Is the number of available bitcoins decreasing? - page 10.

goinmerry

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Quote from: unholycactus on February 19, 2016, 06:54:58 PM

Quote from: richardsNY on February 19, 2016, 06:21:32 PM

The number of freshly created Bitcoins will decrease because of the block halving. In Juli this year the second block halving will kick in and lower the block rewards to 12.5 BTC. Can you explain what exactly you mean with Bitcoins being "lost"?

People send (voluntarily or by mistake) coins to addresses nobody controls. (https://blockchain.info/address/1BitcoinEaterAddressDontSendf59kuE)
Or have stored their coins in an address which the private key has been lost.

This are the ones that are lost. Computers that mined long ago where they get a lot of bitcoins in a low price. like 10,000 bitcoins for just how many dollars. Those computers that cannot be opened now have some bitcoins in there which are the lost ones. It is like a locked treasure box with golds from a sunken ship. It needs to be opened again with a key to go back to the circulation.

avw1982

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Quote from: mrhelpful on February 22, 2016, 07:07:29 PM

I dont know exactly how many mined coins were lost until up this year or point.

So its really hard to say, but just remember the 210,000,000 count.

Thats still a grip load of coins even if a good sum got lost. The actual holder of people holding bitcoin is hard too, since the whole buying and selling..

Yup holding is best one guess instead of investing in bitcoins feature. It's much better to hold the bitcoin till halving atleast.

Yakamoto

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Quote from: fricircled on February 23, 2016, 02:39:37 PM

Quote from: mrhelpful on February 22, 2016, 07:07:29 PM

I dont know exactly how many mined coins were lost until up this year or point.

So its really hard to say, but just remember the 210,000,000 count.

Thats still a grip load of coins even if a good sum got lost. The actual holder of people holding bitcoin is hard too, since the whole buying and selling..

It should be 21,000,000 coins in total. I think we may have lost several million already.

I think roughly 2 million coins have been lost during some of the early days of Bitcoin, I think the loss rate is far lower now and it'll be a little while before there will be another substantial loss again.

People are realising that Bitcoin is actually really valuable, and they're taking steps to protect it.

Hirose UK

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Quote from: mrflibblehat on February 19, 2016, 10:15:11 PM

No wonder. There are a lot of wallets with lost passwords that have many bitcoins in them. Those coins are lost forever.

you're right, I've never thought this way of losing bitcoin before. I thought bitcoin doesn't have possibility of losing. but this is true, really. there are some cases of this.

fricircled

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Quote from: mrhelpful on February 22, 2016, 07:07:29 PM

I dont know exactly how many mined coins were lost until up this year or point.

So its really hard to say, but just remember the 210,000,000 count.

Thats still a grip load of coins even if a good sum got lost. The actual holder of people holding bitcoin is hard too, since the whole buying and selling..

It should be 21,000,000 coins in total. I think we may have lost several million already.

mrhelpful

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I dont know exactly how many mined coins were lost until up this year or point.

So its really hard to say, but just remember the 210,000,000 count.

Thats still a grip load of coins even if a good sum got lost. The actual holder of people holding bitcoin is hard too, since the whole buying and selling..

fricircled

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Quote from: Pitchblackroom on February 21, 2016, 09:37:21 AM

Well really it is only the supply for people who do not want to use them and just hold them. Price is really just relevant on demand and Bitcoin has the decimal points to be used up to a very small value.

If most people hold the bitcoin and do not sell in the exchanges, the bitcoin price will rise and not fall.

arbitrage

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This is still POW and you have constant supply,
only if sudden numbers of withdrawals to cold wallets exceeding new coins made by mining..
And this trend continue to rise. Only then.. Wink

This can trigger scarcity but no..Not yet maybe in future. Roll Eyes

arbitrage

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I don't understand price have nothing to do with how many coin are missing at the moment ( It's doesn't matter if they are lost or they are in cold wallet).
probably 90% of all coins are in wallets out off exchanges..
Price is manipulated by whales on exchange.
MIners sell and you have constant supply.
The missing coins are irrelevant, real thing that is matter those other coins in wallets.
And if number of coins on exchanges decreasing main cause is people are deciding to store them in wallet so they causing "shortage".
This will more influence in future when mining become "useless" after few more halvings..

