ideas for the next generation of our beloved 'provably fair' games

eli113

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void

ok i see

i had the suspicion most of us here in this forum we post JUST
because we carry a sig or a personal agenda

i am smart enough to find my way out without displease anyone
with pure intentions to say JUST what he/she feels

Thread will be locked BUT not for ever

welcome to PM me a good reason to unlock
as you can see i am taking very seriously what you write here
-
Thank you all and Happy 2021.again

eli113

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void

i used already enough red ink in my first reply , read it if you missed BUT
those three words need expanding urgently : JUST provably fair
here it comes , my first ORIGINAL TEXT in this thread , enjoy !

JUST provably fair for Dummies and ... Experts !

lets go back five-ten years
a bright idea came into the light after the shocking innovation of Bitcoin
people always complaining about fairness of online casinos and games lets give them a proof they worry for nothing
provably fair scheme is born - hallelujah !

in simple words lets say i am the House hosting the game 'guess a card out of a full deck of 52'
me the House i am honest to death and i want to prove you that, before you risk your hard earned moneyZ
so i pick a card from my real deck after shuffling 233 times - i am poor to invest for LIVE cameras, damn!
my second best choice is this new thingy called provably-fair so here my clean implementation on that :

i am picking a card , lets say 'Ace of Spades' , then i browse any 'online SHA-256 calculator' found this one : sha256
into the input (source) text field i write
qw2ueFigaj56df today 03jan2021 time 07:20:14.46546 hand picked Ace of Spades as next result *2aZ3^U55TU%s@

*there are garbage characters in front and at the end. those must be random to keep your HOUSE safe against
attackers , if you sha256 only 'Ace of Spades' anyone can find your secret instantly
*in order to avoid including the hidden Return character better triple click to highlight the secret

here is the result i got / try it but wear a Covid mask perhaps j/k
c3619a92299a76dbe90eb8f5e7858705d1f4b354ffee04adf4feb8bd6b33895b

the magic goes further :
i am poor as i said so i have not a site to host my brilliant little game... NO PROBLEM !
so i invite my friend into a chat room, lets call myself as 'HouseOwner' and my friend as 'Costumer0001'

Code:

HouseOwner says   : are we ready to play ?
Costumer0001 says : YAYYyyyyyy - i am more than ready and loaded ! shoot me !
HouseOwner says   : next card i picked for you to bet hides under the following text :
HouseOwner says   : c3619a92299a76dbe90eb8f5e7858705d1f4b354ffee04adf4feb8bd6b33895b
HouseOwner says   : place your bets gentlemen !
Costumer0001 says : i bet 10 Marsian Dollars on Spades / pays 3.96 times /
HouseOwner says   : here is my hidden secret :
HouseOwner says   : qw2ueFigaj56df today 03jan2021 time 07:20:14.46546 hand picked Ace of Spades as next result *2aZ3^U55TU%s@
HouseOwner says   : you WON 39.6 M$ -- your balance increased by 39.6-10=29.6 M$ - calculating next round... zzz zzz 
.. a little later
ChatBot says      : HouseOwner left the building ,OOPS !
Costumer0001 says : my bad , next time i will play this other game out of damn internet scams
RandomChat says   : you mean that provably fair using carrier pigeons instead of chat rooms?
Costumer0001 says : internet is bad, yeah i think pigeons is more fair than this sit here

Fair game you say ! - to be continued i hope i teased you enough to stay tuned
Feed me with comments and i promise to respond as fast i can. happy 2021 again

panganib999

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Quote from: magneto on January 02, 2021, 07:28:11 PM

I think that people will tend towards live games, but obviously they're not provably fair right now.

Whoever comes up with a provably fair version of existing live games (e.g., Dream Catcher, Deal or No Deal etc.) are going to capture a lot of market share as long as their games' RTP aren't too bad. I think that is something that the market will seriously demand.

People enjoy the community interaction of live games just as much as the actual game itself. The RTP doesn't even have to be great - 98% or so will suffice to keep employing workers to handle the lives games feasible financially.

Actually I think this games are definitely some think it is a fair game yet its just on the name of the game. Fair game is somehow needs to be fair ofcourse and we all know that fair game always choose to making people play and play because of loosing. Fair game is just a name for me. Gambling still a gamblimg that gives you a 50/50 chance of winning and I guess this kind of games might not be a little fair though it depends on the persons luck or players luck or somehow their strategy on how they handle every loses and winnings in their play or game when they are on it.

