If the mining profits decrease, will Bitcoin end?

st0nefish

full member

Activity: 182

Merit: 100

Quote from: Xester on January 10, 2017, 07:52:49 AM

There is no way that bitcoin will end with just a decrease in mining profit. It will continue but the confirmation will take a very long time. The users will pay huge fee just to get the transaction done in time. But let us say a miner will stop mining because it is no longer profitable what will happen next, a new miner with a good hardware will replace the old miner and the cycle will continue. New mining hardware, new technology will just come out to solve the problem on difficulty, electricity and others.

One of the biggest problems of Bitcoin is the time to approve payments. At the moment we can say that your payment will be approved in 0-30 minutes with a minimum value of 90 satoshis/byte. For the average transaction size of 226 bytes, you need to pay 20340 satoshi. Average fee values can be viewed on this site https://bitcoinfees.21.co

Bitcoin was the first time the fee values were very low. Over time, these fee values increased. One of the reasons people choose bitcoin is that the commission fees are low in transferring money.
If the block award value is 1.5 BTC in the future and the bitcoin price does not increase, this time the fee values will increase so that the miners can make money. If these fee values are more than the money transfer fees of the banks, there is a possibility that people will drop the bitcoin.

ko0ll0ove

full member

Activity: 182

Merit: 100

I have some question base on your idea. If the reward for miner is decrease through years... so maybe they will quit and nobody will spend there money for mining so how can bitcoin will be created ?

20kevin20

legendary

Activity: 1134

Merit: 1598

Quote from: DOGE12321 on January 12, 2017, 06:44:53 PM

No it won't. The block reward is halved each time. It creates more demand for miners and this way we will see a rise in price. If many miners quit, it would be easier to obtain reward and others will begin to mine. This system replenishes miner numbers.

As the block reward gets halved each 4 years, it actually becomes harder to obtain Bitcoin. Because the demand keeps rising, it shows us just how people are becoming more interested in Bitcoin and because it becomes hard to obtain one, the price needs to increase. Just like gold which is a limited resource, Bitcoin has to keep its price very high or it'd become useless to have one or to mine it. If gold was $1/oz nobody would be interested in investing in it.

ASHLIUSZ

hero member

Activity: 994

Merit: 502

Quote from: DOGE12321 on January 12, 2017, 06:44:53 PM

No it won't. The block reward is halved each time. It creates more demand for miners and this way we will see a rise in price. If many miners quit, it would be easier to obtain reward and others will begin to mine. This system replenishes miner numbers.

As quoted everything gets circulated and functions in correspondence to time. So when the supply decreases the demand will increase generating miners the profit. Another thing is that mining will be profitable till something comes alternate or overcome the bitcoin network.

grandy

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

Quote from: DOGE12321 on January 12, 2017, 06:44:53 PM

No it won't. The block reward is halved each time. It creates more demand for miners and this way we will see a rise in price. If many miners quit, it would be easier to obtain reward and others will begin to mine. This system replenishes miner numbers.

yes that is right to say that if some miners even stop mining still some people will continue and then their reward will also increase. this system will even continue even in a better way. and bitcoin is not going ti end.

serjent05

legendary

Activity: 3010

Merit: 1280

Hire Bitcointalk Camp. Manager @ r7promotions.com

Bitcoin will never end as long as there are demands. There are lots of factor that contribute to bitcoin survivability. Technology, mass adoption, mining etc. The most crucial is the adoption, if it stops then bitcoin will die, but if mining is non profitable, majority of the miners may stop but it will eventually make the difficulty lower, and the electricity needed to mine bitcoin will be lower too since people does not need that much of hashing power to get bitcoin reward.

shinratensei_

legendary

Activity: 3276

Merit: 1029

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: kiklo on January 10, 2017, 02:54:28 AM

Quote from: st0nefish on January 09, 2017, 07:45:23 AM

At the moment the miners for a block are awarded 12.5 BTC. Every 4 years this value will fall by half. For example, let's imagine that the prize value is 1.5 BTC for each block and that BTC's value against the dollar does not increase. In such a case, mining will not be very profitable.

At the same time, miners are also benefiting from the value of the fee. This time the fee values will increase. Then people will have to pay a high fee for bitcoin transfer. The biggest advantage of the Bitcoin system against banking systems was that they could shop without paying commissions to any brokerage house. If this happens, can bitcoin preference be reduced?

