Is Silk Road the best setup to handle commerce??

BitcoinSEC

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Quote from: BkkCoins on October 10, 2011, 10:40:27 PM

They should set SR up so you can access it thru the normal web and see legal products. But if you go thru Tor then additional products show up. That way it could handle all products and expand it's customer base dramatically (not sure of the ability to detect if Tor is used though but presuming it can select content based on origin).

First of all, there is nothing illegal about using TOR. TOR is great. My buddy whose stationed in Iraq uses TOR all the time to prevent people attacking his computer. Second, visiting SR is not illegal either. SR does sell drugs and "illegal" items but SR is worldwide. What may be illegal in one county doesn't mean its illegal in another. SR is a marketplace, and any intelligent adult should know the laws of his country and the risks involved when making a purchase from that site. In addition, SR offers many legal products, and when I say legal I'm talking about US laws. It can very from computer programmers to math tutors, SR offers more than drugs.

BitcoinPorn

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What are the requirements to become a Silk Road seller? How does a person go about that?

I figure a few things you could drop off as requirements if you were not concerned about the legality of your goods. I would love to sell people on the idea of taking their merchandise to the marketplace that supports alternative goods.

WiseOldOwl

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Quote from: MoonShadow on October 11, 2011, 08:50:01 PM

Quote from: Electrongolf on October 11, 2011, 07:52:40 PM

We need to find a 'killer app'. If a product is valuable enough, people will support a system to keep the product easily accessible.

If VALVe would only start accepting bitcoin directly in Steam...

"That would be sweet"
- Beavis

MoonShadow

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Quote from: Electrongolf on October 11, 2011, 07:52:40 PM

We need to find a 'killer app'. If a product is valuable enough, people will support a system to keep the product easily accessible.

If VALVe would only start accepting bitcoin directly in Steam...

Electrongolf

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What's Your Gig?

I don't know if Silk Road has the best setup for commerce. If they do, I'm sure there are people here who could easily duplicate the system.

The fact is, Silk Road provides products with value proposition that cash can't match. Silk Road works because it has to work. People have bought into the system. Trust is the only way to keep this exclusive product available.

With online wallets like MyBitcoin, there is no incentive to be honest. There is no guarantee that people will continue to use your wallet service, because there is no product/service that guarantees people will continue to use BTC. You can make more money stealing than improving the system.

We need to find a 'killer app'. If a product is valuable enough, people will support a system to keep the product easily accessible.

FreeTrade

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Quote from: Shortline on October 11, 2011, 10:13:49 AM

This is how the majority of the world buys regular crap, from ebay. Bitcoin appears to be absolutely irrelevant to this process.

The eBay/Paypal company will never support Bitcoin. A successful Bitcoin requires a credible eBay competitor that accepts Bitcoin.

FreeTrade

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Quote from: WiseOldOwl on October 11, 2011, 06:31:06 PM

...I am talking about cloning their business model. It doesnt have to be on Silk Road. I am just talking about the basic features they have???

The chief problem is not a technical one. The chief problem is adoption - how to get sellers when you have no buyers, and how to get buyers when you have no sellers. Also known as the chicken and egg problem or the network effect. SR solves this by having a very unique selling point - goods that are not available anywhere else on the internet. To replicate with non-controversial goods, you're going up against entrenched competition with a very similar offering. You need very good execution and some good ideas to break into this market.

WiseOldOwl

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...I am talking about cloning their business model. It doesnt have to be on Silk Road. I am just talking about the basic features they have???

netrin

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It would be fine if Silk Road already sold all sorts of things and also happened to have a wide variety of drugs. It would highlight the decentralized unregulated nature of bitcoin. However, given that it is already exclusively in the market for selling illegal goods, any early-adopting legit merchant (with a public identity) would rightly fear that he is committing legal and financial suicide. If it were such a good idea, why aren't merchants cluttering up SR selling graphics cards and socks already?

WiseOldOwl

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Quote from: Shortline on October 11, 2011, 10:13:49 AM

Why would you clone Silk Road for legit stuff? There's already ebay for that, a bigger and better site that supports multiple currencies in multiple countries and has an incredibly large userbase and variety of crap for sale.

I'm not even being facetious here. This is how the majority of the world buys regular crap, from ebay. Bitcoin appears to be absolutely irrelevant to this process.

Just wondering,
Why are you here if you love ebay so much?
I cant believe this is too complicated.
The problem I am solving is a safe BTC commerce site... Why the **** would you suggest ebay if they dont take bitcoins?
Also, the last thing i need is a full definition of their workings, I have been using it since they opened.

I am just saying that the SR has the most btc commerce experience with the least amount of problems, therefore they have the best model.
Its sad when the drug dealers are more legit then a online wallet.

error

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I hate to say it, but Silk Road -- the "black" market -- is the killer app for Bitcoin.

Shortline

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Why would you clone Silk Road for legit stuff? There's already ebay for that, a bigger and better site that supports multiple currencies in multiple countries and has an incredibly large userbase and variety of crap for sale.

I'm not even being facetious here. This is how the majority of the world buys regular crap, from ebay. Bitcoin appears to be absolutely irrelevant to this process.

