"Is the bubble about to burst?" - page 3.

Ultegra134

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Quote from: pooya87 on November 27, 2021, 03:15:04 AM

Quote from: Ultegra134 on November 27, 2021, 02:54:18 AM

However, I'm pointing out that these few people, who are holding most of Bitcoin, can definitely play a vital role in the market.

They can but they don't.
Most early adopters aren't participating in the market, they own bitcoin either through mining or having bought it and are either holding it or using it (getting paid or paying others) as a currency. That doesn't affect the market in any ways.

Your observation about the article is correct though. The view of the author is a naive one that I believe mainly comes from looking at useless tokens and altcoins that are created to only be pumped and dumped. If you look at other posts by the author they are always talking about doomsday of financial markets with similar naive interpretations. The author also seems to have a great love for possible central bank issued shitcoin which tells you a lot about their views.

Just had a look around to confirm what you said, most of their articles are focused on endless economic bubbles that are all about to burst or talking about the cryptocurrency bubble we've been hearing for quite a few years now. I don't believe that any kind of "Financial reset" is going to happen, regarding cryptos, I get that there can be periods where the market is bearish for quite a few months (or even a few years, back in 2017), and it's actually normal to be honest.

pooya87

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Quote from: Ultegra134 on November 27, 2021, 02:54:18 AM

However, I'm pointing out that these few people, who are holding most of Bitcoin, can definitely play a vital role in the market.

They can but they don't.
Most early adopters aren't participating in the market, they own bitcoin either through mining or having bought it and are either holding it or using it (getting paid or paying others) as a currency. That doesn't affect the market in any ways.

Your observation about the article is correct though. The view of the author is a naive one that I believe mainly comes from looking at useless tokens and altcoins that are created to only be pumped and dumped. If you look at other posts by the author they are always talking about doomsday of financial markets with similar naive interpretations. The author also seems to have a great love for possible central bank issued shitcoin which tells you a lot about their views.

matjas

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The situation is certainly not ideal for us who follow what is happening in crypto. I am sure a lot of new small investors dont have any idea, how fast can things go south especially because way too much money goes to meme shitcoins and NTFs. For me, NTFs could be the new MtGox, there is just now way all that much content will keep the value in the future.

Ultegra134

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Quote from: Tytanowy Janusz on November 27, 2021, 01:42:25 AM

Quote from: Ultegra134 on November 26, 2021, 05:43:08 PM

While I get that most of Bitcoin is being held by a small percentage of addresses, I'm trying to understand what exactly the point is. Is the article indirectly implying that BTC and crypto in general also being manipulated to a great degree, creating a hype bubble which will eventually burst? You, as someone who looks like he's experienced with such incidents, what do you believe? Are we in a manipulated bubble about to burst? Or did I get it all wrong?

So what? Its always like that and you will never change it. Some people work 10h daily, are smart, brave, others live from social benefits. Some are focused on their hobbies, other or addictions (drugs, alcohol, pornography), others on earning and multiplying capital. One person buy new iPhone as soon as he manage to save 1000$ other use this money to start business or invest in others business. People are different so their wealth must be different.

Its not about who have how many bitcoins. Bitcoin was not created in a way that everyone have 0.01 BTC and force people not to have more or less. Its impossible and in fact it blocks its main purpose (transfer of value).
Once again. Bitcoin was not made to make everyone wealth equal. It was made (one of its purpose) to make everyone chances equal. To transfer value without restrictions, to obtain asset that is not printed out of thin air by single centralized identity. Asset that its purchasing power did not decrease 95% in last 100 years (only because of printing and no max supply). Asset that cannot be seized by anyone.

Focus on your wealth and how you can multiply it instead of looking at others wallets.

I certainly agree, I never implied that Bitcoin was created in order to evenly distribute wealth. However, I'm pointing out that these few people, who are holding most of Bitcoin, can definitely play a vital role in the market. We all had our fair chances of obtaining Bitcoin, and most of us didn't, there's no one to blame for that. Bitcoin (and cryptocurrencies in general) provide us with capabilities that fiat currency cannot.

Tytanowy Janusz

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Quote from: Ultegra134 on November 26, 2021, 05:43:08 PM

While I get that most of Bitcoin is being held by a small percentage of addresses, I'm trying to understand what exactly the point is. Is the article indirectly implying that BTC and crypto in general also being manipulated to a great degree, creating a hype bubble which will eventually burst? You, as someone who looks like he's experienced with such incidents, what do you believe? Are we in a manipulated bubble about to burst? Or did I get it all wrong?