When there are ZERO rewards , the Fee Prices will be so high, people will move to other coins with cheaper fees and BTC will Die.

Cool

The transaction reward will increase and bitcoin will never die, but just some people are trying retire from the securing bitcoin network. Tongue

DOGE12321

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

No it won't. The block reward is halved each time. It creates more demand for miners and this way we will see a rise in price. If many miners quit, it would be easier to obtain reward and others will begin to mine. This system replenishes miner numbers.

st0nefish

full member

Activity: 182

Merit: 100

Quote from: noictib on January 11, 2017, 05:54:16 AM

Quote from: st0nefish on January 09, 2017, 07:45:23 AM

At the moment the miners for a block are awarded 12.5 BTC. Every 4 years this value will fall by half. For example, let's imagine that the prize value is 1.5 BTC for each block and that BTC's value against the dollar does not increase. In such a case, mining will not be very profitable.

At the same time, miners are also benefiting from the value of the fee. This time the fee values will increase. Then people will have to pay a high fee for bitcoin transfer. The biggest advantage of the Bitcoin system against banking systems was that they could shop without paying commissions to any brokerage house. If this happens, can bitcoin preference be reduced?

You question is no much complicated because , If mining reward will became low or stop then it is sure that a new rule will come into play to earn bitcoin by supporting mining .
Because if mining reward decrease or stop then the system of bitcoin transaction will stop , so to make bitcoin and its transaction live the bitcoin system will provide additional reward .
So don't worry , if you can than make mining Wink

Has Bitcoin technology added new rules up to now? Has Satoshi's original technical design ever changed after Satoshi?
What I mean is not the improvements made in coding. Have new rules been introduced to change the operating logic?

RealPhotoshoper

legendary

Activity: 1050

Merit: 1001

Quote from: Kevin77 on January 12, 2017, 02:49:43 PM

Quote from: fikihafana on January 12, 2017, 02:24:39 PM

Quote from: BitcoinPanther on January 09, 2017, 05:04:26 PM

Quote from: fikihafana on January 09, 2017, 04:52:06 PM

not really. Bitcoin reward maybe decrease but bitcoin price will increase. It's why bitcoin price always increase year by year

Or bitcoin price decrease, mining profitability decrease, miner decrease, difficulty decrease, power use in mining will also decrease, making mining profitability increase. It is a cycle. Each sector will adopt to the changes of each sector. The only thing that will stop bitcoin is when the demand of people to have bitcoin stop.

yes you're right. that's not easy to stop the demand, because bitcoin grow massively

Yes, the demand will persist and will break the cycle at any possible point. When bitcoin price decrease, some more new investment will enter to catch the comparatively lower prices which will stabilize everything else. As long as there are demands, we never need to worry about any ending as it will not be possible.

i guess it wil never give profit for a small miner , not since few years ago.
the difficulity and electicity cost makes solo mining not profitable anymore , but till now there a lot of active miner exist.
why? it is because they know even the bitcoin that they earned that time not worth but it will become worthy in the future.

Kevin77

legendary

Activity: 1652

Merit: 1057

Quote from: fikihafana on January 12, 2017, 02:24:39 PM

Quote from: BitcoinPanther on January 09, 2017, 05:04:26 PM

Quote from: fikihafana on January 09, 2017, 04:52:06 PM

not really. Bitcoin reward maybe decrease but bitcoin price will increase. It's why bitcoin price always increase year by year

Or bitcoin price decrease, mining profitability decrease, miner decrease, difficulty decrease, power use in mining will also decrease, making mining profitability increase. It is a cycle. Each sector will adopt to the changes of each sector. The only thing that will stop bitcoin is when the demand of people to have bitcoin stop.

yes you're right. that's not easy to stop the demand, because bitcoin grow massively

Yes, the demand will persist and will break the cycle at any possible point. When bitcoin price decrease, some more new investment will enter to catch the comparatively lower prices which will stabilize everything else. As long as there are demands, we never need to worry about any ending as it will not be possible.

