesn't care about their reputation and ready to promote scam project if they got money for them. I also think we should leave that matters for now.

The usual bounty campaigns are just numbers in social media. Shill in Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, Medium, and may other platforms. There are no genuine conversation but all misinformation. The bounty hunters even do not understand the project. Project team, campaign manage know it but they do not mind, they are not paying anything for it at all.

It's the market that turned wrong. It was a lot better in late 2017 at ICO peak time. Because these tokens had at least some value back then. A user who is a little informed they know it's waste of time now. Only the new people who heard that they can make money from bounty, they try. After few participation probably they realize the reality or why do we see many newbie fresh accounts in bounty campaigns.

The bright side is, from these newbies sometimes we get some people who find the forum interesting and continue. We have so many such examples.

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Quote from: KingsDen on June 16, 2022, 01:43:56 PM

Quote from: Coyster on June 12, 2022, 12:10:25 PM

Quote from: _BlackStar on June 12, 2022, 11:38:48 AM

That's very suspicious and I think it looks like all those accounts are being controlled by one person or group of people to cheat the campaign.

~Snip~

Quote from: Coyster on June 12, 2022, 12:10:25 PM

most times because some of the bounty managers do not care.

How much can the bounty managers care? Bounty managers also have other things doing rather than connecting addresses and media handle connecting. Besides, the system permits them to return after being caught.

Aside bounty managers having lots of other things doing and not having the time to try to connect addresses to media handles, I personally think Bounty detective is a shitty bounty managers and this is why they can never manage any meaningful bounty campaign on this forum other than the shitcoins they manage campaigns for.
I wish they can at the least, try to act up fully to their name "Bounty Detective", as currently, they are able to detect bounty campaigns but are not able to detect the fraud in the campaigns, which means they aren't doing their job fully as Detectives they call themselves.

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Quote from: Coyster on June 12, 2022, 12:10:25 PM

Quote from: _BlackStar on June 12, 2022, 11:38:48 AM

That's very suspicious and I think it looks like all those accounts are being controlled by one person or group of people to cheat the campaign.

Isn't that what most bounty hunters do in bounty campaigns, not that i bother too much about that since they are more often than not newbies with no merits, and they really do not have anything to lose with their accounts, if they are caught cheating and tagged, they will still continue with the account

Glansing at the occurrence of the usernames one after other in the spreadsheet, the similarities of the usernames and also the time and date of registration. It is obvious that the accounts are very much connected. But you need further evidence like wallet address linking or social media handle linking.
But I ask, how profitable is it for one person to control that large number of the accounts. Is it profitable, compared to the time that they invest?

Quote from: Coyster on June 12, 2022, 12:10:25 PM

most times because some of the bounty managers do not care.

How much can the bounty managers care? Bounty managers also have other things doing rather than connecting addresses and media handle connecting. Besides, the system permits them to return after being caught.

DVlog

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Quote from: Stalker22 on June 14, 2022, 04:11:14 PM

Quote from: DVlog on June 13, 2022, 08:50:31 AM

Quote from: Rikafip on June 13, 2022, 08:30:30 AM

What's your take on solution for altcoin farms abusing bounty campaigns?

A special badge can be provided for bounty hunters. New members must pay 10$ to the forum to get that badge to join the campaign. Already existing members and users above full member will get that badge as an airdrop. It is easy to get member rank by buying merits but for full member rank, it won't be profitable. When an alt farmer gets red-flagged to 10 of his account he or she will think twice before doing the same because it will cost him money this time.
~

How is this different from copper membership? Why introduce something that, basically, provides the same functionality as an existing feature?
But the big question is, who will force bounty managers to accept only copper or Member and higher ranks?

Actually, the problem is bounty managers are looking for mass workers, not quality workers. If only quality work is accepted I can bet 80% of participants will leave this work after a few campaigns. Also recently some low-rank bounty manager appears who doesn't care about their reputation and ready to promote scam project if they got money for them. I also think we should leave that matters for now.

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Quote from: Rikafip on June 13, 2022, 08:30:30 AM

Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 13, 2022, 08:15:27 AM

Honestly it doesn't matter if the rank rule is applied or not. Merit can be bought. So, managers apply the jr member rule and then there will be 500 new jr members the next week. Even if they don't buy the merit, users can start meriting their alts. They may even make a post that gets them 1 merit.

While introduction of rank requirement wouldn't stop altcoin farms entirely, I still think that it would make their life much harder. And I don't think that it would be so easy to buy merit at such a larger scale without any of the forum detectives figuring out what's going on.

Yes, but it still make it more difficult for some bounty spamming to participate in some bounty.

Quote from: Rikafip on June 13, 2022, 08:30:30 AM

Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 13, 2022, 08:15:27 AM

A solution has to go further then rank.

What's your take on solution for altcoin farms abusing bounty campaigns?

The only solution I could think of is, a bounty manager, hiring a special police team, or offering a special reward for an account farming detector who will do a thorough search on every participant of their bounty and also implement the only Jr or Member rank participation in their bounty.

Quote from: DVlog on June 13, 2022, 08:50:31 AM

A special badge can be provided for bounty hunters. New members must pay 10$ to the forum to get that badge to join the campaign.

This will never work.
1) This forum was said to be free as much as possible.
2) Bounty spammer will easily pay for the badge

Stalker22

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Quote from: DVlog on June 13, 2022, 08:50:31 AM

Quote from: Rikafip on June 13, 2022, 08:30:30 AM

What's your take on solution for altcoin farms abusing bounty campaigns?