So what? Its always like that and you will never change it. Some people work 10h daily, are smart, brave, others live from social benefits. Some are focused on their hobbies, other or addictions (drugs, alcohol, pornography), others on earning and multiplying capital. One person buy new iPhone as soon as he manage to save 1000$ other use this money to start business or invest in others business. People are different so their wealth must be different.

Its not about who have how many bitcoins. Bitcoin was not created in a way that everyone have 0.01 BTC and force people not to have more or less. Its impossible and in fact it blocks its main purpose (transfer of value).
Once again. Bitcoin was not made to make everyone wealth equal. It was made (one of its purpose) to make everyone chances equal. To transfer value without restrictions, to obtain asset that is not printed out of thin air by single centralized identity. Asset that its purchasing power did not decrease 95% in last 100 years (only because of printing and no max supply). Asset that cannot be seized by anyone.

Focus on your wealth and how you can multiply it instead of looking at others wallets.

mindrust

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Could be. We can't know for sure. Last year it did and then it recovered again. Bubble pop don't necessarily mean it is not going to recover again. Amazon did pop in early 2000's and then it recovered and became bigger and stronger than ever. Sure lots of other tech companies didn't recover and vanished during the dotcom era but who cares? Most of them were shitty companies anyway. Look at pets.com. Who in the right mind would invest in that shit? Yet, lots of people did and lost money. I say they deserved it.

pooya87

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The problem isn't with the statement you quoted, otherwise there are bubbles of different sizes in bitcoin that burst from time to time. We had multiple small bubbles during 2016, 2017, 2019, 2020 and 2021 that burst and we had 2 big bubbles in 2018 and 2014 that burst.

The problem is that some people tend to call everything a "bubble" without even knowing what a bubble means. For example price goes from $1000 to $2000 and they start calling it a bubble just because $2000 is bigger than $1000!!!

The other problem is that some people have very narrow views. They have read a single article about a single bubble (eg. the one in 2017) and now think that every bubble burst has to be the same size meaning a >80% dump!
The reality is that such a huge ~~drop~~ market crash only happens when there is a huge bubble. As I said earlier there are different bubble sizes, a small bubble can not be followed by a massive market crash. For example I have said many times in the past 2 years that if we are to see another 80% crash we first have to see a massive rise to a price like $400k+ otherwise if the rise and the subsequent bubble is small we can no longer expect such a huge crash.

rhomelmabini

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No God or Kings, only BITCOIN.

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 26, 2021, 09:36:02 PM

In any case, @Blawpaw, the writer has the mind of the skeptic and the article is a skeptical view on what is happening behind the cryptospace while the larpers support what they do not really understand. The larpers cheer if bitcoin pumps without questioning why. They only assume that this is because of adoption, a favorite word in the cryptospace hehehe.

But the writer stands that there was no reversal now or it wouldn't happen anymore, so to speak. The real question is, how does this reset gonna happen if we are already are colonized by these crypto elites and who monopolized it, as the writer explains? Seems Nakamoto's vision has been buried already, we may never know but isn't these maximalist are the one pushing as well price stability, correct me if I'm wrong.

tranthidung

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Farewell o_e_l_e_o

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 26, 2021, 09:36:02 PM

It should also make you question Bitcoin’s stock to flow model. What if the stock to flow model is only a marketing tool to trick everyone. What if it is Tether pumping the price to make it appear that the price is moving according to the model.

You don't need to have model to hold your Bitcoin from $10 to above $60,000. It is magic of HODLing!

All models are wrong but some are useful and Stock-to-Flow model is amongst some useful ones. However, as model basics, there are points it will have invalid times but such ones won't make the whole model becomes useless.

If you want to sell your Bitcoin above $100k, let's HODL it and wait till it reaches to that price. Obviously, this advice is not applied for Margin or Leverage trading. Indeed, it is for investment from your free capital and HODLing strategy.

bbc.reporter

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Did anyone read the article? It appears much of you who replied in this thread did not read it.

In any case, @Blawpaw, the writer has the mind of the skeptic and the article is a skeptical view on what is happening behind the cryptospace while the larpers support what they do not really understand. The larpers cheer if bitcoin pumps without questioning why. They only assume that this is because of adoption, a favorite word in the cryptospace hehehe.

