is it fair? | Bitcointalksearch.org

Quickseller

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Quote from: unholycactus on October 12, 2015, 02:32:25 AM

Quote from: Quickseller on October 12, 2015, 12:41:55 AM

I think goose made a pretty good arguement in support of buying accounts with preexisting trust:

Quote from: goose20 on October 03, 2015, 08:19:55 AM

I remember having an ~~argument~~ discussion with a good friend 6 or so months ago about the buying and selling of accounts on here. He seeing no issues with it, and me dead against it. He is a succussful businessman and likened it to goodwill of a business when that business is sold. Although that goodwill was built by the previous owner it still survives in the business under the new owner and is valued with a considerable premium and so on... I likened it to a personal credit rating - it is a rating for that person alone, it cannot be traded and should not be traded and so on.

--snip--

I think comparing account trust to a company's goodwill is pretty weak too. I like his comparison better.

Companies goodwill is not defined by the biggest stakeholder, at least for the most part.
As opposed to account trust which is worth nothing more than whoever holds it.

Most people that trade on here that use their trust ratings to assist in conducting business, are doing so in ways very similar to a business. There are few people who frequently trade who are willing to accept trades that are not financially advantageous to them (eg they engage in trades that they expect to earn a profit from).

ndnh

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Quote from: unholycactus on October 12, 2015, 02:32:25 AM

Quote from: Quickseller on October 12, 2015, 12:41:55 AM

I think goose made a pretty good arguement in support of buying accounts with preexisting trust:

Quote from: goose20 on October 03, 2015, 08:19:55 AM

I remember having an ~~argument~~ discussion with a good friend 6 or so months ago about the buying and selling of accounts on here. He seeing no issues with it, and me dead against it. He is a succussful businessman and likened it to goodwill of a business when that business is sold. Although that goodwill was built by the previous owner it still survives in the business under the new owner and is valued with a considerable premium and so on... I likened it to a personal credit rating - it is a rating for that person alone, it cannot be traded and should not be traded and so on.

--snip--

I think comparing account trust to a company's goodwill is pretty weak too. I like his comparison better.

Companies goodwill is not defined by the biggest stakeholder, at least for the most part.
As opposed to account trust which is worth nothing more than whoever holds it.

I agree. A company is a separate legal entity while a forum account is certainly not.
Moreover, we have a legal system to protect against using the reputation of a company for malicious purposes, while it mostly becomes unenforceable and impractical (to a significant degree) in case of forum accounts. (Relative anonymity, near zero chance of claiming damages etc.)

I think it is only fair to remove previous trust feedbacks if an account changes hands (at least when the community comes to know about it).

mexxer-2

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Quote from: subSTRATA on October 12, 2015, 02:52:47 AM

Quote from: mexxer-2 on October 12, 2015, 02:44:37 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 02:41:48 AM

I was curious to know this.Thanks this clarifies everything about trust system.
Can anyone tell me how the forum DefaultTrust users are chosed? like vod is trusted and if he just give someone negative then most of the people can see his red trust so how can someone someone count in default trust? does that mean vod is in DT list of everyone?

You are going off-topic on your own thread, at any rate the explanation.
Theymos(admin) chooses people for depth 1 of DefaultTrust, and people on defaulttrust depth 2 are chosen by people on depth 1. So whenever a defaulttrust member level 1 member (say vod) adds QS to his trust list, QS would now be in defaulttrust depth two and so on. By default you only trust defaultTrust members up to depth 2.

i think vod is in depth 2 actually. he's on dooglus's list.

Oh and all the while I thought he was in level 1, he's a guy who deserves to be placed in level 1. At any rate, did you get the answer to your questions yet OP?

subSTRATA

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:^)

Quote from: mexxer-2 on October 12, 2015, 02:44:37 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 02:41:48 AM

I was curious to know this.Thanks this clarifies everything about trust system.
Can anyone tell me how the forum DefaultTrust users are chosed? like vod is trusted and if he just give someone negative then most of the people can see his red trust so how can someone someone count in default trust? does that mean vod is in DT list of everyone?