Fredomago

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Quote from: magneto on January 02, 2021, 07:28:11 PM

I think that people will tend towards live games, but obviously they're not provably fair right now.

+3 on this ,because i myself are now engaging in live games than the Probavly Fair in which for Me Not totally Fair Grin

Quote

Whoever comes up with a provably fair version of existing live games (e.g., Dream Catcher, Deal or No Deal etc.) are going to capture a lot of market share as long as their games' RTP aren't too bad. I think that is something that the market will seriously demand.

Actually i have Been suggesting this to The team of Each Site i visit and Play because this is the Future of Online gambling ,We wanted to Play safer and also more Fairer than What is being Promised .

Quote

People enjoy the community interaction of live games just as much as the actual game itself. The RTP doesn't even have to be great - 98% or so will suffice to keep employing workers to handle the lives games feasible financially.

And Of course the Assurance of Playing Live and Not Manipulated and controlled.

Wexnident

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I don't request loans~

So is it a type of game? Well, any would do for me honestly, as long as its fair. But if you're asking me what type of games I'd want, they wouldn't really enter into the realm of "gambling" games that fully rely on RNG, so I doubt that'd work. I'd honestly pay to play a gambling game style of galaga or something similar, but the game itself requires skill which makes it difficult to be implemented. Luck based games are fun and all, but the "luck" part limits what it could work with though, even if we created a gambling game that's similar to an RPG, where equipment is based on RNG, well, it still sucks.

magneto

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I think that people will tend towards live games, but obviously they're not provably fair right now.

Whoever comes up with a provably fair version of existing live games (e.g., Dream Catcher, Deal or No Deal etc.) are going to capture a lot of market share as long as their games' RTP aren't too bad. I think that is something that the market will seriously demand.

People enjoy the community interaction of live games just as much as the actual game itself. The RTP doesn't even have to be great - 98% or so will suffice to keep employing workers to handle the lives games feasible financially.

btc78

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I think some Good threads created now here in Forum , This is One topic that i will surely Follow and take alook from time to time.

Because this "PROBAVLY FAIR" thing is still Making me confuse if the word "FAIR" really needs to be there.

from the beginning that I played these Games in Probavly fair Yet I never find fairness and What i only Get is continues Losing lol.
Yeah there are times that Luck Seats Besides me but Yet not enough to Believe in this Words.

I would Gladly read Ideas and Stands about this and Please further Discuss why this called to be Probavly Fair Games when the truth is they are not.

Quidat

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Quote from: dimonstration on January 02, 2021, 05:55:46 PM

Quote from: acener on January 02, 2021, 03:41:57 PM

I like betting on price prediction although I already stop spending on it but I still check on it and think that I am still betting.
I think it is the only fair game that we have some of the games are just "Provably Fair" and depends on luck while this kind of game is like trading which require actual skills and knowledge.

It will be good to have more of trading type betting in gambling sites too like what in some exchanges. It's quite fun to bet in gambling sites more as we can play other games while we know we have some bets in some of their games. I do enjoy betting and some slot or dice games without minding if they are probably fair or not as long as I experience some winnings. More New games that may enhanced our mind and skills can only be used in betting and cards when it comes in gambling, it would be nice if there are more games that will develop the use of skills rather than depending more on luck.

You mean those binary options like type of games? It do already exist in the market ex. Betinance.com which you would need to gamble neither the price would go up or down in a short time duration and make some bets of it.We cant deny that this market had been flooded out by these kind of games where it did really come to a point where it becomes boring.

We do love to see something new in the market which havent been seen by the public.For now we do still have some options to take or to play and as mentioned where crash and others do exist.
We can ensure its fairness when we do del with the right website or company.

dimonstration

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Dimon69

Quote from: acener on January 02, 2021, 03:41:57 PM

I like betting on price prediction although I already stop spending on it but I still check on it and think that I am still betting.
I think it is the only fair game that we have some of the games are just "Provably Fair" and depends on luck while this kind of game is like trading which require actual skills and knowledge.

It will be good to have more of trading type betting in gambling sites too like what in some exchanges. It's quite fun to bet in gambling sites more as we can play other games while we know we have some bets in some of their games. I do enjoy betting and some slot or dice games without minding if they are probably fair or not as long as I experience some winnings. More New games that may enhanced our mind and skills can only be used in betting and cards when it comes in gambling, it would be nice if there are more games that will develop the use of skills rather than depending more on luck.

acener

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I like betting on price prediction although I already stop spending on it but I still check on it and think that I am still betting.
I think it is the only fair game that we have some of the games are just "Provably Fair" and depends on luck while this kind of game is like trading which require actual skills and knowledge.
I also like the idea of Shoreno where we could pick our own event as long as it is well known event like election or something.