It should also make you question Bitcoin’s stock to flow model. What if the stock to flow model is only a marketing tool to trick everyone. What if it is Tether pumping the price to make it appear that the price is moving according to the model.

Oceat

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Quote from: rhomelmabini on November 26, 2021, 04:58:55 PM

We will hear these kind of things when crypto or specifically Bitcoin isn't performing best in the market, and, it never gets old to be perfectly honest. Well, anyone can criticize but Bitcoin is too huge to ignore and I don't think the bubble gonna burst, we heard it years ago.

It seems that people are starting to get worried when Bitcoin price slowly dumping each day. Well, it's just normal to see this and a common reaction to most people when there's a drop since it does happen in the past already and it will going to happen soon in Bitcoin market. But I am still bullish despite of this left and right FUDs from people who just have uncertainty whether they believe that Bitcoin is going to break $70k to $100k or is it just going to dump soon.

I think if Bitcoin drop below to $40k I think that's the start of the bear market since most weak-hands investors would just get out already if it isn't profitable.

Lanatsa

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Quote from: rhomelmabini on November 26, 2021, 04:58:55 PM

We will hear these kind of things when crypto or specifically Bitcoin isn't performing best in the market, and, it never gets old to be perfectly honest. Well, anyone can criticize but Bitcoin is too huge to ignore and I don't think the bubble gonna burst, we heard it years ago.

Bitcoin is going to die
Bitcoin bubble burst
Bitcoin go to zero

or simply talks on general on crypto market which its not something new so deal with it once you had
step your foot into this market because this wont be an easy ride.

You would really be having these kind of impressions anytime you do see declines.

Ultegra134

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Quote from: Tytanowy Janusz on November 26, 2021, 12:42:54 PM

Quote from: Blawpaw on November 26, 2021, 11:17:31 AM

"Is the bubble about to burst?" - This has been a common narrative used by crypto haters ever since Bitcoin reach its first peak and MT Gox drawdown. Unfortunately, it seems this same narrative is spreading like a disease that is trying to shake the crypto foundations by turning crypto supporters against each other.

Isn't it true? After "MT Gox drawdown" btc dumped 80%. After 2017 bubble BTC dumped 80%. Same will be now, no matter if it will be 2021 and dump from 69k to 15k or in 2022 from 250k to 50k. Is it wrong to say that bubble burst 3 times in crypto history? During 2019-2020 there were open telephone support lines for people who want to commit suicide because they have lost their life savings... I know it looks easy to hodl from the top of the bubble perspective. Its not that easy after 3 years in bear market and 80-99% dump (depends if btc or alts).

Nasdaq during dot.com bubble also dumped 80%. And it was a bubble... no one question that. But after that tech survived and nasdaq is now +2000% from bottom. Same in crypto. The difference is that crypto is so dynamic that new tech or new paradigms show up much faster. So after third bubble we will most likely see fourth.

Quote from: naira on November 26, 2021, 12:18:11 PM

If Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies are considered bad for fiat financial stability, then why are there so many geniuses who can't solve the economic system that requires only rich people to stand on top of the Pyramids?

Even if you will distribute all global weath equally I bet that in about 1 year 90% of people will have a worse standard of living than before the distribution of wealth from the rich and 10% will be driving lambos. Mostly because people do not know how to save money, they have no idea about the economy, about investing, about simple math.

While I get that most of Bitcoin is being held by a small percentage of addresses, I'm trying to understand what exactly the point is. Is the article indirectly implying that BTC and crypto in general also being manipulated to a great degree, creating a hype bubble which will eventually burst? You, as someone who looks like he's experienced with such incidents, what do you believe? Are we in a manipulated bubble about to burst? Or did I get it all wrong?

Quote from: rhomelmabini on November 26, 2021, 04:58:55 PM

We will hear these kind of things when crypto or specifically Bitcoin isn't performing best in the market, and, it never gets old to be perfectly honest. Well, anyone can criticize but Bitcoin is too huge to ignore and I don't think the bubble gonna burst, we heard it years ago.

While I get your point of view, I was seeing it in real time when Bitcoin crashed in 2017, from what I've understood, the article is implying that it's not impossible for such an incident to occur again.

uneng

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Quote from: CryptoBuds on November 26, 2021, 02:33:52 PM

Quote from: uneng on November 26, 2021, 02:07:12 PM

For that reason I think the author is more like wishing for the bubble to burst than predicting it's going to happen... Because if it doesn't burst and the price keeps rising, the guys who he consider the villains of crypto universe are going to get stronger.