Anddos

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Quote from: Laosai on February 21, 2016, 09:21:58 AM

Quote from: arbitrage on February 21, 2016, 09:06:30 AM

Yes price rise is only influenced by rising demand.
How many btc are available at the moment are irrelevant i think,
(suplay is still very good, we have big mining farms )
In future this can be be more interesting but beyond 2020+
(When mining became more expensive).

It is relevant: if there is less bitcoin in the world, that means the value of the world's assets are to be divided between less coins. Then a coin worths more. Logical.

That seems about right. It's the same thing like with precious metals.

Pitchblackroom

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Well really it is only the supply for people who do not want to use them and just hold them. Price is really just relevant on demand and Bitcoin has the decimal points to be used up to a very small value.

faridkifly

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i dont know dude.
and how convinced are you? and what makes you say so. whether there is a theory that can explain it? Huh

Laosai

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Quote from: arbitrage on February 21, 2016, 09:06:30 AM

Yes price rise is only influenced by rising demand.
How many btc are available at the moment are irrelevant i think,
(suplay is still very good, we have big mining farms )
In future this can be be more interesting but beyond 2020+
(When mining became more expensive).

It is relevant: if there is less bitcoin in the world, that means the value of the world's assets are to be divided between less coins. Then a coin worths more. Logical.

arbitrage

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Yes price rise is only influenced by rising demand.
How many btc are available at the moment are irrelevant i think,
(suplay is still very good, we have big mining farms )
In future this can be be more interesting but beyond 2020+
(When mining became more expensive).

Laosai

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Quote from: arbitrage on February 21, 2016, 07:53:52 AM

I don't see how all those lost coins can influence on bitcoin?
They are as same as in cold wallet ,they're not in circulation.
We have lots ( Enough ) coins in circulation i think.

With rising demand only price can rise. Supply will increase but slower.
This will cause more price rise and more distribution.

Well it influences the bitcoin price because less coins that can be used means higher prices Wink

Gloober

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It's quite possible that this is true and you do have a point here.
But the more demand there is for bitcoin, since there is limited supply the value of bitcoin can only go up this way.

Snorek

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Quote from: aardvark15 on February 19, 2016, 06:04:57 PM

Let me explain. Bitcoins are constantly being created (mined) but bitcoins are constantly being lost also. The number of bitcoins created per year is decreasing (by design) and we could assume that the number of bitcoins lost keeps increasing every year. If this is true, then at some point the total number of bitcoins available (not lost) would decease because more are being lost than being created. If it hasn't started happening yet, it will sometime in the future.

And it is not a problem at all. It is great because if you 'lost' some coins then all other coins will go up in value a little. It will be like donation to every bitcoin user.
Bitcoin alone ise divisible to 0.00000001, so there being less bitcoins remaining is not a problem for the currency itself as potentially you can create whole ecosystem with only 1 btc.

hexitor

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Without knowing the rate at which coins are lost, it is impossible to know if coins are being lost faster than they are created. Eventually, no more coins will be created so there will be a point at which the number of coins will begin dropping.

Actually, you can be sure that more coins are created than lost, because if 25 bitcoins were lost each 10 minutes, the supply would not increase and the price would skyrocket.

arbitrage

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Quote from: willope on February 21, 2016, 07:59:08 AM

If not, you may have missed tipping the numbers (ctrl+c, ctrl+v helps a lot).

Yes but always check again your address after you paste.
I heard a lot about viruses who's attacking "clipboard'.

willope

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Well, when you send btc to an address for the first time, you should send a very little amount (0.0001btc). If you recieve it, then you can send safely to that address. If not, you may have missed tipping the numbers (ctrl+c, ctrl+v helps a lot).
This way I never have lost any bitcoins.
But i've lost with mtgox, even if I think Karpeles still have them, so they aren't "lost" for the entire market.

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