You are going off-topic on your own thread, at any rate the explanation.
Theymos(admin) chooses people for depth 1 of DefaultTrust, and people on defaulttrust depth 2 are chosen by people on depth 1. So whenever a defaulttrust member level 1 member (say vod) adds QS to his trust list, QS would now be in defaulttrust depth two and so on. By default you only trust defaultTrust members up to depth 2.

i think vod is in depth 2 actually. he's on dooglus's list.

mexxer-2

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Activity: 924

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Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 02:41:48 AM

I was curious to know this.Thanks this clarifies everything about trust system.
Can anyone tell me how the forum DefaultTrust users are chosed? like vod is trusted and if he just give someone negative then most of the people can see his red trust so how can someone someone count in default trust? does that mean vod is in DT list of everyone?

You are going off-topic on your own thread, at any rate the explanation.
Theymos(admin) chooses people for depth 1 of DefaultTrust, and people on defaulttrust depth 2 are chosen by people on depth 1. So whenever a defaulttrust member level 1 member (say vod) adds QS to his trust list, QS would now be in defaulttrust depth two and so on. By default you only trust defaultTrust members up to depth 2.

Anmol_Verma

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Quote from: Quickseller on October 12, 2015, 01:34:37 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:30:50 AM

Quote from: dogie on October 12, 2015, 01:28:07 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:22:58 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:16:54 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:13:38 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

yes they can but i doubt users in DT would sell their reputation on selling their positive feedback, but if they do they will likely be removed from the DT and the feedback they gave will be nothing in value

is there any list of DT members.where can i see who are DT member and what's the difference between trusted and untrusted feedback?

See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust with an unedited trust list to see DefaultTrust members (depth 1 and 2). A trusted feedback is from someone from your personal trust list, untrusted from someone outside your personal trust list. If you've not edited your trust list, that corresponds exactly to DefaultTrust.

So it means if i just remove everyone from my personal default trust list then i will never recieve trust red feedback even if they send me?

If you were to do this then any trust that you receive will not show up by default to you, however it may or may not show up by default to someone else looking at your trust depending on if the person sending you the trust is on the person's trust network who is looking at your trust.

If someone is on the Default Trust network, then they will most likely have their trust show up by default.

I was curious to know this.Thanks this clarifies everything about trust system.
Can anyone tell me how the forum DefaultTrust users are chosed? like vod is trusted and if he just give someone negative then most of the people can see his red trust so how can someone someone count in default trust? does that mean vod is in DT list of everyone?

unholycactus

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Quote from: Quickseller on October 12, 2015, 12:41:55 AM

I think goose made a pretty good arguement in support of buying accounts with preexisting trust:

Quote from: goose20 on October 03, 2015, 08:19:55 AM

I remember having an ~~argument~~ discussion with a good friend 6 or so months ago about the buying and selling of accounts on here. He seeing no issues with it, and me dead against it. He is a succussful businessman and likened it to goodwill of a business when that business is sold. Although that goodwill was built by the previous owner it still survives in the business under the new owner and is valued with a considerable premium and so on... I likened it to a personal credit rating - it is a rating for that person alone, it cannot be traded and should not be traded and so on.

--snip--

I think comparing account trust to a company's goodwill is pretty weak too. I like his comparison better.

Companies goodwill is not defined by the biggest stakeholder, at least for the most part.
As opposed to account trust which is worth nothing more than whoever holds it.

Quickseller

copper member

Activity: 2996

Merit: 2374

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:30:50 AM

Quote from: dogie on October 12, 2015, 01:28:07 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:22:58 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:16:54 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:13:38 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

yes they can but i doubt users in DT would sell their reputation on selling their positive feedback, but if they do they will likely be removed from the DT and the feedback they gave will be nothing in value

is there any list of DT members.where can i see who are DT member and what's the difference between trusted and untrusted feedback?