WiseOldOwl

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Activity: 238

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Quote from: BkkCoins on October 10, 2011, 10:40:27 PM

They should set SR up so you can access it thru the normal web and see legal products. But if you go thru Tor then additional products show up. That way it could handle all products and expand it's customer base dramatically (not sure of the ability to detect if Tor is used though but presuming it can select content based on origin).

Quote from: FreeTrade on October 10, 2011, 10:30:58 PM

Quote from: WiseOldOwl on October 10, 2011, 01:06:50 PM

Anyways, It dawned on me that despite it being a blemish on the bitcoin surface, it could very well be a strength we haven't been using.
What if we flooded it with legitimate stuff, like graphics cards and trillion dollar notes

I agree with you - Silk Road does most things right. However it is set up so that it needs to be accessed through Tor, so that's a major usability hit.

Someone mentioned a 'sister site' - that's exactly where the opportunity is. A site that runs on the regular old WWW with pretty much the same model as 'Silk Road'/'Ebay Stores', dealing only in uncontroversial goods. See the link in my sig for more info.

In my first post I said clone the site. Rename it and make it more accessible.

EhVedadoOAnonimato

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Silk Road is a retailer. I mean, a market for retailers. Other bitcoin retailers have been working rather successfully too. The main difficulty has been with e-wallets. It's true that Silk Road has an e-wallet, but I don't think people keep much money there, only enough to conduct their transactions, so there's neither much incentive for the site operators to cheat, nor for someone else to try to hack it. And well, I suppose someone willing to pioneer such a risky venture is not a newbie on security/privacy either.

netrin

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Quote from: cm68jd on October 11, 2011, 02:25:39 AM

(if an ATM was cheating people it would probably be smashed with a bat before it could cheat too many more).

A bigger issue is when the ATM cheats the operator. I have vivid memories of an ATM on campus that dolled out $20's rather than $10's, I've never seen a 'secret' spread so quickly. 'Customers' quickly established a protocol, two transaction per customer before returning to the end of the line. By lunch time, the queue went around the block. I was amazed an ATM could hold so many pieces of paper.

repentance

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Quote from: cm68jd on October 11, 2011, 02:25:39 AM

Get bitcoin ATMs that function as normal ATMs and can give fiat currency exchanged from your bitcoin wallet would effectively kill western union. Its user friendly, "intuitive" (because of people's previous experience with ATMs) and does not require a lot of trust (if an ATM was cheating people it would probably be smashed with a bat before it could cheat too many more).

The thing is that converting BTC to local currency involves somebody buying your Bitcoins. You need to find a counter-party who's willing to do that at the time you want to convert them, and I don't really see anyone being willing to buy unlimited amounts of Bitcoins at the spot rate - which is effectively what an ATM operator would be doing when giving you instant cash in exchange for your Bitcoins. The fees the operators would have to charge in order to make operating such a service viable would almost certainly be too high for anyone who isn't absolutely desperate for cash right this moment to use them.

cm68jd

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Quote from: BkkCoins on October 10, 2011, 08:46:01 PM

Quote from: defxor on October 10, 2011, 04:29:27 PM

1) Replace Western Union. Seriously. Their fees are enormous, yet it's usually the only option for resellers of grey area items (modchips for games consoles etc). That these companies haven't already switched to Bitcoin surprises me a lot, they transfer quite a lot of money.

I'd love to see that and it's something that could work very well but it needs some organization to figure out how, spearhead it, package it and make it widespread enough to be useful. The tough part is that no one is going to bother being an agent unless they get something for it. So you need to allow for that in the fees, and to some extent you end up back at WU rates. (I've used Moneygram several times internationally as a lower cost method)

Get bitcoin ATMs that function as normal ATMs and can give fiat currency exchanged from your bitcoin wallet would effectively kill western union. Its user friendly, "intuitive" (because of people's previous experience with ATMs) and does not require a lot of trust (if an ATM was cheating people it would probably be smashed with a bat before it could cheat too many more).

netrin

sr. member

Activity: 322

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FirstBits: 168Bc

Look guys, it's quite simple. A legal entity does not want to be associated with SR. Generally a legit merchant wants to look legit. He might be selling lines of coke to school children in the back, but his front window is clean as a whistle.

BkkCoins

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They should set SR up so you can access it thru the normal web and see legal products. But if you go thru Tor then additional products show up. That way it could handle all products and expand it's customer base dramatically (not sure of the ability to detect if Tor is used though but presuming it can select content based on origin).

FreeTrade

legendary

Activity: 1428

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Quote from: WiseOldOwl on October 10, 2011, 01:06:50 PM

Anyways, It dawned on me that despite it being a blemish on the bitcoin surface, it could very well be a strength we haven't been using.
What if we flooded it with legitimate stuff, like graphics cards and trillion dollar notes

I agree with you - Silk Road does most things right. However it is set up so that it needs to be accessed through Tor, so that's a major usability hit.

Someone mentioned a 'sister site' - that's exactly where the opportunity is. A site that runs on the regular old WWW with pretty much the same model as 'Silk Road'/'Ebay Stores', dealing only in uncontroversial goods. See the link in my sig for more info.

Topic: Is Silk Road the best setup to handle commerce?? (Read 4053 times)