Only demand for bitcoin decides everything. Demand from new people will stabilize the mining profits, so continuous decrease for mining profits will not be possible.

fikihafana

sr. member

Activity: 462

Merit: 250

Quote from: BitcoinPanther on January 09, 2017, 05:04:26 PM

Quote from: fikihafana on January 09, 2017, 04:52:06 PM

not really. Bitcoin reward maybe decrease but bitcoin price will increase. It's why bitcoin price always increase year by year

Or bitcoin price decrease, mining profitability decrease, miner decrease, difficulty decrease, power use in mining will also decrease, making mining profitability increase. It is a cycle. Each sector will adopt to the changes of each sector. The only thing that will stop bitcoin is when the demand of people to have bitcoin stop.

yes you're right. that's not easy to stop the demand, because bitcoin grow massively

st0nefish

full member

Activity: 182

Merit: 100

Quote from: Bestwishes745 on January 09, 2017, 03:58:29 PM

Quote from: pinoycash on January 09, 2017, 07:47:34 AM

Quote from: st0nefish on January 09, 2017, 07:45:23 AM

At the moment the miners for a block are awarded 12.5 BTC. Every 4 years this value will fall by half. For example, let's imagine that the prize value is 1.5 BTC for each block and that BTC's value against the dollar does not increase. In such a case, mining will not be very profitable.

At the same time, miners are also benefiting from the value of the fee. This time the fee values will increase. Then people will have to pay a high fee for bitcoin transfer. The biggest advantage of the Bitcoin system against banking systems was that they could shop without paying commissions to any brokerage house. If this happens, can bitcoin preference be reduced?

No really, only the BTC reward will be lowered but the BTC price will increase due to the law of supply and demand, less BTC less supply more demand, high prices.

Along with that fact we can also say that with the passage of time the remaining coins will reduce in umber and one day all of the coins will be mined and with the limited number of bitcoin its price will be much higher and the miners will rely on the fees of transaction which is also good in amount.

Yes, this is one of the scenarios that might be in the possibilities. Overall for bitcoin everyone is considering this.
Classic economic information already says it. If supply decreases with increasing demand, prices will rise. In such a case, if the fee is within a reasonable value range, Bitcoin will continue.

electronicash

legendary

Activity: 3178

Merit: 1054

Quote from: Mometaskers on January 11, 2017, 01:31:20 PM

I only have a basic understanding of this but the creator wanted it to be a finite resource like gold. So even if the btc reward gets smaller over time, the value of btc is still increasing so there are still incentives for miners to do their thing. When all bitcoin has been mined out they'd be mostly receiving their income from the transaction fees (which would also become higher by that time).

perhaps so. value of bitcoin goes so high that transaction fees may reach $10. this is still worth for miners to continue making money even after another halving. 6.25 BTC per block will be worth for any miners so long as its value will be doubled in the next 4 years.

Mometaskers

hero member

Activity: 1764

Merit: 584

I only have a basic understanding of this but the creator wanted it to be a finite resource like gold. So even if the btc reward gets smaller over time, the value of btc is still increasing so there are still incentives for miners to do their thing. When all bitcoin has been mined out they'd be mostly receiving their income from the transaction fees (which would also become higher by that time).

Senor.Bla

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 253

Quote from: TastyChillySauce00 on January 11, 2017, 05:58:08 AM

Quote from: Senor.Bla on January 11, 2017, 05:17:04 AM

Quote from: royalfestus on January 11, 2017, 05:07:18 AM

Quote from: Cereberus on January 09, 2017, 03:50:33 PM

Mining end in the year 2140 so in my opinion is the last thing we should worry about as I am pretty sure we will all be dead and forgotten at that year 2140.

As others have already said then it would depend on transaction fees and also bitcoin will not end but it will be extra expensive as there will be only this amount of bitcoin in circulation(21mln coins) and if people by then decide not to sell than the price should only go up.

It is thoughtful to know that it will end in 2140,beside it is a proposed date. Mining of new bitcoin can end but mining to gain transaction fee continues, due the infinity block of network more so this process is also rewarded.

In about 20 year the mining reward will be under half a Bitcoin. To make the same Bitcoin would need to have a price of almost $30000. Transaction fees will overcome the mining reward even sooner. So this will be a problem (or not) sooner then one might think.

Just see what happen after the recent halving and the effect until now that it's proven the price is rising if you compare with the price before halving. I think that if the mining rewards always goes low, the rate of bitcoin will be increasing and it's will be a fair amount of reward equivalent to fiat for those miners to fulfil their needs of mining such as electricity or maintenance and give them some profit out of it.
This problem will be sorted out by the time.

