Is it possible to build a chat/(group chat) app on top of lightning network?

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: Kprawn on November 24, 2019, 02:46:27 AM

Just to be clear... Do you want some chat feature built into the Lightning Network software to enable LN Hubs to talk to each other or do you want

a chat application like Whatsapp or WeChat that incorporates the Lightning Network as a internal currency with some kind of plugin? There is need

for both of these applications, but the one for a large Social media platform would be better for Bitcoin adoption. Wink

I think these companies would

create their own Crypto currency, because they would want to control all aspects of it. Roll Eyes

You cannot add a currency feature and then rely on

external influences to determine the future of that technology.

People need the chat feature built into the Lightning Network software to enable LN Hubs to talk to each other.
The world needs a fully noncustodial chat software build on the Lightning network.
This will truly protect privacy.

Kprawn

legendary

Activity: 1904

Merit: 1074

Just to be clear... Do you want some chat feature built into the Lightning Network software to enable LN Hubs to talk to each other or do you want

a chat application like Whatsapp or WeChat that incorporates the Lightning Network as a internal currency with some kind of plugin? There is need

for both of these applications, but the one for a large Social media platform would be better for Bitcoin adoption. Wink

I think these companies would

create their own Crypto currency, because they would want to control all aspects of it. Roll Eyes

You cannot add a currency feature and then rely on

external influences to determine the future of that technology.

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: bitmover on November 23, 2019, 11:43:37 PM

https://sphinx.chat/

That's another similar service. But have to wait for the invite.

Kyraishi

hero member

Activity: 952

Merit: 513

Quote from: RapTarX on November 23, 2019, 12:38:05 AM

For what purpose? I don't think it's needed if you are thinking it's needed for discussion & learning or even getting help. Because, you can learn everything here in the forum. A lot of legendary are here to help you and figure out if any problem you face to. I have recently had some discussion on Lightning Network and it's my pleasure that I have learnt a lot from the forum.
By the way, a beginners guide to learn basic about Lightning Network if anyone is interested- https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/a-beginners-guideline-to-bitcoin-lightning-network-5202798

It'll be pretty interesting - imagine being able to talk to people in a way where you can't be controlled, and then also being able to send payments via the same messaging system, it'll be a sorta, super platform, in very simple man terms.

I'm not sure about the DDOS threat to it though, wouldn't it be pretty hard for someone to do, unless they had a lot, a lot of power?

The lightning network can actually do a lot of stuff, not just send and receive payments in a fast manner.

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

Quote from: free-sats on November 23, 2019, 09:56:53 PM

Someone is doing this, check this out: https://twitter.com/joostjgr/status/1190714028626251779

There is a beta test already!

You should check it out.

https://sphinx.chat/

Someone on twitter asked something interesting: People could DDoS the lightning network with such a service. Need to think a way to prevent that.

There are even more interesting things that could happen inside such a platform. Merchants over the world could use that chat app to receive payments as well, not only messages.

Sadlife

sr. member

Activity: 1400

Merit: 269

Yes you can there are a lot of tutorials online to do that but i dont think it can be pretty much of use when you can communicate with people here who uses lighting network there are a million user in the forum and building an app taking everything from scratch can be very hard. You can find good piece of information here if that is your after. You can even communicate with the devs here and ask for support if you're having some sort of a problem.

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: Eugenar on November 23, 2019, 09:34:22 PM

There's really no neew building a chat app on top of the lightning network. We already have efficient applications even in the regular network, we need the lightning network for faster transactions such as transacting cryptocurrency. If we want to build a chat application, then use basic platforms.

I think there is a need to build a chat app on top of the lightning network.
Someone is doing this, check this out: https://twitter.com/joostjgr/status/1190714028626251779

Eugenar

sr. member

Activity: 1274

Merit: 278

Quote from: free-sats on November 23, 2019, 12:46:56 AM

I don't think you get my point.
I'm saying people should build a chat app on top of the lightning network, not a chat app about lighting network.

I don't think you're getting his point either. There's really no neew building a chat app on top of the lightning network. We already have efficient applications even in the regular network, we need the lightning network for faster transactions such as transacting cryptocurrency. If we want to build a chat application, then use basic platforms.

I am not against your plan, but for me, it is possible, if you really want then try it, maybe you could provide features from the lightning network which is quite better than usual apps.

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: bitmover on November 23, 2019, 09:06:47 PM

They will lose in fees. To open channel and to leave channel.
Also, there are fees in lightning network. But they are small
So in average people will pay to chat .

But people get their privacy, think it as a kind of paid service for privacy.

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

Quote from: free-sats on November 23, 2019, 07:41:16 PM

So people won't lose any satoshi on average.

They will lose in fees. To open channel and to leave channel.

Also, there are fees in lightning network. But they are small
So in average people will pay to chat .