Saisher

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Quote from: Maus0728 on January 01, 2021, 10:35:39 PM

Thanks for the thread. I am actually waiting for a topic where I can share a game that I want to be played publicly on a gambling website. Well, during my early years in gambling though, I've created a thread here and ask if there is an existing gambling site that has In-Between or Acey Deucey, also known as Yablon. Surprisingly, based on the replies given, there is no website that offers such game. The game is pretty popular in our country though Wink

First time I read about that kind of games but there is a wiki on that
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yablon, and it looks interesting let's see if sme gambling sites will pick this idea and integrate it in their website
gambling sites should look for interesting new games that will generate interest to gamblers and this one might.

eli113

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void

Quote from: robelneo on January 01, 2021, 06:28:23 PM

There's a game coming up it's not something new but there is this prediction game where you predict the outcome of one prediction or even create one for people to bet you can sell your prediction, the only downside is there's a lot of long term prediction that your funds will be lock for a long period of time, I still prefer my old 'provably fair' games dice, slot and mines I just do a variation so not to get bored, every day I'm excited to play them, every day present a new excitement to play these games.

nice contribution ! you are a Hero indeed since you saved our thread here for now

Quote from: Maus0728 on January 01, 2021, 10:35:39 PM

Thanks for the thread. I am actually waiting for a topic where I can share a game that I want to be played publicly on a gambling website. Well, during my early years in gambling though, I've created a thread here and ask if there is an existing gambling site that has In-Between or Acey Deucey, also known as Yablon. Surprisingly, based on the replies given, there is no website that offers such game. The game is pretty popular in our country though Wink

...This is the thread that I have created last year: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.54259231

it sounds interesting yeah, if this thread find some audience i may start 'ideas for new games' thread to fit your desire better

Quote from: maydna on January 01, 2021, 10:45:10 PM

But no matter what strategies you use, that will still depend on luck. The lottery has been played in many countries, and people like to play lotteries game. So that can be a good choice to start a gambling business. Eh, I am thinking about when people shop in the local store, and they get a ticket to win some prizes, but the ticket will be drawn. I think that is gambling, right? Because we buy the product to get as many tickets as we can. The bigger amount of money that we spent, the more ticket number that we will get. People will not realize about playing hidden gambling.

you won the Quality Post Badge
it is gambling but there are workarounds , example : if winners get discounts,goods or services non exchangeable to MONEYz
since it is a real sale involved , it can be legally wrapped as any kind of discount coupons and aftersales promotions
welcome to expand this huge idea here with us, pm me if you like to discuss this with me in private anytime,THANK U

Quote from: shoreno on January 01, 2021, 11:44:02 PM

normally prediction that are offered on predicting sites are too common but if we can pick ours we can choose an event localy or internationaly that is not being offered on any predicting site . as long it was a legit event and we can provide the players an update or a site for them to check the on going event .
lets only pick the events that will not start for too long or will not end for too long because that will be boring anymore and can cause trust issues .

welcome in my thread Shoreno , thanks for your in-topic contribution

Thank you ALL again , laterZ

shoreno

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Quote from: robelneo on January 01, 2021, 06:28:23 PM

There's a game coming up it's not something new but there is this prediction game where you predict the outcome of one prediction or even create one for people to bet you can sell your prediction, the only downside is there's a lot of long term prediction that your funds will be lock for a long period of time.

normally prediction that are offered on predicting sites are too common but if we can pick ours we can choose an event localy or internationaly that is not being offered on any predicting site . as long it was a legit event and we can provide the players an update or a site for them to check the on going event .

lets only pick the events that will not start for too long or will not end for too long because that will be boring anymore and can cause trust issues .

maydna

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Hippocrypto on January 01, 2021, 04:06:49 PM

Maybe on random instances every individual will probably win but not a 100% assurance, because that depends on luck. Just like on our community lottery which is promoting small time business, which is dependent with results coming from National draw. Casino business will be applicable but needs more money to operate. However, in this certain aspect regarding small business franchise; lottery can be a good passive income, much more if it can be done through online options.

Yes sometimes it all depends on luck, but I do believe in some kind of strategies that we can also use in some gambling games, it can also help us to win, yes lottery can be a good choice if you are starting you own start up gambling business, or maybe add some raffle tickets to be won, add some lottery game related to sports as well, since it will bring more gamblers into your business, and if you have some budget make it online too.

