I say it again: REDUCE THE FEES! | Bitcointalksearch.org

mobodick

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Quote from: Syke on April 06, 2013, 12:39:42 AM

Quote from: edmundedgar on April 05, 2013, 12:11:03 PM

Moving a miniscule bit of data from one column to another should be so cheap that it may as well be free for most practical purposes. You'd have to cock your decentralized payment system up unbelievably badly to need to charge anything like what most of the conventional online payment systems do.

That's true if you don't care about security. But if you want that miniscule bit of data to be secure, there is a real cost to achieving that security.

The question is, is the cost of securing a transaction realy that high.

Syke

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Quote from: edmundedgar on April 05, 2013, 12:11:03 PM

Moving a miniscule bit of data from one column to another should be so cheap that it may as well be free for most practical purposes. You'd have to cock your decentralized payment system up unbelievably badly to need to charge anything like what most of the conventional online payment systems do.

That's true if you don't care about security. But if you want that miniscule bit of data to be secure, there is a real cost to achieving that security.

mai77

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that's wrong. fees are coded into bitcoin.

Bitcoinm

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Every fee you pay is completely optional. If I am determined for a transaction to go through in a timely manner, I will pay the recommended .0005btc fee, but otherwise, I'm not paying anything.

giszmo

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WalletScrutiny.com

There is no good reason for fees in the long run. Sure, a x10 bigger currency needs x10 security so halfing the block reward is counter-productive but still we will be out of reach of any attacker soon and that's the only purpose of mining after all. If that's paid for, any further fees just slow down business in the bitcoin economy.

(I vote for proof of stake and no mandatory fees never ever. May the miners decide how to fill their 1MB or 10MB per block later on based on coin age and - yes - fees.)

Littleshop

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Today on a $1.49 order from my store, the customer could be paying a 7 cent fee. This is a FAR better deal then Paypal or Dwolla but as fees have not changed it is now a real percentage of the order cost.

NOTHING in wide use in the real world competes with Bitcoin but here there is an impediment to micro-transactions. Is that important for Bitcoin? Do we want to ration space or cast a wider net and find new applications? These are issues that need to be decided.

I would like to see a smaller fee for smaller transactions with coins older then a month but right now all anyone has to do is use a client that allows no fees and wait for it. Unless the coins are really new should move.

mai77

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that is basically the way to go

rme

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Quote from: rme on April 05, 2013, 04:11:57 AM

Start sending 0.00005 fees now (that is 0.00696 USD).
If too many people start doing this miners will start accepting this fee as a standar.

I have already done it, start lowering your fees and pools will start accepting this transactions.

edmundedgar

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https://www.realitykeys.com

Quote from: ?? on ??

Nothing is free

Moving a miniscule bit of data from one column to another should be so cheap that it may as well be free for most practical purposes. You'd have to cock your decentralized payment system up unbelievably badly to need to charge anything like what most of the conventional online payment systems do.

If we're going to make Bitcoin expensive it'll be a matter of time until someone does it properly and takes most of the transaction business. Good luck maintaining the value of your electronic gold when that happens.

mai77

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well in 2012 a fee of 0.0005 BTC was quite acceptable

mai77

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no.

I want ca. 30% of the network supporting "bitcoin free transaction relay policy"

that may be slightly slower, but still work fine.

blablahblah

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Quote from: mai77 on April 05, 2013, 04:42:53 AM

in bitcoin clients you can set an ADDITIONAL fee to pay.

if you set it to zero, you still must pay transaction fees.

unless you use a modified client or sth.

So what you really want is a sort of "jail-broken" version of the Satoshi client without all the locked-down crap that the non-open-source-believing developers are too scared for you to touch? Grin

QuestionAuthority

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You lead and I'll watch you walk away.

Quote from: mai77 on April 05, 2013, 04:42:53 AM

in bitcoin clients you can set an ADDITIONAL fee to pay.

if you set it to zero, you still must pay transaction fees.

unless you use a modified client or sth.

I use the modified client below to send and receive payments all the time with absolutely no fee. Grin

No Fee Client (TOR users beware/client should not be used by drug addicts or illegal porn collectors)

mai77

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in bitcoin clients you can set an ADDITIONAL fee to pay.

if you set it to zero, you still must pay transaction fees.

unless you use a modified client or sth.

ThomasV

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Quote from: mai77 on April 05, 2013, 04:36:58 AM

that's the ADDITIONAL fee

what do you mean?

mai77

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that's the ADDITIONAL fee

ThomasV

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The default fee in Electrum was reduced recently.
It is now 0.0002 btc/kilobyte
Note that the user may also set it manually.

mai77

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I actually sent you a tip, but it was eaten by the fee Wink

rme

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Start sending 0.00005 fees now (that is 0.00696 USD).
If too many people start doing this miners will start accepting this fee as a standar.

franky1

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as i said before the satoshi dice is showing everyone an example of the future. where most transactions will be done in satoshi's due to bitcoin value being many hundreds of dollars each.

allowing fee's to be high to block/ignore satoshi dice transactions is not a good thing now or for the future of bitcoin. It's just a lazy and ignorant way to avoid thinking about the future of bitcoin, purely for selfish and personal profit of miners today.

think of the future. develop the clients/miners to accept satoshi payments easier without causing the network to struggle.

i want to ensure that in a couple years i can buy chewing gum at walmart for under a dollar (when valued as only a couple satoshi's) without having a 3 hour confirm time or a $1 fee due to miners ignorance/selfish profiteering. think of the community and the future, think outside of the box known as your own pocket.

use satoshi dice as a test bed of how transactions will be in the future. not as something to be ignored by overpricing the fee's in the hope satoshi dice will die.

Topic: I say it again: REDUCE THE FEES! (Read 6229 times)