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: Artemis3 on November 23, 2019, 05:26:50 PM

There are many other "open source private messengers" (even p2p), that don't happen to require satoshis for sending messages. This idea is nonsense, it can be done from a theoretical point of view but its pointless and I wouldn't use it.

You need satoshi to send messages, but you also get satoshi to receive messages. So people won't lose any satoshi on average.
Lightning wallet and chat software can be integrated into one app. I will use it. If they can support group chat in the future, it can be a game changer in social media.

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: bitmover on November 23, 2019, 01:16:42 PM

Also, once the channel is closed, messages would be lost, as far as I understand the lightning network. The messages wouldn't be on chain.

That can be a feature.

Quote from: bitmover on November 23, 2019, 01:16:42 PM

If you are thinking only about privacy, certainly there are better alternatives for a chat. Look for some Privacy friendly open source chat app here
Privacytools.io

I will learn about Privacytools.io. Thanks.
But chatting over Lightning is cool & exciting.

Artemis3

legendary

Activity: 2030

Merit: 1573

CLEAN non GPL infringing code made in Rust lang

Quote from: hatshepsut93 on November 23, 2019, 03:14:57 PM

Someone has already made it just recently

It's pretty cool compared to Whatsapp and other private messengers, because the software is open source and the app is decentralized, so there's less risks of backdoors or third parties storing logs of communication (even if the messages are encrypted, it still can be pretty bad). I don't know if this Whatsat messenger is encrypted or not, but it's always possible to implement end-to-end encryption.

There are many other "open source private messengers" (even p2p), that don't happen to require satoshis for sending messages. This idea is nonsense, it can be done from a theoretical point of view but its pointless and I wouldn't use it.

Take a look at the Tox protocol for better alternatives.

Whatsapp is one of the worst messengers you could possibly ever use.

hatshepsut93

legendary

Activity: 3038

Merit: 2162

Someone has already made it just recently - https://www.bitcoinlightning.com/whatsat-send-private-messages-via-the-lightning-network/

It's pretty cool compared to Whatsapp and other private messengers, because the software is open source and the app is decentralized, so there's less risks of backdoors or third parties storing logs of communication (even if the messages are encrypted, it still can be pretty bad). I don't know if this Whatsat messenger is encrypted or not, but it's always possible to implement end-to-end encryption.

bitmover

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 6089

bitcoindata.science

Quote from: free-sats on November 23, 2019, 01:32:38 AM

1 sat can be devided to 1000 pieces on the lightning network. So it's gonna be extreme cheap to send messages on the lightning network.
The message can be encoded, it's only stored on the user's device.
Centralized servers are still much faster generally in performance, but people need privacy and centralized servers will not protect their privacy.

The problem I see is that users would have to pay to be able to chat (to open the channel) .

Also, once the channel is closed, messages would be lost, as far as I understand the lightning network. The messages wouldn't be on chain.

If you are thinking only about privacy, certainly there are better alternatives for a chat. Look for some Privacy friendly open source chat app here
Privacytools.io

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: q3579338 on November 23, 2019, 06:15:16 AM

send one word and my friend receive afer one block?

No, it will be build on Lightning, not on chain BTC.

q3579338

jr. member

Activity: 54

Merit: 1

send one word and my friend receive afer one block?

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: joniboini on November 23, 2019, 01:52:07 AM

Why not apply end to end encryption or PGP?
LN is not made for that purpose. Even if you want to do it, you'll need to open a channel here and there. Pretty sure end users wouldn't want to do that and just stick with whatsapp with a fake number.

LN can give people a new option to communicate with each other and keep their privacy.
You don't need to open a channel to every people.

joniboini

legendary

Activity: 2170

Merit: 1789

Why not apply end to end encryption or PGP?

LN is not made for that purpose. Even if you want to do it, you'll need to open a channel here and there. Pretty sure end users wouldn't want to do that and just stick with whatsapp with a fake number.

free-sats

newbie

Activity: 16

Merit: 3

Quote from: proxydomain711 on November 23, 2019, 12:57:57 AM

Lightning network has fees when you send something, pretty much like a transaction data, only messages this time. Another thing is that there are already a lot of applications dedicated solely for this purpose.

Another thing to point out is the decentralization that comes into play in Lightning Network. It would bring 2 main disadvantages; [1] It would make private data somehow insecure, since it is stored in individual nodes rather that governed under a centralized secured server, and [2] Even though Lightning Network is faster than the typical blockchain in terms of response time, centralized servers are still much faster generally in performance, which is essential in having an app with the purpose of communication.

1 sat can be devided to 1000 pieces on the lightning network. So it's gonna be extreme cheap to send messages on the lightning network.
The message can be encoded, it's only stored on the user's device.
Centralized servers are still much faster generally in performance, but people need privacy and centralized servers will not protect their privacy.

Topic: Is it possible to build a chat/(group chat) app on top of lightning network? (Read 262 times)