Well, if this is proven, then we all should sell our houses and cars and even take a loan or two and invest it all in Bitcoin. Just wait a few year and we are rich Gentleman. Great!

TastyChillySauce00

legendary

Activity: 3010

Merit: 1028

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: Senor.Bla on January 11, 2017, 05:17:04 AM

Quote from: royalfestus on January 11, 2017, 05:07:18 AM

Quote from: Cereberus on January 09, 2017, 03:50:33 PM

Mining end in the year 2140 so in my opinion is the last thing we should worry about as I am pretty sure we will all be dead and forgotten at that year 2140.

As others have already said then it would depend on transaction fees and also bitcoin will not end but it will be extra expensive as there will be only this amount of bitcoin in circulation(21mln coins) and if people by then decide not to sell than the price should only go up.

It is thoughtful to know that it will end in 2140,beside it is a proposed date. Mining of new bitcoin can end but mining to gain transaction fee continues, due the infinity block of network more so this process is also rewarded.

In about 20 year the mining reward will be under half a Bitcoin. To make the same Bitcoin would need to have a price of almost $30000. Transaction fees will overcome the mining reward even sooner. So this will be a problem (or not) sooner then one might think.

Just see what happen after the recent halving and the effect until now that it's proven the price is rising if you compare with the price before halving. I think that if the mining rewards always goes low, the rate of bitcoin will be increasing and it's will be a fair amount of reward equivalent to fiat for those miners to fulfil their needs of mining such as electricity or maintenance and give them some profit out of it.
This problem will be sorted out by the time.

noictib

hero member

Activity: 966

Merit: 515

One of the world's leading Bitcoin-powered casinos

Quote from: st0nefish on January 09, 2017, 07:45:23 AM

At the moment the miners for a block are awarded 12.5 BTC. Every 4 years this value will fall by half. For example, let's imagine that the prize value is 1.5 BTC for each block and that BTC's value against the dollar does not increase. In such a case, mining will not be very profitable.

At the same time, miners are also benefiting from the value of the fee. This time the fee values will increase. Then people will have to pay a high fee for bitcoin transfer. The biggest advantage of the Bitcoin system against banking systems was that they could shop without paying commissions to any brokerage house. If this happens, can bitcoin preference be reduced?

You question is no much complicated because , If mining reward will became low or stop then it is sure that a new rule will come into play to earn bitcoin by supporting mining .
Because if mining reward decrease or stop then the system of bitcoin transaction will stop , so to make bitcoin and its transaction live the bitcoin system will provide additional reward .
So don't worry , if you can than make mining Wink

Senor.Bla

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 253

Quote from: royalfestus on January 11, 2017, 05:07:18 AM

Quote from: Cereberus on January 09, 2017, 03:50:33 PM

Mining end in the year 2140 so in my opinion is the last thing we should worry about as I am pretty sure we will all be dead and forgotten at that year 2140.

As others have already said then it would depend on transaction fees and also bitcoin will not end but it will be extra expensive as there will be only this amount of bitcoin in circulation(21mln coins) and if people by then decide not to sell than the price should only go up.

It is thoughtful to know that it will end in 2140,beside it is a proposed date. Mining of new bitcoin can end but mining to gain transaction fee continues, due the infinity block of network more so this process is also rewarded.

In about 20 year the mining reward will be under half a Bitcoin. To make the same Bitcoin would need to have a price of almost $30000. Transaction fees will overcome the mining reward even sooner. So this will be a problem (or not) sooner then one might think.

royalfestus

hero member

Activity: 2464

Merit: 519

Quote from: Cereberus on January 09, 2017, 03:50:33 PM

Mining end in the year 2140 so in my opinion is the last thing we should worry about as I am pretty sure we will all be dead and forgotten at that year 2140.

As others have already said then it would depend on transaction fees and also bitcoin will not end but it will be extra expensive as there will be only this amount of bitcoin in circulation(21mln coins) and if people by then decide not to sell than the price should only go up.

It is thoughtful to know that it will end in 2140,beside it is a proposed date. Mining of new bitcoin can end but mining to gain transaction fee continues, due the infinity block of network more so this process is also rewarded.

Topic: If the mining profits decrease, will Bitcoin end? (Read 3040 times)