But no matter what strategies you use, that will still depend on luck. The lottery has been played in many countries, and people like to play lotteries game. So that can be a good choice to start a gambling business. Eh, I am thinking about when people shop in the local store, and they get a ticket to win some prizes, but the ticket will be drawn. I think that is gambling, right? Because we buy the product to get as many tickets as we can. The bigger amount of money that we spent, the more ticket number that we will get. People will not realize about playing hidden gambling.

Maus0728

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Thanks for the thread. I am actually waiting for a topic where I can share a game that I want to be played publicly on a gambling website. Well, during my early years in gambling though, I've created a thread here and ask if there is an existing gambling site that has In-Between or Acey Deucey, also known as Yablon. Surprisingly, based on the replies given, there is no website that offers such game. The game is pretty popular in our country though Wink

Quote from: en.wikipedia.org

Each player must add their ante into the pot. Two cards are then dealt face-up to one player. That player then bets from nothing to the amount that is in the pot at the time whether or not the third card will numerically fall in between the first two. If the third card falls in between the two other cards, the bettor takes the amount he bet out of the pot; if the third card falls outside of the two other cards, the bettor must add what he bet to the pot; and if the third card matches the numerical value of one of the other two cards, the bettor must add to the pot double what they bet. If two cards of the same value come up, e.g. 2,2 the bettor picks if the next card will be higher or lower and bets. If the next card is the same as the last two, i.e. a 2, the bettor must triple their bet.

This is the thread that I have created last year: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.54259231

robelneo

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Quote from: eli113 on January 01, 2021, 02:10:23 AM

at first i can say i have no interest to create or invest on any gambling related bussines
the reason i post this is because i need better games to waste my leisure time

welcome all of you to post ideas as the title suggests
if i see a little response i will post my ideas and discuss yours

HAPPY NEW YEAR 2021 Grin

whatever i may write here offered to Public Domain - Year 2021

update 1 : thank you for more than little response !
of course i will share my ideas , new years eve today so lets say tomorrow ?

There's a game coming up it's not something new but there is this prediction game where you predict the outcome of one prediction or even create one for people to bet you can sell your prediction, the only downside is there's a lot of long term prediction that your funds will be lock for a long period of time, I still prefer my old 'provably fair' games dice, slot and mines I just do a variation so not to get bored, every day I'm excited to play them, every day present a new excitement to play these games.

Hippocrypto

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Quote from: Mauser on January 01, 2021, 10:41:22 AM

Quote from: ryzaadit on January 01, 2021, 09:57:45 AM

Any problem on provably fair like SHA-256?

IMO, even there has some new provably fair in the end the casino will always win because they have a house edge in the long term they will be always profitable. I believe thing kind of issue/discussion most of them came when they losing a feeling cheated.

Sure on a large number of bets the casino will make a profit, that's just statistics. However, a house edge doesn't mean that you can't win big time. In gambling there will always be people who lose and people who win. It averages out for the casino, but the individual gambler there can be a lot of profit being made.

Maybe on random instances every individual will probably win but not a 100% assurance, because that depends on luck. Just like on our community lottery which is promoting small time business, which is dependent with results coming from National draw. Casino business will be applicable but needs more money to operate. However, in this certain aspect regarding small business franchise; lottery can be a good passive income, much more if it can be done through online options.

Lanatsa

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Quote from: Saint-loup on January 01, 2021, 01:16:40 PM

There is a lack of sexy games in crypto casinos I think.
More games with sexy chicks like strip poker would be more pleasant IMO.
(happy new year to you)

I believe this one is already or can be seen in todays casinos or you do mean with that complete stripper? Lol! Grin

We do love to see new games that haven't seen on this market.Something unique that do really pokes out our inner gambler personality.