A special badge can be provided for bounty hunters. New members must pay 10$ to the forum to get that badge to join the campaign. Already existing members and users above full member will get that badge as an airdrop. It is easy to get member rank by buying merits but for full member rank, it won't be profitable. When an alt farmer gets red-flagged to 10 of his account he or she will think twice before doing the same because it will cost him money this time.
~

How is this different from copper membership? Why introduce something that, basically, provides the same functionality as an existing feature?
But the big question is, who will force bounty managers to accept only copper or Member and higher ranks?

DVlog

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Quote from: Rikafip on June 13, 2022, 08:30:30 AM

What's your take on solution for altcoin farms abusing bounty campaigns?

A special badge can be provided for bounty hunters. New members must pay 10$ to the forum to get that badge to join the campaign. Already existing members and users above full member will get that badge as an airdrop. It is easy to get member rank by buying merits but for full member rank, it won't be profitable. When an alt farmer gets red-flagged to 10 of his account he or she will think twice before doing the same because it will cost him money this time.

May be forum administrator won't do anything like this because they have little interest in the bounty thread and there could be many better proposals. But If forum administrator agree then we can open up a community opinion section to gather more idea about what we can do next to get rid of these alt farmers.

Rikafip

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Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 13, 2022, 08:15:27 AM

Honestly it doesn't matter if the rank rule is applied or not. Merit can be bought. So, managers apply the jr member rule and then there will be 500 new jr members the next week. Even if they don't buy the merit, users can start meriting their alts. They may even make a post that gets them 1 merit.

While introduction of rank requirement wouldn't stop altcoin farms entirely, I still think that it would make their life much harder. And I don't think that it would be so easy to buy merit at such a larger scale without any of the forum detectives figuring out what's going on.

Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 13, 2022, 08:15:27 AM

They may even make a post that gets them 1 merit.

I've stumbled upon cases like that, bounty hunter writing a normal post just to get merit and then going back to his usual routine of spamming those reports in bounty section and it really sticks out like a sore thumb.

Quote from: yahoo62278 on June 13, 2022, 08:15:27 AM

A solution has to go further then rank.

What's your take on solution for altcoin farms abusing bounty campaigns?

yahoo62278

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Quote from: Pandu Geddon on June 13, 2022, 07:51:35 AM

Quote from: Rikafip on June 13, 2022, 05:00:48 AM

There is a simple solution to remove farms (or atleast majority of them)- introduce Jr Member as minimum requirement but that won't happen of course due before mentioned reason.

You're right most Altcoin bounty managers don't think much about the account farms in their campaigns. but of course, some still care.

I agree with the minimum JR Member rules that the bounty manager may adopt. or at least for some campaigns like Signature, Article, or Video. while Newbie accounts can be on social media with a minimum of activities that have been achieved.

the problem is, is it possible that the bounty manager is willing to apply such rules? at the risk of client satisfaction that may be disrupted.

Honestly it doesn't matter if the rank rule is applied or not. Merit can be bought. So, managers apply the jr member rule and then there will be 500 new jr members the next week. Even if they don't buy the merit, users can start meriting their alts. They may even make a post that gets them 1 merit.

A solution has to go further then rank.

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Quote from: Rikafip on June 13, 2022, 05:00:48 AM

There is a simple solution to remove farms (or atleast majority of them)- introduce Jr Member as minimum requirement but that won't happen of course due before mentioned reason.

You're right most Altcoin bounty managers don't think much about the account farms in their campaigns. but of course, some still care.

I agree with the minimum JR Member rules that the bounty manager may adopt. or at least for some campaigns like Signature, Article, or Video. while Newbie accounts can be on social media with a minimum of activities that have been achieved.

the problem is, is it possible that the bounty manager is willing to apply such rules? at the risk of client satisfaction that may be disrupted.

Rikafip

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Quote from: Lucius on June 13, 2022, 04:53:11 AM

There is no doubt that these are alt farms, but for me personally there is a much bigger problem in the campaign manager who had to notice what was happening in front of his nose - unless he himself is involved.

The thing is, its not in altcoin bounty managers interest to notice altcoin farms operating in their campaigns because if they remove those, there won't be more than couple of dozens of genuine users doing them and how will they sell their service to potential clients then? They need numbers, and the only way to get that is to allow army of newbie accounts to join.

There is a simple solution to remove farms (or atleast majority of them)- introduce Jr Member as minimum requirement but that won't happen of course due before mentioned reason.

Lucius

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There is no doubt that these are alt farms, but for me personally there is a much bigger problem in the campaign manager who had to notice what was happening in front of his nose - unless he himself is involved. Judging by his trust summary, it doesn't surprise me that things like this happen.

DVlog

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Quote from: mindrust on June 13, 2022, 12:08:22 AM

I think you are onto something. I was talking about this few days ago. Who knows how many others are doing the same thing... This one is one of the dumber ones because he didn't really tried to cover his tracks. I believe there are more sophisticated ones lurking around but it is probably impossible to detect them.

This is not an "if" question imo, this is a multi accounter/bounty cheater.

They will surely make mistakes and leave a clue behind in the future. When someone is managing 10 to 20 accounts and the same amount of social media accounts at the same time there is a high chance some track will be left behind unintentionally. But the problem is red tag is not demotivating them to create a new one.

Update:

Some bunch of ALT farmers. All of their username patterns is the same. All are brand-new and all of them are joining the Article campaign. So suddenly some newbie becomes a professional blog writer!!! I think they are using rephrasing tools to copy other's work and post of as their own. All the BM should use manual approval for joining article campaign for new members.

mindrust

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I think you are onto something. I was talking about this few days ago. Who knows how many others are doing the same thing... This one is one of the dumber ones because he didn't really tried to cover his tracks. I believe there are more sophisticated ones lurking around but it is probably impossible to detect them.

This is not an "if" question imo, this is a multi accounter/bounty cheater.

Topic: I could be wrong but what if? (Read 529 times)