See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust with an unedited trust list to see DefaultTrust members (depth 1 and 2). A trusted feedback is from someone from your personal trust list, untrusted from someone outside your personal trust list. If you've not edited your trust list, that corresponds exactly to DefaultTrust.

So it means if i just remove everyone from my personal default trust list then i will never recieve trust red feedback even if they send me?

If you were to do this then any trust that you receive will not show up by default to you, however it may or may not show up by default to someone else looking at your trust depending on if the person sending you the trust is on the person's trust network who is looking at your trust.

If someone is on the Default Trust network, then they will most likely have their trust show up by default.

mexxer-2

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Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:30:50 AM

So it means if i just remove everyone from my personal default trust list then i will never recieve trust red feedback even if they send me?

You will recieve them and other will view it by default, you will just not see any rating on your account

Anmol_Verma

member

Activity: 112

Merit: 10

Quote from: dogie on October 12, 2015, 01:28:07 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:22:58 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:16:54 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:13:38 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

yes they can but i doubt users in DT would sell their reputation on selling their positive feedback, but if they do they will likely be removed from the DT and the feedback they gave will be nothing in value

is there any list of DT members.where can i see who are DT member and what's the difference between trusted and untrusted feedback?

See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust with an unedited trust list to see DefaultTrust members (depth 1 and 2). A trusted feedback is from someone from your personal trust list, untrusted from someone outside your personal trust list. If you've not edited your trust list, that corresponds exactly to DefaultTrust.

So it means if i just remove everyone from my personal default trust list then i will never recieve trust red feedback even if they send me?

dogie

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dogiecoin.com

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:22:58 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:16:54 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:13:38 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

yes they can but i doubt users in DT would sell their reputation on selling their positive feedback, but if they do they will likely be removed from the DT and the feedback they gave will be nothing in value

is there any list of DT members.where can i see who are DT member and what's the difference between trusted and untrusted feedback?

See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust with an unedited trust list to see DefaultTrust members (depth 1 and 2). A trusted feedback is from someone from your personal trust list, untrusted from someone outside your personal trust list. If you've not edited your trust list, that corresponds exactly to DefaultTrust.

mexxer-2

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 1005

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Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:22:58 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:16:54 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:13:38 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

yes they can but i doubt users in DT would sell their reputation on selling their positive feedback, but if they do they will likely be removed from the DT and the feedback they gave will be nothing in value

is there any list of DT members.where can i see who are DT member and what's the difference between trusted and untrusted feedback?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust this is the trust list , and the defaultTrust members are there considering you have never visited that page and updated the trust list. Trusted feedback- feedback from someone you trust(defaultTrust members) and untrusted , all other persons that you don't trust.

Anmol_Verma

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Activity: 112

Merit: 10

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:16:54 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:13:38 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

yes they can but i doubt users in DT would sell their reputation on selling their positive feedback, but if they do they will likely be removed from the DT and the feedback they gave will be nothing in value

is there any list of DT members.where can i see who are DT member and what's the difference between trusted and untrusted feedback?

Decoded

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give me your cryptos

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 01:13:38 AM

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

yes they can but i doubt users in DT would sell their reputation on selling their positive feedback, but if they do they will likely be removed from the DT and the feedback they gave will be nothing in value

Anmol_Verma

member

Activity: 112

Merit: 10

Quote from: Decoded on October 12, 2015, 01:04:41 AM

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

Then I can say that buying trust can't be stopped too.People can just pm others secretly and offer some bitcoins for trust instead of writing openly.right?

Decoded

legendary

Activity: 1232

Merit: 1030

give me your cryptos

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 12:54:34 AM

Quote from: jacee on October 12, 2015, 12:43:10 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 12:34:58 AM

i wanted to ask this question is it fair that people buy and sell forum accounts on the forum without any issue but when someone try to buy trust,he receives -ve trust.why?
i mean they can buy accounts with positive trust.How it can make them trustworthy?