We do have already some crash, other ways or methods of lotteries and roulletes and other stuffs but we do really like to see more.

eli113

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void

DISCLAIMER : The author is a supporter of clean implementations of what we call 'Provably Fair'
if you want to discuss about 'Provably fair' there are many great threads already in this forum

Quote from: DoublerHunter on January 01, 2021, 02:36:32 AM

Quote from: eli113 on January 01, 2021, 02:10:23 AM

at first i can say i have no interest to create or invest on any gambling related bussines
the reason i post this is because i need better games to waste my leisure time

^ Provably fair in poker games. It is more fun to play that game.
I don't think gambling game is a waste of time and I don't also gamble if I am not at a convenient time. Gambling for me is a form of entertainment and it is separated from my leisure time, of course, gamble in my free time will always have a good mood while I am gambling.
What's Public Domain you offer?

leisure time = free time , English is my 2nd language too so i do not imply you wrote something wrong
if you stay in this thread long enough it is possible to read some original ideas i have
in advance i want to make them usable for any creative mind willing to base his/her work on
thats why i mention Public Domain https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_domain

as about your reply , provably fair in poker is a really complicated matter , the main problem you need
to solve efficiently is what is called 'mental poker' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_poker
wiki page talks around the condition : without the need for a trusted third party.
history can tell us what happens when house can shuffle decks at will and how easy are player collisions
however it is a solvable problem , but huge task overall. provably fair may help but it is only part of solutiion

Quote from: Vaskiy on January 01, 2021, 02:38:57 AM

Everything is upon trust, every game will be termed as provably fair but one in ten try to verify it. Maybe we can create new games, but how fair this gonna be fair is unknown.

For you to waste your leisure time every gambling website have got lots and lots of games. There are sites where you can play without spending.

Provably fair is good foundation of trustless games , but there are many bricks needed to build a game
actually you touched the reason i started this thread a little , i mention next generation in title you know
even minor changes on existing games can upgrade fun,convenience and overall sense of fairness
removing a rotten brick can make miracles , so please discuss with us on that matter ,in your leisure time ofc Cool

Quote from: acroman08 on January 01, 2021, 05:04:17 AM

why not share your own Idea instead? It would be good to share your idea to start the discussion instead of waiting for others to give one. and to be honest(at least for me) it is hard to think of an idea for an original gambling game. so the idea that you have would be a great starter for this discussion.

the reason i was not shared my ideaS yet is simple :
if you read older posts i made here, you will see i spent lot of time talking to myself in
some of my threads, so i learnt my lesson, welcome relax and enjoy !

Quote from: peter0425 on January 01, 2021, 05:12:27 AM

But i'm more engaging in Sports betting nowadays and Only visit these Games when i have no good pick in Sports.
So i have nothing to share and Maybe will Look back here for the shared ideas.

welcome and stay tuned

Quote from: dothebeats on January 01, 2021, 05:20:53 AM

As a casual gambler and fan of dice, there’s not much to ask on that facet of gambling for me. I only prove that my games are fair by checking the seed every 10 games or so. Perhaps if gambling platforms could automate that process without being too cheeky about it, ie altering something on the front end while returning differently on the back end, that would be great. Other than that, everything is good—at least for me.

so you have ideas , thanks for the reply, expand and share if you feel like

Quote from: milewilda on January 01, 2021, 05:25:43 AM

He would be sharing up his idea if he wont see any ideas that had been posted here shared but if we do really think that sensibly is that no one would
really share up their ideas for the tendency or possible for that good idea to be stolen.When it comes to gambling games then we do see some several
games that are quite unique and not really that common and they do really get some popularity and success to this market.
When it comes to new games then we are really looking for something that we havent able to try on this place.For someone who would able to offer that
then they might really able to get some recognition and build up popularity later on.

thanks for your support , welcome

Quote from: imstillthebest on January 01, 2021, 08:21:43 AM

any activity isnt a waste of time if you enjoy .
he have a free time that he want to waste and he will waste it in gambling . gambling when we dont have a free time should be avoided tho because priority or responsibility should come first before entertainment but what are those provably fair poker games ?
poker that are not online or dont have a human oponent ? but those are old and he want want new ideas to create a new provably fair game .

welcome , in green bold something i agree 100%

to be continued...
HAPPY NEW YEAR 2021 and thanks a lot. Grin

Saint-loup

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Quote from: eli113 on January 01, 2021, 02:10:23 AM

at first i can say i have no interest to create or invest on any gambling related bussines
the reason i post this is because i need better games to waste my leisure time

welcome all of you to post ideas as the title suggests
if i see a little response i will post my ideas and discuss yours

HAPPY NEW YEAR 2021 Grin

whatever i may write here offered to Public Domain - Year 2021

update 1 : thank you for more than little response !
of course i will share my ideas , new years eve today so lets say tomorrow ?

There is a lack of sexy games in crypto casinos I think.
More games with sexy chicks like strip poker would be more pleasant IMO.
(happy new year to you)

Topic: ideas for the next generation of our beloved 'provably fair' games (Read 524 times)