But even if the bubble has burst what makes you think that the old Hodlers will sell their Bitcoins those they are holdings for years? The bubble may burst like 2017 but as well it will recover from time to time and pump 20x more than the previous ATH. Hodlers also can prolong their hodling time even they can increase their portfolio once again if they got chance buying lowest price.

That is true, the cycles of pumps and dumps should keep happening along the time. Meanwhile, whales are going to be always whales in crypto market, because they aren't going to sell most of their coins. Nevertheless, I think for each and every market manipulation whales attempt to launch, it's inevitable they end losing part of their holdings dumping the prices. And that is really good.

Everything another investors must do is to take the opportunity and buy the coins whales are going to sell. This way big investors lose their manipulative influence on long run, while bitcoins become splitted among more different hands.

rhomelmabini

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No God or Kings, only BITCOIN.

We will hear these kind of things when crypto or specifically Bitcoin isn't performing best in the market, and, it never gets old to be perfectly honest. Well, anyone can criticize but Bitcoin is too huge to ignore and I don't think the bubble gonna burst, we heard it years ago.

passwordnow

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As usual, whenever the market starts to dump, there will be an enormous criticism of the market with just and repetitive speculation about the bubble bursting and going through a bear market.
People always think of that as something going in whenever the market is no longer showing the green colors. But that's not new anymore when we see those reds on the streets. Articles like this may be right or not, we don't know as everyone is entitled for their opinion to be expressed.

Kelvinid

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win lambo...

Everyone can make their own prediction and speculation based on the current market status.

As the market is struggling now due to bitcoin dump, then it will be easier for them to once again spread some FUD.
I'm getting used to it already, as an investor, I just have to choose which article to read which would fit my personal belief and views of what would happen in the future.

CryptoBuds

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HODL

Quote from: uneng on November 26, 2021, 02:07:12 PM

The author is too concerned about the called crypto elites, who are the early adopters who accumulated most coins in their wallets during the first years since bitcoin was launched. He thinks it's too dangerous to give more power and money to these people, with the certainty they are going to become clones of the feared wall street whales and other establishment's billionaires in general.

It is true, it is really very dangerous having a vast amount of bitcoin in a single party. It will become more dangerous when that pioneer adopter bought his Bitcoin at the lowest price below $10k or $5k.
When a single party has a huge stock of Bitcoin purchased at a low price, they will be able to create a volatile market environment at any time.

Quote from: uneng on November 26, 2021, 02:07:12 PM

For that reason I think the author is more like wishing for the bubble to burst than predicting it's going to happen... Because if it doesn't burst and the price keeps rising, the guys who he consider the villains of crypto universe are going to get stronger.

But even if the bubble has burst what makes you think that the old Hodlers will sell their Bitcoins those they are holdings for years? The bubble may burst like 2017 but as well it will recover from time to time and pump 20x more than the previous ATH. Hodlers also can prolong their hodling time even they can increase their portfolio once again if they got chance buying lowest price.

dothebeats

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Cashback 15%

I somehow get the concern over pioneer investors. They really hold a lot of power in this market and for that reason the author is somewhat anticipating that they would soon turn into something so weetched and controlling like those billionaires in Wall Street does. Well, only a few of those pioneer investors hold huge stacks right now, while the rest are new investors who made enough money to go on a roll with bitcoin, but still the status that they have on this market is just the same.

The points that were laid out weren't really new, but the writer made it clear to express his thoughts across and not outright bash crypto just because he loved to.

uneng

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The author is too concerned about the called crypto elites, who are the early adopters who accumulated most coins in their wallets during the first years since bitcoin was launched. He thinks it's too dangerous to give more power and money to these people, with the certainty they are going to become clones of the feared wall street whales and other establishment's billionaires in general.

For that reason I think the author is more like wishing for the bubble to burst than predicting it's going to happen... Because if it doesn't burst and the price keeps rising, the guys who he consider the villains of crypto universe are going to get stronger.

This is a good article and I must greet the writer, but I believe we shouldn't blame bitcoin and its ecossystem for not providing a real utopia for the human civilization on the practice, because that is actually impossible in a world characterized by the imperfection of human nature on its actions. Bitcoin is doing the best it can for now and I'm glad for that.

Topic: "Is the bubble about to burst?" - page 3. (Read 512 times)