Buying an account and buying trust are two different things. You could hardly see a forum account with a positive trust on sale.

People buy accounts not for the trust feedbacks but for the rank.
Buying and selling of accounts are allowed in the forum while buying trust is not. That should answer your question why people who buy trust gets the -ve.

what if someone buys hero member account and then just do 1 trade here to get +ve trust thus making him trustworthy?
i think forum accounts positions should also be earned and account selling should be banned just as buying trust.

this is already discussed before, buying/selling accounts cant be stopped as who will know if the account is sold or not but for the trust it should be earned, someone could it earn trust in many ways not only when trading.

FruitsBasket

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Activity: 1232

Merit: 1017

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 12:54:34 AM

Quote from: jacee on October 12, 2015, 12:43:10 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 12:34:58 AM

i wanted to ask this question is it fair that people buy and sell forum accounts on the forum without any issue but when someone try to buy trust,he receives -ve trust.why?
i mean they can buy accounts with positive trust.How it can make them trustworthy?

Buying an account and buying trust are two different things. You could hardly see a forum account with a positive trust on sale.

People buy accounts not for the trust feedbacks but for the rank.
Buying and selling of accounts are allowed in the forum while buying trust is not. That should answer your question why people who buy trust gets the -ve.

what if someone buys hero member account and then just do 1 trade here to get +ve trust thus making him trustworthy?
i think forum accounts positions should also be earned and account selling should be banned just as buying trust.

Even if that was banned, people will still sell accounts, but then secretly through other forums or so.
I would say let it be like it is now. Will people leave -ve trust when you sell a green trust account?

Anmol_Verma

member

Activity: 112

Merit: 10

Quote from: jacee on October 12, 2015, 12:43:10 AM

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 12:34:58 AM

i wanted to ask this question is it fair that people buy and sell forum accounts on the forum without any issue but when someone try to buy trust,he receives -ve trust.why?
i mean they can buy accounts with positive trust.How it can make them trustworthy?

Buying an account and buying trust are two different things. You could hardly see a forum account with a positive trust on sale.

People buy accounts not for the trust feedbacks but for the rank.
Buying and selling of accounts are allowed in the forum while buying trust is not. That should answer your question why people who buy trust gets the -ve.

what if someone buys hero member account and then just do 1 trade here to get +ve trust thus making him trustworthy?
i think forum accounts positions should also be earned and account selling should be banned just as buying trust.

jacee

legendary

Activity: 1302

Merit: 1025

Quote from: Anmol_Verma on October 12, 2015, 12:34:58 AM

i wanted to ask this question is it fair that people buy and sell forum accounts on the forum without any issue but when someone try to buy trust,he receives -ve trust.why?
i mean they can buy accounts with positive trust.How it can make them trustworthy?

Buying an account and buying trust are two different things. You could hardly see a forum account with a positive trust on sale.

People buy accounts not for the trust feedbacks but for the rank.
Buying and selling of accounts are allowed in the forum while buying trust is not. That should answer your question why people who buy trust gets the -ve.

Quickseller

copper member

Activity: 2996

Merit: 2374

I think goose made a pretty good arguement in support of buying accounts with preexisting trust:

Quote from: goose20 on October 03, 2015, 08:19:55 AM

I remember having an ~~argument~~ discussion with a good friend 6 or so months ago about the buying and selling of accounts on here. He seeing no issues with it, and me dead against it. He is a succussful businessman and likened it to goodwill of a business when that business is sold. Although that goodwill was built by the previous owner it still survives in the business under the new owner and is valued with a considerable premium and so on... I likened it to a personal credit rating - it is a rating for that person alone, it cannot be traded and should not be traded and so on.

--snip--

Topic: is it fair? (Read 1109 times)